/5eg/ - Fifth Edition General

StonedTime
StonedTime

Unearthed Arcana: Three-Pillar Experience
http://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/UA-ThreePillarXP.pdf

5etools:
https://astranauta.github.io/5etools.html

/5eg/ Alternate Trove:
https://dnd.rem.uz/5e%20D%26D%20Books/

Resources Pastebin:
http://pastebin.com/X1TFNxck

Previous thread: /tg/thread/54831830#p54831830

How does your character dress? They don't just stay in unadorned armor, do they?

All urls found in this thread:
http://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/UA-ThreePillarXP.pdf
https://astranauta.github.io/5etools.html
https://dnd.rem.uz/5e%20D%26D%20Books/
http://pastebin.com/X1TFNxck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sgI9f77KnA
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/12/21/are-fighter-champion-improved-critical-hits-like-a-normal-20/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/18/only-20-hit/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/04/10/about-critical-hit/
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MoreThanMindControl
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSZO8vD54ts
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_novels_in_order_of_publication
Booteefool
Booteefool

@StonedTime
anyone try my tactician homebrew i posted in the last thread?

im still looking for feedback for longterm playing.

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

In traditional Eberron fare, since it's the best setting.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

Is there literally any reason to use a sorcerer over a wizard outside of eldritch blast spamming or twincasting buffs once per day?

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

Is this homebrew magic weapon OP to give out around level 5?

Scythe(re-skinned halberd) that when waved over the deceased in a farming manner teleports their bodies to a mass grave and sends their souls to the phylactary of the lich who crafted it.

Also kills with crits raise the slain as zombies for 1d4 days under the control of the holder of the scythe.

Requires attunement

Nojokur
Nojokur

Okay so I'm coming from WFRP, and my group doesn't know any other system. How do I sell them on D&D 5e?

DeathDog
DeathDog

What's the proper way to roll an action with multiple attacks: all attack rolls together and then the damage rolls, or one attack roll then a damage roll, etc?

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@CodeBuns
I don't think it's too powerful, I can't see it being too often that you kill someone with a crit, and even then, a regular zombie is pretty weak so it's not game breaking. Put an upper limit on how many raised zombies it can control or else you might end up with some hold person combo shenanigans to guarantee Crit kills and have an army of zombies

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@DeathDog
Why are you concerned about something so trivial?

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@StonedTime
metal shield
full plate and shield

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@DeathDog
Literally doesn't matter

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@DeathDog
Roll one attack at a time because you don't know if you're going to get a crit in there, and you need to be able to know in which order your crits came out.
Plus you don't want to kill someone with the first attack and then have wasted your second attack on a corpse

When you make an attack, roll the D20 and the damage dice at the same time to save time

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Gigastrength
Good answer. Thanks, m8.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@DeathDog
one attack roll then a damage roll
This one, otherwise you risk overkilling a creature.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@CodeBuns
Make it a +1 Halberd either conjures a zombie cohort who can be resummoned at midnight and has the ability to make a single attack as reaction when an enemy within 5ft attacks the wielder.

Alternatively, make it conjure 3-4 zombies but only for a short period of time, such as 10 miniutes a day.

As for the reaping bodies/souls, I'd say just leave that as a rumour/fluff of the weapon that it carves a slither of the soul away as it already reeks of shitty edge and far too high-magic for anything less than an artifact at that point.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@New_Cliche
Its a tool crafted by a lich used by their followers to empower him and his undead army. Sorry it has some edge to it. That "fluff" is why the adventuring party would even get it

girlDog
girlDog

@CodeBuns
Give the big bad lich +1 HP for every person killed with the scythe so that when they finally fight him they've strengthened him through their own actions

Playboyize
Playboyize

Thank you to all of the anons who provided feedback yesterday on the toxicologist rogue archetype I'm trying to make.

I've since revised it, and it definitely reads as a much stronger class, but I think it still retains the balance principles I had in mind ("easy" injury potions provide the weakest effects). To the user who thought of the type-specific poison buffs, you're brilliant.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@girlDog
Stealing this

RavySnake
RavySnake

@BinaryMan
Because your blood commands it.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Nojokur
WFRP is a shit system that takes a big shit all over any creativity you might have in making a character. You have to roll for absolutely EVERYTHING. There's no balance.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Playboyize
The idea of this sounds dumb. Why would you need an archetype that is not an assassin when you can already create poisons with basic herbalism skills? Just take herbalism expertise and tell your DM you are looking for herbs to use as poisons.

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

supposed to play from noon to 5pm
only maybe three actual hours of gameplay between autists getting into political/sociological debates, rules lawyering, fat fucks demanding food breaks instead of eating beforehand, people asking to end early because "i'm pretty tired guys work was rough this week :'("

I just want to purge evil.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Crazy_Nice
Unfortunately, full plate and shield is an extremely old trope in fantasy gaming and probably won't be going away anytime soon.
Personally, I just don't use shields when wearing full plate. 18 is enough AC in this game.

takes2long
takes2long

I'm thinking of revising the fighter class for my table. How does this sound for a rough idea:

3 maneuvers and d6 superiority die are given at 2nd level and maneuvers may be changed every time you gain a fighter level.
Battlemaster gets one more maneuver at 3rd level and a d8 superiority die. Maneuvers and superiority die progression continues as normal for battlemaster.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@takes2long
Talk to your players, not us. Many groups will still want the option of a simple fighter.
Also, you're giving the class a straight buff that it doesn't need.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Evil_kitten
my weekly group is 5:30-8 but we're lucky to be rolling by 6 generally

Soft_member
Soft_member

@takes2long
I'm thinking of revising the fighter class for my table.
Why? Give us context before you ask for our opinion.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@takes2long
Why? Fighter is pretty spiffy
you'd be better off monkeying the feat that gives extra maneuvers instead

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@VisualMaster
5e cucks thing this is a good argument
lol

Flameblow
Flameblow

@Crazy_Nice
Coming to /5eg/
Calling 5e players "cucks"
What are you trying to accomplish?

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@PackManBrainlure
Perhaps a d4 then, or restrict it to certain maneuvers? Battlemaster and the feat then gets the full list, better die etc.
@Soft_member
@Firespawn
Some of the players feel that martials are boring compared to wizards, and want more to do during combat. Rouge is still a skill monkey, and barbian is the KISS class.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@BinaryMan
flavor

and if you are REALLY into fireballs at max strength

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

Do ya'll use the optional flanking rule from the DMG?

I've always played with it, and DM'd with it, but today I did a random roll20 game and the DM didn't even think about it.

Saw another dude saying that it's broken.

Thoughts? Opinions? Cries of outrage?

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Flameblow
and if you are REALLY into fireballs at max strength
I really am
@TurtleCat
My DM started it last week now I'm back in 4e mode where it's my main objective since I'm a rouge

Spamalot
Spamalot

@New_Cliche
rouge

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Spamalot
fucking dammit
every godamn time

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@TurtleCat
i'm not a fan of it as it gives players very easy ways to get advantage. the way opportunity attacks work in 5e means you can run circles around an enemy without triggering an OA, which means you can always set up an ally for the flanking bonus if there's room.

(OAs only trigger if you *leave* someone's reach, not if you move around within it.)

And I'm saying that as a player who has abused it for advantage rather than a DM trying to balance a game.
Honestly I try to stay away from the variant rules as much as possible. None of them really add anything to the game, they mostly just take things away from the players and screw with class balance.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Nojokur
D&D is a way simpler system, and way more fun!

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@Need_TLC
Tell them to actually read the combat chapter of the PHB. Battle is a lot more than getting in range and using attack action. Actually, I'd advise you to do the same since you seem to share their notion. Battle are the fighter's play fields. They, and only they are the guys who get away with throwing shit straight into an enemy's face.

and want more to do during combat
Additionally, if your players are bored by battles, make the battles more complex and challenging. If any non-fighter gets away from an encounter without praying heavily to the dice gods it's your fault. Their enemies are too easy, to simple to overcome. Throw dangerous stuff at them. Then give them them shit for unimaginative battle tactics. Make the enemies smarter. Fighter are only fun if they see that they're doing so much better in combat than others.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Snarelure
Thankfully my regular group gets started immediately but we play 3.5 and only bi-weekly.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@Carnalpleasure
I give the enemies flanking as well.

12 Kobolds vs 5 players doesn't play out well for them.

In the opposite 4 players vs 1 ogre goes very well for them.

I tend to play large groups of vicious and intelligent enemies against my players.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

/tg/thread/54831830#p54840443
This sounds pretty good and seems really fun.
I'm playing a fiendpact and I've been going full melee to get all up in their grill. It's been great but I have staying power thanks to vampiric healing and temp hps.
You should have considerable melee options thanks to your superior proficiencies, hexblade's curse.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Need_TLC
kobolds have pack tactics so they'd get advantage anyway

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

Is there any plothooks that haven't been tried before? I'm trying to think of something original but coming up blanks here. Maybe an arch nenesis with the charlitain background who's alternate identity is an NPC party member?

Methshot
Methshot

@Playboyize
Tying crafting to a class always rubs me the wrong way on an immersion level. Why not just make a feat (or better yet, just allow) for a player with the right skills and proficiencies to craft poisons?

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@Gigastrength
Is there any plothooks that haven't been tried before
no

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@BlogWobbles
What about - and hear me out here - a GOOD Drow?

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Gigastrength
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sgI9f77KnA

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@StrangeWizard
What about - and hear me out here - a LAWFUL Tiefling?

Bidwell
Bidwell

@StrangeWizard
I could deal with a goo drow.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@TurtleCat
It makes some class features useless (like the barbarian's Reckless Attack) and makes GWM even more powerful. We played with it for a bit then tuned it down to a +1 bonus to hit.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Supergrass
I'm going to save you 20 minutes of listening to that fat fuck. The most important thing when making a memorable villain is a badass voice. Some people think it's moral ambiguity or strong motivations, but none of that comes even close to the importance of a villain sounding cool whenever they talk

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Supergrass
@Illusionz
These are pretty dope actually

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@StrangeWizard
Memes aside considering the aftertaste of Drizzit and the fact Viconia has yet to be outdone I usually look at Drow PC's with derision

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@VisualMaster
Who is the fat fuck? Can't be bothered opening it.

