MTG Magic The Gathering Ask A Judge - 「 B L U E M O N D A Y 」

Duels is a fine place to begin. There's a few things that aren't quite right (I don't know if it still shows damage as reducing toughness, for example- it shouldn't!) but it does a good job of teaching you the basics. It's absolutely perfect for beginners.

He seems like the sort of self-important cunt who'd cross that line.

Still, man. That'd involve probably three or more verbal "I am giving you a way out of this" warnings before I brought out The Ban-Axe.

are welcome decks good way to begin and learn magic? me and my friend picked up two welcome decks and have played 4 games against each other, the problem is that every game has been extremely boring. All games have been decided by who is lucky with cards while the other player is handicapped by not having enough spells or lands. We played with a mulligan rule to prevent us from having shitty cards at the beginning of the game but still as the game progressed the player who got better lands/spells ratio later would just roflstomp over the other player. Are we doing something wrong? I thought these decks were made to play against each other, I want some close games with tactics and hard decisions. My friend has given up on this game but I'm looking for a way to give us a better introduction to magic (must be cheap or free).

Without looking at the decks, it's hard to say whether it's a power imbalance or just luck. Luck IS a factor of Magic- no matter how good a player you are, sometimes RNGesus just decides today is a going-in-dry kinda day and you topdeck seven lands in a row.

As far as hard decisions and the games being boring, that's almost certainly by design- the Welcome Decks tend to not be overly complex to avoid throwing too much at 'new' players at once.

You might give Magic Duels a try- it's free on Steam and it's a good introduction tool.

I moderate online game servers. I can tell you for a fact that there's people so dumb that they will raise an objection to another player's conduct, get told that "No, that's fine", raise an objection to the moderator's decision, get told by the head moderator that "No, he's right, that's fine", raise an objection to the head moderator's verdict, and not fucking shut up about it until muted or banned.
And the "When he does X it's fine but when I do/point out X it's not fine" is a classic line from that type of person. Since he neglected to provide any information at all, I'm trusting my gut.

Fair enough. I've encountered plenty of hotheaded "I DEMAND HE LOSE THE GAME FOR CHEATING" people, but usually a simple application of my L2 At-Will power and a Warning shuts that shit down. I have yet to encounter someone who escalates it beyond that, thankfully.

Summoning Sickness:
When creatures are cast, they can't attack or use tap abilities until your next turn, unless they have haste.
If you cheese them out with a Planar Bridge, I would assume they need to wait a turn to use their abilities as well?
What if they put onto the battlefield using polymorph? Does a 1/1 insect token polymorphed into Ulamog have summoning sickness?
What if you flicker a creature with Felidar Guardian or Eerie Interlude? If they return to the battlefield on your first main phase, do they have summoning sickness?

It's not just 'cast'. Any creature is 'summoning sick' until you've controlled it nonstop since the beginning of your most recent turn, no matter how it came under your control (this is why effects like Threaten give haste- if they didn't, you wouldn't be able to attack with that creature)

Does that apply to flicker effects?
If they try to bolt something in my first main phase, and it gets flickered, can it attack the same turn?
Do you still control it even though it's temporarily in exile?

>any creature
It applies no matter how the creature got there. If the answer to the question "has this exact object existed on the battlefield, under my control, continuously, since the beginning of my most recent turn" is "no" for any reason, then it has Summoning Sickness.

He has dark confidant. If he forgets to have it trigger, he just misses it and gets a warning. if he misses it and I point it out next turn, I get thrown out. WTF?

That is not at all what happens.

If your opponent misses their Dark Confidant trigger, one of two things happens: Either they get a Warning (and you, the opponent, are given the option to put the trigger on the stack, if it was caught within a reasonable timeframe) and we move on if it was a legitimate mistake, or they are DQed for Cheating if they "missed" it on purpose.

If you notice them miss a trigger, YOU have two options: You can call attention to the fact that they have missed it, if it's a trigger you want to happen (like if it's Dark Confidant and they're at fairly low life total); or you can just keep quiet and let them miss it (for example, if it was a 100% upside trigger, like if they attacked with an Untethered Express and said "Take 4"). In neither situation will you receive ANY penalty, let alone a DQ.

