Jumpchain CYOA Thread #1923: I Goofed Last Thread Edition

Emberburn
Emberburn

Google Drive
http://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B1qb0_OLhDrDSmZpRWdZaGZRcWs?tid=0B20r6rsFLOg_Zk5RdVdya3hJNnc&authuser=0

Jumpchain IRC Chat
http://client00.chat.mibbit.com/?server=rizon.mibbit.org&channel=%23JumpchainCYOA
http://kiwiirc.com/client/irc.rizon.net/?#JumpchainCYOA

Rules
http://pastebin.com/Gqj3iKyn

How to Jumpchain
http://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1qb0_OLhDrDNjZmRG02SDFaRVk/view

Last Thread
/tg/thread/56798529#p56798529

All urls found in this thread:
http://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B1qb0_OLhDrDSmZpRWdZaGZRcWs?tid=0B20r6rsFLOg_Zk5RdVdya3hJNnc&authuser=0
http://client00.chat.mibbit.com/?server=rizon.mibbit.org&channel=%23JumpchainCYOA
http://kiwiirc.com/client/irc.rizon.net/?#JumpchainCYOA
http://pastebin.com/Gqj3iKyn
http://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1qb0_OLhDrDNjZmRG02SDFaRVk/view
http://boards.Veeky
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOxDGXu3BVA&feature=youtu.be&t=4m30s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqiSBxvdws&t=66s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xihzgEsV2nw
TurtleCat
TurtleCat

Is...is it safe to post?

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

Sorry about that. This should be the fixed edition.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

I claim your waifu regardless

FastChef
FastChef

I was gonna say to the Church user, Roastbeef (Riesbyfe) seemed pretty sane, albeit airheaded.

But she's also FUCKIN DEAD. Except maybe not really? Look the TATARI is dumb and I don't know how that shit works my dude

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@TurtleCat
It's never safe to post.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@BlogWobbles
Reminder that Gwen tried to kill Doom by throwing him off the comic page.
It didn't work, Doom just magicked himself back. Fourth wall shit does not work on Doom.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

So, how bad would it be if Shirou became a Demi-Servant of EMIYA in the Fourth War?

Lunatick
Lunatick

Go to Doom
Companion DoomGuy
Take them to Undertale
Have them go Ghost and make Praetorian Suit as their body
Best plan?

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

Okay before I continue, is this readable or too hard on the eyes? I had to use a dark background since the damn logo only shows up in white without a start menu. Any tips for making it readable?

Also what was the trip/moniker of the original maker? I want to credit them in the intro, especially since I'm mostly adding to what was made originally.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

What happened, anyway?

Also, how many ki perks do I need to combine before the whole world starts shaking when I power up dramatically?

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@BinaryMan

Also:
@FastChef

She's a ghost in Sion's head being projected outwards via magecraft. Or something roughly analogous to that explanation.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

Heavens will never give us the option to be Dust of Osiris.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@Dreamworx
Fourth war
He'd be a literal babby without any sword powers or justice boners

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

/tg/thread/56798529#p56805647
Indeed, it's good.
I just always found it amusing that of those following the Eighth Sacrament which we get to see or hear of, the kindest and most sane are Ciel and Kirei. Neither actually qualifies as either kind or sane.

@FastChef
She's dead, but that's not really anything to be concerned about when it comes to Dead Apostle Ancestor shenanigans. So, I stand corrected. She ranks above Ciel and Kirei among the list.

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Ignoramus
Sauce?

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Lord_Tryzalot
Fuckin ghost magics!

@Sir_Gallonhead
DON'T EVEN GET ME STARTED ON TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THAT SHIT FUCK YOU

askme
askme

@Garbage Can Lid
Yeah, it's readable. I like dark background with light text better than white background and black text for some reason.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Ignoramus
I actually want to read this now.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Garbage Can Lid
quite ironic beings that it is...
beings

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Garbage Can Lid
It's readable.

Like the visual at the top.

Brings back good memories.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Spamalot
Well, he's the same age as Tohsaka. Didn't stop her from getting into shit, and Archer might help if it's little babby pre-hero-boner Shirou.
Maybe.
I just find the idea of a little kid being able to stand up to Servants highly amusing.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@Garbage Can Lid
a e s t h e t i c as fuck my dude.

Memes aside, reads just fine to me. Admittedly I prefer white text on black backgrounds anyway.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Garbage Can Lid
I'd say it's readable, but... hrm. You might wanna consider a different font? Something a tiny bit thinner, maybe.

WebTool
WebTool

@Garbage Can Lid
The colours are readable. The format seems to be all messed up though, at least on my end. Every second line has only one or two words on it.

TechHater
TechHater

@kizzmybutt
That's the old jumptext that I'm going through and revising or adding to. You'll be able to tell what I typed since it won't be bunched together weirdly due to copypasta sorcery.
@askme
@Poker_Star
@Flameblow
Aight, cool. I'll see if I can get a bit more done before bed.
@WebTool
Blame me copy-pastaing the old text from the previous PDF. The newer text should be formatted right - I just started so it's all on the top.
@RavySnake
Hmm. Suggestions? I'm using google docs atm.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Sir_Gallonhead
Given how many times I've punched her out, I can't take her seriously anyway.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@PurpleCharger
But she's cute, and Heavens hates cute things.

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Snarelure
The problem is, without his hero boner, what reason would the Grail have to choose him?

I wonder if BabbyArcher would fight Kiritsugu or not.

farquit
farquit

@Spazyfool
SION IS THE BETTER CHOICE YOU SHIT

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Spazyfool
He used a Misaka clone two posts above you.

Your case is baseless slander.

Bidwell
Bidwell

@Supergrass
What I'd like to know is, would he fight Gilgamesh or not?

hairygrape
hairygrape

@cum2soon
Then why is there no Dust of Osiris, user?

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@Spazyfool
Alright. Hold the fuck up. Yeah, you. Right there. user. /jc/ you can shitpost at me. You can ridicule me. You can make up stories about me. You can even criticize my admittedly trash taste in waifus and canons. But never, EVER will I stand for such a falsehood of this degree! Cute things have a place on this Earth of ours! They are to inspire us with hope and to melt out icy hearts with adorableness, and remind us we have things in this world worth protecting! Cute is love! Cute is life! AND I ADORE ALL THINGS CUTE! Whether it is an Eevee chasing its tail, cat videos on the internet, or even a small pink ribbon, cute is the lifeblood of this short, fleeting life we live!

AND I BANISH THEE, FOUL LIAR AND DECEIVER!

also Melty is like my weakest knowledge point of this canon so let me actually do research and outline Alchemist first man

Techpill
Techpill

@TechHater
pic
remembers death scene

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Bidwell
And what I'd like to know is, would this babby!EMIYA become a Jumper?

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

Paging Toriko

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

Kingdom Hearts builds, anyone?

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Garbage Can Lid
The intro
They always found go missing at night.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@hairygrape
Because she's confuzzling and Heavens can't into button spam.

@Bidwell
To be honest, a lot of the reason Shirou can beat Gilgamesh is because Gil isn't willing to take him seriously. If he was a demi-servant, Gil might actually bother to try...at which point Baby!Shirou dies.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@happy_sad
@lostmypassword
I got you guys.

Thing is though, it's not actually Doom. Just an illusion based on who Gwen THINKS he should be. Iron Doom recovers and promptly thrashes him when Fake Doom corners Gwen.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Deadlyinx
Any chance of Mad Mechanist or Giant Form perks?

farquit
farquit

@Need_TLC
Could you link the storytime?

viagrandad
viagrandad

@StrangeWizard
212. KINGDOM HEARTS

Drawbacks: Old Friends and Familiar Faces, They Come, Critical Mode (1400)

Background: Drop-in, Moogle, Traverse Town

Skills: Free I live to Sell, Free Supply and Demand, Discount Master Synthesist (1100), Discount Crystal Concepts (1000)

Items: Free outfit, Free Dosh, Free Gummi Ship, Free Gummi Shipyard, Free Moogle Badge, Free Munny Pouch, Free Holographic Jumper, Deck of Cards (950), Keyblade (350), +1 key point (300)

Keyblade: Import Conflict and Resolution (13), Short, Lightweight, Sharp, Stand your Ground (12), Dual Elements [Time, Gravity] (6), MP Recovery, Lady Luck (4), 2x Strength Boost (2), 2x Spell Boost (0)

Companions: Full Import (0)

Companion Builds too big for 1 post

askme
askme

@MPmaster
Yes, very yes. I'm going to be adding a Servant background and a background for Akiha/SHIKI.

Speak of, what would I call the latter?

Bidwell
Bidwell

@farquit
Sure thing.

>>97311296

massdebater
massdebater

@TechHater
google docs
...Eeh. Hrm. I'm not too sure on most of these, but I've used Calibri, Trebuchet and Roboto before and they worked fairly well. Potentially you could also use Alegreya but it probably wouldn't work as well.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@Bidwell
Thanks.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@Deadlyinx
Heavens if you are going to have a True Ancestor race/perk could you make it so we can choose to optionally be Arcuied's sibling?

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Playboyize
Is it actually up for you? It's not working for me, for some reason.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Methnerd
Probably.
@massdebater
Calibri looks a bit better on my end. I'll see when it gets PDF'd again.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Need_TLC
I am sad now, I for some reason thought it was Doom as in the DoomSlayer.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@viagrandad
2B: Wielder, Human, Destiny Islands; Free Choose Wisely [Sword], Free Dive into the Heart, Free Your Adventure Begins at Midday, Free Don’t Ever Change, Free Paopu seeds, Discount Light My Way (300), Discount Master Form (0)

9S: Magician, Human, Hollow Bastion; Free Protect The World Border, Free MP Rage, Free MP Haste, Free Cosmic Arts, Free Ether, Light My Way (0)

Priscilla, Quelaan, Yana: Drop-in, Nobody, World that Never Was; Namine Treatment (600), Free Double-Jump, Free Protagonist’s Endurance, Free Absent Silhouette, Free Aspect of Oblivion [Death, Life, Mind], Free Corridors of Darkness, Free You Are Nobody, Free Sea Salt Ice Cream, Free Potions, Free Black Coat, Discount Enter the Void (300), Empty Mirror (100), Discount You are not Alone (0)

Nobody Forms: Free Nothingness Physiology, Free Nothingness is Eternal, Large Body (14), Free Distortion, Free Air-Walking, Free Weapon [Shield, Melee, Ranged], Free Elemental Weapon [Melee, Ranged, Melee], Magic (13), Warp (10), Durability (9), 2x Speed (7), Charge Up (6), Teleportation (3), Extra Extremities (0)

Adam, Selvaria, Elizabeth: Local Hero, Heartless, Realm of Darkness; Hunger (600), Free Best Defense, Free Glide, Free My own Shadow, Free Living Shadow, Free Evil Radar, Free Corridors of Darkness, Free Heart Stealer, Free Playful Shadows, Free Watch your Shadow, Free Emblem Sticker Pad, Free Skateboard, Discount Hello Darkness (300), Discount Creeping Shadows (200), Discount My Friends are my power (0)

Heartless Forms: Free Darkness Physiology, Free Darkness is Corrupting, Large Size (14), Shadow (12), 2x Speed Boost (10), Free Emblem, Disconnect (8), Durability (7), Claws (6), Human Embodiment (4), Armory of Darkness [Nanoblades, Valkyrian Spear, Positron Blades] (1), Magic (0)

6/8 companions either fighting the murderboner, or going nuts from cognitive dissonance

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@farquit
that IshtaRin
Holy shit.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@TreeEater
http://boards.Veeky Forums.org/co/thread/ 97311296

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@TalkBomber
Ishtarins are pretty lewd

DeathDog
DeathDog

@TreeEater
Not working for me either.

FastChef
FastChef

@askme
Oni-blooded?
Demon-kin?
Demonic Bourgeoisie?

@Methnerd
I mean, technically aren't they all siblings? Or rather, given how they're made is the concept of sibling even applicable...other than twins.

*Is still hoping for it to be an origin*

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Burnblaze
The Doom Slayer
In Marvel
That'd actually be pretty cool.

@DeathDog
This user @TurtleCat
gave me an idea. Let's try this: /co/thread/97311296#p97311296

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@VisualMaster
@TalkBomber
Lewd but cute.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@FastChef
I mean, technically aren't they all siblings? Or rather, given how they're made is the concept of sibling even applicable...other than twins.
I know, but at the least she and everyone around us could consider Arc and I to be siblings.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@askme
Somewhat disappointing fact: the phenomenon that sometimes causes the moon to appear larger when close to the horizon is just called a "Moon Illusion." I was hoping for a much snappier scientific name, which would've been perfect. Now I'll have to think about it some more to come up with a good one.

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@GoogleCat
There we go!

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

What are some good jumps for gaining power after reaching city-busting level?

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

DC:U jump
Great, More Time Travel [600cp]:
"No matter how badly someone damages the timeline you will always exist.
Barring something like the complete destruction of earth and humanity, or all of reality being rewritten, you will always be able to survive any temporal alterations with your memories intact
and remain at least roughly the same individual you were before someone altered the timeline."

Is it fair to interpret this as making me able to survive the Retcon in one piece if I take the Sburb jump as a capstone (a.k.a the homestuck drawback)?

5mileys
5mileys

@Illusionz
True.

I suppose it could be something like you being the metaphorical run-off of power when the True Ancestors made Arcueid. Probably the closest thing to a proper sibling other than TAs who were made in pairs or such.

takes2long
takes2long

@Sir_Gallonhead
DC:U jump
The what now?

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Deadlyinx
Emilia is a cute! A CUTE!

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@takes2long
Whoops, meant JLU

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@Methnerd

Would being her sibling be a good idea? I mean while being a possible successor to the crimson moon sounds cool it seems like it kind of leads to possession if your strong enough.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@StrangeWizard
Only if you give up your identity.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@askme
Will that No Sell perk be given any significant changes?

How about calling them Demonic Descendants?

iluvmen
iluvmen

@StrangeWizard
New to this discussion, but the reason I would want it is just so I could get whatever genetics went into sculpting those hair intakes and thighs.

Playboyize
Playboyize

How would Lucifer Morningstar react to a Jumper who has a perk that allows him to have total free will where no being, not even the Presence, can control and predict his/her fate and action?

Snarelure
Snarelure

@cum2soon
Probably just going to be a Dead Apostle capstone and fluffing the description a bit - going by the logic that strong enough Dead Apostles aren't too bothered by sunlight, if I'm remembering right? I might be wrong, though.

Also, ended up keeping the old name.

Demon-Blooded - Blood is thicker than water, indeed. Your family is one of several who intermingled with the demonic Oni in an ancient past - perhaps a lost sibling of the Tohno Family, or even the Kishima family. Maybe even a different one entirely, lost to the records of history and the attentions of those who care to see it? Either way, such families usually end in tragedy as such monstrous bloodlines usually create such bloody results...or simply mundane disappointments. The family you’re part of is respected and likely fairly wealthy, even if that luxury likely came at the loss of a normal life or childhood. It’s also likely you’re one of the more ‘fruitful’ results of your bloodline...giving you all the benefits of a human body and a monstrous ability...and all the downsides of both together.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Playboyize
Probably kill them, since such a being would be completely non-deterministic and therefore utterly terrifying to any being that lived in a world of cause and effect.

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@Playboyize
A nod and a snarky comment?

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@Snarelure
Servant - You have lived your life in the shadow of someone else. Always in the background, always unseen and simply tending to your duties. Perhaps it’s just a job you take pride in. Perhaps it’s all you’ve known. Maybe you have nowhere else to go or be. Either way, the one thing that a caretaker, a janitor, and a maid all have in common is that it is your duty to keep things nice and tidy and to ensure your employer is able to face the next day. That’s all. And perhaps the most surprising and interesting thing is the sort of impact a person like that can have on someone’s life...or how it ends, entirely in your hands.