Techpill
Techpill

@cum2soon
Is this your rule for heavy armor in general?
I want to go fighter with chain, shield, great swords and longsword for complete versatility

WebTool
WebTool

@Need_TLC
12 Kobolds vs 5 players doesn't play out well for them.
In the opposite 4 players vs 1 ogre goes very well for them.
This is true with our without flanking

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@BunnyJinx
I think I hate gnome npcs even more. Why do weebs always pick the gnomes?

whereismyname
whereismyname

I'm the DM of a game and one of my characters wants to play a dueregar with a way to get around the sunlight sensitivity using something like sunglasses basically, does this really unbalance the race that much?

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@TurtleCat
I've only seen Gnomes as joke PCs. I've never seen a non fighter or barbarian Gnome PC. Except as an Illusionist multiclassed Mage back when it actually mattered

massdebater
massdebater

@whereismyname
If he wants to play the race give him the downsides of it

hairygrape
hairygrape

@Gigastrength
No idea

Evilember
Evilember

@Techpill
Historically chain was used with shields, so I would have no problem playing a character like that. Also, 16 is not necessarily high enough fro a frontliner.
If you have a longsword, you don't really need a greatsword because the longsword is versatile. It would be better to get a different alternate weapon, perhaps one with reach.

@whereismyname
If someone wants an unusual character, they should deal with unusual difficulties.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Evilember
a better alternate would be a bludgeoning weapon

eGremlin
eGremlin

@whereismyname
If you're concerned about unbalancing it, then consider having him lose Darkvision while they're equipped.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@RumChicken
Damage type matters extremely little in 5e.

@eGremlin
That won't solve much - he'd simply remove them whenever he entered darkness.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@lostmypassword
Yeah bad example.

In my mind kobolds got extra advantage on top of flanking and not the other way around. That's how ingrained this was till I actually read some rules.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@PurpleCharger
I've been fucked before by it so now I'll always be mindful of it
They were gargoyles and swords did dick

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@Evil_kitten
9 PM to 2 AM online is my usual game times.

Techpill
Techpill

@PurpleCharger
Yes, but now you have the opportunity as DM to incorporate scenarios that alter the light levels (daylight spell, plunging a sunlit room into total darkness, etc.)

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Raving_Cute
Gargoyles have equal resistance to all weapon damage types.
If you have a DM that uses damage types more than the base game, that's something I can't know, but maybe it WOULD be good for you to carry different weapons.

@Techpill
Maybe. After the first couple of times, it would feel trite and the player would rightfully complain you're targeting them.

FastChef
FastChef

Is Storm King's Thunder any good?

idontknow
idontknow

@StonedTime
If you're putting it in there to specifically screw him over, sure. But I'm going on the assumption that there's at least one other pc with no darkvision.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@FastChef
From my experience no but I did not have the greatest dm

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@FastChef
It's one the most consistently liked published adventures in 5eg, along with Curse of Strahd and LMoP (for beginners)

Bidwell
Bidwell

After "Greyhawk Initiative" and "Three Pillars" I no longer look forward to UA.

Methnerd
Methnerd

Playing around with a few character builds for an upcoming game. Thinking of picking a fighter since the party so far is:

Sorcerer
Bard
Paladin
Warlock (I think, he may have left or changed to a druid)

1. Human variant, Polearm master and Sentinel feats, you know the drill.
2. Human variant, sword and board with shield master and tough feats. Make a real tank.
3. Half Orc fighter crit build.

For the first 2 thinking of taking battlemaster and obviously champion for the crit build. Starting around level 3 or 4. Just want any advice/recommendations for fighters. Have never played a class without spells before.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Bidwell
You're a shit who complains about free material. The UAs have been consistently strong in that we got a lot of good stuff, the dming advice in the downtime UA was alone worth the equivalent of paid product.

FastChef
FastChef

@FastChef
Only if your party wants to play it exactly as the book assumes, and the DM makes the giants morons. Even then, it's quite bland and most of its content is intended to be skipped (you can go to X places, but there's no need to do more than one, and the narrative suggests that solving problems in those extra places wastes time).

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@CouchChiller

Ten cents has been deposited into your bank account.

WotC thanks you for your continued patronage.

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Methnerd
2. Human variant, sword and board with shield master and tough feats. Make a real tank.
This, but Resilient instead of Tough. Also works as a Dwarf, Orc, or Dragonbitch.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Fuzzy_Logic
Don't be a little shit. You've been nothing but whiny.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Methnerd
Half-Orc Champion. Sword and Board.
Take Brawny Feat for Expertise in Athletics.
Take Shield-Master for Shove as Bonus Action.

Sparta people all day every day.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@CouchChiller
Just because it's free doesn't mean i can't call them out on half arsing it.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Flameblow
Then don't use it, no one cares if you do or don't. Sure, do that, try not to be a little bitch about it though.

askme
askme

@New_Cliche

Greyhawk initiative wasn't new content, it was put on twitter months before, and the three pillar experience is basically pages of restating stuff already in the DMG as BASIC INFORMATION, with a small section on an alternate EXP system.

Bidwell
Bidwell

@Supergrass
Why resilient though? +1 to my con won't change the mod with array and I'd already be proficient in con saves? Or is it for a different skill?

@Poker_Star
Love it.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

Where can I find monster manual pdfs?

RumChicken
RumChicken

@StonedTime
Let's just say i wear many hats

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Bidwell
@Poker_Star
@Supergrass
@Methnerd
@Methnerd

I'm new but why would anyone take either of the other subclasses over battle master? It juwst seems way better. EK just seems to get low level spells (better to multiclass) and champion gets nothing other than a 5% crit chance.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@askme
Not everyone goes on Twitter, or cares to. As long as they're releasing material they want to test out to the general public that's good but the material was weaker.
To say you've been soured on UA just because of the previous two UAs when the other UAs have been pretty good is the definition of an entitled whiny little bitch.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Flameblow
I'm more of a fan of upcasting scorching rays under mantle of flame personally. Phoenix sorc is so good for flavor, shame it's kinda crappy mechanically, I hope it gets a revision at some point

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Soft_member
And that's what I'm calling you out for.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@whereismyname
Related question: is there any logical lore reason wearing sunglasses wouldn't fix sunlight sensitivity?

Skullbone
Skullbone

@New_Cliche
Champion gets an extended crit range at 15
18-20

WebTool
WebTool

@Crazy_Nice
Is that really not something people did?

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Carnalpleasure
I feel like at least one reason is that nobody wants to deal with day-raids from sunglass wearing drow

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@girlDog
Oh shit m8 that's good.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@TurtleCat
I don't want to use it as it makes advantage way too easy to get, but my group is a product of 4e, so we always use it

Soft_member
Soft_member

@GoogleCat
@Methshot

Too much about crafting relies on "ask your DM" or other DM fiat because 5e is deliberately light on complicated rules. The rules that do exist tie into "downtime days," which I have literally never seen formally used outside of Adventurer's League.

What's wrong with someone essentially putting recipes in writing to make casual crafting, in this case of poisons, codified and less of a headache?

cum2soon
cum2soon

@WebTool
Full plate is ridiculously effective. It was more efficient to put both hands on your weapon for greater control at that point.

@New_Cliche
You realize that 5% doubles the crit chance, right? It might not be phenomenal by itself but it can be fantastic with a critfishing build.

Inmate
Inmate

@WebTool
I'm no expert or the person you're responding to, but outside of jousting I think full plate and a shield would largely be considered somewhat redundant. I wouldn't say that is really enough to push something out of "realistic" territory when you consider fantasy art in the broad sense though

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@Evil_kitten
We play from 4:30 pm to 10 pm. Sometimes we start earlier, but usually I feel like I could keep going for an hour or two more.
We have played for 9 months now and only have had to cancel like three games. Started at level 1 and are getting to level 12 next Friday. Feels good.

Emberfire
Emberfire

@Soft_member
Like I said. I just find things like "you can use this plant to make something at level 12" kind of anathema to immersion. That opinion also extends to things like engineer/gadgeteer classes that make power armor or guns or whatever. These sorts of things tend to wander into the territory of difficult to justify limitations like "You can magically only carry X amount of bombs at a given time" that completely take me out of a game, and feel like evidence it just shouldn't be a class in the first place

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

Any user help me come up with a build for a wandslinger.

I had the idea for a character that uses magic without really being a mage. Instead of casting big powerful spells he pelts you with lots of low levels spells to deal damage.

For example instead of throwing a fireball they might just cast magic missile, twice, adding their modifier.

Like, a counterfeit mage.

TechHater
TechHater

@Skullbone
The champion should really have gotten Superior Critical at 11th level and Devastating Critical at 15th: your weapon attacks score a critical hit on a roll of 15-20.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@TechHater
A 30% crit chance without advantage is fucking absurd

viagrandad
viagrandad

@VisualMaster
At high levels there's thief rogues with Use Magic Device, but otherwise I'm not sure if there's really much way to not be a caster and freely use wands

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

Would a Sea Sorcerer with two levels in Warlock for Eldritch Blast with repelling blast be overpowered? Would you allow it?

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Gigastrength
No, yes

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Lord_Tryzalot
But you're at 15th level, something like the GOO warlock can create a permanent thrall with no save on an incapacitated individual.
Think of like abilities at similar level

idontknow
idontknow

@viagrandad
But you're at 15th level, something like the GOO warlock can create a permanent thrall with no save on an incapacitated individual.
Think of like abilities at similar level

Techpill
Techpill

@viagrandad
problem with that is the "use item" for some reason doesn't apply to magic items, so you can't use them as a bonus action.

