How it all went to shit

Skullbone
Skullbone

I used to know some influential people back in the day so I was able to get a job in my local town government's office as a sort of an apprentice right after graduating high school with mediocre grades.

I literally cheated the entire math final exam, got caught and was told to "get out of here" as the examiner just wrote "passed" on the test without even looking at it.

It was 10 years ago today and I was 19 and had no idea what to do, but being on the government's payroll was nice. I even started my own business which was one of those paid survey sites that used to be very popular.

Within a year I was making a minimum of $2000 monthly from my website and sometimes the profits would go as high as $5k and more per month.

Obviously I quit my office job to concentrate on my business. It was fucking happening! (To put it in perspective my country's minimum wage was $2 per hour back then.)

For years I was able to live like every human should live. I wasn't greedy, I wasn't a show-off, I was still driving my 1988 year Volkswagen rust bucket and I didn't care. Thinking back now on those times I guess I was most satisfied about the fact that I didn't have to look at the price tags when I went shopping for groceries. I could just put whatever the fuck I wanted into my basket knowing that I'd always have enough money to cover it.

One thing that I do regret is not buying Bitcoins when they were dirt cheap. I remember someone telling me about them and I disregarded that as being some sort of a stupid scam. No way I would install something on my PC that promised currency. But meh, no point it crying over that any more.

At the peak of my success streak I owned 3 survey sites and then it happened...

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

I don't know if you remember Liberty Reserve or not, but it was like PayPal for 3rd world countries.

Well, one morning I discovered that all of my over $4,000 USD had disappeared from my account. I was shocked. Upon investigation I realized that one of my members had somehow hacked the payment system on my website which allowed them to withdraw any amount of money into their Liberty Reserve accounts. I was able to track them down to China, but that was pretty much it. Nothing I could do.

Pro tip: don't implement automatic/instant payments on your website. Do everything manually!

So I had just lost $4k and had no way of getting those funds back as Liberty Reserve was a non reversible e-currency unlike PayPal. Fuck that. I had more in other places. So I disabled my auto payment system and continued business like nothing had happened.

Eventually I had earned back that 4k and much more. I was back on track!

But then what happens? Out of the blue comes the FBI. The fucking F B I and shuts down Liberty Reserve accusing the owner of some fucked up shit. If I remember correctly the term "child porn" was even used occasionally.

So now I had lost another 4-5k but this time it wasn't a shady hacker, it was the FBI. It has now been years after the incident and they don't give a fuck about any one of us. They even did a press conference saying that anyone who owned Liberty Reserve is a criminal and should be ashamed of themselves.

Obviously they didn't think of all of those poor Indian guys who had no other way of moving money on the internet- PayPal wasn't that popular back then and it used to be a real pain to get it in and out of your bank account. Liberty Reserve was actually the only viable option for some people.

Emberburn
Emberburn

The entire industry took a massive blow below the belt. Owners were closing one site after another and eventually I found myself bankrupt as well. Mostly because I no longer had any serious advertisers who would buy ads on my website because they lost money too.

Literally everyone I knew lost a huge chunk of their profits thanks to the feds that day. Funny thing is that Liberty Reserve was registered somewhere offshore so it made no fucking sense for the feds to even have any legal power over them.

But what can you do? Big Brother will always find a way to fuck you over.

It has been years after the incident, but I still haven't been able to recover. I'm now almost always late when paying the rent and I have started to eat less just to be able to pay for other expenses.

What makes all of this a million times worse is that I'm almost 30 years old now with absolutely no work background. And nobody wants to hire an ex entrepreneur it would seem. I am unable to even get a simple job as a janitor- they just don't want to hire me.

I had a "mental breakdown" because of all of this and spent some time in the hospital among other crazy people. I actually kind of enjoyed it there.

Now that I'm back in the real world I have no money, my clothes are years old and ragged, my shoes have holes in them which make it very uncomfortable to walk when it's raining and I have nobody left to turn to because everyone have turned their backs on me. My own fucking family pretty much hates me and they are convinced that I am having drug problems.

