Sci-fi setting has magic

>calling something scifi when it has magic(or not!magic)

>fantasy setting has magic
>its not really magic but some kind of snowflake sci-fi shit

>Setting has magic
>Setting differentiates between mundane magic and 'true' magic

>muh jeek

>sci-fi setting has magic
>like plain old actual magic type magic
>it's even called magic
>practitioners are called magicians, mages, or one or more of the other synonyms for spellcasters
>The magic isn't just tacked onto a standard sci-fi setting, it's actually reasonably well integrated
This has never happened.

>Setting has stupid names for common shit.
Knock it off. I don't want to learn a new language just to play your godawful game.

Yes.

Science FICTION
The spaceships make the science, the magic is the fiction.

Have you NEVER read Zelazney user? Changeling and Madwand are all about this. Creatures of Light and Darkness explicitly does this.
Come on.

No, the SCIENCE makes it science, the part where the event are fictional makes it fiction. Spaceships are ENGINEERING, not science.

Engineering is a form of science you cunt.

No it isn't, dickhead.

Hey. Fuck you. The Warp is cool

Fate/_Series.txt

Perdido Street Station maybe?

Engineering is applied science

Engineering predates science.

>The spaceships make the science, the magic is the fiction.

Unless your spaceship is something that fits the laws of physics as we currently understand it's fiction. So basically does it take years to go to mars? Science fiction is fiction because it contains some macguffin that makes the setting run. In case of space adventures it's at the very least some drive tech, but usually there's some power tech too. Laser rifles and the like are also fiction.

Magic makes it science fantasy, not fiction you dummy.

>setting has unrealistic power
>it's not called plot element.

Magic applies bullshit to spontaneously achieve real-world results
Engineering applies knowledge to optimize real-world results
Science expands knowledge by gradually weeding out bullshit

Ergo, science is the process of going from one to the other.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orgone

I mean I know you're underage but this stuff has been around for a while now

>setting takes place after dark ages
>has magic

So?

>Its both OC donut steel and normal magic

If you can have engineering without science, that means it can't be applied science.

>Engineering isn't science
Something tells me your a physicist with a stuck up your ass and an over inflated superiority complex

But I've come up with this great new word for coffee and

Jokes on you, I'm working on a math degree. Science isn't pure enough.

So you have all the down sides of being a pretentious physicist, with none of the practical use and application? Yup, sounds about right.

Good luck being a middle school math teacher

Actually I'm planning to get into insurance business.

I advise against it, as you obviously lack the communication and social capability to be an effective insurance agent. Further, you'd also have to study and major in economics, which by your own admonission and your own logic that you applied to Engineering, cannot be considered following the "pure" path of math that you are so enamored with, as it is often barely even applied math at times. Thus, by logical discourse and your own admonition you show yourself to be a hypocrite no better than the engineers you patronized

When did I say that I have anything against engineers? They're just not doing science, that's all.

Everything that science discovers was already there.
So hence, science is not science.

>science fiction
>has inhabited planets beyond the Sol system
is that way.

>WOLBACHIA

>he doesn't know that the Martian athmosphere is inhabited by small amounts of archea
wew lad

>Sci-Fi setting has magic
>It's called Technomancy
Fuck you

>it's not magic, it's some shit name like "biotics"

>Only new things can be bad
Magic in science fiction thing is a weird holdover from the 60s and 70s zeitgeist. It sucks BECAUSE it's outmoded and overdone but somehow sticks around anyway. Personally I can't stand it. It's one thing to deliberately blend of scifi and fantasy elements, but too often it's just sort of shoved in there without much thought or care to making it fit with the rest of the setting.

how would you describe "magic"

and that is why god is a shitty writer.

>slam magic cards into computers that render 3D images of the creatures held inside
>watch players fight in 3D space with 2D cards

Now what do we call this?

have a campaign between magic users and donut steel not-magic users

>psychics aren't magic

YGO

psychic = comes from the mind
ki = comes from the body
magic = comes from the world

Here's the important question though. What exaclty is magic? What determines if something is magic? How do we determine if something isn't magic? And why should we care about these?

Excuse me, how would I pronounce this? It doesn't seem like any western language I've ever seen.

Its an acronym for Yu-Gi-Oh

Nice fake name for a magic system, nerd. Just call it magic. that's the whole point of the thread.

Drokkhead.

>magic system
Its a fucking cardgame you retard, as in what has been the most popular cardgame in both the East and West since the fuckdamned 90s.