And one more.

farquit
farquit

@Snarelure
Hm...seems pretty good. One sentence uses the word 'such' a lot though.

Maybe change it to something like: >Either way, such families usually end in tragedy, as truly monstrous bloodlines usually create equally bloody results...or simply mundane disappointments. ?

askme
askme

@StrangeWizard
Eh, technically all True Ancestors and Dead Apostles are possible successors, it's just that Crimson Moon mainly focuses on Arcuied and Altrouge because they're the strongest/most akin to him.

likme
likme

Do we have a Shantae jump?

Playboyize
Playboyize

@farquit
Either way, these families usually end in tragedy as such monstrous bloodlines usually create incredibly bloody results...or simply mundane disappointments.

How's this?

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@Playboyize
Looks good.

Flows nice and easy.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@TurtleCat
You don't need to absolutely deterministic to generally have cause and effect.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@likme
We do not. Are you offering to make one? Because that would be great.

TechHater
TechHater

@likme
Sadly no.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

Alright, I gotta go to bed soon, but the last backgrounds are Alchemist, Dead Apostle (getting a price reduction to 400 unless I change my mind) and True Ancestor for 1400-1600, not sure yet.

I might also have to disappear abruptly if my area catches on fire, so...mind that if I vanish. Seeya all around.

Supergrass
Supergrass

@ZeroReborn
I am not a good jump maker. I would have to do too much research for it. Though I am kinda surprised that we lack this jump.
@TechHater
Sad is correct.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@TurtleCat
Yes, but this isn't "not absolutely deterministic", it's "not deterministic". If the Presence can't even make probabilistic assessments of your behavior, you're not even in the Everett-Wheeler model.

askme
askme

@Ignoramus
Good night, and may our praises for you light your nightmares! Not your regular dreams though, you should enjoy those.

Also, be safe.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Ignoramus
spoiler
Dang, that's a pretty expensive background. Are they really that good? Asking as someone unfamiliar with the setting.

Good night, Heavens, I hope your area doesn't catch on fire.

@Supergrass
Well now I am sad as well.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Ignoramus
Califag
Ugh.
Good luck Heavens. Hope the fire doesn't reach you.

JunkTop
JunkTop

@Ignoramus
Sleep tight, Heavener.

DAA HYPE

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@VisualMaster
Are they really that good?
True Ancestors could whoop the asses of most Servants. Basically only the most bullshit of Servants, Gods, and Types are above them.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Lord_Tryzalot
Huh, I didn't know that. Cool.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@Lord_Tryzalot
Defintiely not. Arceuid, the super true ancestor with bullshit power ups from the planet, was said to be equal to 3 or so Servants, way before power creep made what the average or even good Servant level was much higher. A normal True Ancestor is way, way below her considering she wiped them out after they became demon lords without turning herself.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Skullbone
Shiki can beat Servants. You're trying to apply logic.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@askme
Well, less "successors" and more "fragments of Crimson Moon which he can turn into himself if their potential is great enough." A minor distinction, but an important one - Crimson Moon did not die, thus there are no successors.
The one most ignore as being among the most likely to be the new form of Crimson Moon is Zelretch, but I think he should be counted as being near Arcueid and Altrouge.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@RavySnake
Shiki has the potential but not the ability to keep up with Servants to seal the deal. Stop trying to excuse your lack of logic and reasoning with memes.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@VisualMaster
Dang, that's a pretty expensive background. Are they really that good? Asking as someone unfamiliar with the setting.

Well, we're talking Servant level stats, conceptual adaptation (i.e. heavy resistance/immunity to magecraft systems and conceptual effects they're exposed to and survive), personal-time-reversal based regeneration that isn't reliant on the consumption of blood, no physical needs (i.e food, water, maybe air), and Marble Phantasm (i.e the ability to manifest natural phenomena, including making new bodies for yourself if yours is rendered unrecoverable...and possibly teleportation).

Though, keep in mind that our examples are all based on Arcueid, who is both the strongest of the True Ancestors and was made for the explicit purpose of putting down insane True Ancestors.

So depending on how Heavens works it, you can expect those nifty abilities to all be noticeably weaker than what Arc shows...which should still be enough to put the average Servant in the ground and deal with most Dead Apostles.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@Lord_Tryzalot
Source? The only ones of I've ever heard of being strong are Arc and her sister.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@whereismyname
You're trying to apply your own logic to Nasu statements, user. That's not how it works.

w8t4u
w8t4u

@New_Cliche
Zelretch is very unlikely to let Crimson Moon incarnate through him, he'd pull something off, even if it involved killing himself.

Techpill
Techpill

@RavySnake
I gotchu, fαm.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@SniperGod
.... Do 2B and 9S get it philosophy debates with your other companions?

Also I'd think Selvaria is more of a Nobody then a Heartless. She does use a blue light as her main weapon.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Nojokur
Isn't Arc, like, the only True Ancestor we actually have any real information on?

If it's priced at the full 1600 then it seems reasonable to me to be equal to her, since that'd already be maxing out what would be your budget in most jumps. Then again, I don't remember how harsh Tsukihime's drawbacks are.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Nojokur
Those are some pretty interesting abilities, even if we'll only get weaker versions. Out of curiosity, are True Ancestors a race or just a group that share similar abilities?

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Ignoramus

I'd recommend just putting true Ancestor as the capstone Dead Apostle perk.

It (sort of) fits and it would help with the whole too expensive background thing.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@w8t4u
He's still among the top candidates though - Keep in mind that none of the candidates mentioned actively want Crimson Moon to return, especially at the cost of themselves.

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@RavySnake
The White Princess is the last True Ancestor alive, so information on them is pretty sparse.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@RavySnake
Arc at full power, actual full power and not the 30% she is in Tsukihime, would be way too good even for 1600 with how strong the rest of the jump is. Even at 30%, she remains the top powered character in Tsukihime with a big array of special powers and resistances to most everything everyone else has.

100% Arceuid option is like putting in a option to be a Grand Servant in one of the non-Grand Order fate jumps. It doesn't matter that it's 1600 when it's that far above everything else.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Skullbone
Doesn't one of those bullshit powers ups make her one level beyond her opponent in strength? How the hell was she said to only be as strong as 3 servants?

idontknow
idontknow

@StonedTime
True Ancestors are direct descendants of Crimson Moon and are not human at all. Dead Apostles are former humans who can (generally) trace their pseudo ancestry to a True Ancestor in some way.
There are exceptions, of course - Notable would be Zelretch (turned by Crimson Moon personally)

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Nude_Bikergirl
Ah, right, sorry. I forgot about all that stuff that had her end up nerfed during the story.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Lord_Tryzalot
Simple answer:

Tsukihime hasnt had an installment in over a decade.
Fate has had installments every other year and is the current golden child of Type-Moon

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@Lord_Tryzalot
No idea. Nasu is a bit inconsistent about this. He talks as if she's naturally equal to 4 Servants (Other guy got the quote wrong, it's 4 and not 3) but he also talks as if that's mostly the scaling power, since he points out that she'd lose to Gil because the scaling is a poor match up power to his treasury.

I personally assume it's more like she has good servant level stats and then the scaling takes care of the rest. Middle ground.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Nude_Bikergirl
So when do you see your 100% Arc and where do you get this 30% number from?

JunkTop
JunkTop

@SniperGod
The game itself. Nasu as well. Read the wiki page on her if you want to get into the conversation and haven't played the game. It explains all of this.

You don't see 100% Arc at all, since it goes from 30% in Tsukihime to Archetype Earth in Melty Blood, which is something different (maybe).

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@RavySnake
Keep in mind that the Arcueid we see in Tsukihime is running on the same amount of power as a Ghoul and is a stiff-breeze away from keeling over thanks to Shiki.

@StonedTime
They're a species/race.

Made by the Planet and Crimson Moon Brunestud/Type Moon

@CouchChiller
Eh. That'd be like making the JoJo Vamp captsone 'You're actually a Pillar Man'.

Kind of invalidates the origin, and any perks to do with blood-drinking and lessening the weakness to the sun.

@Nude_Bikergirl
Isn't it that she's normally at 30% power, but she used most of that making her new body after getting sliced up by Shiki?

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@PackManBrainlure
.... Do 2B and 9S get it philosophy debates with your other companions?
for that jump, when we weren't dealing with the consequences of creating maso-infused neo-humans imagine baby Dante/Vergil, now imagine 100s of them
but their first import was Resident Evil with darkside chronicles drawback, so that fell away to exasperation and bewilderment
Also I'd think Selvaria is more of a Nobody then a Heartless.
True, but I wanted them balanced out, and the nobynoby choices were selected with the drawback for maximum healing-type

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@JunkTop
Well remember that this jump is going to cover Melty Blood too, meaning it doesn't need to be limited to Tsukihime level.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@PurpleCharger
I thought she had her full power but got reduced to 30% after the Shiki incident.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@idontknow
@PurpleCharger
Gotcha, that's actually pretty cool.

massdebater
massdebater

@Booteefool
Nah, she needs to use most of her power to suppress her Vampiric Impulses.

idontknow
idontknow

@Stark_Naked
Yeah, that still doesn't do anything. Arceuid still remains the strongest, barring her super powered form Archetype Earth.

All the new characters in Melty are much lower level than her and the only one that even pretends to be close is Tatari and that's not through raw power, just the unique hax he has.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@Nude_Bikergirl
Arc in the story isn't really better than Nidhoggr, and he's just a Dead Apostle Ancestor. If the option costs 1600 and puts you on that level, then it's really overpriced when with the 400 Dead Apostle background and some experimentation and growth you will get on the same level of power and more. The True Ancestors don't have that same capacity for growth that we know of.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Lord_Tryzalot
Her scaling is actually part of Gaia's side of the Counter Force, in her incarnation as Archetype Earth. It only takes into consideration the personal power though, so those who rely on external factors can slip through the cracks (Gil, Atlas Academy, some others.)

Side note: The fact that the Counter Guardians have not struck down Atlas Academy, despite its ability to end the World several times over, should make you think carefully before taking any actions against them as a group.

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@hairygrape
And here we see the real reason why anybody wants a Tsukihime update

Cheap power at no risk. Same as always with every other update.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@BlogWobbles
I can tell by your new IP that you're not the person I was talking to.

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

@hairygrape
Nidhoggr,

Who? also Just a Dead Apostle Ancestor is kind of an underestimate. Each of the Ancestors have their own level of haxs that puts them in the really high tier.

That's like saying that a Nuke is just an explosive.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@idontknow
*Glances at Jorge Joestar*
I mean, it's not without precedent.

@hairygrape
Who is this Nidhoggr fellow, and why have I never heard of him?

@BlogWobbles
Um...if what he said is true, it applies to the original just as much.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@hairygrape
Not really. Nero is the same sort of foe as Gil, where her scaling power is a very bad fit because Nero is a whole bunch of fighters at once.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

I'm trying to build a specific thing for my jumper, and I could use some help.

I want to build multiple forms that specialize in certain powers, hopefully with the benefit of boosting them above their normal when using the associated form. Thing is, I don't know of any perks or items that would actually help me do so. In general, I'm looking for boosts both to elements and magic (e.g. lightning form, fire form, etc) and general attributes (e.g. speed form, strength form).

Anybody know things that may help?

tl;dr help me turn myself into a sentai hero

5mileys
5mileys

@BunnyJinx
@whereismyname
I think his autocorrect got pissy at Nrvnqsr.

askme
askme

@whereismyname
Says the shitposter. Why do you even bother trying to shitpost about Jorge when it's so clear you don't know anything about it? You realise just how much power you can get outside of the Ultimate Lifeform option right? You're not that retarded? You can get any level of Stand for a couple hundred points. Free time travel is a capstone item. You can get a reality warping force to make the entire setting play to a story where you are the hero.

Tsukihime doesn't have stuff that strong compared to full power Arceuid. But you're just here to shitpost mindlessly like the shitposter you are.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@hairygrape
Offering True Ancestor as an option at the power shown by Arc in Tsukihime, when it's based on "I'm suppressing my blood thirst due to creating Roa, and you also cut me into pieces with Mystic Eyes of Death Perception" Arcueid would be disingenuous - especially as the game itself tells you that she's more powerful than that.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@iluvmen
Offering it at full 100% power would overshadow everything else in the jump even at 1600 points.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@hairygrape
You realise that 100% Arceuid is basically a TYPE right? You really think that offering Aristoteles level power in this jump is balanced?

eGremlin
eGremlin

@BunnyJinx
@whereismyname
Nrvnqsr.

And their hax is all the product of their own growth and magic experimentation, most of them still started as Dead Apostles, which is my point.

@whereismyname
Also you need to ignore @BlogWobbles
, please.

@Illusionz
We're not talking about with her Archetype powers, which I'm pretty sure she wasn't using during Tsukihime anyway. So she's just using her own power.

@iluvmen
@Poker_Star
@Skullbone
My point is that offering at the level of Tsukihime is overpriced because a Dead Apostle kicked her ass. Sure they'll need to play with magecraft a little to get there, but when they're 4 times cheaper, that'd be way worth it rather than paying 1600 for something that doesn't grow like Dead Apostles do.

You don't even have a good definition of 100% power if we're ignoring the Archetype thing, which obviously no other True Ancestor would get. I seriously think a lot of this 100% parroting is other people repeating someone's point without thinking.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@Sir_Gallonhead
There's sentai jumps.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@eGremlin
I think you are seriously underestimating the time and effort Nrvnsqr put in and doing it on purpose to justify your argument. You don't need to just 'play around a little' to get to that level.

For someone accusing others of parroting without knowing the meaning, I'd say you're going one worse for purposefully trying to misrepresent information to get your way.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@eGremlin
Her archetype powers are part of her powers. You can't just cut out the abilities she has that you can't argue against.

girlDog
girlDog

@Poker_Star
Well, truthfully all we know is that Arc is stronger than the other True Ancestors, and they're stronger than the Dead Apostles among the 27 DAA.
Since we don't have any information on them directly beyond that, I'm not a fan of offering it as an option - I just wanted to say that offering it in a weakened form is deceptive.

In terms of the story, it was important that Arc be weakened - Otherwise the Near Side in its entirety would not have needed Shiki's involvement at all.

Bidwell
Bidwell

@PackManBrainlure
She does use a blue light as her main weapon.
Well, she does say that she dislikes said blue light.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Raving_Cute
I think you are seriously underestimating the time and effort Nrvnsqr put in
Most Dead Apostle Ancestors are only a few centuries old. It's not poof and done, but it's not some massive barrier.

@Boy_vs_Girl
I can when you guys are talking about basing the True Ancestor perk on HER power level, and when the True Ancestors WON'T have Archetype.

idontknow
idontknow

@Poker_Star
@Skullbone
Not anymore than Legendary Hero in Medaka Box or Ultimate Lifeform in Jorge. Sure it's super powerful, but a running theme in the Nasuverse is that no matter how stronk you are, compatibility is everything. Shiki completely evaded all of Arcueid's senses and crippled her because he registered as a normal human, but simultaneously had one of the most bullshit abilities ever. I could see Heavensanon balancing the option around that if this argument doesn't scare him away from the idea.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@iluvmen
So who exactly are you basing it on then? Who is this other true ancestor you are saying is balanced to price it around?

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Raving_Cute
Didn't Roa have to put Nrvn together to make him like that and he was falling apart too I think?

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@idontknow
You mean the two jumps filled with loads of other extremely powerful, highly priced and competitive options? Why do people keep using examples they know make no sense?

