What is the point of becoming rich when reproducing is unethical?

>the 'people' in this thread

This is the high level analysis I expect from biz

Most of us are not in our teens anymore, so what you mistake for the pinnacle of thinking of this topic is to the rest of us a remnant of embarrassing years.
As you'll grow older your hormonal balance will adjust and the angst will wane, which makes "woe is me, life is suffering" seem quaint and coincidentally explain why you don't see 40 years old emos.

Not an argument.

“Nothing” can’t not consent, or consent, so its a fallacious argument.

> i wont have kids because of global warming and shit
> omg lets donate to save 50000000 babies born to moronic somalian women who for some reason felt it necessary to breed a horde in a famine and disease stricken desert country cause omg every childs life is so important
> yea abortion at 8.5 months is totally ethical, its not a person till they cut the cord

KYS

If you create an android that can feel and think, feel pain and die, is that ethical? Could it consent to being built?

You'll desperately want to have kids once you hit 30 and realize that this postmodern, consumerist shitshow we call modern life is as empty and soulless as your sex dolls. Men are defined by their ability to provide, teach, pass on their strength and knowledge to those weaker than themselves. You may be a pseudo-nihilist 18 year old faggot now, but you won't always be, user.

No they can’t consent because until they exist there is nothing to consent to

if you retards seriously believe this, kill yourself now and stop wasting resources

You're completely missing the point, brainlet.

>realize that this postmodern, consumerist shitshow we call modern life is as empty and soulless as your sex dolls.

So why would you force more innocent souls into it? Especially when they'll be destined for a life of wageslavery too?

I always like how dumbfucks like you get so defensive. Stay retarded.

So because a baby couldn't consent to being thrown in a fire, it's okay to throw a baby in a fire

Makes sense

unethical is subjective

Great response there, bud. Really made me think.

"Killing children is unethical" is subjective too.

itt: pampered autists unable to comprehend that life can be quite difficult to navigate without suckling on mommy and daddy's teet.

Although OP is 15 and angry that a daddy's son is riding his oneitis on his motocycle, he's got a point.

When you have kids, make sure you're not poor past their first few days.

No, I’m saying consent isn’t a relevant concept to something that does not exist. Something that does exist but can’t consent shouldn’t be tortured.

It's empty and soulless because you bought into the consumerist myth. Embracing traditionalism and fighting against the mainstream nihilist bullshit by having kids is a way to escape the current system. It's worked for our species for hundreds of thousands of years, why the fuck do you think you're so enlightened that it won't also work for you? The logical conclusion of your line of thinking is just suicide. Why are you still here, soyboy?

40 yo here.

Coming to accept and be at peace with being here (I am angst-free) does not equate to an endorsement of endless, mindless, purposeless DNA replication.

I did indeed come to this conclusion in my late teens, but in the 20 years since, I have yet to encounter an argument to make me even begin to start moving in the other direction.

Unless you at least have some spiritual justification to back it up (whether or not your metaphysics ultimately prove to be BS), willfully procreating is, at the very least, morally questionable.

>I have yet to encounter an argument to make me even begin to start moving in the other direction.

Do you really want one? If you do I might be ready to invest half an hour or so explaining it.

Spreading your DNA is the closest thing to an actual, literal purpose and meaning of life and existence.
Kys genetic dead end faggot

I would appreciate that. Though you've already reverted to ad homs in your previous post.

You're pretty much the same as any other retard spawning crotch fruit, but I'll hear you out.

Wrong. That means nothing.

>Kys genetic dead end faggot

It's funny how unintelligent people get so defensive when they know they're wrong.

don't raise useless consumers then well developed humans have a net positive effect on the world

Alright, so; is close but no cigar.

Growth is actually the purpose of life.
By having offspring, you grow the pool of consumers in your community.

By that, then, you create jobs. By jobs you make more chance of further growth.

Our society is built on top of growth, our existence is built on top of growth. And it all depends on you making +1 participant.

That's why the Western world made such progress, why Japan's starting to actually regress, and why poverty is growing by the second in Eastern Europe.

If you start shrinking instead of growing you're fucked.