Are you legit retarded?

Plus, if you were paying attention you'd know that the post chain you entered was talking about holographic cardgames in space, to which YGO is pertinant because THATS THE WHOLE PREMISE OF THE TV SHOW YOU RETARD DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT A TELEVISION IS?

>most popular card game
But that's Magic the Gathering. That's what happens when you name your magic system after actual magic. People know what you're setting is about.

I can guarantee you that normies can recognize YGO more often and easily than fucking M:tG. Plus, unlike MAgic, YGO has had numerous TV shows since the 90s that still air in every 1st world nation. Holy shit how do you not even know about it? Are you from some kind of shitty 3rd world nation or some slav shithole?

Am I being baited? Someone please tell me I'm being baited and user isn't this retarded

No, I don't think so. YGO is just a nonsense phrase for a magic system, remember?

It's your first day on Veeky Forums, isn't it kiddo?

if it is heavily tested, understood, and has repeatable experiments with predictable outcomes it stops being "magic"

No, because was making a joke to insult and make fun of the premise of

You're the retard here.

Everyone in this thread is being baited.

Nah. The guys pointing out that a repeatable, predictable system of "magic" really isn't magic, those guys are fine. It's just a natural force that exists in the world, albeit on that is not natural to our IRL world.

Everyone else though, sure. They disagree with me, so they're shitposters.
I remember when shitposters used to mean something, and we made distinctions between "trolling" "baiting" "flaming" "shitposting" "funposting" etc.
Now they're just used interchangeably even though they describe different things. Such is the decay of language.

So D&D magic isn't actually magic then?

A "magician" in D&D is more like a physicist, really.
If you want to see a good magic system, look to Exalted.

>Exalted
Its the best system to atract thatguys's

Actually that's Pathfinder.

If something creates effects that are not explainable via a known scientific principle, OR explained and mediated in universe through a technology.

One can have forcefields or FTL and still have science fiction. These require some level of "fake science" in that their exact operation might not be explainable with today's science, but they are believable, and more importantly, mediated by some form of technology. A device generates the force field.

I would even go one step further, and say that each effect must be generated by a separate technology or have a believable reason why it does multiple effects. Handwaving things like teleportation, generating explosions and mind control all under the umbrella of "nanomachines" or "biotics" still would count as magic using this definition, because these disparate effects are all generated by a single unexplained technology.

>And why should we care about these?

You don't.

This thread is made of people who don't play roleplaying games trying to sound like they play roleplaying games.

Physicists study physics, they don't invoke them at will.

technically everyone invokes physics at will, it's called doing stuff

It's Wizardry, which is a highly advanced empirical study, or Sorcery, which is a natural application of ambient energy by one's genetics, which isn't very well understood.

>The only kind of roleplaying game is fantasy
I hate you people
You can roleplay in a game without magic, and it can be very interesting and fun. But every thread here always inserts stupid magic bullshit into every setting, because neckbeards want to play wizards.

We don't invoke them, they invoke us.

BY NEWTON my hate remains in motion as my almighty fist slams down putrid words upon the input device.

By TURING I form them into the arcane and mystic runes known only to the mecho-people who live inside the box of smoke.

By WATT I cast them at the speed of thought over the ether waves yonder to your door!

I do here by invoke the ancient wills of the physics gods upon you!

>HAMBURGERS

Shadowrun.

this post should have been the end of the thread

>math

All high-end mathematics is just 'Hey so what IF...' and then you throw a bunch of rules together. It's more magic than science.

Hook, line, and sinker.

>setting has magic
>everyone is just playing an elaborate prank on me

REEEEEEEEE EVERY TIME

...

I love it

I don't think I've ever seen a single poster so comprehensively BTFO in all my years on this site

Head back to >>>/reddit, kiddo. You need to be 18 to post here.

what should it be called instead then?

>sci-fi setting has magic
>it's called magic instead of an appropriate scientific name for the new field of physics.

"""Magic""" in science fiction is just science to the setting's inhabitants.

Chronicles of Amber did it well

Wildstar had good magic. No contrived explanation just, "Yup, magic guns."

I miss that game.

I think it works when the magic is specific. The Force is ominous enough of a name and nobody is casting fireballs so it's not like they just took Merlin and changed the name. Like if all the magic is firebased you can simply call it The Flame or something.

"Sufficiently advanced technology."

Did it close already?