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Sir_Gallonhead
There's a perk in Cuphead, can't remember the name, that lets you separate your powers so that you can only access them in certain forms. The more specialized the form and the fewer powers it has, the more of a boost the powers assigned to it get.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@hairygrape
Arc. Your argument is the same as mine only we want different cut offs. You're saying "Offer it at Tsukihime levels without Archetype" and I'm saying "Offer it at general Arc levels without Archetype." I'm simply suggesting you not reduce it to Tsukihime level because then there's little reason not to go Dead Apostle instead.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@Emberburn
What is her 100% power level without Archetype. Answer the question already.

WebTool
WebTool

Heavens will probably end up taking the option away
Now I am sad

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Flameblow
What is her exact power level in Tsukihime? Answer that question.

@WebTool
That was probably the goal from the start.

TechHater
TechHater

@Sharpcharm
Because TOPICAL and DRAMA-MONGERING.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@StonedTime
Equal to 4 Servants worth. Do you want me to get the quote from Nasu or are you going to keep shitposting to avoid having to admit you don't actually know what you're arguing for?

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@StrangeWizard
Yeah, get the quote so we can see if it's referring to during Tsukihime or after. We'll go from there.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@Gigastrength
Soil of Genesis was taught to Nrvnqsr by Roa to help him control the chaos of his familiars (side thought: His magecraft is likely similar to that used by the Makiri.)

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@Sharpcharm
Why are you ignoring everything I said but the mention of those two jumps? It really depends on what Heavensanon does with the rest of the jump. He's apparently reducing the pricing of Dead Apostle already, so the jump could totally be balanced in such a way that Arc at 100% isn't an otp anymore than ULF is.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@Gigastrength
Roa taught Nrvn the Soil of Genesis and the two planned to work together to stabilize the latter's Reality Marble so he wouldn't eventually be subsumed, but I'm fairly sure he became a DA using Magecraft without outside help.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@askme
ULF, with all the Perks bought, literally means that unless you do something monumentally stupid in the interim, you get the chance to snatch up near every Stand in JoJo, boosted and depending on how you interpret things also given their Requiem forms.

@eGremlin
because a Dead Apostle kicked her ass

Arcueid is normally at 30% of her power due to devoting roughly 70% to suppress her Vampiric Impulses. She also lost a significant chunk of her power to Roa when he tricked her into drinking his blood.

After being sliced apart by Shiki in Tsukihime and making herself a new body, Arcueid is basically running on empty, in regards to the 30% she has acceptable access to.

The wounds inflicted on her also don't heal well, and due to circumstances keep getting re-opened and exacerbated since she can't and is unwilling to just rest.

During the last fight with Nrvnqsr, Arcueid was casually shredding everything he could throw at her before cutting him in half. But due to her fragile state, doing so exhausted her to the point she could barely stand.

In normal circumstances though, she'd have been fine and been able to keep continually shred Nrvnqsr until he fled.

In ideal circumstances Arcueid might not be able to kill Nrvnqsr (though it very well may have starved him to death), but she certainly wouldn't have lost the fight.

girlDog
girlDog

@Sir_Gallonhead
As user says here @Burnblaze
the Debtor Capstone "You Like The New Look?" is almost exactly what you're looking for.

5mileys
5mileys

@Fried_Sushi
Q: How strong are Servants?
Nasu: Well you see, attack power is about the same as one fighter. A fighter has way too much power for one person too stand up against, but to destroy one city they'll have to refuel many times. But what makes these guys dangerous is that since they're spiritual bodies, regular weapons won't work against them. As far as destructive power goes, there are more numerous powerful weapons among modern ones, but as normal weapons won't do a thing to them, they're among the most powerful. Anyway, just as fighters can load a nuclear warhead, they each have their own Noble Phantasms and among the Servants there are ones that have ridiculously powerful ones. That's why when I meant strength being the same as a fighter I thought it would be easier to image. Oh and, if I were to say it in a sort of non-serious way, they'd be 1/4th of Tsukihime's Arcueid I suppose?

Q: About the power comparison between Arc and Servants, would the Arc being compared be the 30% one or the full one?

A: That would be the 30% Arc. It takes 7 Counter Guardians to control the Primate Murder and the Servants of the Grail War are based on these.

You are shockingly lazy and incompetent.

Inmate
Inmate

@girlDog
Could T3 Ice Cube make stuff like Ice Statutes, Ice Weapons...etc. All the interesting stuff like Sub Zero does. Besides make giant ice walls, or freeze touching opponents.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@MPmaster
Doesn't seem fair to me to judge a single option on how balanced it is when you combine it with an entire perkline and count what you do in ten years during the jump.

Methshot
Methshot

@Snarelure
No Sell increased from 400 to 600 price.....and now solely a vampire capstone.Yep,it begins.
@BlogWobbles
Really?I thought it would be the other way around since Heavensanon in my experience tend to nerf things whenever he replace a jump and is known for giving you far far below protagonist level strength/potential in jumps he makes ,at least in stronger settings like Saint Seiya and Disgeae.

@StrangeWizard
@5mileys
Continuation of Quote

Against one Servant, Arc would probably win, but against two, while Arc's having trouble against the one, the other could get behind her and nail her... maybe.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@MPmaster
You don't even need the capstone honestly. That kind of charisma is nice, but you could probably get a similar mindfucky ability by going stand farming.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@5mileys
..... so does it take more then 12 servants to defeat a 100% powered Arc then? Is she equal to a Grand?

I love how Nasu can answer a question in such a way that it causes even more questions.

WebTool
WebTool

@Methshot
Yes, that continuation is in an actual fight, where raw power takes a back step to skill and strategy. That's why he says in terms of strength and power, a servant is equal to 1/4th of Arceuid.

Arceuid is as strong as 4 Servants but two servants can beat her by being smart. Like how Shirou is not as strong as Gilgamesh but can win because of special advantages or how Saber and Archer can fight Heracles and not die straight away despite being weaker.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@StrangeWizard
That's fucking cute.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Flameblow
When it comes to fiction, people usually don't actually use percentage in the right way. 30% to 60^ of someone's power often means far more than just twice as much. So we have no clue what she's like at 100%, especially since one of those anons wants to take out an integral part of her power first to make it even more obscure.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@Gigastrength
The race by itself makes you a megagenius country flipping immortal who can basically do anything as long as it's related to biology and can easily copy and upgrade the bullshit superpowers of everyone else in the setting. It literally makes you the most bullshit thing in the entire setting by an enormous margin with the exception of your dad. If we're comparing a True Ancestor/Arcuied option to Ultimate Life Form, it should probably be more like 1200 or 1400 since there are plenty of things in her universe that can wreck her.

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Gigastrength
To be honest, those are just to ensure you don't die due to some of the drawbacks.

The race option itself is more than sufficient to become one of if not the most powerful thing in setting in less than a month.
@Flameblow
Well, if you don't mind using the manga this is something 100% Arcueid does pretty casually.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@Inmate
Why wouldn't it be able too? It'd be fairly powerful ice manipulation at that point, complexities would just become a matter of figuring things out and practice but you've given basic examples of what should be possible with relatively little time.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@Dreamworx
I repeat. Any Stand you want for 200. Absolutely nothing prevents you from getting KC or GER or even a Stand that is equal to Kars for your Stand.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@girlDog
@Burnblaze
Ooo, that sounds fun. Any others like this I could stack or is that it?

farquit
farquit

@5mileys
Thanks for supplying your proof, senpai. Now though, I have to stress, that's not exactly relevant to my argument. You see, if the Tsukihime Arc at 30% is as strong as 4 Servants, then she still only about as strong as Nrvnqsr, the Dead Apostle Ancestor. My entire argument is a comparison between Nrvnqsr and Tsukihime's Arc, with the price in mind. Do you seriously think that it's a good deal to pay 1600 to be at Nrvnqsr's power as a True Ancestor with no potential for growth, rather than paying 400, having some perk discounts and such too mind, and be able to get to Nrvnqsr's level within a mortal lifespan (remember, he got to that level through applying the magecraft he developed while a human), probably shorter if you've gone something in mind, and with even further capacity for growth with DAs have naturally and through application of Magecraft? That's my point. 1600 is just too much for Tsukihime's Arc, if you don't want to get 100% then at least acknowledge that it should be cheaper.

Also to be blunt, if 30% Arc is as strong as 4 Servants, then 100% Arc is as strong as around 13. It can easily be measured using Nasu's simplistic description.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Stark_Naked
Nope. Archetype Earth there. Anons' not wanting to use Archetype stuff so that's not a valid feat for her.

5mileys
5mileys

@WebTool
Being smart, using weaknesses or advantages...
Hell, just choosing not to fight her under anything other than the new moon during the day would be a big boost in effectiveness against her.

w8t4u
w8t4u

@farquit
Didn't an user above absolutely slaughter your argument about 30% being equal to Nero?

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@farquit
But your argument comparing Nero to Arc makes no sense. Someone pointed out that she is NOT at 30% in her fight with him. She's lost a big chunk of that power several times and is exhausted when she fights him and even then, is wiping the floor with him until she just runs out of energy completely.

Your argument about using this 400CP option, with multiple centuries at least of growth, as a measuring stick for another option makes no sense at all.

Snarelure
Snarelure

Anyone know where the Nuclear Throne Jump is?

Emberfire
Emberfire

@SomethingNew
...um, it's not.

Archetype: Earth is something that doesn't manifest until Melty Blood.

That's just Arcueid before Roa...and before Altrouge stole her hair.

@farquit
Nero also relied pretty heavily on Roa's help to become what he is. He actually flat-out tells Arcueid that one of the reasons he's after her is that if she hadn't killed Roa, he might've figured out a way to allow Nero to control/stabilize his Chaos.

So it's not like the guy did it on his own.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@w8t4u
@Gigastrength
The quote user supplied says that Tsukihime Arc is at 30%. From Nasu himself. I'd like to see @MPmaster
provide HIS quote saying that it's actually pre-Tsukihime Arc that's at 30% and Tsukihime Arc is actually far less.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Emberfire
Roa didn't help him get strong, Roa helped stabilize him so he wouldn't kill himself, more or less. His methodology to gain power was developed on his own.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@farquit
get to Nrvnqsr's level within a mortal lifespan (remember, he got to that level through applying the magecraft he developed while a human)
The fuck?
Fabro Rowan of the Sea of Estray became Nrvnsqr the Dead Apostle through his magecraft. Nrvnsqr has spent over a millenia improving himself since then.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Flameblow
That's all stuff that happens in game. I provided those quotes and I agree with the guy detailing how the Nero fight went down.

I'd actually like for YOU to get off your ass and find some quotes to support your arguments, since you've seemed to prefer everyone doing the work for you until now.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@Snarelure
It seems like DAs are getting the shaft a bit.

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@ZeroReborn
This. The user arguing for cheaper True Ancestor is outright lying. Nero has had over a thousand years to grow stronger, like DAs do, and he is trying to pass that off as just a single lifetimes worth.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@farquit
if 30% Arc is as strong as 4 Servants, then 100% Arc is as strong as around 13

I don't like how people use servants as some sort of measure of power level. Each servant is their own unique being each with their own powers and weaknesses.

I'm pretty sure that Chaos could beat down 14 Mata Hari's and yet would get shredded against 14 Gilgameshes or Karnas.

Power levels vary widely between each servant and that's not even accounting for NPs.

Also a Dead Apostle Jumper is not Chaos, you'd need centuries or even more to reach Ancestor level, and Arc can easily blow (most) of those guys out of the water.

Oh My God, why am I arguing about Nasuverse power levels over the internet, this way leads to insanity.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@CodeBuns
Reminder to kill Kuro.

happy_sad
happy_sad

Thinking on it, if True Ancestor is a race, couldn't you just use Primordial from Justice League Dark? That perk makes you the Captain America of your race, and that should at least make you equal to 30% Arc, if not more, right?

takes2long
takes2long

@happy_sad
Not really relevant to the discussion?

Inmate
Inmate

@Raving_Cute
Everyone can beat Mata Hari, but that would be rude to do, mean even. She's not even a combat Servant, Marie Fucking Antoinette is more of a combat Servant and that's more because she has abilities and skills specifically about Trying Not to Die

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Spamalot
Holy shit really?! I thought it was only normal stands, not shit like GER or Made Over Heaven. That certainly changes things.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@takes2long
I'm just saying, if you really want to reach that level of power, you don't really need to be given that by the jump itself. We have stuff for that.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@PurpleCharger
That's all stuff that happens in game.
The stuff about her parrying some attacks before she gets exhausted? That's not what I'm talking about, user. Go read his post.

user if you can't find quotes to support yours as it actually relates to mine, why should I have to?

@Stark_Naked
@ZeroReborn
Nero grows stronger by eating things. It doesn't actually take that long to get there unless you're spending most of your time trying not to dissolve into primordial chaos like he was. Also he's not the only Dead Apostle Ancestor around.

@Raving_Cute
Blame Nasu, he did it.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@takes2long
It allows you to tell the jump to fuck off with its limitations.

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

One of the anons seems to be throwing a fit about the True Ancestor perk, like he really doesn't want it to be that good for some reason. Wonder what his personal motivations are.

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@Skullbone
Because people already gave you quotes first and you've never bothered to return the favour. You've just leeched off what others have given.

Also you can't try and use the fact that Dead Apostles grow stronger with age and then try and turn around and say a THOUSAND YEARS is not going to make him a lot stronger.

I guess you're just continuing to lie but you could be less blatant.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@kizzmybutt
Eh stands are pretty freeform so whats the problem

DeathDog
DeathDog

@TalkBomber
One of the anons seems to be actively telling lies and misinformation in an attempt to get more power at a cheaper price. Business as usual.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@BlogWobbles
Because your quote isn't relevant. I can't wave a wand and MAKE your quote matter to what I'm saying, user. So no, don't act like I'd just be reciprocating you. You found a quote about power levels. It still isn't about what I was arguing, so it was not some coup de grace. I know it pissed you off to open the wiki, but come off it.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@Snarelure
Goddamn am I fucking late on this, but- that's pretty damn lame if all they're getting for a capstone is an old perk with a price hike, which would presumably no longer be discounted to the other background that got it.

If you're attached to slotting it on that level, I'd suggest an inversion of how DAs/TAs are empowered by moonlight and also making it so you actively get stronger the brighter the sun is, making it so your power is at its highest when both sun and moon are burning bright and full and lowest when either is milquetoast.

But, if you aren't attached to the concept, I'd like to suggest something based on Nero manifesting his Reality Marble through his body, and giving you a natural talent/unnatural ability to alter spells to be maintained permanently inside your own body in beneficial ways, even if they shouldn't actually be useful in that form.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@whereismyname
If you're not going to put in the effort to back up the things you say and just demand everyone constantly prove themselves to you, as if you are the one in control of the jump, people are just going to stop responding to you.

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@DeathDog
What are you personal motivations? You seem personally offended at this internet conversation.

5mileys
5mileys

@Skullbone
The stuff about her parrying some attacks
You seem to be trying to lowball Arcueid's showing there.

Nero was throwing Phantasmal Beasts at her by the end, and she just cut right through them like she did the land-shark.

It doesn't actually take that long to get there

By chance can you point me to where in the VN this is indicated?

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@DeathDog
Everyone is my enemy, everyone is trying to upset the balance of the jumpchain order, everyone is always only wanting more power always
user, have you ever had people tell you that you were paranoid before? My build is Dead Apostle and I'll keep it unless he fucks up No Sell somehow. I'm not trying to break your precious internet crossover fanfiction game.

@Lunatick
Back up what you said first, find that quote that says that Tsukihime Arc is less than 30%, or even just that she was stronger than Nrvnqsr. I never said I controlled the jump, but you're the one who came in here slinging off about quotes.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@DeathDog
This is just a game, calm down.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@lostmypassword
Still not willing to back your words up. Shame.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@5mileys
Phantasmal Beast are cool, but they vary in power a lot. You're going to have to remind me what she was cutting here, because there's a difference between a cu sith and a dragon.