Well derp. I don't have a drug problem. I never drink and I have only smoked a couple of cigarettes in my entire life. I like to live healthy, but I can't afford to buy any real food any more. Not to mention supplements.

Emberfire
Emberfire

The worst thing about all of this is the fact that I keep going door to door, keep sending my CV (which doesn't have much in it) and my applications get rejected over and over again.

It's been like this for years now and I sometimes collect cans and bottles to turn them into quick cash just so I could buy a loaf of bread.

I have no idea how I can get out of this place.

The only thing I am really good at is web design and development and I have built a couple of virtual reality game demos for Google Cardboard, but there seems to be nobody out there who would actually WANT to hire me.

RavySnake
RavySnake

bad decisions
externalizing all fault
good luck friend

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@RavySnake
I'm well aware that my decisions have led me here.

I still believe that if I had around $2k I could make it work. In the end it's all about advertising.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Skullbone
1. owning a business doesn't translate into any real credential in employment. As you've seen. You're not a good employee because you didn't work for others.
2. Janitorial companies may not hire you but their clients might. I've made millions being a janitorial contractor. If you're willing to scrub toilets and vacuum floors why not approach businesses that hire janitorial services and offer them your services for slightly less? The average hourly rate to clean offices in the US is about $125/hr if you're fast. Do what I do and work for $100/hr and put the janitorial companies that wouldn't hire you out of business.

just a thought. An entrepreneur is only good for entrepreneuring.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@VisualMaster
Thanks for that. That is essentially the perfect "battle plan" but right now I'm so broke I can't even start a business. I have no social security etc. Where I'm from you need to start paying this immediately as you register yourself as a company.

FastChef
FastChef

@BinaryMan
Where I'm from you need to start paying this immediately as you register yourself as a company.
in the US at least you only have to pay self-employment tax if you plan on showing a profit.

with a good accountant and a fair understanding of tax law you shouldn't be showing a profit.

starting a janitorial company in my area would cost a few hundred dollars. Maybe not even that since a lot of clients will provide equipment and supplies so all you have to provide is labor.

I assume a lot of other B2B service companies are similar. Low startup costs, you're just selling your time, and it pays over a hundred an hour. Taxes will eat you alive, but that's what business expenses are for.

not trying to hard sell though, I realize what I do isn't for everyone. I just find it a bit silly how much I get paid and how little they care about my past.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Emberfire
Thanks for the tall tale friend.

Yeah right all your friends and family from your hometown just turned their back on you because your web business failed.
Tell the full story: how much did you scam them out of?

If you really do have web skills all you have to do is get some clean clothes and start knocking on the doors of web shops. They will hire you in a flash.

But you don't, cause your lying about some important parts of the story to make yourself look good on an anonymous image board where there is no point in lying.

Tell the real story: no one knows who you are here, and no one is going to give you money here.

Fuck your ego.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

tl; dr. OP is literally a poo in the loo who cheated to try get ahead and ran a string of those spammy survey sites. They did well and he cried when he got hacked from his shitty code since it meant he had to go back to working a regular job instead of promising people they would get rich from doing surveys. Pathetic. You got what you deserved faggot

girlDog
girlDog

@VisualMaster
The average hourly rate to clean offices in the US is about $125/hr if you're fast. Do what I do and work for $100/hr
Are you serious?

happy_sad
happy_sad

@girlDog
I don't joke about money.

askme
askme

@happy_sad
This guy is one of my favorite biz cucks, desu. Just a random user who decided to serve a decent market segment for decent cash and did enough hard work to earn it. You're a good role model to the autists here, desu

idontknow
idontknow

@askme
thank you.
I'd be thrilled if even one person here told me they made their first million selling assignable service contracts.