Even if you could, you'd lose the ability to sneak attack since it doesn't apply on spells, and sneak attack is basically THE reason you'd play rogue.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@AwesomeTucker
@idontknow
What's so strong about that ability? The target is charmed and you can talk to them telepathically. The charmed condition isn't fucking mind control, and the feature is nullified by Remove Curse or anything that removes charms.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Techpill
It's pretty hard to level to that point and not have something better to do than point a want at someone. In theory you would only need a single level in a caster class to be able to attune though, so you could just either take a small dip in one or just go eldritch knight or something

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@LuckyDusty
Sometimes I wonder why anyone would choose GOO for any reason aside from flavor.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@StonedTime
Most of my characters don't even wear armor period.
/tg/thread/54831830#p54841519
Late ass response, but that does sound hilarious for the sheer rarity of them.

What about /5eg/ of today? Any ideas for fun weapons for Kensei monks?

Soft_member
Soft_member

@StonedTime

I have a certain affinity for masks.

Most my characters wear a mask of some sort.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@VisualMaster
Nothing really comes to mind besides Sorcerer's metamagic. Maybe check that out?

Methshot
Methshot

@Lunatick
I'm kind of annoyed that it never occurred to me to use a blow gun with a kensai. It's not like it would actually be amazing by any means, and I'd probably never actually do it, but the idea of killing a creature by standing in front of it and shooting a non-poisoned blow gun dart in their face is priceless

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@Emberfire

Honestly? That's fair. Crafting or "material-based" classes need to treat their resources as sustainable and renewable, without being infinite, in order to work. And yeah, it's not realistic so for people who prioritize immersion, it's sloppy.

I feel like it comes down to the Venn Diagram of "robust item crafting," "realistically balanced" and "fun gameplay" being three distinct, completely separate circles.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@VisualMaster
That's a Rogue Thief for you, with Fast Hands, and Use Magic Device.

A Refluffed Artíficer could do.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@LuckyDusty
Because you can still give directives to the thrall, and the feature can only be negated if someone passes the check to determine what is going on with the thrall.

Think of creative fucking uses. This isn't fucking metagaming nonsense.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@King_Martha
@LuckyDusty
There is also no fucking limit to how many times you can use it.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@King_Martha
@King_Martha
Because you can still give directives to the thrall
Which they don't have to obey because "charmed" isn't mind control.

There is also no fucking limit to how many times you can use it.
Same with crits...

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@LuckyDusty
You also maintain a mental link with the thrall as long as you're on the same plane of existence, it's absolute gold for intrigue/information gathering information. If you don't understand how versatile and how powerful it can be, you're fucking retarded.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@Skullbone
@cum2soon
i'm pretty sure i read something that mathsed out the battle master bonus damage as roughly equal to the average damage increase from the 5% extra crit chance

but considering the combat versatility you get from battle master i'd take it 100% of the time over extra crit

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@Skullbone
Which they don't have to obey because "charmed" isn't mind control

Its advantage on Charisma rolls with a +10 in persuasion

w8t4u
w8t4u

@Skullbone
You gain advantage on socially interactive checks against the creature.

Emberfire
Emberfire

@Skullbone
All charisma based checks given towards the thrall are made with advantage. It really kinda is like mind control.

Not all crits connect.

WebTool
WebTool

@Crazy_Nice
Champion doesn't catch up to Battle Master's extra damage until like 50 attacks per short rest.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@Boy_vs_Girl
Its advantage on Charisma rolls with a +10 in persuasion
@w8t4u
You gain advantage on socially interactive checks against the creature.
@Emberfire
All charisma based checks given towards the thrall are made with advantage. It really kinda is like mind control.

I don't think you guys understand how Persuasion works. It's not mind control. No matter how high you roll, there are plenty of things a charmed creature will not listen to you about. Stop trying so hard to make this ability seem more amazing than it really is.

You are the kind of people that try to roll to seduce the dragon, aren't you?

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Crazy_Nice
@WebTool
I was going to post a bunch of links but the google result for "battlemaster vs champion" returned exclusively posts about how the damage output is at best roughly the same and at worst in battlemaster's favour, so.

i mean it's not really what matters generally in an RPG, but if you're picking champion because you want to do the big damages apparently it's not actually much better than the alternative.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@Skullbone
"The charmer has advantage on any ability check to interact socially with the creature."
Read the fucking manual.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@Emberfire
Not all crits connect.
???
A crit is an auto-hit. Are you retarded?

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Ignoramus
Before shooting your mouth off, do you even understand how persuasion works?

5mileys
5mileys

@Nude_Bikergirl
See @Ignoramus

High persuasion rolls are not mind control.

massdebater
massdebater

@Emberfire
Not all crits connect.
READ THE DAMN BOOK

hairygrape
hairygrape

@Harmless_Venom
I mean not all hits turn out to be crits.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@Carnalpleasure
I think one of the DnD team got asked this and responded that Drow and the like aren't just sensitive to bright light, but basically have an allergy to sunlight, like vampires but less severe.

Whether or not this is a satisfactory answer or just an excuse for it to not work the way that would make more sense is up to you.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@massdebater
See @hairygrape

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@happy_sad
Do you?

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@Harmless_Venom
You might be. A CRIT doesn't auto-hit. A NATURAL 20 auto-hits. If a crit is not a natural 20, there's no rule that says it can't miss.

@massdebater
Same general message.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@Ignoramus
You can functionally persuade it to do tasks as long as no harm if brought to the creature, so it's gold in intrigue/information gathering missions. Creating a thrall out of a sleeping king is gold.
It doesn't have to obey all directives but you have advantage in doing so, as long as your DM isn't a dick.

If it fails an Insight check then it probably would just obey.

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Nude_Bikergirl
You can not force someone to do something just by rolling high on persuasion.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@PurpleCharger
You seem to fail to grasp simple rules.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@kizzmybutt
I don't think it could even be simpler @happy_sad

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@BunnyJinx
You're mixing up rules from 3.5 or something. In 5e a crit is just a crit

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@happy_sad
@PurpleCharger
@kizzmybutt
BOY WHAT AN INCREDIBLE DISCUSSION, THANKS FOR MAKING ME LOOK AT IT

Firespawn
Firespawn

@happy_sad
If it fails an opposed Insight check then the Charisma attempt should go through.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@Firespawn
That's not how it works.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Sharpcharm
Rules for crit. Nothing about automatic hit.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@BunnyJinx
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/12/21/are-fighter-champion-improved-critical-hits-like-a-normal-20/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/18/only-20-hit/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/04/10/about-critical-hit/

my favourite:
a critical HIT is a hit.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@BunnyJinx
You might be. A CRIT doesn't auto-hit. A NATURAL 20 auto-hits.
The Champion ability says that a roll of 19 or 20 is a critical HIT
You can't get a critical hit and miss.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@BinaryMan
How does it work? Are you going to explain anything or are you just going to screech away?

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@PurpleCharger
@CodeBuns
i honestly absolutely adore that you've been arguing, essentially, "a hit isn't a hit" this whole time.

a critical hit is by definition a hit.
i can't believe you didn't even look at what they're called.

cum2soon
cum2soon

The correction was not all hits are crits, but the Create Thrall always works when the creature is incapacitated.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Crazy_Nice
It's up to the DM. It's not that difficult of a concept to grasp, but RAW you would roll Persuasion to convince a target to do something, and whether or not they do it is up to the DM. Whether the DM decides to do this via contested Persuasion vs Insight or by "high rolls can make the target do anything" is up to them.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@Harmless_Venom
Shove the condescension. Terminology doesn't have to make sense.

@CodeBuns
THIS, however, changes things. I still maintain the RAW doesn't make them automatic hits, but apparently the RAI says otherwise. Well, I learned something today.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@BunnyJinx
@PurpleCharger
@hairygrape
a hit doesn't actually hit

Firespawn
Firespawn

@hairygrape
terminology doesn't have to make sense
hahahahaha
i haven't seen backpedalling this good since cirque du soleil

a critical hit
is a hit that is critical
it is a hit
please just accept you were super wrong and didn't read what it's called

SniperGod
SniperGod

@hairygrape
I still maintain the RAW doesn't make them automatic hits
Confirmed moron
"A HIT ISN'T A HIT BECAUSE THE BOOK DOESN'T EXPLICITLY SAY THAT HITS ARE HITS"

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@PurpleCharger
user...

DeathDog
DeathDog

@iluvmen
No fucking shit, but as long as the DM isn't a dick it should work, and as long as you aren't a fucking autist and can roleplay it well by making convincing speeches or give appropriately worded directives.
Git gud at roleplaying better.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@DeathDog
So your version of roleplaying is "I tell my thrall to do this thing that no reasonable person would ever be convinced to do, but he will if I roll high!"
kys

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@hairygrape
Even RAW and if you choose to ignore the word HIT the description @PurpleCharger
simply states that critical hits deal extra damage. It doesn't mention anything about whether it hits or miss, so by your wacky reading of the rules it just means that despite them missing they still did bonus damage.
Don't be such a tool that you have to commit to a flawed argument on the internet with strangers after clearly being shown to be wrong

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@VisualMaster
But, that actually sounds good

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@CouchChiller
Literally doesn't say anything about a one-to-one relationship between crits and automatic hits.

Like, I get it, I was wrong according to the designer, but I think y'all are making a bit too much of all of this.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@Fried_Sushi
Like, I get it, I was wrong according to the designer
HE STILL HASN'T ADMITTED THAT HE'S WRONG ACCORDING TO RAW

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@PurpleCharger
You're retarded
never mind critical HIT but 20 has always been a hit since Advanced Dungeons and Dragons and a 1 has always been a missed

King_Martha
King_Martha

@GoogleCat
Are you fucking retarded? What the goddamn fuck, do you understand at all what the following means? >by making convincing speeches or give appropriately worded directives
You're not asking the thrall to behave out of character, you fucking autist. And there's reasonable expectation for it to fail but less so because you're gaining fucking advantage every time.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@iluvmen
@DeathDog
desu the DM shouldn't be letting you roll for things he thinks shouldn't work anyway
like "hey I want to try and persuade this guy to sell me his house"
"he... won't do that? it's his house. that doesn't make any sense."