Flameblow
Flameblow

@kizzmybutt
@LuckyDusty
Stands have always been an honor system thing since the original JoJo Jump. Everyone gets absolute freedom to design them as they like with the hope they don't step out of line for what Stands are.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Methnerd
You didn't back yours up either, so that puts us at an impasse if you refuse to say anything without citations.

FastChef
FastChef

Does it make you angry when you think someone is trying to get something out of a jump or when something might look like it's unbalanced?

JunkTop
JunkTop

@Flameblow
fuck the JoJo user for never finishing that fucking supplement.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

Arc's pretty strong.

BUT can she beat Shaggy? And I'm not talking about Verde Shaggy or evem Ultra Instinct Shaggy.

I'm talking about a Shaggy who has reached his perfect Blanco form and has mastred the art of the Zoinks!

I don't think so.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

What exactly ARE the limits on the things you can be a Witch of in Wadanohara? Would Moon Mother let you be a child of a specific comet, or would it be better to go with a star? Would different stars have different powers? Could I use Magic of the Cast Pearl in conjunction with a perk that lets me open up dimensional rifts to seal the evil inside the shrine and the shrine inside the other dimension? If so, if the dimension I put the shrine inside collapses, would that release whatever's sealed inside it?

Nojokur
Nojokur

@happy_sad
Couldn't you instead take the perk from Angel Notes that does the same thing but better? And if you take the origin attached to it, aren't you already the same thing as Arcueid?

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Emberburn
Not him but I think one was a Unicorn? Dunno, it has been a while.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@FastChef
I just think it's kinda sad, really. It's just an imagination game, why do you need to argue so much for higher or lower power when you can just wank it to what you want on your own?

Lunatick
Lunatick

@Nojokur
Archetype is a bit different from Type, though it's similar.

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@PurpleCharger
Has he also mastered the art of the SWOOCE?

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@JunkTop
Please tell me how would you do a supplement for stands, which are almost random abilities and no predetermined limits?

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Lunatick
Well now I'm curious: what's the difference?

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@Need_TLC
The thing that always gets me is when anons get sincerely angry and insulting because they assume someone else wants something to be higher or lower power. They leap right from 1 to 12, it's really offputting.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@PurpleCharger
I always knew Cell was the best.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@JunkTop
Quit being a piss baby for being forced to use your imagination in an imagination game.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Evil_kitten
I understand why. people get attached and no one like a liar/hypocrite/greedy guts/whatever the person in question is or is seen to be.

I think it's a bit much to think they're like, genuinely angry and full of rage. At least anymore than people get angry at games normally. Well, angry people anyway.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@GoogleCat
Be the witch of witches.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@Evil_kitten
Autism.

Autism never changes.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Stark_Naked
I wonder if unicorn is equal to Pegasus, which is an A rank NP iirc.

RumChicken
RumChicken

From Tsukihime Dokuhon Plus Period (as quoted by the Type Moon wikia):
The factors of 666 beasts are swirling around within his body, but it might be easier if you just think of it as him being equipped with 666 familiars. Because this is essentially like having 666 lives, properly speaking even a serious Arcueid wouldn't be able to kill him

For the record, the only reason he died was because of Shiki. Whether he could win is a completely different question - Weakened Arc was not overly troubled by fighting him, but she also wasn't making any progress against his absurd regeneration.

JunkTop
JunkTop

@PurpleCharger
implying anyone can defeat the Master of the Ancient Art of SWOOCE

@Nojokur
Well, there's that as well. Then again, aren't Types already way more buff then Arc is? Even her Archtype "I'm stronger then you" thing only works when she's on Earth from what I remember being discussed here before. Given that Types can transform the local landscape into their homeworld, or something like that, doesn't it cancel that out as well?

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@cum2soon
Pissbaby
Found the Tumblrite.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@RumChicken
I like how this guy is basically a super beefed Hercules.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@Ignoramus
Seems more like a really fast healing cockroach. He's not able to keep up with her, just curl into a ball and heal too fast for her to hurt.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@Ignoramus
Funny part is: He's a scholar. Hell, the only reason he died was because he was trying to understand what Shiki was doing and charged in.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@PurpleCharger
I don't think so.

Arc is about equal to an Goku Negro or possibly a Freezer Dorado at her max power.

But she can't even compete with Gohan Blanco, much less Shaggy at his base form.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@lostmypassword
@TurtleCat
.....
*sighs*
I'm going to start up Tsukihime and look for some quotes.

Only going to put in so much time on it tonight though, so it might only bear fruit in a day or two.
@Nojokur
If you take the Aristoteles origin and choose to be Type Moon, then you're by default the thing the True Ancestors are based off of, and don't manage to equal.

Also, depending on how you fanwank Notes' background, you very well may be in Arcueid's body after the events described here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOxDGXu3BVA&feature=youtu.be&t=4m30s happen

Methnerd
Methnerd

@MPmaster
I wouldn't bother. We've seen that the user continually tells fibs and then refuses to provide any citations for his own arguments. Just wait till Heavens comes back and talk to him.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@MPmaster
I'm going to start up Tsukihime and look for some quotes.
Only going to put in so much time on it tonight though, so it might only bear fruit in a day or two.
Alright senpai, I'll be here. Good on you to have dedication to the cause, if nothing else, and I'm glad you're keeping a level head unlike this guy @Methnerd
.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@eGremlin
Still waiting for you to back up your words.

likme
likme

@Ignoramus
Waiting on you to do it. It's really dumb for you to keep yelling the same point when you haven't even done it. It comes across as so petty on your part.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Ignoramus
@likme
I'm waiting on you; to wait on you, to wait on You!

To Wait on You?

Skullbone
Skullbone

@likme
Didn't people already point out that you've made several incorrect claims and link things that proved it? Like your belief on how long it took Nero to get where he is that turned out to be completely wrong?

Bidwell
Bidwell

@Skullbone
Not really, there was a quote that wasn't about what I was referring to and another user was discussing the battle, which I disagreed with in regards to Nasu's claim about Arc's power, and that guy is above saying he'll play through the game again. So that's one thing that is, from my position, refuted, and one that we're waiting on before continuing the discussion on. Your third claim here about how long it took Nrvnqsr is a different matter, because that would have to involve an argument over how much was passive DA growth and how much was his own power that made him a DAA, the consumption of Beasts to grow in power. That's something that'd be really hard to pin down and thus non-conclusive, and we never really did have a full argument over it.

Still though, I'm never going to understand why I offend you. Basically from the start you've been angry and insulting like I shot your dog.

Emberburn
Emberburn

Okay, this transcription will be in two parts. It's the relevant section of the fight between Nero and Arcueid. I apologize for any typos that got past me.

Also, while I'll still be looking for quotes from the VN, I remembered I had some scans from the manga that indicate that Arcueid was below her normal level during most of Tsukihime. I'll post the second part of the transcription when I find the second page relevant page.

“—Interesting. You are so weak you cannot even use your Marble Phantasm, yet you still challenge me?”
“There’s no need. It can’t be helped, even if I am fighting a Dead Apostle. For someone like you—these claws will be enough, Nrvnqsr Chaos.”

A short laugh comes up.

“—Fool. Realize your folly, Arcueid Brunestud—!”

Nrvnqsr raises an arm.
His coat ruffles like a cape and countless animals fly forth.

Grrrrrrrrr.

With a thunderous road, three beasts run towards Arcueid like bullets.

Not anything like black dogs,
but three giant leopards larger than Nrvnqsr himself, like large demonic silhouettes.

“—”
Arcueid can’t move.
Three leopards run, cracking the bricks under them just by running.
They’re far faster than Arcueid, who is trying to run away.

—The three beasts pounce towards Arcueid.

It’s over quickly.

In an instant,
the three leopards’ bodies are cut in half and fall to the ground.

“—What?”
Nrvnqsr’s voice booms.
Arcueid is silent.
From there, she moves to attack him.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

Fucking Nasu shit and its fanboys.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

...and it turns out the second part is over the character limit. I'll add the rest in a third post

“—!”
Beasts emerge from Nrvnqsr’s body.

The instant it emerges, the lion’s head is grabbed and torn apart from its body.

The leopard is killed the instant it attacks Arcueid by getting pierced by her punch through its head.

The tiger is torn apart like clay.
Everything following them suffers the same fate.

The same with the flying eagle and the giant grizzly bear.
The same with the shark swimming in the ground.
The same with the ridiculously large elephant.
In the end, they can’t even stop her, and turn into a black sticky fluid.

“—Wha…”
Nrvnqsr tries to escape.
Arcueid swings her claws.

—After the sound of ripping flesh,
Nrvnqsr’s body is split in two from the neck down.

“Gaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh!!”

Roaring in pain, Nrvnqsr leaps away from Arcueid.
Split from the neck to the waist, he’s lost over half his body.

Splat.
The rest of his body falls at Arcueid’s feet.

“—“
This isn’t a fight.
…What about Arcueid saying she was only able to move?
The beasts Nrvnqsr let out weren’t weak. Those lions and tigers, just one of them can tear a car into scraps.
And that grizzly bear could have torn a tank apart with its uncontrolled violence.
But such beasts were torn apart by Arcueid, and Nrvnqsr himself is half dead.

massdebater
massdebater

“Ha—“
It almost seems like a joke.
If it was this easy, maybe it would’ve been better if I wasn’t here from the start—
“GA… AH, aaaa…!”
Nrvnqsr keeps retreating as if to escape.
She might be tired…Arcueid walks towards Nrvnqsr slowly.

Panting.

I can hear heavy breathing.
…It belongs to Arcueid.

Ragged, painful breathing.
Why is that?
Arcueid’s breathing sounds more painful than Nrvnqsr’s, who is torn in half.

“—It is quite unbelievable. Weakened as you are, you still have that much power. As expected from the executioner prepared by the True Ancestors.
…Do not fact the white vampire princess—It seems the warnings of the others were correct.”
Nrvnqsr’s voice isn’t dimmed at all.

—I feel.
A horribly sinking sense of despair.

Arcueid tried to catch her breath as she slowly draws near Nrvnqsr.

—I feel.
A horribly sinking sense of despair.

Arcueid tried to catch her breath as she slowly draws near Nrvnqsr.

“But, I never expected to defeat you with only ten or twenty of myself in the first place.”
“—Enough boasting. You can’t kill me with any amount of such familiars, and I have cut off half your body. No matter what, you have no chance of winning.”
“Hah—My familiars have all been killed, but you seem to be mistaken.”
“—?”
“I do not carry familiars, nor do I use them. All those things you fought were truly me.
…It is quite unpleasant to be considered similar to the other mongrels who capture living things to repair their damaged flesh.”

“You should have been able to tell with a glance if you had not been weakened. Use your golden Mystic Eyes and see. Can you see it? The chaos of the 666 “beasts” inside my body—“

Splash.
Something moves quickly at the edge of my vision.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Need_TLC
Why is it the dude with the half-metal face has a half-metal nose in the first panel, but not the second?

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

“Arcueid, behind you—!”
“Shiki—?”
Arcueid turns around.
But, she doesn’t make it.
The half of Nrvnqsr’s body lying on the ground becomes countless large serpents which attack Arcueid from behind.
“Cr—“
The large serpents wrap around Arcueid and return to a black fluid.
Arcueid is pinned to the ground like me, but the pressure is hundreds of times worse.

“Wh, what—no way…!?”
As she is pushed down, Arcueid tried to escape.
“It is useless. You should understand what that is, Princess of the True Ancestors.”
“…!”
Arcueid’s face lights up in pain and surprise.
The remaining half of Nrvnqsr raises its voice almost as if howling.

“—Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666—Haha, are you pleased with the chaos within my body, Arcueid Brunestud?”
“Are you sane…!? A human body…having more than three hundred factors compressed in something as small and closed-in as a human shape, this is just like—“
“Indeed, no different from the Primordial Sea.
I am not making my body up with other animals. I merely use the factors called ‘animals’ as my body, mixing them like mud.”
“I have no such things as familiars. What exists are 666 beasts—the lives equal to that number.
Ripping my body in half or crushing my head is meaningless. I am one and 666. If you wish to destroy me, you need to destroy 666 lives at once.”

....and finished.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Need_TLC
I have no idea what you're all talking about but the fact you went through the trouble of transcribing this much is pretty neat.

...Kinda wanna copy this guy's gimmick now though.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

@PurpleCharger
Eh, just one of those small errors that gets missed. If you look carefully, you can see he has what looks like skin in his eye socket, despite being a Doom Bot.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Sir_Gallonhead
Is there anyone in the HISTORY of jc who could beat Trashman Calvo? I feel like even Vortex Buster would fall against him.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@lostmypassword
Keep in mind that the below is what's discussed immediately afterwords.

“Of course. –So my alter selves have no concrete existence. When released from this body which is my territory, they will take form as some kind of ‘species’ for the first time.
They have no form of their own from the beginning. You can kill them outside me, but once they return they regenerate as a part of my chaos.
…Though, even I cannot predict what they will become once they emerge. Understanding and controlling this discorded dendrogram is my eternal thesis.”

The vampire with only half a body gives a boasting, muffled laugh,

“That’s impossible…! To take in souls—if you encapsulate uncolored conceptualized existences, you yourself will disappear…!”
“Indeed. That is why this is not a single person here. The personality of Nrvnqsr already does not exist. We are not a single body, but closer to a limitless collective.
…Certainly, there is no meaning of existence in such a life. There are already life forms in the deep ocean which can be termed eternal systems. This body will lose its intelligence and become a mere ‘specimen’ just like them someday.”

“But, do you not find it magnificent?
There are things which swirl inside me, and you do not know what form they will take. This small world is like that of our world in its primal stages.
A chaotic space where what will be born is unpredictable.
The darkness of chaos just like this planets dendrogram, while still having the possibility of dramatic change.
I wish to know what lies at its culmination before I disappear.”

“This is why the Church gave me this name.
— Nrvnqsr Chaos.
Equipped with 666 beasts, no longer a vampire bur a space which has become chaos, a heretic who broke the taboo.”

So personality death, and unpredictability.

TreeEater
TreeEater

What jumps offer the chance to live in a world in which all fauna are some form of crustacean?

Emberburn
Emberburn

@TreeEater
I'm not sure if such a place exists user.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@TreeEater
Spongebob after the racewar

RumChicken
RumChicken

@TreeEater
I really just want to know why.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@TreeEater
I assume in most space settings you could find or create a planet where the animals are crustaceans.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@TreeEater
OCEANMAN TAKE ME BY THE HAND
LEAD ME TO THE LAND
THAT YOU UNDERSTAND

whereismyname
whereismyname

@hairygrape
Dead Apostle Ancestors are a weird scale of power. Kaleidoscope and the other TYPE can't hardly be called part of the same species and yet they are.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@TreeEater
Buffy has a world with nothing but shrimp.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@TreeEater
@Emberburn
@DeathDog
You could use EVO, Geneforge, and Ben 10 to make the world's fauna crustaceans. Or go to From Dust to get a giant crustacean with its own fauna.

askme
askme

In Carnivores there is

Honorable Duel - 600 (Discount Drop-in)
You're an honorable Sir or Madam right? No need for guns or this so called "hunting" sport. Just walk right up the the opponent & declare a duel. One-on-one, no tricks or weaponry only your fists, and jaws if they lack the fists. They can't refuse and anyone can be challenged.

Did anyone pull anything interesting with this like beating up Slenderman in a fist fight?

iluvmen
iluvmen

@whereismyname
Kaleidoscope and the other TYPE can't hardly be called part of the same species and yet they are.

....wat?

Zelretch was a human until he won his battle against Crimson Moon, who turned him into a Dead Apostle out of spite.

Crimson Moon is the Ultimate Being of the moon and technically the first True Ancestor (though in truth its more that True Ancestors are modeled after him).

Very different species.

@Crazy_Nice
Huh, that's true....I wonder if I could make a world's planet entirely populated by magic conchs.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

Wait, you can Marry two Quirks of the same Tier and Type, right?