I doubt anyone will do what I do, but maybe someone will see things aren't always what they appear to be.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@idontknow
I'd be willing to try, desu. I'm making about the same money as you ATM but I have to work at lot harder to find contracts. If I have to fucking push around something to wax floors all day and have a guaranteed income stream at that kind of level I'd definitely do it.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@happy_sad
yeah this is true.. if youre a contractor.. since you have to provide the gear and the cleaning materials.. but if youre an employee janitor.. you'll just get minimum wage

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Methnerd
Most of my clients find me.

I like to post that contract that I had from 08-12 but the reality is I was in business making about $100k gross per year for 4 years before that plum job showed up. And I went back to grossing about $200k per year once it ended. I did make a nice million while it lasted though.

but yeah, the secret to getting big jobs in my line of work is to just stay in business long enough for them to come along. Eventually the big jobs come up, you just have to figure out how to float long enough to be there when they do.

currently I only work 6 contracts for 5 clients is all, but all 5 have hired my company for the last 15 years running so I'm pretty safe on future work and don't really need to actively pursue new jobs.

it helps that I work in a rural area and have no local competition.

Skullbone
Skullbone

Son, you made it before.

You can do it again.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@Carnalpleasure
yes, the going rate for a contractor here is $125/hr.
the going rate for a janitor is $12/hr.

about 1/3 of the difference goes directly to the IRS. Another fraction goes to supplies, equipment and insurance. A contractor still makes at least 5 times what an employee does though.

and even if I lose money it doesn't matter. When you're sitting on over a million dollars in contracts your bank will lend you pretty much any amount you like.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Emberburn
do you have some wagecucks working for you?

I used to do cleaning shit by myself, no employees, but at the end of the day, i'd be tired after 8 hours.. no kidding, its hard work.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Sharpcharm
What kind of equipment is recommended for starting up and how did you find your first clients?

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Firespawn
I currently have 16 subs working part time for me.

probably about 10 FTE's.

I do about $200k gross cash or about $1 million a year accrual. I employ a ramrod, a foreman. My wife and I handle the actual business management side but he handles operations and carries out our orders regarding strategy and hr.

about the only thing I actively do anymore is selling and closing contracts. I work when someone gets sick or goes on vacation though. I'm not too good to scrub a toilet when it needs to be done.

SniperWish
SniperWish

@SniperGod
Most clients provide equipment.
If not I go to Sam's club and buy a mop bucket, mop handle, mop heads, rags, cheap bissel vacuum, brooms, dustpans, cleaning products such as scrubbing bubbles, toilet cleaner, windex, whatever.

I bought my biz with a few clients already in hand. But I find new work by talking to business owners and managers, cruising FedBizOpps, and talking to government property managers.

most of my clients find me now though. Word of mouth and a yellow pages listing as well as a lot of local advertising dollars.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@SniperWish
Not bad. You know what you're doing. Thanks for the advice

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@TalkBomber
did you start just by yourself?

one of my main problems is hiring employees.. lots of attrition.. no one wants to do it.. when someone is sick or AWOL, i have to cover for them which sucks.

thought about hiring only migrants, but i was getting tired of that biz anyway. moved on to other things

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@RavySnake
my pleasure, I like to talk about me.
@TurtleCat
Yeah, it was just me doing $75k/year at first. As soon as I got my first million under contract I hired my first person. My sister in law, she still works for me 13 years later.

what I've been doing is paying my people close to what I charge. If I charge $125 I pay them $50. If I charge $250 I pay them $50. You get the idea.

they're making a ton of money either way. I barely have to manage them, all I have to do is find them work to do and let them loose. They don't want to lose a job that pays $50 per hour.

of course the reality is I'm working them as contractors so what I'm paying is close to what they'd cost as employees anyways. I don't have to pay their taxes, insurance, health insurance, workmans comp, etc.

so while $50/hour is a great deal for them it's close to the same cost as an employee to me. Only difference is they love their pay and do a great job so they don't lose it.

JunkTop
JunkTop

@VisualMaster
thats pretty generous of you man.. its rare to find employers like that. I was 18 when i first got into that biz.. basically i was stupid and young, didnt really put much thought into expanding it.

