Human rights

happy_sad
happy_sad

human rights

Spamalot
Spamalot

@happy_sad
That's right
we should take away yours

massdebater
massdebater

@happy_sad
what is the argument against the existence of human rights?

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@massdebater
He owns a fedora and thinks his thoughts are groundbreaking/revolutionary new developments

Methshot
Methshot

@massdebater
a lack of things resmeslbing humans. Germans, somalians, swedes...

Methnerd
Methnerd

black (((""""""""""people""""""""""))

Snarelure
Snarelure

@massdebater
Materialism.

Firespawn
Firespawn

be German
rapefugee crisis happens
apparently it's now a human right to migrate to any country you want for any reason according to leftards
they literally call you an enemy of human rights if you disagree with that notion

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Deadlyinx
not helpful
@Methshot
English please
@Snarelure
Cut the jargon

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@massdebater
the existence of non-whites

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@StrangeWizard
Actually Andean villages are more peaceful and crimeless compared to european villages.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@massdebater
Its an imposition on everyone to demand that everyone deserves a respectful disposition

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@massdebater
It's illusion

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Crazy_Nice
what the fuck, I hate white people now

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Crazy_Nice
Do you have a source on that?

Firespawn
Firespawn

@StonedTime
In a cosmological model that presumes that all things that exist are physical objects and physical forces (material monism: all is one substance, the substance is matter), non-concrete things like "rights" aren't real things, just fiction like "spirit".

If you go with social constructivism or social contract theory or epistemological pragmatism or something like those things you can say "Yeah, they are made up, but people believe in them and act on these beliefs in ways that have tangible effects (the social contract is enforced) and thus these abstractions are useful enough that we may as well treat them as if they are real". Or something. I mixed several models in here but they come together kinda coherently, I think I pinpointed where they intersect on the matter of human rights.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@happy_sad
Human rights should've just stayed the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Ifit wasn't for autists ruining the idea of human rights by adding shit like freedom to travel or freedom of religion, the world would be better off.
Prove me wrong

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@massdebater
That they don't exist naturally.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@massdebater
Human rights are just feel good bullshit.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@eGremlin
liberty without freedoms

iluvmen
iluvmen

@eGremlin
right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness

How is worshiping your god of choice not a part of liberty?

RavySnake
RavySnake

@iluvmen
That’s the thing though. Freedom of religion doesn’t just mean worshiping the God you choose. It’s interpreted to mean that the government cannot have any religion.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@RavySnake
So then what does that imply for the common citizen?

MPmaster
MPmaster

@RavySnake
it has always been interpreted as and written for, the protection against the accusation of heresy between churches.

Evilember
Evilember

@eGremlin
Agree with everything except being against the freedom to travel because what if said government took away the right of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness and you want to get away from that regime?

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Stupidasole
Don't complain about the Holocaust or the Great Purge.

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@happy_sad
human lefts

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Stupidasole
*shits in your mouth*

Lunatick
Lunatick

@CouchChiller
@Stupidasole
prohibitions against bad behaviors didn’t exist until someone thought up human rights

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

people have innate rights without a god or a state

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Lunatick
is it actually real? no.
are we much much better off acting like it is? yes. it's very easy for you to balk at it from your desk

w8t4u
w8t4u

What's happening is a group of people are trying to discredit another notion of the Enlightenment for their own political purposes. That's all this thread is doing.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@w8t4u
I’m trying to discredit it because I don’t believe in it.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Gigastrength
good thing nobody needs to give a shit about what you think, huh?

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@iluvmen
Because there is only one God, and he not not want you to rape little kids. Yet, thanks to freedom of religion, Catholics and Muslims get to rape little boys and girls respectively with impunity because "hurr everyone has the right to believe what they want"
Heretics should be burned at the stake. At least Muslim countries got that right

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@ZeroReborn
implying children have the right to not be raped
lol
besides you would burn first

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@StonedTime
it's not jargon you nigger
point out to me where rights exist

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Stupidasole
nice argument

farquit
farquit

@BlogWobbles
'materialism' is jargon, shithead.
point out to me where rights exist
For me, it's like religion. It's not about whether natural rights exist -- it's about the benefits of their existence.
Religion=morality
Human rights=peace

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@farquit
there's nothing real backing rights. they are an invention of the mind. If I have the power to violate your "rights" to my benefit, there's nothing stopping me.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Evil_kitten
Except your mortality. If you're too weak willed for that, you can pretend God exists and use religion as a crutch.