Playboyize
Playboyize

@RumChicken
It just sounds like a really cool place. Also mount and blade offers a pot with replenishing butter.

@DeathDog
@Crazy_Nice
I kind of want to see a world where this occured naturally. I could genetically engineer a crustacean ecosystem at any time, but seeing it in nature would be beautiful.

@Dreamworx
Sounds promising (despite not having any crabs, isopods, or lobsters, which would be ideal). How advanced are the locals?

Emberfire
Emberfire

@Playboyize
I kind of want to see a world where this occured naturally
That's the beauty. Both settings have simulation machines that show you what happens to a setting when you introduce things. You could plug in a few adjustments and use the machines to view a world that evolved that way.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Emberfire
Whoa, I had no idea that was a thing. Thanks, jumping this immediately.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@Playboyize
Sounds promising (despite not having any crabs, isopods, or lobsters, which would be ideal). How advanced are the locals?
The sun is made of burning shrimp. Everything is shrimp. There is nothing but shrimp.

takes2long
takes2long

@Garbage Can Lid
May I ask for a reduction of the price of companions?

likme
likme

@takes2long
You may ask. No guarantee you will be happy with the answer though.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@AwesomeTucker
Sorry, I mean Ben 10 and EVO have that stuff respectively.

But they also adapt and take into account your machines and abilities to genetically alter things. So jumping the other settings for samples and the like too would only help you.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Poker_Star
You can marry any two Quirks that you desire. What made you think otherwise?

DeathDog
DeathDog

I'm in a bit of a conundrum, /jc/.

So for Farethere City, the protag is literally dead and the setting is the afterlife, and the titular city is a "Garden" which is a little part of the afterlife. Which is run by these spirits called Omens! Which can explicitly create Gardens and run them.

Now, I have several options here

1. Offer the ability to create Gardens (Omens can explicitly do that and they have to study to do it too) and turn souls inside of them into Omens that can run your Garden for you or put them on the Path To Rebirth (Not personally recommended as is but I'm sure a jumper could unfuck how shitty the process is and it's low success rate somehow)

2. Offer a scenario where you run your own personal garden for 10 years as an Omen (Or if you're not an Omen you're offered the chance to run your own Garden by the Omens to see if regular old souls are up to the task) and have that garden come with you from place to place.

Should I include both, combine the two somehow, or any other suggestions?

FastChef
FastChef

@iluvmen
I was talking about TYPE-Mercury

MPmaster
MPmaster

@SniperGod
Just wanted to make sure after I saw the pricing scheme - pay full price for the highest and 100 for the other one. If that works even on the same tier, which you seem to be saying it does, then great. I'm marrying Mania with Dreamcatcher and calling it Nightmare.

takes2long
takes2long

@iluvmen
Crimson Moon is the Ultimate Being of the moon and technically the first True Ancestor
Crimson Moon is Type-Moon. True Ancestors came about through Crimson Moon's dealings with Gaia. They are as much of earth as they are of the moon - This is why Arc is Archetype-Earth rather than Type-Earth, and why she's still a Crimson Moon body candidate.

idontknow
idontknow

@MPmaster
Yeah, in the case that both Quirks are the same tier, it's the same price either way. Sounds delightfully dreadful.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Emberburn
@Harmless_Venom
@massdebater
@Need_TLC
@Dreamworx
Alright, Arc is stronger than Nero and Arc is weakened during Tsukihime. You've established that, but are we sure Nasu means she's at 30% before or after she's been mutilated? That never seems to be clarified.

Also sorry it took me so long to respond, I was busy.

Methshot
Methshot

What kind of magic can one get by studying at hogwarts for 10 years? I always jump it pretty much just for the horcrux, and in previous chains, I've just travelled the setting's world, demonstrating my newfound inability to die to everyone by jumping off tall buildings everywhere. But is there any magic that's worth learning instead?

Emberfire
Emberfire

@lostmypassword
Nasu's given the 30% figure, but not which route it was for. Given that the Arc route doesn't give her time to recover herself, she's weaker in that route than in the Ciel route.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@DeathDog
So are people forced into being omens?

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Methshot
Utility magic mainly, think about living your life and doing magic for everything.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Emberfire
Then that's the main point of issue at the moment as far as possibly making the perk stronger than what's being shown above.

Though either way I still don't feel like the feats in the copied text are worth 1600 points, all things said.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@DeathDog
I'd prefer the ability to make Gardens personally since providing alternative afterlives to settings with REALLY bad ones is always nice, but I like the idea of a personal Garden, although I'm not sure what functionality that'd really serve in the long term.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@TreeEater
Rick and Morty has a functionally infinite multiverse, despite throwing around the phrase 'central finite curve' a lot.
There's a world where humans evolved alongside giant telepathic spiders.
There's a world where chairs are sapient, communicate through phone-pizza, sit on humans, and eat phones.
A world where phones are sapient, communicate through people-phones, sit on pizza, and eat furniture.
A world where pizza is sapient and eats humans. Their phones and furniture are normal.
You should definitely be able to find crustacean world.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@DeathDog
I'd say include both. You can have a perk to create Gardens that are run by Omens made from the souls within and stays with the setting, and then there's a scenario for your own Garden that you run and that follows you.

viagrandad
viagrandad

@AwesomeTucker
What a pretty crab.
Why am I scared/hateful of spiders, but seeing crabs makes me admire them and a little hungry?

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Need_TLC
Rick and Morty
Ugh.

takes2long
takes2long

@TreeEater
Someone could make a Noumenon jump, if they could figure out what the hell is going on in that game. I think you're in the afterlife, and the true shape of the soul is an arthropod?

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@lostmypassword
Does it matter? Your argument was that because the Dead Apostle background would eventually let you grow to being Nrvnsqr's level after a thousand years, being Arc's level in Tsukihime wasn't good enough. Now that we've shown that it is, why do you need to keep arguing?

Playboyize
Playboyize

@viagrandad
Crabs aren't small, so you're not worried about not seeing it if it's around. But mainly, you don't associate crabs with deadly venom, just a minor pinch, so your brain isn't as scared of them. It sees crabs as essentially harmless while it sees spiders as death.

Methshot
Methshot

@ZeroReborn
A True Ancestor option, without drawbacks, should be at the level of an unweakened True Ancestor (otherwise you're not really getting a True Ancestor option) - Unfortunately, we only ever see one True Ancestor, and it's either at the weakened level, or at the Archetype-Earth level (which other True Ancestors would not be.)
What we do know is that Arcueid has a Marble Phantasm which she would have normally been able to use (otherwise Nrvnsqr wouldn't have been surprised that she couldn't use it) and that most of her power is bound up in suppressing her vampiric impulses - Impulses which only exist to that extent because of the events which led to Roa coming into being as the Extra DAA.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@happy_sad
A little bit of genuinely interesting philosophical discussion wrapped in a massive pile of garbage.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@RavySnake
So is there like a spell that makes breakfast for you, or a spell that gives you honest feedback on your writing without telling anyone anything about it?

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Carnalpleasure
You can get your House Elf to do that.

Evilember
Evilember

@RavySnake
But that's what the Force is for.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@lostmypassword
Mainly I think that 1600 is still a lot for the shown feats.

@Methshot
Well all True Ancestors would have the issue with vampiric impulses, that's why they made Dead Apostles. Though they would indeed have their Marble Phantasms.

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Burnblaze
I don't want an elf in my house though. They creep me the hell out. Especially if they're anything like shelf elves.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@GoogleCat
What exactly ARE the limits on the things you can be a Witch of in Wadanohara?

There doesn't seem to be a limit as far as I know. The Witch Leader doesn't seem to have a specialization--maybe she IS a witch of witches as @Deadlyinx
brings up (Given how closely she looks like a classic witch) and eschewed a specialization in favor of being really good at everything instead of perfect as one thing, but this is pure speculation on my part and not stated in canon.

Would Moon Mother let you be a child of a specific comet, or would it be better to go with a star?

There's no difference between the two in terms of power. Just go with whatever you like.

Would different stars have different powers?

Perhaps, or perhaps not. It's up to you. You could do something interesting with the symbolism associated with a specific star if you were a child of one, however.

Could I use Magic of the Cast Pearl in conjunction with a perk that lets me open up dimensional rifts to seal the evil inside the shrine and the shrine inside the other dimension?

If I'm reading this right, sure.

If so, if the dimension I put the shrine inside collapses, would that release whatever's sealed inside it?

Yes, it would release the evil sealed inside because the thing holding it is gone now.

@Firespawn
Not at all! A spirit on the Path To Rebirth was scouted out as a good Omen but he refused the offer to become an Omen because he wanted to do a stamp rally of afterlife inns (Which given how much the Path To Rebirth sucks for the spirits that go on it with a less than 1% success rate, I have no idea WHY he refused the position since being an Omen sounds fucking awesome. I guess he just loved his stamp rally idea that much).

Should you have this ability, you can't force or coerce people to become Omens.

@Stupidasole
@Boy_vs_Girl
Hm...thank you. I'll include both, then.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Carnalpleasure
You can make breakfast by using magic to prepare.
The second seems to be possible based on the Quick Quotes quill, portraits and IIRC there is a spellchecker spell. You might find it easier to make a magic item to do it though.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Methshot
Um, user, a horcrux only prevents you from _entirely_ dying. You'd still be messily going splat at the bottom of the tall buildings, becoming a spirit, and having to obtain a new body.

Though if masochism's your thing, hey, you do you.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@Methshot
It's mostly what you'd call street level stuff.
Levitate objects, transmute stuff, summon and banish stuff, clean things, repair things.
There's a few spells for offense and defense but most of it seems geared towards making life easy.
Plus magical teleportation. That's gotta be fun, but most people don't seem to do it a lot, nor do they do anything interesting with it. They seem to be able to teleport to anywhere they've been or can see.
I mean, there's absolutely nothing stopping them from Apparating a thousand feet up and Apparating back to the ground before impact, but no one ever does that. Boring fuckers.
@Carnalpleasure
a spell that makes breakfast for you
Probably. There's spells for folding clothing and knitting, no reason to think there's not a spell for cooking up some eggs and bacon, provided you have some to cook.
And I'm sure someone has made a quill that will spellcheck shit for you. They have quills that ghostwrite shit for people, or take dictation.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@SniperGod
would have the issue with vampiric impulses
True, but not complete - The impulses exist no matter what, but they become far more potent and persistent the moment the True Ancestor gives in to them. Roa took advantage of the period where Arc was fighting them, and she's been weakened ever since due to fighting them.

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@Ignoramus
They have quills that ghostwrite shit for people, or take dictation.
Or, more notoriously, misquote and misrepresent what people say.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Methshot
As the thread's official horcrux user, I feel I should point out to you that a horcrux's purpose is to chain the soul to the local level of reality the horcrux is on. Your body can be incinerated and you can still, by the metaphysical definition, not be dead.

You're just also not alive.

If you jumped off a building you're still chunky salsa, bro, I can tell you from firsthand experience. Hope you have a philosopher's stone handy.

Bidwell
Bidwell

Anyone got the list of Jump Claims?

idontknow
idontknow

@CouchChiller
You're pretty much mini-Val at this point. It's fucking disgusting, not to mention sad and pathetic.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@happy_sad
ugh
A comment so generic that it has no weight. You might as well have used bancho's text-to-speech program to turn a fart into text.
@Methnerd
Really? I thought the philosophical discussion was what people hated about Rick and Morty.
Personally I thought that some of it was kind of tedious. I don't need a cartoon to bestow moral wisdom to me. It just needs to be funny and/or entertaining. Tom and Jerry does that, and it's about a sapient mouse and cat duo that never talk and constantly try to murder each other.

Methshot
Methshot

@Methshot
Most wizards are content just to order their house elves around, but if you gave no fucks about anything except studying, well:

* hogwarts was built by wizards. it's a castle that's bigger on the inside and can rearrange its internal topography.
* flying cars. why not get dangerous and see if you can make a flying building (or city).
* magic that can hide an entire suburb.
* intercontinental teleportation

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@idontknow
implying that isn't the best state for a jumpmaker to be in.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@ZeroReborn
the perk stronger than what's being shown above

Well, given what Heavens has said so far, it's looking like the True Ancestor option will be a background unless he changes his mind.

@Illusionz
True, but not complete - The impulses exist no matter what, but they become far more potent and persistent the moment the True Ancestor gives in to them. Roa took advantage of the period where Arc was fighting them, and she's been weakened ever since due to fighting them.

It might be a difference between the VN and the Manga, but if I'm remembering correctly, Arcueid was viewed by the other Ancestors as something of an anomaly who they thought didn't *have* Vampiric Impulses since she was using her full power to carry out her duties as their Executioner.

It was only with Roa that her Impulses became known, but given the other Ancestors didn't know I think that would indicate all the Ancestors have to use a significant amount of their power to suppress their Impulses.

Also, we do have the whole 'She waves her hand to make a new canyon' in the picture posted here: @Stark_Naked

Which is Arcueid, given that's what she looked like back then and Archetype: Earth only physically manifests in Melty Blood.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@idontknow
this is the funniest goddamn message I've ever read this night holy shit dude

Skullbone
Skullbone

@Garbage Can Lid
Reminder that Rita Skeeter is a massive cunt who represents everything wrong with news media, and if you don't smack the shit out of her and blackmail her into giving up her career you are literally jumping wrong.

Evilember
Evilember

@CouchChiller
Thanks for answering!

eGremlin
eGremlin

@Bidwell
I have some jump clams.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Ignoramus
I mean, there's absolutely nothing stopping them from Apparating a thousand feet up and Apparating back to the ground before impact, but no one ever does that. Boring fuckers.
Except, y'know, the fact that it's extremely difficult to do properly even when you're plummeting toward a one-way trip to chunky salsa ville. It's also disorienting, with even characters who've done it before being thrown off balance and getting nauseous/disoriented. If you're not incredibly experienced, you'd be really lucky to manage it at all and would probably still end up splinching yourself? Remember splinching? Where some of your body parts end up over there and the rest over here?

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@Skullbone
righto, time to turn into a beetle and spy on that new wizard!
ho hum, boring
holy shit, he just laughed at me and walked through the wall
...
why can't I turn back into a human?

Illusionz
Illusionz

@eGremlin
No, no, Jump Claims. The Jump Claims list. Jump clams are all well and dandy but not what I seek.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Skullbone
I introduced Rita "the beetle" Skeeter to the Aburame answer to threats to the hives.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@Playboyize
Really? I thought the philosophical discussion was what people hated about Rick and Morty.
Personally I thought that some of it was kind of tedious. I don't need a cartoon to bestow moral wisdom to me. It just needs to be funny and/or entertaining. Tom and Jerry does that, and it's about a sapient mouse and cat duo that never talk and constantly try to murder each other.

The philosophical discussion barely there is glossed over. People have a problem it because of the people claiming that RIck & Morty is insightful because of the basic philosophy references. The real issue of the show is the tedium, lack of originality and the incoherence of the setting. I mean seriously one entire episode was dedicated to a guy fucking sugarbowl creatures and repeating that same joke over and over even though it wasn't funny in the first place.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

Does Independent Action do anything Post-Jump?

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Soft_member
It's like you are watching Teen Titans and then it will keeps switching between Teen Titans and Teen Titans Go! and you don't know why.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@Illusionz
Oh, riiight. The Jump Claims list. The list for Jump Claims, the list chosen especially for listing Jump Claims, Jump Claims' list.

...that list?

Inmate
Inmate

@Illusionz
Would the High Spec Quirk have any physical tells? It's a Mutation Quirk so I'm not sure, since I've only watched the show.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@SomethingNew
As a now-concerned owner of a horcrux, do I remain conscious after being 'not alive, but not dead'? Also, what options do I have for recovery?