Say you have an instant that says "tap target permanent."
If you cast it on your opponent's land, they would still be able to tap it in response and float it in their pool, until it goes away at the end of the phase, right?
Could you cast the spell and tap their lands on their upkeep phase so they couldn't play main phase things?

I was told by the judge that since there was a turn between him missing it and me catching it, (I remembered he didn't bob last turn when he did this turn) I "sat on" the missed trigger and DQd me for fraud.

You could! "During your upkeep, Mistbind Clique" was a common play back in the day (oh my god Lorwyn was almost ten years ago)

>DQ'd me for fraud
I thought this was a judge, not the IRS? Please tell the actual story.

Then you might want to report that to your area's Regional Coordinator, because it was 100% incorrect. You are -never- punished for not pointing out your opponent's missed triggers, EVER.

To be fair, "Fraud" used to be a specific category of infractions in older versions of the IPG.

According to him, I wasn't punished for pointing it out so much as I was punished for pointing it out late, when it benefitted me.

My first deck I bought was a w/u lorwyn merfolk deck back in early highschool.
Before that it was shit that other people didn't want.

You will -never- be punished for pointing out your opponent's missed triggers.

Ever. Period. Full stop. End of story. There is absolutely no situation in which pointing your opponent's missed trigger results in ANY penalty for you, no matter how much time has passed, or if there is benefit to you.

From IPG 2.1, Game Play Errors - Missed Triggers:

"Even if an opponent is involved in the announcement or resolution of the ability, the controller is still responsible for ensuring the opponents make the appropriate choices and take the appropriate actions. Opponents are not required to point out triggered abilities that they do not control, though they may do so if they wish."

"The opponent’s benefit is in not having to point out triggered abilities, although this does not mean that they can cause triggers to be missed."

Your Judge probably should actually read the IPG. I'd recommend contacting your area's Regional Coordinator, because ten'll get you twenty this guy didn't collect a DQ statement from you for you to tell your side of things.

>Opponents are not required to point out triggered abilities that they do not control, though they may do so if they wish."
Is it ethical to jew people and refuse to let them gain from triggers?

Your triggers are your responsibility, not mine. Many variations on missed trigger policies have been tried over the years. Believe me, this one is the best they've had so far.

I thought you'd get complementary Dairy Queen if you deliberately waited on missed triggers until it was beneficial to you. Like, if the other guy had a Midnight Banshee and a Goblin Rabblemaster (fuck if I know why) and missed the "nonblacks get -1/-1 until EOT" trigger on the banshee at upkeep but you pointed it out after he made the goblin token from rabblemaster so it'd wipe out the token.

>DQ statement
what.

Remembering your own triggers is a skill. It's no more "unethical" to say "Nope, you missed that" than it is to say "No, I'm not letting you re-do that spell because you tapped your lands wrong to leave up counterspell mana" or "No, I'm not letting you take back that attack".

You never

Ever

Ever

Ever

Get punished for pointing out your opponent's triggers, or declining to point them out.

Ever.

Any time a player is disqualified, the judge is SUPPOSED to submit written statements from everyone involved (themselves, the DQed player, the opponent, anyone else they involved in the investigation) to be submitted with the DQ report.

That sounds like it would require keeping the cheater in the building for some amount of time. Which makes no sense when cheating is an automatic ban. Bad enough I had to leave my deck there.

Alright, you pulled me along for quite a while there, I'll have to give you that.

what do you mean?

Can I modify my cards and use them in sanctioned play (alt art, etc) as long as they have sleeves and are indistinguishable from the back?

Maybe.

HJ has final say on any alterations. I do know that if you change the weight or thickness it's for sure disallowed (meaning any paint) also if it gives helpful advice or notes, or has obscuring or obscene images it's out.

Best suggestion is to have un-altered ones just in case.

Jein.