Techpill
Techpill

@w8t4u
muh “Enlightenment”

Methshot
Methshot

@Evil_kitten
I will stop you, or others who believe they have moral duty to stop you will do so.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@Methshot
Well if i can't beat them, I wouldn't have the power to.
there is a moral duty to protect your rights
again, nothing real backing this. even if you just replace rights with "privilege" or "self-interest" there's still nothing obliging me to protect either. I can, but I have no duty to.

SniperWish
SniperWish

@Skullbone
Don't you think the organism--the person--wants to be alive? If there wasn't an inherent desire to exist, people wouldn't have nerves or the necessary neural capacity to detect threats to their being.

girlDog
girlDog

@massdebater
There is no such thing as a human outside of a society. There is no such thing as a "right" outside of a precise political system.
To try to abstract both those things and universalize them is therefore based on very faulty premises.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@New_Cliche
right to own proprierty should end too

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Gigastrength
Well according to your own principles I can just stab you in the ass with a carving knife because I don't give a shit about edgelords on Azerbaidjani Donkey Fucking Stables.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@massdebater

Human rights are a subjective top-down enforced set of requirements that people are forced to observe like a religious dogma. They are based on sentimentalism and reaction against historical events without clear thought and consideration. They allow the neo-liberal globalist hegemony to crush any nation-state that dares to go their own way and adopt their own moral/economic/political system under the guise of humanitarian compassion. Although they practice hypocritical double standards with their cherished human rights, when they punish a vanquished enemy for committing the same acts the victor deployed to achieve said victory.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@massdebater
the burden of proof is on those who belief in human rights to demonstrate that human rights exist, which is impossible.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@massdebater
Basically the argument is not that things such as "freedom of thought, right to life, etc" are wrong (the critics actually agree that freedom of thought and the other fundamental rights are good) but that the concept of "human rights" lacks a philosophical basis.

So, Human Rights are in practice "whatever UN bureaucrats think they are". And we end up with some bizarre stuff such as some people saying "abortion is a human right". And when shit like this happens, this strengthen the arguments of the people making this argument.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@Fried_Sushi
They are based on sentimentalism and reaction against historical events
Wrong, they are based on human nature. Go fuck yourself leftypol

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Nojokur
A soft and sheltered lifestyle has led me and my peers to be giant fucking bitches so that means everyone has always been just like me and I am correct.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@massdebater
rights are a spook

SniperWish
SniperWish

@Snarelure
rights are a spook, but without this spook all the betas on Veeky Forums would be having their boypussies creamed by big dominant Chads

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@massdebater
chink bugmen are threatened by the fact that westerners achieved more in the span of a few centuries than they ever did in millenia so they shitpost about how human rights are degenerate and weak.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@massdebater

It doesn't exist in a meaningful sense, tangible or abstract. Right of might is the only real "right", since all the others in practice lean on might to exist.

You could argue that you're entitled to something based on contractual obligations or the like, but the idea of universal, innate entitlements seems useless. It's preferable to think in terms of knowing what people generally want, what they can have and go from there.

Put it another away, do you really have a right to live, or is it the fact that murder is illegal that keeps you alive? You can argue the right to live is why murder is illegal, but what happens when someone murders you anyway, or worse, if it's a cop that murders you? Clearly what matters is the force of law's ability and willingness to deter violence and guarantee safety, not if you have a "right" to live, so human rights are just feel-good rhetorical fluff; the empty calories of philosophy.

Bidwell
Bidwell

@happy_sad
liking sam hyde
you have the mind of a 12 year old

idontknow
idontknow

@Spamalot
I agree, I think it would be beneficial if we revoked OP's rights ASAP.

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