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@Ignoramus
That's the list, yes!

@Inmate
Nope, it's just a Mutation type since it's a passive brain enhancement.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Soft_member
This is an accurate representation of the humour in the series and makes about as much sense as anything else in the show
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqiSBxvdws&t=66s

Illusionz
Illusionz

@StrangeWizard
Gotcha covered! It's a little out of date, but it is the latest version I could find.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Illusionz
Thanks dude. I think after reviewing this I'm going to be claiming Nuclear Throne! I'm pretty sure it's not been claimed or made already. I have had some bad luck with that.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@PackManBrainlure
Let's you operate normally in places/circumstances that would otherwise deplete your magical energy operation, IIRC.

@TreeEater
There's a couple parallel to the Buffyverse where the most interesting feature is shrimp. One of them has giant, people eating shrimp.

The other is literally made of nothing but shrimp.

...I have to know, why DO you want to live in a world in which all fauna are some form of crustacean? Are you trying to make the world's largest post of gumbo? Crustaceans are parasites at worst, and immortal, ever-growing sex fiends at best.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Techpill
I swear I'm gonna end up replacing a lot of this Deku folder with your edits if you keep this up.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@idontknow
Val making NikaMoth crossdress as her while NuBee watches
thanks for my newest fantasy

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@Emberburn
immortal, ever-growing sex fiends at best
Sounds familiar.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

Why are we still here? Just to suffer?

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@DeathDog
Nika is a girl too though. Is that really crossdressing?

whereismyname
whereismyname

@GoogleCat
Pretty sure we're here to ship jumpmakers now

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@GoogleCat
Personally I'm just here for the free snacks.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@Stupidasole
I think user meant cosplay, and got confused by his trap porn while trying to type

askme
askme

@GoogleCat
I'm here to shoot the breeze and make Jumps.

@Lunatick
That's just silly, and oddly specific.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Need_TLC
Oh yeah, totally forgot about the existence of a multiverse search algorithm. Would that mean that I could go to a crustacean version of any jump I did afterwards once I learned the technology?

@Emberburn
I just like crustaceans man. I like eating them, I like them as animals, I like thinking of how they would have turned out if their growth wasn't hindered by the existence of non-crustaceans. I have no idea what this means about me as a person.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@RumChicken
My understanding is that you do remain conscious, if in an incorporeal form that probably can't be perceived unless you have magic. After all, you only split your soul once. Not five or six times like Voldemort.

You'd have to possess someone and figure out a way to get a stable vessel long term, like a homunculus or reanimated body. Or just kick out the other soul in the body, or have the possessed person wear the horcrux so you've got an anchor, I'd figure.

SniperWish
SniperWish

@hairygrape
This seems way more complicated than the jump seemed to imply. I just assumed some form of recovery from anything fatal became possible, I had no idea my soul became split or I became a ghost thing forced to possess people. That should really be in the notes or something.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@RumChicken
From what we can infer from the books and movie? You remain conscious, sort of like a ghost except more substantial looking, through force of will you can fly, influence people and show them visions, and even with sufficient effort temporarily possess a person if they're weak-minded enough (or willing). Permanent recovery requires making and inhabiting a replacement body via special ritual(s), but if it's not done right it gradually degrades.

You might want to take a leaf from Emperor Palpatine's book and use advanced technology to have mindless clones of yourself prepared and preserved in advance, which should make things easier, along with loyal servants and/or contingent spells to perform the restorative ritual if you can't simply possess a spare clone long enough to do it yourself (just don't forget to ward your clone room against spirits so no passing spectre can nick them first).

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Methnerd
I can't tell if he's having a good time or a bad time. He's smiling, but those eyes man, those eyes...

FastChef
FastChef

@hairygrape
Voldemort had six total, but only five at once (The diary expired before Nagini became one.)
He also wasn't even aware of one of them.

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Methnerd
Thank you photoshop user, I really do appreciate all of these. I really do need to go find fun stuff to request from time to time.

@ZeroReborn
There are many mood ambiguous Deku pics when you go looking for them.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@AwesomeTucker
Alright, I walked right into this one. I was thinking about lobsters, but you win this round user

@GoogleCat
I'm here to catch up, mostly.

@kizzmybutt
Ah, if we're talking about speculative evolution crustaceans that's a whole other kettle of...crustaceans. I think a lot of my views on crustaceans are colored by the vore-hell of an ocean they usually grow up in, sometimes unfairly so, which makes it easier on the palate to think of them as food. But isopod tea parties sound amazing.

Unless you go to a magical crab land or something, I'm pretty sure anywhere with big crustaceans would have a really high oxygen concentration atmosphere too. So watch out for any naked flames.

@ZeroReborn
He's vibrating, that means he's either excited or drugged. On those odds, I'd say happy is the safer bet.

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@SniperWish
Well, you didn't technically SPLIT your soul to get it so you're probably a lot better off and more capable - it's more of an anchor than anything. I suspect that Voldemort did some voodoo to let his horcruxes posess someone in the first place. Then again the only data point we have to go off of is Voldemort - nobody else in canon is known to have had a horcrux, fanfiction notwithstanding.

It's entirely possible that it would anchor your soul to your body unless your body was destroyed, but in such a case you'd still have to heal up, wouldn't you? And healing from jumping off a tall building is like putting a birthday cake back together after you threw it on the ground.

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@SniperWish
Well it is kind of basic knowledge of the setting. Voldemort didn't hang around after he got blasted by the killing curse and tries different ways of getting a body back in different books.

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

@DeathDog
ward your clone room against spirits so no
against _other_ spirits

Heh. That would be a bad mistake to make.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@ZeroReborn
Looks like friend Computer sent him for mandatory happiness pills.

Inmate
Inmate

Is the Harry Potter jump the movies or the books, or do we get to choose? There are slight differences (e.g. in the books, Voldemort can't feel the destruction of a horcrux; in the movie, he can)

Methnerd
Methnerd

@New_Cliche
I've forgotten literally everything from both the books and the movies except for the fact that chocolate frogs die just moments after being brought to life for the sole purpouse of entertaining wizard children.

@Fuzzy_Logic
Putting a cake back together is easy, just squish it back into the same shape.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Methnerd
Sure, because the layers of frosting in the middle will definitely just squish right back to where they were, and the bits of fruit will go back to where they were, and the different colored layers of cake will just squish back normally... I think it may be a bit more complex than that.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@Inmate
You get to choose, yeah. The movies come with the benefit of a definitely white Hermione.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Burnblaze
Will the kid be happy about it? No. Will it still be a cake? Yes. Will I eat it once his mother buys him a fresh cake and tells me I'm a bad parent? Absolutely.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@RumChicken
In the books Hagrid gives Harry a cake he sat on and it was fine.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

So what are you Jumpchads up to?

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Burnblaze
But Crux, what if it's a magical cake?

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@RumChicken
Have fun being addicted to literally every painkiller in existence.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@StrangeWizard
The same thing I'm up to every night, user: trying to take over the world! Or galaxy. Or universe. Or multiverse. It all depends, really.

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@Stark_Naked
But what if it's Christmas cake?

girlDog
girlDog

@Raving_Cute
Magic Painkillers are best painkillers and you could magically put your legs back together. They probably have Featherfall spells anyway.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@Raving_Cute
Hey man, just because I have low standards for cake doesn't mean I'm a drug addict.

takes2long
takes2long

@Harmless_Venom
You go on the Naughty list.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@Nude_Bikergirl
I thought we were trying to figure out why the banana people were modeling scarves in the middle of June narf

TechHater
TechHater

@StrangeWizard
That's perfect.

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

Jumpers! How do you handle the process of compaioning in your chain? Does your Benefactor create the OCs or they let you customize them? What about canon companions? Do you choose them before entering a world or you are given a 'blank' invitation that you can extent to whoever you want while in the jump?

New_Cliche
New_Cliche

@Nude_Bikergirl
What habbens after you take control?

Supergrass
Supergrass

@Fuzzy_Logic
When it comes to OC companions I usually fluff that the Benefactor is in fact their creator either directly (customizing personally) or indirectly (spawning them from some generalized concepts). When it comes to canon companions, I always do the invitation route and that's how I write the options for canon companions in my Jumps.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@SniperGod
Pffft. There's more than enough continuity issues that make that theatre play an AU without involving melanin.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@Fuzzy_Logic
For OCs, I have them be either people that existed in the world or were created and then then the world is made to be as if they were always there. For both OCs and Canon characters, I never give my jumper the actual options to choose that stuff, I just have it decided for them so it remains a secret who is picked and what they're like until they're met in universe. In terms of canon invitations, always have it so that they need to be alive and willing by the end to come along, since sometimes I end up killing off the companions before they actually become such.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@SniperGod
Hermione is white in the books, it is just that her skin color is rarely mentioned and JK Rowling wants Progressive brownie points, so she went along with the BS.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Playboyize
mfw

@New_Cliche
I oppress the innocent and run a tyrannical empire, acting like any proper evil overlord should! I also spoil my daughters rotten, but I do that all the time even when I don't rule the world. I can't help it, I just love doting on them, even if my eldest tries to act practical and mature by refusing my extravagant birthday presents.

idontknow
idontknow

@Fuzzy_Logic
OC or canon, I get to invite them whenever I want so long as I have enough CP left.

OC companions are random people I happen to meet in the jump, unless the jump specifically says I get to determine their attributes (in which case I have to do so before I arrive, and have to seek them out once I do to bring them along).

Methnerd
Methnerd

@Fuzzy_Logic
I don't bother with Canon companions, but OCs are customized to my Jumper's desires, within the limitations given, and then fate is set in motion so that the Jumper will bump into the companion and hit it off with them so well that they would be willing to leave their world behind to follow the Jumper.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@Spamalot
It's a _theatre_ play. Y'know (or maybe you don't), the place with a long tradition of characters being played by people who don't resemble them at all?

JunkTop
JunkTop

@Emberburn
On that note, Jumpers! How much do the characters in your jumps match the actors who played them in your world? Are there any oddities?

For example, Crux, do you find that no matter what world you jump to, one of the MCs always looks like Nicholas Cage?

Nojokur
Nojokur

@JunkTop
Anytime I am in an Isekai setting, the MC always looks and sounds like Nick Cage...or Danny Devito.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@StrangeWizard
Kingdom Hearts builds, anyone?
Location: The World that Never Was (Free)
Age 16 (Free)

Weilder (300)
Race: Human (Free)

Perks
Tema Del Jumper (Free)
Tema Di Mondi (Free)
JPRG Style (Free)
A Heart To Call My Own (200)
Magical Potential (Free)
Hit It (Free)
Protect the World Border (100)
Heart Breaker (100)
Choose Wisely (Rod) (Free)
Dive Into the Heart (Free)
Station of Awakening (100)
Flow Motion (Kaiserfarbe trail effect) (100)
Your Adventure Begins At…Midday (100)
Don't Ever Change (150)
Battle At The Center of the Heart (150)
Last Chance (200)
Reaction Commands (200)
Light My Way (300)

Items
Nomura Brand outfit (Free)
Paopu Fruit Seeds (Free)
Black Coat (Free)
Drive Clothes (Anti-, Valor)+Wisdom (Free)
Master Form (100)
Final Form (100)
Potions (Free)
Ethers (Free)
Jiminy's Journal (+Re:Coding) (Free)
Red Staff (real & training version) (Free)
Keyblade (Free)
Import (Cane) (Free)
Medium Length, mediumweight (Free)
Sharp (Free)
Lady Luck (Free)
Elemental Key (Time) (Free)
Dual Elements (Reflect) (Free)
Hook (Free)
Spellbook (Free)
Stand Your Ground (Free)
Extra Long (Free)
MP Boost (Free)
Dream Sword (Free)

Trinity (2x Companion Import - V & KS) (Free)

Drawbacks:
They Come (Free)
Kupo (+100)
Nomura school of art and design (+100)
Paopu Pursuer (+100)
Finding Your Light (+200)
Shut Up (+200)
grinding loot (+200)
plot bound (+300)

Keyblade
Import (Cane) (3)
Medium Length, mediumweight (Free)
Sharp (Free)
Lady Luck (Free)
Elemental Key (Time) (3)
Dual Elements (Reflect) (3)
Hook (1)
Spellbook (1)
Stand Your Ground (1)
Extra Long (2)
MP Boost (1)

@Snarelure
There is no Nuclear Throne jump? Someone wanted to work on one aaaaaaaaaaages ago, but I don't think any wips were posted nor have a name.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@takes2long
Yes. Yes I do. :3

askme
askme

@Emberburn
Oh no the theater play is fine, it's the fact than Rowling started waffling about Hermione maybe-sorta being canonically brown in the books too that rustles jimmies

Flameblow
Flameblow

@JunkTop
Everyone looks the same, but upside-down. They hover a milimeter or so above the ground and they seem to propel themselves by walking on the air at their feet level, which behaves exactly as if they were walking on the ground, producing the sounds of a footstep on the ground beneath them. All infrastructure is catered to this (upside-down doors, some really weird tables, etc). People scream when they see me walk around normally, and are confused when they see me standing still, as if I were doing a handstand in public.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@Sir_Gallonhead
I think there's something for that in Sword art online

happy_sad
happy_sad

@iluvmen
by refusing my extravagant birthday presents.

what is extravagant by your standards?

Flameblow
Flameblow

How to protect against telekinetic body disassembly

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Fuzzy_Logic
How do you handle the process of companioning in your chain?
My Jump-chan is a person, like a personal DM/GM/Storyteller and not a vending machine, so it varies. I pay the cp and I get to bring someone along. As long as she gets the cp and I get a companion, there's flexibility in the arrangement.

Does your Benefactor create the OCs or they let you customize them?
I hand the cp to Jump-chan, and she goes "What do you want them to be like?", and then either I 'build' them like an RPG character, or I give jump-chan some generalities ("They should be tall") and let them do the rest, or I let her take the wheel with the proviso she makes someone suitable for joining me.

What about canon companions?
There's a chance I won't persuade them to come along, but I'm usually pretty picky about canon characters, so I don't spend cp on anyone likely to choose to stay in the first place.

Do you choose them before entering a world or you are given a 'blank' invitation that you can extent to whoever you want while in the jump?
I can choose to start with them as my friends/acquaintances, or I can choose to let my journey bring us together, but the invitation is (was) always specific to that person.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@Soft_member
Isn't what's in SAO like, the exact opposite of what user is asking for?

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@Soft_member
That's a single alt form, Bancho.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@JunkTop
The look basically the same. It's hard to get people to hold still long enough to measure mole/freckle/scar size and placement to verify they are exactly identical in appearance to the actors that play them.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Garbage Can Lid
I was thinking of roleplay , but I might be misremembering the perk.

5mileys
5mileys

@Sir_Gallonhead
Duel Monsters - Heroes has a sentai mask maker each with specific forms and modes

massdebater
massdebater

@Flameblow
There's a perk for that in FEAR, and a power for that in Worm.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@haveahappyday
Oh!

That one could work theoretically, but it'd be less Forms and more Loadouts? Think that perk from Cuphead might still be the better option for user, but Roleplay's a good secondary.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@Flameblow
Avoid line-of-sight of anything sentient. If you enter line of sight, leave as soon as you can without looking or feeling afraid. Remember- anyone could have psychic power, even your own dad. Avoid civilization at all costs.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Sir_Gallonhead
Kamen Rider Heisei Part 1: Kuuga and Agito has a good gaining new forms perk, You can also pick up new forms and a good way to swap between them in the Kamen Rider Decade gauntlet.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@TurtleCat
needing line of sight
Shitty psychics.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@massdebater
Which perk is that in FEAR?

@TurtleCat
Was asking for perks, basically speaking trying to find a way to get around matter manipulation as an attack without getting
Alexandria from Worm

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

Speaking of Kamen Rider, is Amazons covered in the current ones? Where does it fit in?