Was hard work.. sweated alot with my backpack vaccum cleaner, and cleaned disgusting toilets on occation.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@JunkTop
I've seen some shit, man. literally shit.

but I'm not really generous. The extra money I pay them is just what I'd spend on taxes and insurance anyways.

and in return they work better, harder and faster than any employee. They seriously supervise themselves and do great work. I never have to deal with turnover or people calling in. I haven't fired a person in 13 years and I haven't had an injury, lawsuit or failure to show up in that same time.

paying extra isn't generosity, it's just good business practice in my case. It's the main reason I get to sit home most of the time while my biz runs itself.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@GoogleCat
yeah this makes sence.. i didnt really think of it like that. most people dont really think about these things.

just goes to show, hard work pays off.. something Veeky Forums is averse to.. (including myself)

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@Stupidasole
no, I'm with you.
I got into this biz because I don't like work and it pays ten times more than a regular job.

eventually I got to the point where I barely have to work at all. I consider myself retired, I haven't worked a 40 hour week in 13 years now.

not wanting to work is an important part of making money. Most rich people don't like work from what I've seen.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@Spazyfool

what age did you start taking bizniz seriously? It wasnt till i was 30 that i started to really put some thought into it. Been working my own businesses since i was 16, but i was basically living paycheck to paycheck. when youre young, youre stupid and a big spender.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@Need_TLC
I got my first management job at 20. I made my first million dollars for someone else at 20. I kept working in management for ten more years, making a number of people very rich.

I started my first business at 24. That one succeeded until my divorce a couple months later.

I bought my current business at 30. I paid it off at 31. I put my first million under contract at 32.
I retired that year.

I'm not really serious about business anymore. Money is a fucking game, just a scorekeeper.

it doesn't matter, get rid of it as fast as you can. Make it and pass it on. You don't need it. It's not about what you own, it's about what you flow. Huge cash flow is better than being rich. It's the same thing but without the risk. Don't hold cash, be the person that lets tons of cash go by them. Then people will lend or give you anything you want.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Crazy_Nice

thats my problem, i've never really been good at management.. im a bit of a slacker with no foresight. the only thing im good at is saving, and letting my money work for me.. but put me in charge of a company, and i assure you, it will go down the tubes at some point.

Do you come here often? Most people here are heavily invested in memes, rather than actual business entities, which sadly i am a part of.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@MPmaster
I'm on Veeky Forums and /an/ daily.

the thing I think needs to be said is that money doesn't actually matter.

It's fun to make money and it's nice not to have to worry about it,

but life's too short to make it the priority at any point. If you're good at making money then do it.

if you're not good at making money then stick with what you're good at.

Enjoy your fucking life either way. Go get laid. Eat weird things and wander to foreign places. Money or no, do what you want to do.

I've been homeless and I've been a millionaire, both are equally free.

farquit
farquit

@Soft_member
yeah this is true.. I have so much money at this point i dont know what to do with it. and im not even a millionaire. I dont really like expensive cars and mansions and all that. So most of my money remains unspent, silently working for me.

I've tried living in my car before. Its the experience that counts.. I still like having alot of money though, because it means more free time to do the things you like, instead of being stuck in traffic jams and working 12 hours a day.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@farquit
the homeless don't work 12 hours a day or sit in traffic for hours either.

it's a thin line between the wealthy and the broke. Both survive on the good will and excess of other.

I'm off though, have a good day.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Skullbone
I literally cheated the entire math final exam, got caught and was told to "get out of here" as the examiner just wrote "passed" on the test without even looking at it.

and
It was 10 years ago today and I was 19 and had no idea what to do, but being on the government's payroll was nice. I even started my own business which was one of those paid survey sites that used to be very popular.

fuck you faggot, youre survey websites were gayer than AIDS and you deserve to live in a cardboard box..

I suggest investing in $KNPD

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@farquit
Can you talk about the bizopps site you mentioned? I run an IT consultancy company that is very young and I have issues finding clients.

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