Officially, the guidelines on artistic modifications are:

1) The name and mana cost must be wholly unobscured

2) The art must remain "recognizable"

3) There must be no significant strategic advice or notes incorporated into the alteration

4) The alteration cannot be "inappropriate" (IE don't put softcore porn on your cards)

5) The card must be 100% indistinguishable from any other card in your deck (this is mostly a thickness/weight thing)

Even then, all alters are subject to the Head Judge's final approval. If they say 'no', then it's not kosher. Bring along spares just in case, and check with the HJ before the event.

So, if you're not trolling, and their respond to this situation was to DQ you, ban you, and keep your property, you absolutely need to report that to the WPN, your area's Regional Coordinator, and probably the police since they stole your shit.

We were drafting the old modern set with the cardboard boxes. Since I was banned for cheating my draft stuff becomes the store's draft stuff.

Is that not right?

Not even a little.

"When this penalty is applied, the player loses his or her current match and is dropped from the tournament. If a player has already received prizes at the time he or she is disqualified, that player may keep those prizes but does not receive any additional prizes or awards he or she may be due.
When a player is disqualified from the tournament, his or her event is over. The results of the matches or games he or she has finished won’t be changed, and if the player has already received prizes prior to the Disqualification, he or she gets to keep what has already been received. However, he or she is not given anything he or she is yet to receive. This is mainly to avoid the legal complications of “taking back” something that has already been given.
All Disqualifications should be reported to the Investigations Committee by using the Judge Center. The player’s statement and the Head Judge’s brief report are needed. The testimonies of spectators are optional. Here is a pretty good article on the ‘paperwork’ aspect of a Disqualification."

user, that's straight-up theft. Contact the WPN; not sure it's worth calling the cops over. Any materials that you've been given as part of a tournament (like boosters for a draft) are your property. The store can't "repossess" them.

What happens when I Copy Enchantment this thing, then try to turn it back into a creature?

To hell with this card.

Well, when you Copy Enchantment it, it'll be a creature to start with.

I'm not really sure I understand.

Let's say I have Dominating Licid on the field, and my opponent has a Raging Goblin and a Reassembling Skeleton.
I dominate the goblin with the licid, by paying 1UU and tapping it. It becomes an aura that gives me control of the enchanted creature, and I choose to enchant the goblin.
It resolves.

Next I cast Copy Enchantment, targeting the Licid (now an aura enchanting the goblin). Since Copy Enchantment is entering as an aura, I'll have to choose a creature to enchant (not targeted, though!). I'll plop it on my opponent's Reassembling Skeleton.
Now I'm enchanting both of my opponent's creatures. I choose to pay U as a special action, and end the effect of Dominating Licid (the Copy Enchantment one).
What happens?
Did I get the previous steps right, or is there something I'm missing?

The Copy Enchantment isn't ever an Aura. It copies the Licid as it exists in layer 1, and in layer 1 the Licid is not an Aura. It's a creature.

Ah, fuck.
So is it just a Dominating Licid, then?

Yep. It'll be an unanimated Dominating Licid.

Confusion in the Ranks and Kari-Zev, or just some creature that creates create Tokens tapped and attacking. When you trade the creature token for another creature is the original creature token does the creature token stay tapped and attacking the player it was pointed at,

When Phantasmal Image ETB as a copy of Spell Queller, is the Queller's ETB ability copied as well i.e. do I get to tuck a spell under the Image?

Continuing the topic, if the Image copies Selfless Spirit and is then targeted by an ability, does this go on a stack so that I can respond to it by saccing the spirit and giving the crew indestructible?

if i control captain's claws but it is attached to an opponent's armory automaton, when the robot attacks and my kor is created 'tapped and attacking' during THEIR combat phase, what goes on with the kor? can i declare who it is attacking or is it just an invalid command as it is not my turn? does it enter 'tapped and not attacking' despite what the card says?

The token is put out tapped and attacking, which triggers Confusion. You'd target a creature another player controls, and swap your token for that. The token is still tapped, but no longer attacking, because any creature that changes controllers is removed from combat.