>Japan's starting to actually regress

I read a story about a Japanese police force doing random shit because there was literally no crime for them to go after

Wow, I thought you were actually going to give me a good answer for a minute.

>muh growth
>muh jobs
>muh we need more numbers to make the cogs turn

Fuck off.

I'm from a regressing Eastern European country. Our police has nothing to do either.

>we need more numbers to make the cogs turn

Exactly. Denying this truth is denying your own human nature.

Have fun with that.

>all these non arguments

Your life will always have more misery than pleasure. You will always want more, and when you achieve it, want more still.
The human is designed in such a way that he always wants, wills, feels deficiency and thus suffering. Every tile you fulfill a want, you get a new want, and suffer from not having it fullfilled.
The people who fullfill all their wants, or want for nothing, we call these "depressed" and they suffer most of all, because they have no wants to chase and no reason to act.

Because the human creature is such designed or has such evolved that the only reason to act is to want, and because wanting is perceiving a lack that you suffer from, you will always be in varying states of pain and misery.

What kind of a monster would create such humans, thus dooming them to suffering, and increasing the overall suffering of the world, and by virtue of the struggle for resources also increasing the individual suffering of all other humans?

Hi inmemdham viewr/pol browser

"Da nigs and shitskins are too dumb to introspect, only whites and smart zipperheads an hero"

lol, "you solve the underlying existential problem by perpetuating the problem."

>Infinite growth is sustainable.

You're completely wrong.

People shouldn't be forced into existence to make some pointless machine run.

Thom Yorke from Radiohead is a 49 year old emo

>Existence is a problem

>Existence is pointless

That's your starting point?

Do you disagree?

Ew, sounds like a girl saying "my biological clock is ticking!" Are you a gay boy? I aint nob apron wearing provider pussy, I do my own thang nigga

Fuck off with this Jew shit

If you feel that way you can adopt, you asshole

It will exist though, ya dumm dumm silly gooth.

I have no stance on existence. It's the hand I'm dealt with and have to make best of.

I struggle with depression everyday. Many people do. Why would we have kids if we cant even get our own shit straight? Part of it os shitty capitalism makimg us wage slave but part of it is inherent. Most people are average. Being average isnt all that great, its passable until the shit hits the fan and it almost always does. Also you probably murder animals cus "muh protein"

Pay attention to which side is getting mad and flustered in this thread.

It is always this way.

My wife has this problem when surrounded by her baby-mongering friends. "I don't want any." "Why???"

An explanation is attempted, and they just do cartwheels of "B-BUT BABIES!! THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOU!"

(Wrong = not mindlessly following genetic programming)

I can imagine a world, or a type of existence, where existence is worthwhile. This is most definitely not that world.

The ONLY justification for being here and bringing more in is if we are, in reality, some sort of multi-dimensional energy being, and this is some sort of VR game that we're fucking around with in order to level up.

How are you so certain of how others feel?
>I can extrapolate how I feel on the entire human race
Maybe your brain is broken?
So perhaps for you, have children would indeed be unethical as it would for anyone else with such debilitating mental disabilities.

It's always the same thing with you people projecting your own misery onto everyone else.

If life is so bad then why the fuck are you still here. Go jump a bridge already

>which side is getting mad and flustered in this thread

Which side is that?

Opting out of procreation is perfectly fine too.
That's why I'm not against abortion.

My point above was to explain through economics why procreation is a big part of a community.

You cant make up your mimd, can you?

And they clearly asked why thats important and you gave no answer. Whats wrong you Mr. dumm silly gooth?

>I can imagine a world, or a type of existence, where existence is worthwhile. This is most definitely not that world.
Yet again, you people project your views onto the rest of humanity and then claim objectivity, when it's nothing but pure subjectivity.

>I can imagine a world, or a type of existence, where existence is worthwhile. This is most definitely not that world.
The fact that you subjectively think existence is not worthwhile in this world doesn't mean everyone else agrees with you.

Those are the objective facts of biochemistry.
People are driven by wants. When you should do something to maximize your individual gene's chances of copying themselves, you feel a want to do that thing.
So you always want things. To want something is to suffer. It is unpleasant to want something and not have it.
And when you do have it, you get new wants. So you always want, and you always suffer for not having what you want.