@Fried_Sushi
it's because you were making a silly argument based on silly evidence and the thing that proved you wrong was right in the name of the thing you were arguing about

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Spazyfool

Isn't mounting a horse in WFRP an insanely dangerous act attempted only by the most brazen and foolhardy of adventurers?

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Firespawn
'Hey king, make me the king'
rolls 1 on insight
'Ok sir, now you are the king'

Insight isn't even anything to do with persuasion

massdebater
massdebater

@King_Martha
You're not asking the thrall to behave out of character, you fucking autist. And there's reasonable expectation for it to fail but less so because you're gaining fucking advantage every time.
THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING THIS WHOLE FUCKING TIME
"Persuasion isn't mind control" WAS MY WHOLE FUCKING ARGUMENT
Thank you for finally agreeing with me.

Inmate
Inmate

@Fried_Sushi
read nigga, read!

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Fried_Sushi
literally doesn't say anything about a one-to-one relationship between crits and automatic hits
"If the d20 roll for an attack is a 20, the attack hits regardless of any modifiers or the target's AC. In addition, the attack is a critical hit..."

Niggah wat.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@Fried_Sushi
Give me an example of a crit missing, because I legitimately don't actually understand what you were trying to argue.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Soft_member
You really need to roleplay it out instead of just saying "hey I want to try and persuade this guy to sell me his house", that's not actually helpful but if you can make up something that should be good.

@GoogleCat
No, that was never the point or the way to do it, stop being autist.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Boy_vs_Girl
I never said a 20 doesn't automatically hit
I get that I was wrong but you don't have to invent new things to argue about

@Deadlyinx
I thought (based on 3e, probably) that the increased crit range of the champion didn't guarantee a hit on a 19. I was wrong.

@lostmypassword
All x is y
All x is z
Therefore, y = z
t. you right now

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Fried_Sushi
@Soft_member
for the record, we're talking about a game that differentiates between "melee weapon attacks" and "melee-weapon attacks." this isn't some naming oversight we're talking about, this is wotc calling a hit a hit because it's a hit.

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@RumChicken
x = y
x = z
therefore y = z

is LITERALLY HOW MATHS WORKS LMAO
STOP POSTING ANY TIME

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Skullbone
@5mileys

Oh fuck off. You must be the most unimaginative person to play with in the whole world if your don't get this.

First off, it's called Create Thrall for a reason. Why the hell dya think that is, huh?

(http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MoreThanMindControl - it's this, basically)

Create Thrall doesn't *need* to mind control the target. Otherwise we would call it 'Dominate Person', which is shock of shocks, a spell that already exists in the game!

What it gives the player is the ability to speak directly into the mind of someone who permanently thinks well of them and will believe what that voice tells them. Anytime, anywhere, for as long as they want.

A persuasion roll with charm can't exactly do much. Hundreds of them sure can.

The point isn't to be 'Dominate Person', the point is to gain allies that you otherwise might not have had.

Say you use it to Thrall the captain of the city guard. No. He is not going to kill his own men for you, or kill the King. But he could be convinced to turn his eye away from your crimes, or he could be convinced to give you information you wouldn't have gotten, or tell you important secrets. Side with you on criminal cases etc. etc.

Or hell. Convince him your the voice of his god, or of a ghost haunting his mansion or something, and drive him totally freaking nuts at all hours of the night by screaming into his head so he can be replaced by the party member you've been working up the ranks.

I love features like this. Theyre fucking fun! Sure, it requires imagination on your end and you need a DM that will actually co-operate with you. But if you don't have those two things why the hell are you playing this fucking game?

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@massdebater
No, you've been autistically screeching it's not like mind control, it's not like mind control, it's not like mind control, IT'S NOT LIKE MIND CONTROL!!! when you have reasonable expectation to succeed because you're actively roleplaying it out to do so and you're gaining advantage every goddamn time.
Nobody has been saying it's mind control, only functionally aking to it, you goddamn colossal autist, but you do have more than reasonable grounds to have it succeed.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@BunnyJinx
No, "all x is y" does not imply "all y is x" and is therefore not equivalent to x = y
You don't know basic logic.

askme
askme

@BunnyJinx
All squares are rectangles
therefore all rectangles are squares
-you

massdebater
massdebater

I'll wait till the next thread...

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Fried_Sushi
when you have reasonable expectation to succeed because you're actively roleplaying it out to do so and you're gaining advantage every goddamn time
Yet people in this thread still seem to think that Persuasion with advantage means you can convince them to do anything. Hmm. What does that sound like to you?

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@RumChicken
thinks that a crit is not a guaranteed hit
argues that a guaranteed hit cannot always be a crit
somehow makes the former statement that all crits are hits false

SniperWish
SniperWish

@askme
Oh hey, someone actually taking my side on something
This is the happiest day of my life

@Deadlyinx
argues that a guaranteed hit cannot always be a crit
Please, show me one place where I argued that.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@askme
A better analogy would be that All Rhombuses are quadrilaterals and all Squares are quadrilaterals and thus all squares are rhombuses and vice versa.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Lunatick
@askme
you are right, I was incorrect.

amazingly that is how easy it is to admit to a mistake like misreading algebra or arguing a hit isn't a hit for an hour. crit guy, you can do it to!

JunkTop
JunkTop

crowdsourcing names for features of a wizard specializing in curses
gives you a couple tool proficiencies
no clue
add hex to spellbook
evil eye maybe
get bestow curse and add some kind of expanded use to it
cursebearer maybe but it could sound better
as a bonus action after using your action to cast bestow curse you can cast a spell targeting that creature, concentration lumped together on the two
also a blank
AoE curse 1/long rest, not necessarily attached to the spell
big bad voodoo

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@Poker_Star
Do you know what roleplaying is? As long as what you're also saying is reasonably thought of. No one has been saying it must succeed no matter what, but it has a better chance at always doing so because you're always fucking getting advantage.

Learn some imagination and creative uses for fuck's sake.

Supergrass
Supergrass

I'm pretty sure what the guy was trying to say was that if you play a champion and crit on a 19, that doesn't turn the 19 into an auto-hit like the nat20 is. He might be wrong, I dunno

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@massdebater
Stop being so utterly and severely autistic that you think well delivered roleplaying can't be used to persuade, deceive or intimidate someone into doing what they want. What the fact is wrong with you?

This "I tell my thrall to do this thing that no reasonable person would ever be convinced to do, but he will if I roll high!" must be what you do and because you never succeed think others shouldn't.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Spazyfool
Learn some imagination and creative uses for fuck's sake.
Nigga I'm not arguing against it - I'm actually arguing in favor of that. What I've been saying this whole fucking time is that you can't use Persuasion to convince a target to do anything you want, regardless of how well you roleplay. That's what people were arguing higher in the thread.

5mileys
5mileys

>>54846068
>>54846090
@Harmless_Venom
Stop being so utterly and severely autistic
What does that say about you that you felt the need to post the exact same thing three times?

cum2soon
cum2soon

@ZeroReborn
You're a fucking retard. I argued for literally 9 minutes, at which point I said
apparently the RAI says otherwise. Well, I learned something today.
But I guess you can't admit you were wrong without also praising yourself and hurling a baseless accusation at the same time because your pride can't take that hit.

askme
askme

@Supergrass
that is what he was arguing.
a critical hit is a hit by definition.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@ZeroReborn
Although he was wrong I get what he was arguing though. Nowhere in the phb does it say a crit is an auto hit, just that a 20 is. So RAW a champion who rolls a 19 can miss, despite the writers clarifying.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Supergrass
You're right. That is what I was saying, and I was wrong.

@kizzmybutt
That was basically what I was saying. Then some people said "lololololol he thinks critical hit isn't always a hit" like my arguments were pulled out of my ass.
Like, I was wrong, and that happens, but the level of schadenfreude was mind-boggling.

Flameblow
Flameblow

What's some good soundtracks for pirate/sailing based campaigns?
Preferentially something like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSZO8vD54ts

RavySnake
RavySnake

@cum2soon
yeah the problem is you're holding onto this RAI thing when the rules in the rulebook clearly state you're wrong, and your only defense against it has been "well sometimes words don't mean what they say."

@kizzmybutt
book says "critical hit" in huge letters
people continue to argue it doesn't say anywhere a critical hit is a hit
>>>>>> it literally has "hit" in the same

RumChicken
RumChicken

this bread

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@askme
@RavySnake
If a "weapon attack" doesn't use a weapon by definition, it's not completely out of the question to think a "critical hit" doesn't necessarily involve a hit. Is that really such an unreasonable position to assume?

JunkTop
JunkTop

@Lord_Tryzalot
No one has, you fucking moron. But you have a higher chance of convincing because you are gaining advantage every time.

Do you fucking understand what it means to still give directives to the thrall? There is no expectation to succeed but you have higher than normal chance of succeeding.
Your autistic and continuous screeching that it's not mind control is fucking horrendous and not even needed.

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@RavySnake
I wasn't arguing that he was right, I was saying I understand why he thought it was that way.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@TalkBomber

Sell me on Eberron. All I know is that it supposedly has psionics

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@Emberfire
Not all crits connect.
@BunnyJinx
A CRIT doesn't auto-hit. A NATURAL 20 auto-hits. If a crit is not a natural 20, there's no rule that says it can't miss.
@RumChicken
All x is y
All x is z
Therefore, y = z

Which, by your very own logic in responding to @lostmypassword
;

all crits (whether they be base 20 or including an expanded range) are critical hits
all crits are hits
therefore, critical hits are hits

Which they are.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Emberburn
what about wrapping yourself up like the burned man or a mummy?