Yep! It's entering AS a Queller, so the "when I enter" trigger will fire and eat a spell of your choice (assuming one exists, which will be tough without help because Phantasmal Image does not have Flash)

Image's "sac me" ability is a trigger. It goes on the stack and can be responded to. If your Image is copying a Selfless Spirit, you can respond to the 'sac me' trigger by activating that ability to get value.

You control the Claws, so you control the trigger, which means YOU get the Kor Ally token. It can't be put onto the battlefield attacking, because you're not the active player, so it's just put in tapped.

506.3b. If an effect would put a creature onto the battlefield attacking under the control of any player except an attacking player, that creature does enter the battlefield, but it's never considered to be an attacking creature.

does a card like this mean base p/t, or current p/t after other etb and static effects?

It means total P/T. If you play a Feral Hydra for X=8, it's entering as an 8/8 (not a 0/0) and won't trigger Ezuri. If you have out a Gaea's Anthem and play a Runeclaw Bear, it won't trigger Ezuri because it's a 3/3, etc.

What happens if I have an Elspeth, Sun's Champion in play and my opponent plays a Goblin Tunneler? Play stopped last night because we couldn't determine whether the effect went on the stack or if it was instant speed.

I'm not understanding the question. Could you clarify?

one more question for clarity: if i play something like lurking crocodile, would bloodthirst resolve before ezuri?

Bloodthirst is a replacement effect that modifies the way the creature enters the battlefield. If you've got Bloodthirst online and a Lurking Crocodile is entering the battlefield under your control, it enters as a 3/3.

I assume you mean you got Eleded's emblem off? That'd mean Goblin Tunneler would have no valid targets among creatures you controlled unless you had a base power 0 creature and no other buffs.

Goblin Tunneler's ability is best understood when split into two parts.
"Target creature with power 2 or less" and "is unblockable this turn."
When it's TARGETING it cares about power. Afterwards, it doesn't give a shit.

Technically it cares exactly twice: As you select your target, and as the ability resolves.

What would be the most optimal utilization of Bottle Gnomes, I don't need to make a deck around them (though if we could...) but I would like something with maximum cheese factor.

Buy a large amount of those godawful Mana Potion energy drinks, dump out contents. Fabricate tiny metal pants and tiny metal hats for them. Utilize as many was as possible to repeatably create token copies of Bottle Gnomes. Represent those tokens with your Mana Potion "bottles", filled with the drink of your choice. When you activate their ability, literally rip them open (rip off the 'top' you made) and consume their contents.

Can you overload a Cyclonic Rift if you tutor for it with Bring to Light? (to light to light lchaim, lchaim lchaim to light)

You cannot. Bring to Light is allowing you to cast the spell for an alternate cost ("Free", in this case), which means you can't cast it via another alternate cost, which is what Overload is.

That's what I thought, this came up during a commander game with my friend
Also, is Yisan banned in just duel commander, or in regular multiplayer edh as well?

Just Duel. French/Duel Commander has a totally different banlist than 'normal' Commander.

ty based judge
Last question, can I run Ring of Evos Isle in my Zurgo edh deck?

Sure can! Color identity is only based off of mana symbols in the rules text and mana cost, and off of Color Indicators for cards without mana costs. Color WORDS present in rules text don't contribute to Color Identity; you can put the Ring of X cycle in any deck, because all of them have a colorless color identity.

Can bring to light cast Breaking/Entering fused?

It can't. You can absolutely do Bring to Light with only 2 colors and find Breaking, then cast Entering (because split cards are weird), but you can only fuse from your hand.

Hey ga, blood moon vs spreading seas is just a timestamp thing, right? Most recently resolved one wins?

Yep. Unless of course you Spreading Seas a basic land, in which case it's just an island.

Right. Both work in Layer 4, and there's no dependency, so it's just timestamp. If you play Blood Moon and then someone chucks a Spreading Seas onto a nonbasic, it's an Island. If the Spreading Seas was already on the nonbasic and Moon gets dropped, it's a Mountain.

Blind obedience can only be run in EDH if my commander has at least black and white or it can be run in white/something?