It is the way the human body is designed. Its not subjective. We function with the carrot on a stick system, a want dangled in front of you so that you chase it, and a new want when you get that one. Wanting is not having, not having is suffering, we are programmed to work on suffering, it is the fuel that makes us want.

To be human and to live is to suffer.

On what exactly? Existence?
It's there and it can be altered. So you must bend it to your will.

Not waste time bitching about it on a Nigerian royalty forum, purpose or not.

Why is it important? So that your tribe can survive, pretty much.

>Your life will always have more misery than pleasure.
no, not everyone is as pathetic as you. I'm pretty happy every day.

Have you never relaxed or experienced content?

no im filling the point in for OP by assuming he is some liberal cunt since he made some nonsensical claim without elaborating, just like you did

will exist is not the same as exist

You get an injection of pleasure when you complete an objective, but the objectives are always many, you never complete them quick, you never complete them all, and so on. Always the suffering of wanting is more than the pleasure of getting. The animal being eaten always suffers more than the animal getting a meal.

you don't have to "consent" to life, life is a gift and if you don't want it you can literally go kill yourself

What is this difficulty that pro-natalists seem to have with the concept of anti-natalists having friends, family, responsibilities, etc. that they can't simply abandon just because they don't like it here?

durrr, stop consumin' muh resources then.

Yeah, and completely fuck over everybody that I know?

"Earth was a mistake and creating more life is actually a major moral quandary" is not the fucking same thing as "boo hoo, nothing matters, time to kill myself."

Lmao, people like you are so utterly hopeless. A broken clock is right more often.

You think da joos want less people? That's less fucking money for them you tard, their whole model is "infinite growth".

>WAAAA I DIDNT CONSENT TO GETTING BIRTHDAY PRESENTS WTF??? FUCK U MOM!!

>Wanting is not having, not having is suffering, we are programmed to work on suffering, it is the fuel that makes us want.
Your very argument is flawed for it assumes no one can enjoy wanting but not having.
When I want to win a game, I push myself hard to play the very best I can.
In that time I enjoy playing regardless if I end up winning or not.
Boom, your entire premise is flawed.
>wah wah wah it's objective fact
As I said before, stop projecting your own misery onto the rest of the human race.

If your that nihilistic just give away your money.

One major point constantly coming from the "should not exist" argument - suffering.

And? Are you implying that's always bad? You become stronger (read: grow) through suffering.

>when you complete an objective

Dude.

If you see life as this carrot-on-stick model, I'd advise to smell a rose sometimes. Or take a breath of fresh air.

>{insert rationalization}
>BOOM BTFO!!!!

404 argument not found.

Nah, it's more like anti-natalists are smug fucks who think they're superior to natalists.

Tbh you make it sound so robotic and bleak. But your last sentence is more fair. Yes we suffer. We live too, and living is a way more complex topic then suffering. Living, feeling alive, is awesome.

Tribe? Why revert back to this word? This is a word to describe primitive people. I live in society, not a tribe. Those tribal people live in societies too. Society means you live among people you dont like, people nothing like you, and under a system that you didnt create. I cant escape society unless im some kind of activist making their own society.

Do you have a working argument against infinite growth?

Whats the fucking difference? Stop playing games sonny

>This is a word to describe primitive people.

And that's exactly what we are user.

>you are not qualified to ascertain what you experience, only I alone know when you suffer
Wow, how the fuck can you read my mind user?
How can you tell when I enjoy things and when I suffer?

Uh, last I fucking checked the earth is a finite thing. The fuck?

People believe in the "infinite growth" thing unironically? Holy damn lmao

Best answer in this thread so of course all you get is people saying their lives are better than yours and you should kill yourself. Sometimes I think thoughts like these are just proof that humanity has evolved too far because we know too much. However, one talk with an average person or seeing all the replies in this thread proves that's not the case. All you have to do is think about it for a while to come to this conclusion, but many people completely refuse to do this and continue to believe they have some higher purpose.

Just because you think like this doesn't mean the logical conclusion is to kill yourself. You're already here, and the pleasure that you do continue to get with life is better than not existing.