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@JunkTop
gives you a couple tool proficiencies
Malevolent Mastery
as a bonus action after using your action to cast bestow curse you can cast a spell targeting that creature, concentration lumped together on the two
Curseweaver? Something something you gain the ability to weave curses and maledictions into the casting of another spell

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@Illusionz
Don't bother playing it, it stinks.
Try Mystara instead!

TreeEater
TreeEater

@AwesomeTucker
Is that really such an unreasonable position to assume?
assuming everything is a weird edge case when there's actually no reason for there to be any confusion is unreasonable, yes

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Illusionz
It has robets

@Garbage Can Lid
No, the logical argument I was implying is
All nat 20s are crits
All nat 20s are auto-hits
Therefore, crits and auto-hits are a 1-to-1
Which is obviously a terrible logical argument to make.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Poker_Star
thank you very much

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@TreeEater
RAW he is correct though. The name is not the definition.

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@TreeEater
Well, at least we can now see that's where the point of contention is and agree to disagree (on the reasonableness, not the ruling).

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@BinaryMan
you understand you're saying the rulebook should contain a line saying "critical hits are hits," right?
you understand the reason it doesn't is because no sane human would ever expect that to be necessary, yeah?

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Illusionz
GNOME
GESTAPO,

farquit
farquit

@Illusionz
Imagine fighting on the top of a magic lightning-powered train alongside your warforged ally as a group of undead-worshiping terrorists fly in on an airship and rappel down to you. That's Eberron.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

DM asks me to roleplay as someone from my character's backstory
whip out the world's worst French accent

w8t4u
w8t4u

@Sharpcharm
That is most definitely not the example provided. In that case, it would:
x = y
x = z
(x - z) or (z - x) = 0

idontknow
idontknow

@Fried_Sushi
I guess koala bears are bears. I guess all blackboards are black. I guess starfish are fish. The name is not the definition you dense clod.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Fried_Sushi
You understand this is the game where you can make weapon attacks without a weapon, correct?

Methshot
Methshot

@w8t4u
Whoops. That should be:
(y -z) or (z -y) = 0

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Poker_Star
No one has been arguing that, you fucking retard, only you seem to because you've convinced yourself others have been arguing that.
People have only been saying you're always gaining advantage every fucking time.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Illusionz

Magic does not somehow prohibit technology, rather, it has essentially become technology. Religion and Alignment are more vague. The last World War ended recently, and now there's a bunch of sapient magic killdroids looking for a purpose. Halflings apparently ride dinosaurs. There's a bunch of monster nations, and they hire out apolitical gnoll mercs to kick the shit out of each other.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@idontknow
Not even him but you're retarded if you think this is an argument

viagrandad
viagrandad

@idontknow
@Gigastrength
so just to be absolutely clear, you're arguing there should be a line in the PHB that says "critical hits are hits?"

5mileys
5mileys

@Illusionz
The selling points are probably the higher "tech level" and the additional PC race options that are basically just monsters in other settings like constructs doppelgangers or werecreatures. I'm not a huge fan because it reminds me of steampunk
@Deadlyinx
Mystara is the dead setting with all the furry shit right?

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@SomethingNew
give my guy a German accent
end up sounding japanese

Playboyize
Playboyize

@viagrandad
No, you pedantic little shit, we're arguing that the phrasing in @CouchChiller
shouldn't use the phrase "in addition" because it makes the two events look like... well, two separate events that just happen to coincide when you roll a 20.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Playboyize
so you're saying there doesn't need to be a line in the PHB that says "critical hits are hits?"

JunkTop
JunkTop

@TreeEater
Why are you so fucking fixated on this particular phrasing issue when, as I have stated, this is the edition where "weapon attacks" don't have to use weapons?

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@JunkTop
because you won't commit either way, and I'm pretty sure it's because you don't want to admit the phrase isn't necessary because critical hits are obviously hits.

likme
likme

@Crazy_Nice
either that, or you don't want to admit you actually do thing it should say "critical hits are hits," because you realise how insane that is but you've argued yourself into a corner.

so which is it?

Techpill
Techpill

@Crazy_Nice
My exact point is that no, you can't assume anything is obvious, as with the "weapon attack."
So you know what? Yes, I think they SHOULD specify critical hits are hits. They don't have to autistically say "by the way, critical hits are hits," but they should at least remove the superfluous "in addition" and maybe just rephrase the whole section.
Happy?

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Techpill
I am positively delighted.

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

Is it really that important to be right?

What about them gnolls? They're fucking badass but also terrifying, a good enemy to put up against the pcs.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@BlogWobbles
I like gnolls when I play in more generic settings, because they give me a chance to do truly horrific shit as a DM, and I like my games gritty.
In my homebrew setting, they don't exist, because the wood elves are bad enough.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@Techpill
Well, it's something, but I'm almost ashamed for you that it took this admission instead of, you know, agreeing that a critical hit (doubling the damage die) always happens with a hit; you know, when you roll damage.

massdebater
massdebater

@VisualMaster
Rolling for stuff sounds fun. Maybe I'll try it. Take that, guy who doesn't like something. That'll teach you.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@New_Cliche
the wood elves are bad enough
Hah! Those damn elves.

w8t4u
w8t4u

@massdebater
That post is like 4 hours old.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Spazyfool
Well, when you've get amoral fey rolling around the mortal world in caravans and stealing, raping, and murdering whenever they can get away with it, gnolls just feel a bit redundant.

@w8t4u
Some people just finished dinner and are looking over the thread for things that interest them, I'm guessing.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@GoogleCat
I'm an idiot who can't come up with compelling arguments, threats, bluffs or role play that would justify what would normally seem merely plausible, be turned thanks to a roll of 30 into a certainty.

Ok then.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Stark_Naked
@farquit
@CouchChiller
@5mileys

All of these are valid. A group I used to play with called Eberron the "Final Fantasy" setting of D&D.

I really like Eberron because it just feels different. Everything is on a bigger scale because things are more interconnected. Doing the "stereotypical" things in D&D like dungeon diving can be done in Eberron but then you also have the politics and the grander scale the setting has. That cult of the undead isn't nameless, they worship the Blood of Vol, the religion of the undead-loving nation of Karrnath. Could this cult be a Karrnath cell in foreign territory to convert locals? Is it really just an isolated group?

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@SomethingNew
"I roll to seduce the dragon"

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@Gigastrength
If you were to put eberron on a timeline similar to Earth's would you say its approximately after WW1? or would you say it's closer to the napoleonic wars or earlier?

eGremlin
eGremlin

I'm making a High Elf Arcane Archer. Any idea what cantrip I should take?

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@BunnyJinx
That isn't how most roleplaying is resolved, you don't just straight up roll. Git gud.

Methshot
Methshot

@eGremlin
If you can't think of anything else, Prestidigitation makes your life a helluva lot more comfortable. Warm things, cool things, dry things, dampen things, flavor things, re-odorize things...you can make every meal taste like a fantastic banquet, your clothes and blankets will always be the right temperature, and you will always be as clean as can be.

You can have 3 effects active for an hour, and you can end them as an action. You can eat your meal and make a food taste heavenly, end the effect when it's in your belly, and move on to the next dish.

Just has to be non-living. The possibilities are INSANE.

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Methshot
Well I will probably take either Prestidigation or Mage Hand. I'm still thinking about it.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

Would it break anything to give the party a magic item that can Searing Smite without concentration?

WebTool
WebTool

@BunnyJinx
"Lo oh great and mighty wurm, pithy but before we do such terrible violence, could we not trade but a brief banter?
I see you have wrought around you great power, that you have come bare with with talons and breath and cunning, but behind all that, have you not brought as well doubt?
Your minions have not wrought you victory, nor have your trappings. And yet, here while your victory is surely at hand, do you think of us of such really small power, that it is truly worth the battle?
Tell me oh great Venomfang, are you truly that far without rivals? I hear Isohedron the White dares beyond his station. What guarantees you he is not outside, waiting?
And if you entertained this thought for a second, how much sweeter would it not be to Inflict the same upon him?
Come then oh magnificent, let us join in this strike now, and as ancient law demands, through consort seal our bargain

And then you roll to seduce the dragon

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@BunnyJinx
I can't roleplay properly so I'll keep making this autistic statement.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@Crazy_Nice
magic

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Bidwell
You already have Con. You take Resilient with something like Dex (since you have Shield Master) or Wis.

Nojokur
Nojokur

I've got my paladin to level 4. I'm planning to slide him into Sorcerer. Should I do this now, or wait until 6? My cantrip would automatically shoot up. Also, I'd technically gain a 2nd level spell slot. Could I do anything with that?

idontknow
idontknow

@Nude_Bikergirl
implying even the best roleplay imaginable would allow that role
This is the kind of autism I'm talking about

Evilember
Evilember

@cum2soon
"Your attacks score a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20"
score a critical hit
Tell me, how is it possible to "score a critical hit" and miss?

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@idontknow
With the best roleplaying imaginable there's a chance to succeed, especially if your DM isn't autistic and retarded like you seem to be.
You seem like the least fun and least creative person to be around.
Do you flat out autistically screech no at players?

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@Gigastrength
The only thing unique about Eberron is that, on a detail level, it plays up the fact that magic exists and people would exploit it. It turns every nation into a Halruaa or Alphatia. Every other setting also acknowledges magic, but assumes that powerful Wizards stay off doing their own shit and would never sit in a castle as the guest of the King and exploit their reality-bending powers for the economic or diplomatic benefit of the nation.

For instance, someone looking through the spell list would see that Druids can cast Plant Growth and double crop yields. Why are people not hiring Druids, they ask? Why do PC Druids not make a living casting this fucking spell on farms? Why aren't kingdoms going out of their way to foster Druids so they can reap economic benefits? Eberron assumes they would, FR ignores it.