Harmless_Venom
Harmless_Venom

@Spazyfool
Even if you find some kind of telekinesis shielding, stay away from those fuckin psychics, man. No good can come from them.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@Fried_Sushi
Speaking of Kamen Rider, is Amazons covered in the current ones?
it is not

Where does it fit in?

it really doesn't,it is a alternate universe.

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Flameblow
@Spazyfool
Hmm. If it's telekinetic disassembly and not conceptual disassembly, sufficient durability perks would help, as would any perk that gives you HP like a video game (at least until you ran out of HP).

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@happy_sad
Specifically asking so i dont get instagibbed by Darkseid. Trying to find ways to meaningfully hurt him/stay alive in the event I need to fight him

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Flameblow
Get a perk that makes your soul your body (Mtg -Kamigawa has one as does Evangelion) . Get a perk that protects your soul like the one in Castlevania.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@lostmypassword
I'd be hesitant to assume his omega beams work via telekinesis and not something more esoteric. Or is he also telekinetic? His "power levels" are all over the place.

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@Firespawn
Omega Beams arent telekinesis but he does have telekinesis as well.

Omega Beams though come from an origin point that isnt me which makes it slightly easier to deal with

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@lostmypassword
Encounter from Medaka Box nosells any attack that directly targets you.
Kira Killer from Jorge Joestar nosells any attack that doesn't directly target you.

Combo the two then laugh at Darkseid. And everyone else.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@Firespawn
He does have Telekinesis. His Omega Beams though are something else, and do all kinds of wacky shit, like cause time travel, preform summoning, kill things super dead, unkill things and more.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@lostmypassword
I thought Darkseid's go-to attack was the Omega Beams, not telekinesis. I mean technically they probably can telekinetically disassemble you but his first instinct is always to blast you to smitherins.

Anyway, the NP Avalon is roughly sufficient as a defence against the Omega Beams; as I remember he usually can't target something straight in another universe unless he pulls out the Boom Tubes, let alone one that conceptually shields you from all harm or something. The causality weapon tech from Blazblue could also help if you make a clarktech/soultech shield.

As for hurting him, if you're a really good guy the Swords of the Cross from Dresden Files are effectively kryptonite since he's the god of tyranny. He's also been totaled by an aspect of Death, so the death summoning spell from Magicka might at least weaken him.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@kizzmybutt
I'd be wary about assuming that mashing your soul and body together would result in soul perks (completely) covering the result. Potatoes, of course.

@BinaryMan
Strictly speaking telekinesis still has an origin point that isn't you, it just isn't(?) dependent on the force carriers (electromagnetism, strong nuclear, weak nuclear, etc) known to RL physics.

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

So with all the warframe talk lately I decided to watch some videos of it. What perks do we need in order to merge with and teleport through our warframe and jump into other peoples bodies?

viagrandad
viagrandad

@StrangeWizard
inb4 Darkseid shuts one eye, and uses a time portal shoots an Omega Beam that ricochets off a point in the past, which comes back to hit you. Which because it technically hit before he fired, simultaneously directly and indirectly targets you

You laugh, but I've seen dumber loophole abuses in comics.

Inmate
Inmate

@viagrandad
To be fair unless you go blabbing to Dark Side about how your powers work he probably wouldnt find out that particular loophole.

He is immensely smart but I would argue the connecting logic isnt there if you dont know the originating components (aka specifically what the perks do)

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Inmate
Dark Side
Autocorrect why you do this

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@Poker_Star
Clearly Autocorrect was programmed by a Star Wars fan who hates comics.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Supergrass
Dark souls questions.
Do we need Soul Growth to improve ourselves with souls in the jump? Also is there any use for this perk post jump if we don't also take the Soul Collector perk?

Evilember
Evilember

@viagrandad
Obviously you shouldn't just stand there and let him try to get around your defenses.
Use the time he wastes on trying to kill you to kill him first.
And like @Inmate
says, don't monologue about how your powers work. That's just stupid.

If that's not enough just get some good superspeed and Untouchable from Sailor Moon.
Suddenly he's just a weird looking dude while you still have all your powers.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@Evilember
I love monologuing, especially about the untrue weaknesses and plans I make up on the spot. And sometimes about the plans I made specifically to be foiled to set other things up (Xanatos Gambits, ho!)

BinaryMan
BinaryMan

@Evilember
don't monologue about how your powers work. That's just stupid.
No, Do monologue about how your powers work, but lie about it.

FastChef
FastChef

@Evilember
Untouchable specifically only works on magic, not superpowers in general.

I hope your jumper isn't retroactively dead now.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@FastChef
Untouchable (600 CP, Discount Drop-In)
...
You can outright nullify all supernatural forces around you in a three meter radius for ten minutes once a day.

And i haven't actually been to Sailor Moon yet in my chain.

Booteefool
Booteefool

@Evilember
@FastChef
Also while we are at it super speed does not have a good track record against Omega Beams the best option is to use a body shield at the last second

happy_sad
happy_sad

@Booteefool
It's not about the Omega Beams. It's about getting him into that 3 meter radius from Untouchable and keeping him there.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Sharpcharm
Soul Growth allows very efficient, focused application of souls to improve yourself. If you do like any other boss or character and just kill the shit out of things to amass large quantities of souls, you'll still get bigger and badder in general though. As covered in the notes section, sufficient amounts of spiritual energy can replace 'souls' where they would normally be spent.

idontknow
idontknow

@Nude_Bikergirl
Context matters, user.
You did not originate from a world where magic existed. There was only physics in your world. It is for this reason you are aware that magic and physics are just two different forces at work in this reality. Magic may manipulate physics, but it is a separate force entirely. This power erases magic in a small zone around you, leaving only the presence of physics. You can outright nullify all supernatural forces around you in a three meter radius for ten minutes once a day. Anyone slinging magic at will find their blasts fizzling when they enter this zone. Your powers, however, are not affected.

Within the context of the Sailor Moon Crystal jump, all supernatural powers are a result of the fundamental force of magic. That's definitely not the case in DC.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@eGremlin
I love monologuing, especially about the untrue weaknesses and plans I make up on the spot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xihzgEsV2nw

Techpill
Techpill

@haveahappyday
Not that user, but it reminded me of a question I had:
Would the life force I stea...err...borrow from people using my Sailor Moon villain tricks work towards counting as souls?

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@Evilember
This is the correct answer @BinaryMan

But why! I thought you said that only indirect attacks could work on you!
"I lied"

Firespawn
Firespawn

@BinaryMan
I'm always uncomfortable with things like that.

Mostly because you might unintentionally give a data point to work off of for a sufficiently intelligent foe to guess your actual powers.

RavySnake
RavySnake

@Evilember
And then you pray that you're not in the continuity where it's a supernatural force that makes him human-sized instead of solar-system-sized when he visits the material universe. Comics be bullshit.

WebTool
WebTool

@Sharpcharm
Umineko's art is so bad. It's worse than Demonbane art.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Techpill
I don't know enough about Sailor Moon to say either way. You probably gotta fanwank.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@RavySnake
Which is in turn merely an avatar of the omniverse strangling horror Darkseid's true form is.

FastChef
FastChef

@Firespawn
Just get super intelligence, manipulation, keikaku and precog abilities of your own.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@Emberburn
There is also a world without shrimp.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@Firespawn
You're a jumper. If you're at the point where you can play with your food you likely have hundreds of powers.
Nobody is going to guess them all unless you provide a list. Even then they'll need perfect memory to account for all of them.

And that's not counting perks that specifically make your enemies jump to wrong conclusions.

@RavySnake
That's what extra lifes and time travel are for. The point isn't to not fuck up, it's surviving your fuckups and getting to try again.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@Firespawn
Nobody can tell when I'm telling the truth or lying, or even if I'm acting unharmed/harmed. Even if they do hit on my weakness, if they don't exploit it fully in that moment, they'll likely write it off as not working.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@AwesomeTucker
... I have a new plan, OP. Use robots to fight Darkseid from far, far away.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@FastChef
7, 6 at once though you are otherwise correct.

farquit
farquit

@Sir_Gallonhead
Yeah, somehow I miscounted. I knew I shouldn't have cut off that extra toe in Fallout.

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Lunatick
Funnily enough that's also the omniverse's plan. There's a...thing called the Superman Thought Robot that is basically the Endless of being the hero that always defeats the villain which is created from the Trinity (Batman, Wonder Woman and Superman) when Supes fights his evil alternate self. Except instead of targetting Darkseid in particular, it fights all the evil ever in abstract.

massdebater
massdebater

@WebTool
Considering the art was done by the same person who wrote it...I've seen a lot of worse author-done illustrations.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Firespawn
Up your keikaku game user. Lead them into a trap with the information, but that trap isn't actually a trap, but is actually a burly man wielding a log, and is ok.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@massdebater
It's impressive for that I guess but it doesn't stop the art from being among some of the worst in VNs. Even including western stuff actually.

Spamalot
Spamalot

Is the best power sharing still Sacrificial Bestowment?

Bidwell
Bidwell

Between the SWAT armory from Munitions Mastery in City of Heroes, and the ability to create dust, variable weapons, and to awaken peoples' aura from various perks in RWBY, I could probably get a small village relatively well defended with a few weeks of effort.

massdebater
massdebater

@Spamalot
if we are not counting that one jump everybody seems to hate but nobody with any Authority seems to disavow yes.

SniperGod
SniperGod

@idontknow
Not that user but we're also not from a world of superpowers and to us all superpowers could classify as magic. Beside you could just get the magic must beat magic perk from Jackie chan and use it in conjuncture with that sailor moon perk and free climbing. It's let you keep that sailor moon perk active for almost an entire week while lowering the cool down from once a day to like 86 seconds.

SniperWish
SniperWish

@massdebater
There is also paper mario which has this drawback allowing to make perk badges

Badge Link +300cp
So you know all those fancy abilities you have from other worlds? Well now
you've lost them and have been reduced to body mod plus whatever you purchased in
this jump. All is not lost, however, as badges containing your powers have been
scattered about the mushroom kingdom and some of it's neighbours. If you find them
you can use them like a badge to be able to access whatever power the badge
represents. Post-jump you get all your powers back, even if you didn't find all of
them. And sorry, but you don't get to keep the badges. Although if you have the
badgesmith perk you may be able to recreate them with a lot of work.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@SniperGod
If you are going to do that you might as well get Mundane Mondays and Drain No. It would be easier, more reliable and have greater range.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@haveahappyday
Do warriors of Sunlight start with Lightning Spear and Great Lightning Spear?

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@CodeBuns
user they don't even in-game, you gotta earn like 40 sunlight medals and transpose Gwyn "the real OG" Lord of Cinder's soul to get the Great Lightning Spear.

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@AwesomeTucker
I like how Darkseid used to be this super powerful thing in jumpchain that was normally very difficult to beat. Now we just kind of trivialise him, it shows the slow but steady decline of jumpchain. How sad.

Spamalot
Spamalot

@Spazyfool
The original lightning spear is granted just for joining and the Great version is the first reward, requiring only 10 medals.

viagrandad
viagrandad

@Spamalot
Oh, my bad. Been a while since I played the game, must have forgotten the name of the really big lightning bolt you get from Gwyn's soul

cum2soon
cum2soon

@Fried_Sushi
Again, it depends on which version of Darkseid you're facing. In some continuities, trivially killing Darkseid just makes him level up. And now you have his attention.

massdebater
massdebater

@viagrandad
That's Sunlight Spear, which is offered for purchase in the jump.

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@CodeBuns
Yeah, don't see why not given they're rather basic parts of the background.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Spamalot
Combine Retinue, A Shadow of My Power and Authority Equals Asskicking to share all your powers with your minions and manifest all their abilities. That's the best one right now.
The one in Worm is also cool, but it has you lose the ability.

Illusionz
Illusionz

@Bidwell
Call in tactical drops from Mercenary minions (also CoH) and you can equip and armor people rapidly in the field.

You'd also have the Mercs themselves, who (like you if you've got the powers) are supers - Against squishy things like humans and tanks, they're overkill. (I miss running my MM through mayhem missions and watching the collateral damage from fighting.)

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@Burnblaze
How would you suggest we distribute Miracles in future jumps? I know My Own Personal Sun is a good way to give out talismans but what about the Miracles themselves?

farquit
farquit

@ZeroReborn
What jumps are those from?

SniperGod
SniperGod

How Dangerous is The Collector drawback in Marvel Cinematic Universe?

So far the most dangerous mercenary in the movies is an Asgardian. I would also assume most arent as strong as Hela thoughts?

StonedTime
StonedTime

@farquit
Oh, the perks are from Diabolical. Forgot to put it. I'm surprised that almost no one talks about it

Fuzzy_Logic
Fuzzy_Logic

@SniperGod
His home doesn't seem that heavily guarded, and the mercenaries in general are pretty weak. I have yet to see someone that has city busting abilities without using some sort of super mystic artifact. Maybe Hela?
Although she was playing home

Spamalot
Spamalot

@SniperGod
I would also assume most arent as strong as Hela thoughts?

Thor is drastically stronger than 99% of MCU Asgardians, not counting Mjölnir.

Hela manhandled Thor like he was a wee babe.

w8t4u
w8t4u

@Spamalot
Im just trying to get an accurate scale of the drawback. I am not risking eternal life in a little box forever without heavy precaution

Methnerd
Methnerd

So, Jumpers, what's your favorite way to deal with Slasher villains who pose no threat to you?

@w8t4u
Fair enough.

RumChicken
RumChicken

Don't mind me, just answering some stuff from last thread.

/tg/thread/56798529#p56801796
(By the way the Gateway of Sundraprisha is just a Raksha metaphor for having physical shape via traversing the aspect of the Shinma Nirakara that controls it)
It's also the name of a Charm (p. 75) that CAN turn an Unshaped into a Raksha, for what that's worth.
That same charm also allows a Shaped Raksha to turn into an Unshaped, per the Errata

/tg/thread/56798529#p56801396
Please elaborate. I still haven't found the "become Unshaped" Charm Mardukth mentioned last thread but someone later posted some stuff saying Creation-born can't become Unshaped at all.
Gateway of Sundraprisha, errata version.

...would the Boosted Faery Grace from Lunars work on Unshaped? It talks about crushing a noble's Heart so I get the feeling it's meant not to.
No, it specifically works on Nobles. Not on Unshaped (or Commoners).

JunkTop
JunkTop

@w8t4u
Play the slasher victim straight and then show up almost immediately afterwards as a nearly identical "family member" (except with maybe a mustache or something) and a very slightly different name with like one or two letters changed. Repeat until they give up in frustration at the feeling that they're being made fun of.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@JunkTop
Oops. Meant to reply to @Methnerd

viagrandad
viagrandad

@Evil_kitten
There's a perk for teaching people Miracles in the Way of White origin, even if they're not natives.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Methnerd
Send zombies after them that nobody else can see or touch until they commit themselves to a mental institution.

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

@Methnerd
Give them extra powers for extra murdering, and also give the chosen ones some powers. Basically I turn everything that I find too mundane into a battle shonen.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Methnerd
Bad luck curse that scales with hostility. They try to get into a house to kill someone and suddenly the place is set up like Kevin McCallister has prepared for an invasion of Wet Bandits.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@Methnerd
what's your favorite way to deal with Slasher villains who pose no threat to you?
By ignoring them? I mean, do you stop every criminal in the worlds that you are in? Do you cure all illness? Make sure that everyone is happy forever? I'm not a multiversal babysitter.

I'm just passing by

Booteefool
Booteefool

@SniperGod
At the moment, it's easily the most trivialisable of the 600 CP drawbacks. The problem with Taneleer is that he's a slimey asshole in a very hopeful movie, which means he isn't allowed to do anything cool.