>Always the suffering of wanting is more than the pleasure of getting.
I dissagree, and I disklike antinatalists like you who just claim this shit. Quantify and qualitate your statements, bitch. What the fuck are you talking about? You're clueless.

>life is a gift and if you don't want it you can literally go kill yourself

I want normies to leave.

Earth might be, IF it is. Rest of galaxy perhaps not?

Where is your argument against infinite growth?
Do you propose a better model?

>Quantify and qualitate your statements, bitch.

He did. I like how flustered you're getting though, happens every time.

I dont wanna propogate primitive people who have advanced Soviet manufacturing of AK47s and McDomalds bru

He didn't quantify shit you retard.
You pretentious fucks never quantify suffering ever, all you do use it as a rationalization for being a smug fuck.

Haha, yeah, lets sum up all of psychology and all of human life with one paragraph that is as general as possible. Smug fuckers. Write a book and grt back to me, plebe

That's on you.

You get rich so you can find yourself a hot piece of asian ass

>MONEY
>ASIAN GIRLS
>MONEY
>ASIAN GIRLS

This is what it means to be a Veeky Forumstard

>reproducing is unethical
Only if you're nigger/chink/pajeet.

GO THE FUCK BACK TO /pol/ AND GET OFF MY FUCKING BOARD YOU FUCKING Veeky Forums BOARD IMMIGRANT

"The earth might be infinite or it might not be, who knows"

Good god damn what am I reading, rofl. You must be that flat earther guy.

And yeah a better model is one that doesn't destroy the infinitely more beautiful, complex and enriching natural world to make way for a toxic, homogenized, bleak artificial one that's so shitty it's caused the mental illness and suicide rate to skyrocket

Doodads and gizmos are cool don't get me wrong but anyone who thinks they're worth trading entire ecosystems for is a very desperate soul

>Always the suffering of wanting is more than the pleasure of getting. The animal being eaten always suffers more than the animal getting a meal.

Dude cant even paraphrase schopenhauer. The second sentence is a very different topic then the first. And no, claimimg that wantimg always outweighs grtting doesnt make it so. unless you can prove it. Please prove something for once, O wise One.

GO THE FUCK BACK TO reddcoin AND GET OFF MY FUCKING BOARD YOU FUCKING reddcoin BOARD IMMIGRANT

>absolutist artificialism
>naturalist, yet absolutist artificialism mindset

Ouch. So, what's the your model exactly?

back to /r9k/ you sperg

>what’s the difference between existing and not existing

are you serious right now?

You are retarded my friend.

>inb4 'I love it how unitelligent people get defensive' no no no you deserve to hang.

Do you suggest we completely cease reproduction in all living species? Allow the Earth to become a lifeless rock identical to the rest of the known universe?

If you think there is more point to that than living to reproduce and develop then you're an ill cunt.

Life's initial goal is reproduction and continuation, perhaps so we can evolve into a species with a greater purpose. You could say humans are at the next step, with a much better awareness and ability to give their offspring a brighter future and thus allow them to accomplish the next level of meaning faster.

Now I'm not gonna lie I'm a bit high rn but I think I've clocked it and I stand by my comment that AjB6 or whatever his thing is should commit suicide.

>Buh-hu-huuu /pol/ isn't making me any money how about I go to Veeky Forums where they know how to make money
HMMMMMMMMMM maybe if you want to make money you don't bring your USELESS fucking rhetoric to my BUSINESS AND FINANCES board.

Newfags like you are the cancer on this site that's somehow turned shilling into a bad thing and made browsing through Veeky Forums a pain in the fucking ass.

>MONEY
>ASIAN GIRLS

IF YOUR POST HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS, SHUT THE FUCK UP AND LURK MORE

Even assuming the second part of your loaded question is true (it isn't), I don't see what it has to do with the first part.

>>absolutist artificialism
>>naturalist, yet absolutist artificialism mindset
Not sure what the shit you're trying to say here with your big college kid words

I just think we need way less people. Like the wise sage Bill Burr said, the problem isn't you driving a gas guzzler. It's that there's too many people doing it.