Continual Light makes something glow eternally. A flask of oil costs 1sp and can keep a lantern burning for three nights. After four years, the Continual Light doodad burning forever on the streetcorner has paid for itself. Less, actually, when you consider you no longer need to ship this oil in, buy lanterns or wicks, or pay people to light and extinguish lanterns around town. The economy of scale would likely drive down the cost of the necessary ruby dust, too. Eberron assumes wealthy cities would jump on this, FR ignores it.

It goes on and on like this. The moment you start playing out the consequences of a magic world as though the people within it are as keen to cheese their existence as the players outside the game are, you turn your setting into Eberron. Wooden people and magical trains flow from this naturally.

All the shit about politics and grander scale? Exists in every other setting.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

we have a running theme in my game that my fighter just keeps ending up with armor that causes ordinator-tier autism wherever he goes

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@idontknow
With your continued idiotic statements @BunnyJinx
the DM would ask you to say how you would or what you would say to seduce the dragon not just straight up roll, that's retarded.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@SomethingNew
While I'm not ordinarily one to defend "I roll to persuade" and other shenanigans, characters can have 20 Charisma or Int or whatever while the players behind them don't. We don't ask the Wizard's player to actually cast a spell or the Barbarian's player to jump onto the table from standing to demonstrate that his PC can do it.

Some people aren't good at RPing. Most players' mental stats are nowhere near their PC's. Now, there's middle grounds where DMs might give modifiers to a roll or the difficulty based on the player's RPed words, but barring that, the stats and skills and other numbers are there in the game to take over when you can't play it out yourself in a way that's consistent with your character's capabilities.

Otherwise I'm telling your dumb ass that your Wizard PC can't solve my fiendish puzzle because you're a dumbass IRL and I demand you decode this Enigma machine cipher with a piece of paper and no Google.

massdebater
massdebater

@Garbage Can Lid
Fuck, eberron sounds awesome

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Spamalot
We don't ask the Wizard's player to actually cast a spell or the Barbarian's player to jump onto the table from standing to demonstrate that his PC can do it
he doesn't ask the wizard to make up spells or the barbarian to jump on the table from a standing position

Firespawn
Firespawn

@massdebater

Amazing what a little consideration for gameplay elements will do to a game world.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@massdebater

I'm glad you find it so interesting.

Anyway, here's our next DnD campaign adventure book: Forgotten Realms Remake Adventure #359.

....I'm just extremely salty RE: Storm King's Thunder. They fucking said it, man, they said airships. EVERYONE thought Eberron. Then it was more FR-shit. I fucking hate Chris Perkins.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@massdebater
The point is, that's not the setting. You can do that to FR or Mystara or whatever else you like, and most settings have a nation or two where that magical exploitation is the norm. Why hasn't it spread everywhere? Because they're kitchen sink settings and we need to have half a million square miles of steppe for the Mongolian stereotype nation, and another for the Arabian mercantile empire, and another for whitebread feudal medieval Europe, and so on.

The unique shit about Eberron is what they do with the races, really. Everything else can be found elsewhere. And, really, if you're playing in Eberron you're just as likely to have a group that ignores all that complicated magical stuff and the supposedly detailed politicking to have standard D&D adventures in a setting that simply has electric trains and pants that cast Grease 1/day not being a rarity in shop.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@Fried_Sushi
namefagging AND tripfagging

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Spamalot
Then at least try to say something and roll to hope to succeed, with the DM's encouragement, otherwise you're also defending his retarded assertion that it would fail no matter what. Do you understand the point being made?

You're also being entirely autistic, no one is pressuring the meek to say something they don't want and it's entirely unlike the examples you've stupidly given.

Otherwise I'm telling your dumb ass that your Wizard PC can't solve my fiendish puzzle because you're a dumbass IRL and I demand you decode this Enigma machine cipher with a piece of paper and no Google.
Never go full autistic retard.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Garbage Can Lid
In fairness, Eberron was also designed specifically for the 3rd edition ruleset, while settings like Birthright, Greyhawk, FR, Dark Sun, etc. etc. weren't. So it can take advantage of what the designers put in the spell lists for 3rd edition, whereas other settings have a sudden "why couldn't we do this always" question, versus only having a couple of places in the setting that use the "magical utopia" instead of basing its entire concept around that.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@haveahappyday
You seem to really love calling people autistic retards

Emberburn
Emberburn

@lostmypassword
The solution is to stop being one. And based on your blathering it seems true.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@Spamalot

Otherwise I'm telling your dumb ass that your Wizard PC can't solve my fiendish puzzle because you're a dumbass IRL and I demand you decode this Enigma machine cipher with a piece of paper and no Google.
Some can do that, will you give them inspiration?

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@Fried_Sushi
Wizards, and TSR before them, were required by the terms of the original contract under which they bought FR from Greenwood (in addition to the original purchase, royalty payments etc.), to publish/accept/whatever one full-length novel from him each year. By a later adjustment to the agreement, a full-length RPG book (sourcebook, but presumably adventure as well) can qualify for this.

That's also probably part of why they're using FR as the baseline now.

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@StonedTime
How does your character dress? They don't just stay in unadorned armor, do they?
Tends to just dress like an ordinary peasant most of the time. Even after he and the crew got rich he's hard to pick out in a bar crowd except that he's 6'4" and basically a wall of muscle balancing someone on each bicep and singing as poorly as a drunken gnoll-reared merc can.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Firespawn
Eberron considers, "What if everyone listened to wizards?"

The answer turns out to be exactly like Forgotten Realms: oops, we blew ourselves the fuck up. Only difference here is that Eberron is currently in that hey-day of the extant empire(s), whereas Forgotten Realms' advanced magical civilizations came and went and built on top of the previous one and then went again and three more times.

Really, you could plop Eberron into FR's distant past and everything plays out the same. Say Sharn is a Netherese floating city, boom, done.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Emberburn
I'm mad that I can't do ridiculous, outlandish things just because I used big words and Shakespearean language to describe them

w8t4u
w8t4u

@cum2soon
The spell list for 3e really isn't all that different from the spell lists for previous editions.

idontknow
idontknow

@LuckyDusty
Between World Wars or Post Franco-Prussian, about the time of the Chrimean war..

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@eGremlin
solving the enigma machine with a piece of paper
If a player at my table can do that I'm shutting down the game and asking them to hack the fucking Gibson and tell me the lotto numbers.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@cum2soon
If you want to roleplay someone who dearly wants to prove themselves sure play that, but here's a hint and gasp secret, roleplaying someone personable doesn't require big words and Shakespearen flowery language.

@Deadlyinx
You'd be surprised, but it also requires this dumb ass @Spamalot
making a puzzle with anywhere even close that level of complexity.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Ignoramus
If you want to roleplay someone who dearly wants to prove themselves sure play that, but here's a hint and gasp secret, roleplaying someone personable doesn't require big words and Shakespearen flowery language.
See @WebTool

idontknow
idontknow

@Ignoramus
But user, the DM can use the internet and an Enigma emulator and get godly encryption on his secret puzzle no problem. It's the player / character trying to unravel this with paper and pen that's got to be the supergenius.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Lord_Tryzalot
You could roleplay like that/that way or you don't have to, it's the character's choice. You do realize there's more than one way to roleplay something, don't you, you fucking retard and that's not my post.

Do you even understand how to roleplay?

Emberfire
Emberfire

@Firespawn
Yeah, that's some real food for thought.
@Fried_Sushi
Yeah, I can see that being a real bummer. Doesn't get to me too much, b/c I homebrew my settings. Which is why this set of ideas is such a sweet one.
@Booteefool
You can do that to FR or Mystara or whatever else you like, and most settings have a nation or two where that magical exploitation is the norm. Why hasn't it spread everywhere? Because they're kitchen sink settings
Yeah, that makes sense.
The unique shit about Eberron is what they do with the races, really.
I know they have warforged, but besides that, what's different?

Flameblow
Flameblow

@idontknow
Topkek!

SniperGod
SniperGod

@TreeEater
Do you even understand how to roleplay?
Of course I do. I also understand that even amazing roleplay won't let you seduce the dragon.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@Emberfire
Half-elves are a race unto themselves, the gob race used to own most of the continent, minotaurs aren't savages. There's just a lot of weird racial dynamics going on that normalize what other settings would consider monstrous PCs or XP-fodder.

massdebater
massdebater

@SniperGod
No, you really don't based on your weird presumptions and fucking retarded blathering, who has been saying it's an absolute certainty you blithering moron, do you actually understand words and their meaning.

There's a chance to succeed, do you actually understand what those words mean?

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

Rate my revised storm sorcerer spell list 5eg?

Ice Knife
Chromatic Orb

Shatter
Hold Person (replace with Hold Monster)
Warding Wind (to be replaced with Control Winds)

Fly (to be removed at level 18, when I can fly anyway)
Counterspell
Lightning Bolt
Haste

Greater Invisibility

Control Winds
Cone of Cold
Hold Monster (replace with Dominate Monster)

Chain Lightning
Disintegrate

Prismatic Spray

Dominate Monster

Wish

Gonna take twinned, quickened, heightened, and extended metamagics, and focus on twinned buffs/debuffs and blasting spells. Thoughts?

Evilember
Evilember

@Carnalpleasure
um yeah, sunglasses cover only your eyes not your whole body and don't block all sunlight.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Illusionz
Huh, sounds interesting. I might check out a setting book if I can get ahold of one.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@massdebater
Different user. The DC for seducing a dragon is most likely so high that any character other than a high-level bard literally has no chance to succeed.

girlDog
girlDog

@RumChicken
True, but it can be done which is the point, with amazing roleplaying based on this @idontknow
giving a positive nudge, unless your DM is fucking autistic.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@SniperGod
I really think you'd be suited to Pathfinder.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Emberburn
Consider: Drow metal shit melts when it leaves the Underdark.