It can be run in any deck with white in the identity! The Orzhov hybrid symbol is in the reminder text, which has no rules meaning- and that includes defining color identity.

Sweet, that's neat! Thanks gA!

What about OGW diamond colorless mana spells?

Colorless isn't a color.

If I create tokens that come tapped and attacking, if I have another combat step and it untaps all my creatures, can the tokens attack again?

They can't, because you haven't controlled them continuously since the beginning of your most recent turn.

So they'll need some kind of haste enabler à la ogre battledriver?

Correct.

Also, bed now.

If i return 4 Kalastria Healers at once with March from the Tomb do all of their abilities add up? Do i drain 16 life from each opponent in one go?

Will Chalice of the Void on 0 counter a creature being played as morphed?

Cheers.

Can you explain dependencies to me?

so with infinite mana i can do infinite things?
what's a good way to get infinite mana with lots of redundancies using breya?

You can't actually do anything "infinite" times in magic. If you've demonstrated a loop that you can repeat as many times as you like, you have to specify the number of times you're doing it as well as what the end state will be. Fortunately this number can be stupidly large. (e.g. flicker palinchron ten billion times, generate fifty billion mana) Your opponent can respond at any point during those ten billion iterations, but they can't make you actually go through the motions ten billion times.

Anything one of the combos blue gets for infinite mana. Probably something involving Ashnod's Altar. Ask the EDH thread

Basalt/grim monolith + Power artifact/rings of brighthearth is a good one with breya.

Yes, 16.

Yes, a moprh creature have cmc of 0

If you pull out four of them at once, each one will trigger for itself and the other 3 friends. You'll drain 1 life, 16 times, not 16 life once. It's 16 separate triggers, they don't merge into one mega-trigger.

Yes, because a face-down spell has a CMC of 0.

I'll come back to this!

Basically, since you can activate the gain life/untap a guy/tap a guy/draw a card mode and then untap the Staff, so you can do any combination of those things as many times as you want. It's not truly "infinite" since you have to pick a number, but you could say "I generate ten billion mana. I then activate the 'draw a card' ability of my staff and untap it, and do that 40 times. Then I activate the 'gain 1 life' ability and untap it, and do that one million times. Then..." etc.

So, dependency is a certain kind of interaction between continuous effects where you ignore the normal timestamp rules.

An effect is said to be "dependent" on another effect if:

1) Both apply in the same layer or sublayer

2) Applying the other effect would change the text or existence of the first effect, what it applies to, or what it does to any of the things it applies to

3) Neither effect is from a CDA, or BOTH are (no mix and match!).

If you have all three of those, then you have a dependency. If an effect is 'dependent' on another, you apply them in that order regardless of timestamp. An example is Urborg and Blood Moon. Both work in Layer 4, the type-changing layer, and neither is a CDA. Applying Blood Moon before Urborg will turn Urborg into a Mountain, which blanks the ability on it (because 'turning things into basic land types' is weird). If we do that, then Urborg's ability won't exist. Therefore, Urborg is dependent on Blood Moon, so Blood Moon will always 'beat' Urborg, no matter the order in which they were played.

What was the hardest sort of thing to learn when becoming a judge? All the priority shit you've mentioned in the past just baffles me.

A lot of the stuff isn't really hard, it just seems a bit daunting at first. Once it 'clicks', it all makes sense.

My roughest area was policy, honestly. I could study the CR all day until I knew the rules in and out, but a lot of policy stuff (MTR, IPG) is hard to just read about (or at least, it was back when the resources were scarce). I didn't have a shop for years, so it was hard to get hands-on practice with that stuff.

What happens if master warcraft is cast and it chooses Odric, master tactician and three other creature attacks? Does Odric decides the blockers?

I'd say the newest created effect 'wins' here. Odric's trigger means they get to pick the blocks.

Sigarda's Aid says "Whenever an Equipment enters the battlefield under your control, you may attach it to target creature you control.", does this mean you pay the equip cost or you just attach it for free? Because it seems vague enough to be either.