The easy, bullshit-proof explanation is that the Sun gives off a special kind of radiation which doesn't bother anyone else but fucks with Drow and other Sensitive races hardcore, and there ain't no UV protection or bundling up that's gonna save you from some EM band that penetrates a solid foot of matter.

For the Drow specifically, you can say it's some polar opposite of the Faerzress, the magical bullshit radiation that permeates the Underdark, concentrations of which the Drow specifically search out to build their cities in (because it fucks with scrying and teleportation; they don't want people portaling bombs into their bathrooms).

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@SniperGod
What if the dragon is rolling to seduce you? at what level is that no longer viable?

whereismyname
whereismyname

@TurtleCat
I feel like that dragon's getting what it wants no matter what you role

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Booteefool

Dark Sun is pretty lit, though unfortunately it suffered from serious issues during its run.

- Shitty modules where the players stand around and watch metaplot characters accomplish interesting goals(I'm not making this up at all, either)
- forcing psionics onto the setting so they can sell the psionics book seperately
- same with the battlesystem

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Ignoramus

but they actually publish a lot of FR novels still

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_novels_in_order_of_publication

farquit
farquit

@TurtleCat
@whereismyname
Roll to grapple.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@massdebater
Holy fuck you're mad
No, there's no chance in succeeding to seduce a dragon. I'm sorry if I'm striking a nerve with your magical realm or whatever, but you really gotta chill out

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Poker_Star
You mean the game that emphasizes the exact opposite of what I'm arguing?

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Supergrass
forcing psionics onto Dark Sun
I'm gonna go to sleep right now so there's no time for a huge argument, just know that this is 100% a load of bullshit. If you've got some raging hate-boner against psionics, fine, but don't make shit up. It's okay to say something's not your cup of tea.

post apocalyptic setting where magic is responsible for ruining everyone's day
medieval Mad Max Thunderdome shit going on everywhere
NOT embracing the ESP/psionics phenomenon of the 60s-80s that was all-pervasive in fantasy (then still fantasy+scifi) writing at the time, whose settings closely mirror it
It's a more hardcore Barsoom. Of course it has psionics. I swear, posters here think psionics as a fantasy or sci-fi cliché was made up in the mid-90s and not something that was all over influential stories simply before their time (but not the time of the writers of various D&D settings).

Illusionz
Illusionz

@SomethingNew
Hahaha, only you are right?
Sure, whatever helps you sleep better at night, buddy.
You sure must be fun to be around.

Holy fuck you are autistic and have no understanding how to actually to play the game, it's not magical realming but sure justify your insufferability however you want.
Again, do you actually understand words and their meaning? Is English your first language?

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@AwesomeTucker

If psionics weren't shoehorned in, why weren't the psionics rules included in the set?

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@Poker_Star
Your severe, severe autism and buttmadness seems well suited to that system.
Especially since all you do is roll and screech no when things don't go your way.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Illusionz
You sure must be fun to be around.
Holy fuck you are autistic
kek

takes2long
takes2long

@MPmaster
You aren't even denying it.

w8t4u
w8t4u

@Sir_Gallonhead
I think you might need to take a class on reading comprehension, because that's literally the opposite of what I'm doing.
Nice projection tho

likme
likme

Should my Monk be Sun Soul or Open Hand?

TreeEater
TreeEater

@takes2long
Why would I? You've clearly made up your mind.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@MPmaster
Yes? I don't see what that has to do with what I said: they have to publish at least one novel from Greenwood a year, and a sourcebook can qualify for this.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Nojokur

Same user. Even if I don't know any second level spells, could I still burn it with smites?

Flameblow
Flameblow

@AwesomeTucker
post apocalyptic setting where magic is responsible for ruining everyone's day

only when practiced by shitty people

medieval Mad Max Thunderdome shit going on everywhere

t. never read a sourcebook in his life

WebTool
WebTool

@w8t4u
Sure you are, you keep making the stupid I roll to seduce screech. You're actually doing the exact thing you're saying you aren't. Holy shit you are mad.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@WebTool
Holy shit you are mad
Lol, why would you think that?
I'm only giving the "roll to seduce the dragon" meme because you all seem to be the exact same kind of children that think it's something you can actually do.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@SomethingNew
Any reason? Or do you just screech no over and over again? Because that's what you're doing. Even bad DMs still give the option of doing so.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@whereismyname
Even bad DMs still give the option of doing so.
Lmao. No, ONLY bad DMs give you the option to do so.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@PurpleCharger
What the fuck are you blathering about?

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Crazy_Nice
Can you read?

girlDog
girlDog

Our DM just blew everyone's minds. Besides the DM, whose basically been playing since AD&D, I've played the longest (since 2008) and everyone else just recently started playing.

We're a 3rd Level party and the campaign was happening on Faerun, mainly in the Underdark. We were doing Out of the Abyss. While fleeing the Drow we just escaped, we found a pool of water with a portal at the bottom. Suddenly, we come out in a small base on an Asteroid. That was when the DM informed us we were no longer on Faerun and the campaign went from Faerun/Underdark to Spelljammer.

I was freaking excited due to stories I heard of Spelljammer, everyone else was confused as fuck as the DM began to explain to them what Spelljammer was. The last thing I expected was Spelljammer in 5th Edition. Originally, when he started saying we were not on Faerun, I figured we wound up on Eberron because of the ship that was docked in the base.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Fried_Sushi
Do you actually understand the game? My point is that even bad DMs give you the choice to do so, ie not everyone autistically screeches no at the top of their lungs like you do.

Techpill
Techpill

@MPmaster
Are you able to comprehend words and their meaning?

Evilember
Evilember

@iluvmen
Do you actually understand the game?
Yes, I do. Much better than you appear to.
My point is that even bad DMs give you the choice to do so
Thanks for agreeing with me, at least partially. Of course some DMs can do this, but they're objectively bad DMs.
I love how you keep referring to calm disagreement as "autistic screeching". It really helps your point, keep doing it.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Techpill
Better than you, apparently.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@Evilember
You seem to think you do but all anyone has been hearing is a long autistic screech of no, you can't.
No, only bad DMs like you seem to want to say no at every avenue to players. Replace the I roll to seduce with anything and you'd still screech no because you're severely autistic.

Inmate
Inmate

@Evilember
Any reason? Or is just an autistic screech of no?

@RumChicken
Whatever helps you sleep better at night ;)

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Boy_vs_Girl
say no at every avenue to players
It's unbelievable how you could be so stupid as to think that's anywhere close to my point.
Replace the I roll to seduce with anything and you'd still screech no because you're severely autistic.
Except I wouldn't, because I've been arguing the exact opposite.

Jeez, 5eg sure is dull today.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

How would you guys handle the stats of players and monsters if the party is shrunk to be a few inches tall?

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Boy_vs_Girl
autistic screech of no
@Inmate
autistic screech of no
Nice samefagging

FastChef
FastChef

@Gigastrength
This is exactly why I want to do a goo lock/sea sorc. Feel free to also grab the incantation that lets you pull enemies towards you, and suddenly you can slide people how ever the hell you want.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@PackManBrainlure
Actually understand roleplaying, mate. Give reasons why amazing roleplaying wouldn't help succeed?

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Boy_vs_Girl
Player: I'd like to high jump to the moon. Can I roll for that?
You: Sure, because to say no would be autistic screeching! I'm a genius!

Nojokur
Nojokur

@PackManBrainlure
Just to be fair, I side with you. Seducing a dragon doesn't make sense in 99.9% of campaign settings. Then you have the 0.1% of campaign settings specifically designed where everything from Beholders to Dragons can be seduced and fucked.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@PurpleCharger
Roleplaying doesn't make impossible things possible.

askme
askme

@GoogleCat
Are you actually retarded? Are you actually autistic?
One is there's a chance to succeed, understand what those words mean. The other can be attempted by magic.

massdebater
massdebater

@GoogleCat
I'd like to jump to the moon, can I roll for that
You can try
Natural 20!
You give the mightiest leap you think you could possibly do, but you do not get anywhere near the moon and land back on the ground

TreeEater
TreeEater

@askme
there's a chance to succeed
in jumping to the moon

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@Nojokur
That's not what I've been arguing, I've been saying it could succeed. Magical realms are shit.
Especially if you flatter the dragon enough, whether you act on it is another matter entirely.

SniperWish
SniperWish

@massdebater
You should not roll for things that you cannot achieve. This is like DMing 101, what has this board come to?

RavySnake
RavySnake

@TreeEater
Through magic, dumbass, can you fucking read?

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@RavySnake
If you could do it through magic, you wouldn't need to roll in the first place
But no, I'm clearly the autistic one.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@RavySnake
@Carnalpleasure
@TreeEater
@massdebater
@askme
@Spazyfool
@Nojokur
@GoogleCat

OH MY GOD

SHUT THE FUCK UP

YOU ARE BOTH FUCKING RETARDED AND UPPING THE POST COUNT OF THIS THREAD WITH RETARDATION

THIS IS NOT WORTH DISCUSSING

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Carnalpleasure
My bad then. Got lost in the comment chain. I personally wouldn't let it happen in my games if it is used to start a 'romance'. However, if used similarly to how Bilbo worked on distracting Smaug, I'd be chill. I just can't see a Dragon being sexually attracted to a player character, even a Dragonborn PC.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@Fuzzy_Logic
Do you understand all of those words in their context? No shit, you wouldn't need to roll for your dumbass example, do you actually the words written in English?

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@Lunatick
THIS IS NOT WORTH DISCUSSING
I know, but making these fucks rage has been really fun for the last hour.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Soft_member
No shit, you wouldn't need to roll for your dumbass example
That. Is. The. Point.
Congrats, you still can't understand a basic English sentence! Good for you!

likme
likme

@Lunatick
This is not worth discussing
You're right

Let's go back to talking about how warlocks are bad

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Lunatick
Three, not both. I'm a third person who butted into the conversation between the first two. The conversation seemed interesting so I wanted to add my two cents in, even if I did manage to get lost in the chain.

Methshot
Methshot

@Lunatick
Are you new?
This is always what happens after 5eg hits bump limit. Every single thread.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Lord_Tryzalot
No worries, my bad for continuing. I've also been taking seduce to mean enticing to make someone do or believe something inadvisable or foolhardy.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@iluvmen
Do you understand what seduce actually means? You're the one with the magical realm on your mind but it doesn't necessarily mean sexual, and hence there should be a chance to succeed.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@AwesomeTucker
topkek

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Deadlyinx
Not this user but since it's like half the fucking thread long:

His argument is:
Natural 20 = automatic hit. Critical hits are a rider effect that apply to natural 20s. When crit range is expanded, the rider effect applies to more than just 20s ... but 20s are still the only thing that cause a guaranteed hit, because they are separate from critical hits.

Which, as we know; they are not. Critical hits are critical *hits*. But that's what his argument is.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@AwesomeTucker
Are you really unfamiliar with the meme? Are you genuinely new here? "I roll to seduce the dragon" is a classic and has always been in a sexual context.

farquit
farquit

What kind of BBEG have you lot wanted to run but never managed to get rolling?

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Fried_Sushi
Topkek.

massdebater
massdebater

@cum2soon
See @Harmless_Venom

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Harmless_Venom
That's a stupid meme, not gonna lie.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@likme
I'm putting a warlock together. It's only my second time playing and it felt like something outside my wheelhouse. Have I done a mistake?!

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@PackManBrainlure
And that is something I would personally allow. Tricking a dragon through use of persuasion is accepted in my games. As long as it is not done in an attempt to fuck the dragon.

This is one of the reasons why I ask my players to be specific when asking if they can do something before I give them a yes or a no.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@massdebater
Oh so you're wrong, good to know. Topkek.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@Poker_Star
Let's be honest here, all memes are stupid.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Deadlyinx
Nah, you'll be fine. The class isn't nearly as bad as 5eg memes it to be. It can be pretty fun and very flavorful with lots of chances for RP. What do you have in mind?

WebTool
WebTool

@Snarelure
I'm literally not, but I see that being wrong is something that's been incredibly hard for you to accept.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Emberburn
But they're also funny as fuck.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@Carnalpleasure
@Emberburn
True true, and good points.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@WebTool
You are actually literally wrong. See @cum2soon
Do you understand what literally means?

takes2long
takes2long

@Need_TLC
No, I'm not. The entire previous discussion was using the first definition. The fact that you would attempt to change it to the second, significantly rarer use of the word reeks of desperation. Just admit that you lost and stop trying to dig your way out of the hole you made.

likme
likme

On another note, I'm pissed that I'm starting College and it's going to cut into my time on Veeky Forums and playing D&D.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

I'm playing a lizardfolk rogue and I'm wondering what my first feat should be. Looking through PHB feats, the main one that's appealing to me right now is moderately armored. I have 15 DEX and all my other ability scores are even. I'm not gonna bother with medium armor, but the shield proficiency seems pretty useful. I'm playing a melee mastermind rogue and since I can't use my bonus to disengage, I thought it'd be useful to get that higher AC. Thoughts?

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@takes2long
Hahaha, whatever helps you sleep better at night, buddy. And the second meaning isn't even rare. It's what normal people use outside of sprouting memes because they're not autistic.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@SniperGod
GOO Warlock, aiming for tome pact. Working on his background and debating sage (astronomer or alchemist) vs charlatan (trading the disguise stuff for alchemy stuff). I've always played good, quiet characters in the past. Wanted to try someone a bit evil and high cha. He'll have some alchemy knowledge from before contact with his patron and while he's capable of making real ones, he sells fake potions to find his travels/searching/whatever.

It's all still kinda nebulous. Deciding if I want him to have been a decent guy and contact with his patron changed him, or if he's just always been kind of an asshole.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Sharpcharm
If you really think that then there's no reason to believe anything else you've said in this thread. You're unbelievably dense.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

New thread
/tg/thread/54849395#p54849395
/tg/thread/54849395#p54849395
/tg/thread/54849395#p54849395
/tg/thread/54849395#p54849395

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@StonedTime
So your entire augment is a failure and you have been screeching no this whole time because you don't like giving players choice is true, good to know. Topkek.

massdebater
massdebater

@Dreamworx
Except everything you just said is the opposite of the truth. Do you really think that just by saying it you make it true? Are you that desperate to not be wrong that you're just going to tell straight-faced lies?
I love it.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@massdebater
You're just prattling now, are you actually okay?

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@Skullbone
I'm fine, but it's nice to know that you really are so desperate that you're trying to change the topic again.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@CodeBuns
Good stuff, buddy but I would recommend actually understanding words and their meanings because you really can't seem to grasp even the simplest of words.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Sir_Gallonhead
actually understanding words and their meanings
How many times are you going to say this? Both of us know that I can understand just fine. Only you seem to believe that what you're saying makes sense.

Evilember
Evilember

@Poker_Star
Do you? Do you really? You don't understand what chance to succeed means, you don't understand the meaning of seduce outside of memes, you don't understand what literally means, are you sure you're okay?

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@Evilember
You don't understand what chance to succeed means
Except that I do. I understand that attempting to seduce a dragon, by the significantly more common definition of seduce AND the meaning that was being used for most of the thread, does NOT have a chance at succeeding.
you don't understand the meaning of seduce outside of memes
It astounds me that you actually think the second definition of seduce is more common. It really does. You could only be more wrong if you said it was the only definition.
you don't understand what literally means
You might want to look this one up too.
are you sure you're okay?
Ask yourself the same question, bud.

TechHater
TechHater

@Fried_Sushi
You actually don't because you've only been talking nonsense and just screeching no, it can't be done.
Using the normal definition of seduce rather than the meme example you've always used should have a chance of succeeding.
You might want to brush up on the actual meanings of the words instead of the meme meanings of the words.

If you know what literally means then you should've used it correctly but you didn't, forgive me for taking everything you say especially with your nonsensical prattling with a grain of salt.

You do protest too much.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@TechHater
Using the normal definition of seduce
The normal definition is the first definition. Only a complete retard would actually think otherwise. When people use seduce, 99% of the time it is using the sexual definition. But you would know that if you ever left your basement.

You might want to brush up on the actual meanings of the words
If you know what literally means then you should've used it correctly but you didn't
I can't believe you could be this fucking dense. I WAS RIDICULING YOU BY USING THE SECOND DEFINITION OF "LITERALLY". Now that I've spelled it out for you, I'll let you look up what the second definition is.

The irony here is delicious.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@likme
Way of the knife bastard

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@haveahappyday
It's cute how you would phrase it like that, the normal definition would be either the two definitions, only basement dwelling complete autistic retards like you would exclusively use the first and use it to mean meme magical realm.
I like how you made up that statistic, was it difficult?
I'm off to meet lots of friends actually, but what would I know, right?

Sure you were using the second definition of literally, you who doen't even understand the meaning of words.

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

How does Extra Attack work? It basically replaces your melee attack action with "melee attack twice", right?
https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Vampire_(5e_Class)
Wondering how Vampire's Bite and Unarmed Strike work with that. When he gets Extra Attack he should be able to grapple and bite in one turn, right?

DeathDog
DeathDog

@Sir_Gallonhead
only basement dwelling complete autistic retards like you would exclusively use the first
Most of the world isn't "basement dwelling complete autistic retards", user.
I like how you made up that statistic, was it difficult?
Oh absolutely. Took like an hour.
I'm off to meet lots of friends actually, but what would I know, right?
Of course you are.

Sure you were using the second definition of literally, you who doen't even understand the meaning of words.
I've demonstrated more knowledge than you have, by far. But thanks for playing.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Evil_kitten
Extra Attack does what it says it does: when you take the Attack action on your turn, you can make two weapon attacks instead of one.

Dandwiki
Get out.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@Evil_kitten
Using anything from dandwiki
Don't do this. Ever.

askme
askme

@PurpleCharger
@StrangeWizard
That's what a player in my party uses. I'm just wondering how it works. I'm not the DM and I don't really want to screech about balance. I'm one of two persons in our group who hasn't played at all before this campaign), so just messaging DM about stuff that's already in this class and how it actually works (in previous session vampire almost won the battle because he used both bite and unarmed strike at the same time at level 3 (Vamp 1/Gunslinger 2).

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@askme
he used both bite and unarmed strike at the same time at level 3
How the fuck did he get Extra Attack at level 3?
Gunslinger
Your DM let this fuck multiclass homebrew? And dandwiki homebrew at that? Is he retarded?

As an aside, even the level 1 features for that Vampire class are ridiculously broken. At this point I'd either stop worrying about it or leave the group, because the DM obviously doesn't give any kind of shit.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Dreamworx
He didn't have Extra Attack, that's the thing.
DM is new at DMing (and at DnD if I remember right), so far it was actually nice and DM is my friend, so I don't really want to stop playing, it's just this dude who plays his multiclass noble who looks down on everyone (aside from human nobility) and picking goddamn undead when I said that Druids don't like undead and that something else would be better. Other two players are Human Warlock and Drow Fighter (Drow died and will be replaced by monk character who was suggested by DM).

Illusionz
Illusionz

@StonedTime
He didn't have Extra Attack, that's the thing.
So he should not be able to attack twice.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@DeathDog
This is actually laughable.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@SomethingNew
One in a million chances always work nine times out of ten.

If you can't get with that sentence, then you don't get Dungeons and Dragons.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Evilember
Can I roll to attack the dragon with my sword ?
Yes
How about with my Scorching ray?
Of course
Can I roll to spot a weak spot in the dragons hide?
Of course billy
Can I roll to figure out how many stomachs a dragon has?
Of course
Can I roll for Persuasion?
NO NEVER, NOT EVER

Ok then buddy.

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