The man can't even keep control of his own slaves, and his own collections take pity on him after it literally blows up in his face. I wouldn't say the most dangerous mercenary in the movies is any kind of Asgardian, it's Yondu. And Yondu will only let you think he can be bought for anything these days. If he's coming after you with everything he has, the Asgardians AND Guardians are probably also not going to want to give him anymore Infinity Stones for safe keeping either.

The most ominous thing in his collection was a cosmic cocoon, except as of Guardians 2 the Sovereign are designing Adam Warlock in their own so it seems like a red herring.

The most impressive thing I can think of the guy doing is surviving the Power Stone blowing up a little in his face.

I'm pretty sure the Guardians could have murdered him there, if they wanted to.

I don't normally recommend making light of a 600 CP drawback but I'm...genuinely struggling to think of anything other than the obvious to watch out for if you're a decent fighter and have access to both alien guns and a spaceship.

I guess he might, in theory, be able to bribe all the Ravagers to come after you? They have far bigger, more and probably better spaceships than the Guardians, and the Guardians' spaceship lasted all the way through a battle with Ego. And far, far more high energy guns/bombs/whacky weapons.

@RumChicken
This just makes me think the only reason why all those anti-Creation terrorist Raksha don't gang up spontaneously turn into Unshaped to chip away at the Bordermarches, is because they're too disorganised to do regular terrorist attacks.

@Methnerd
Have them arrested, rehabilitated/mentally reconditioned and legally obliged to perform The Slasher Villain Shuffle.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@viagrandad
There's a perk for teaching people Miracles in the Way of White origin
That perk is way too expensive for another origin, especially when I have no interest in the main effect. I just want to know how to teach miracles which shouldn't require a perk.

even if they're not natives
Why would they need to be natives?

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Booteefool
and the Guardians' spaceship lasted all the way through a battle with Ego

That spaceship had a shit-ton of armor. Plot armor, to be precise.

But everything else, yeah, except I'd be wary of the line in the drawback "and they will adapt to your tactics quite frequently... as well as all your powers." If that's fiat power adaptation, well, things could get hairy...

w8t4u
w8t4u

@Lord_Tryzalot
Miracles come from revelations brought about by hearing the associated stories. If you can figure out a way to simulate that to as deep an extent as it occurs in Dark Souls you should be good.

Why would they need to be natives?
If someone tried to tell you about the glory of a Sun God/Sky Father figured that brought about the Age of Fire in a war against the Eternal Stone Dragons, despite never hearing about anything like this in your life, do you think it's more likely that you would get divine inspiration or you would think the other person is a nutter?

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Carnalpleasure
Damnit now I have an image of Saber waking Shirou up by throwing him out of his bed and screaming "AWAKEN, MY MASTER!" as she poses.

Inmate
Inmate

@VisualMaster
Good point. Especially if the adaption takes the form of having said plot armor.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

Can we name the Imaged folder “Jumps with Coloured Backgrounds” instead? Or just do away with having them be in a separate folder from the alphabetical listings? Seems like the only reason for this split is that it’s what we’ve done in the past, which would make it unnecessarily confusing for newcomers.

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Methshot
Wait, increased? I thought--oh, whoops. I misremembered the base price being 800 for some reason.

Price will probably be the same.
Your next line will be 'so how strong will the True Ancestor background really be?'
Let me do the rest of the jump first, please. Or at least ask on the weekend. Also, power levels, especially in Nasuland, are bullshit. That has no bearing on the question, I just like saying it.

TurtleCat
TurtleCat

@w8t4u
You can also just find/purchase them. I want to know how to make the scrolls.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@w8t4u

nuby, are you working on civ beyond earth?

Illusionz
Illusionz

@TalkBomber
tfw you posted the worst possible image for that question
I need coffee. The original price was 400, right? It'll still be that.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@PackManBrainlure
I woudln't be opposed to this. Including NuBee and Valeria's (as well as a few others) who only changed the background color in the imaged folder makes searching more confusing.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@TurtleCat
You're not really getting it. This is the fluff on how people learn how to perform Miracles in-world. Miracles aren't spells that you go through the steps to learn using specific instructions. Whether they're taught directly or read about it from a scroll, learning about this story, this miracle, somehow triggers epiphanies in the faithful and allows them to replicate the miracles they studied. Casting a Miracle is more like instant gratification praying than normal spell-casting.

So basically, just write down the story behind the Miracle.

@CodeBuns
I am not, Ancilla and Worm are. I tried to mention that earlier, but the thread I posted in was deleted.

askme
askme

Didn't someone post adult Kuro pics here at some point?

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Illusionz
In DDLC, on a scale of one to infinity, how much despair would Monika feel if the jumper revealed that the reality she thinks is real (ie: the one Jumper is travelling through) was actually yet another layer of fiction?

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

@Snarelure
Nubee they are spells, in the lore they are spells and in gameplay they are spells. They can be found and used by people who know nothing about the stories they're based on and whose Faith is has nothing to do with what the miracles are based on. They are attuned just like any other spell, are used like any other spell and, are learned like any other spell. There is even proof in the lore that they are all different forms of the same thing (See Hexes and Fire Sorcery).

How do we learn/teach sorceries and pyromancies? Because it's going to be the same thing with Miracles.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Burnblaze
Can you provide citations?

DeathDog
DeathDog

@Illusionz
@Snarelure
Since we are on the topic of DDLC, I'm also confused about the purchases. Does getting your powers back stop you from companioning Monika and getting her ending?

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Snarelure
Probably a scale of you monster.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@StonedTime
See Hexes, Fire Sorcery, and the gameplay.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@DeathDog
No, you just have to get either the Just Monika or Good Ending to companion her.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

What perks are there that can make you... ANGRY?

idontknow
idontknow

@GoogleCat
Those aren't citations. You're not proving anything, you're just throwing out random terms and expecting others to agree that you have the right of it.

hairygrape
hairygrape

@ZeroReborn
Good. This is vital to her understanding that just because she is fictional, doesn't mean she isn't real.

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

Is it reasonable to say that I can form and control multiple avatars simultaneously as a Yog outer god?

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Need_TLC
Just Monika
That just requires to kill everyone but her, right?

PurpleCharger
PurpleCharger

@Burnblaze
I looked into the lore and have references for my beliefs. It's not like I'm speaking from the ass here.

The description of the Heal Miracle "To cast a miracle, the caster learns a tale of the Gods, and says a prayer to be blessed by its revelations. Heal is the shortest of such miraculous tales."

The description of Wrath of the Gods "Wrath of the Gods was an epic tale that tattered into the modern Force. This primal form of Force emits a shockwave that also emits damage."

Gameplay does not equal reality. The scrolls you find are excerpts and tales. How are you going to say that Miracles are found and used by people who know nothing about the stories they're based on when worship of Gwyn and the epic tale of the Lords and their battle is spread far and wide? Everyone knows about the gods and that the gods did stuff, big stuff. That's why those with Faith can find it in them to trust in the stories and wield the power of Miracles.

How do we learn/teach sorceries and pyromancies? Because it's going to be the same thing with Miracles.
Learning from teachers, books and scrolls the same as Miracles, only there's direct reference right above that what we're getting with Miracles isn't a set of instructions.

Can you please post the references that are making you believe otherwise? Because right now that's not the way I look at it.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@RumChicken
Yup. Either purposefully or indirectly via escaping.

Evil_kitten
Evil_kitten

@Sharpcharm
...define "multiple avatars". Demonbane Yog never quite shows the versatility Nya does when it comes to avatars in the sense of distinct individual humanoids.

However when Yog shows up in reality he DOES look like everything at once before taking a gate form. There isn't a clear answer, but I would guess that as a Yog you can't make avatars for the same reason the ocean can't flow downhill: It is in your nature to already be everywhere and everything, not anyone or anything as differentiated entities.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@TalkBomber
Your next line will be 'so how strong will the True Ancestor background really be?'

I'm honestly just excited to see what the background fluff will look like.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@PurpleCharger
Hexes are a form of "dark magic" made by using humanity in the creation of Sorceries and Miracles. This implies that they're both similar in structure if the same process works the same way with both of them.

Fire Sorcery is exactly what is says on the tin, it is sorcery using fire that was the precursor of Pyromancy. Pyromancy is just the Fire Sorceries modified later on.

This means that all three are of the same basic structure and work in overall the same manner, even before you get into gameplay where it does work in the same manner.

How are you going to say that Miracles are found and used by people who know nothing about the stories they're based on when worship of Gwyn and the epic tale of the Lords and their battle is spread far and wide?
Because they aren't spread far and wide, there are scraps floating around but most references to them are in the long forsaken ruins of Lordran that the game takes place in. It can also be used by jaded individuals whose faith is completely unrelated to the miracles, such as the woman from DS2.

Gameplay does not equal reality.
This is Dark Souls, the gameplay and the lore are tied together very deeply.

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

I remember there was a jump that allowed you get your own political party. Can anyone please remind me of where it's from?

Fried_Sushi
Fried_Sushi

@PurpleCharger
But then how does Attunement factor into this?

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Stupidasole
Alright, thanks for the clarifications. I guess I will save my choices for after playing the game.
@Evil_kitten
Yog always had an avatar in the Mythos besides his spheres form

Soft_member
Soft_member

@DeathDog
Funny that he uses quotes and you just say what it means without any quotes.

JunkTop
JunkTop

For the Metroid armor you can toggle the Arm Cannon off right
Because I don't want to have to unequip the whole suit just to be able to use both hands

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@JunkTop
Probably. Don't see why not.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@PurpleCharger
Is there any reason to buy My Own Personal Sun? From the looks of it we would need another expensive perk to make any use of it.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@JunkTop
Just go sleeveless

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@SomethingNew
suggesting sleeveless armor with big pauldrons
What are you, a Roman?

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@JunkTop
Samus's Arm Cannon isn't a part of her suit. It's a separate weapon which she inserts her right arm into. It locks into her armor and then connects to its system while she controls it with a trigger mechanism that she's holding inside of the cannon itself. Her armor actually does have a right arm, it's just covered up by the Arm Cannon.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Gigastrength
Sure, why not

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

@JunkTop
Thankful he doesnt need to deal with this concern by just adding on beam functions onto my X-Buster from my imported reploid armor

w8t4u
w8t4u

@King_Martha
Don't know how to tell you this but Demonbane doesn't exactly follow the Mythos word for Word. Nyarlathotep didn't have a titty monster form either, and Azathoth didn't get blown up by a giant robot and assimilated by a bumbling schoolgirl either.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@w8t4u
While that's true, it also seems a touch ridiculous to assume something so powerful cannot create a smaller body to act through remotely.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@w8t4u
Not him, but the burden of proof here is on you. It's your responsibility to prove that Yog-Sothoth can't form avatars if you're going to make that claim.

In my opinion the reason Yog doesn't form avatars is that, unlike Nyarly, he doesn't have to. He's everywhere and can do anything he wants without bothering to form a physical body.

WebTool
WebTool

@PurpleCharger
The second quote is only a description of that particular Miracle. We have plenty of examples of Gods and tales of them not being needed for Miracles.

Atonement:
Miracle given to those cast out from the Sable Church of Londor.
This is the only tale known by exiles, who believe it carries words of forgiveness. Cursed journeys, too, must come to an end.

Dead Again:
Miracle of the Sable Church of Londor.
The third daughter Liliane, one of the founders of the Sable Church, is said to recount tales that portray the suffering and conflict of Hollows.

Deep Protection:
Miracle taught to inaugurated deacons of the Cathedral of the Deep
The deep was originally a peaceful and sacred place, but became the final rest for many abhorrent things. This tale of the Deep offers protection for those who worship amidst those horrors.

Emit Force:
Traditional miracle of Catarina.
The people of lands known for festivity and drink are typically outspoken. One can be sure that they will not bottle their emotions, instead venting anger and the like with confidence.

Gnaw:
Dark miracle taught in the Cathedral of the Deep.
These insects which lurk in the Deep have tiny jaws lined with fangs to tear open the skin and burrow into the flesh in the blink of an eye, causing intense bleeding.

Great Magic Barrier:
The tale which was later interpreted as Magic Barrier.
Said to be a tale of Havel the Rock, arch enemy of Seath the Scaleless. Havel despised magic, and was never complacent in preparing means to counter it.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@w8t4u
Nyarlathotep didn't have a titty monster form either
Well, it wasn't specified that it did or didn't.

To my knowledge Lovecraft didn't go out and list all of its forms or anything.

Stark_Naked
Stark_Naked

@Firespawn
Yog is always outside. That's his thing, he's not everywhere, he's at the border of everything. Just saying. Also we know that Yog can at least have an avatar of somesort that is able mate with a human woman. In the case of BoP just read Dunwitch Horror.

Garbage Can Lid
Garbage Can Lid

@PurpleCharger
@WebTool
Contd.

Heal Aid:
Miracle imparted as charity to those of little faith..
To use miracles, equip a talisman or sacred chime and attune a miracle at a bonfire.
A miracle specifically meant to be used by the not-quite faithful.

Lightning Stake:
A lost dragonslaying miracle.
This tale describes the lost practices of ancient dragonslayers, who found that in order to pierce dragonscale, lightning should not be hurled as a bolt, but rather be thrust as a stake directly into the dragon's hide, to be truly effective.
Almost verbatim "instructions to be followed".

Magic Barrier:
Miracle of clerics who wield weapons.
There was a short period in history where clerics and sorcerers opposed one another. Thus it became necessary for even simple clerics to have some means of opposing magic.
Implies there was a need for a specific type of Miracle that this was developed in order to fill. No mention of Gods or epic tales.

Seek Guidance:
Miracle of stray souls.
Faith serves as a guide for clerics, meaning they should have no need for secondhand wisdom. Be that as it may, this miracle has been passed down from soul to soul, providing a tiny ray of hope for the lost.
No mention of Gods, no tales, created, etc.

Force:
Elementary miracle among clerics.
While it inflicts no direct damage, this miracle propels foes back, staggering them. Can also defend against incoming arrows.
No noteworthy tale to be found here.

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

@Stark_Naked
That's actually wrong. Yog-Sothoth is coterminous with space-time while also existing beyond it, meaning that all of space-time is merely one part of Yog-Sothoth. He isn't "always outside" of anything, he is both the inside and the outside. He is the Gate and the Key.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@DeathDog
You're explicitly using conjecture to fight with what little lore we have on how things work. Hexes come from DS2, which had a different director than 1 and 3, and weren't brought back for DS3 despite other elements like the Giant Trees and various armor sets, weapons and equipment.

If we're passing back and forth theories though, and taking Hexes as just as factual as anything else, I have some of my own. You say that because Hexes are rooted in both Sorcery and Miracles as hinted in descriptions such as Dark Hail-

"A hex modified from an old sorcery by Gilleah the Hexer. Fires several orbs of darkness. Hexing is rooted in both sorcery and miracles, but is viewed as a perilous affront to all life, and is banned in most lands."

-that all Miracles and Sorceries are from the same source. I don't think you're entirely wrong. I think both powers are rooted in the soul in a manner of speaking, just as many powers in this world are, but not the common soul. Sorcery can come from every soul, it is the art of manipulating the power of the soul after all. Miracles are obviously different though, most exhibiting powers of healing, light and lightning which are assuredly not native to the dark aligned Humanity. This reflects Gwyn and Gods. Who is to say only his Lord Soul could share such magic though?

When the Witch of Izalith's soul was warped by the accident that changed her into the Bed of Chaos, the art of Fire Sorcery died with her. That could be interpreted as the art dying out due to lack of knowledge, but three of her daughters who would definitely know the art suddenly lost that power too. But I think it's more likely that the art was something innate and even reliant to the power of the Witch's Lord Soul.

(Continued below)

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@DeathDog
@iluvmen

Now, more evidence, other Hex excerpts since you didn't want to bring them.

Dark Dance "Hex that unleashes a large mass of Dark. This momentous mass of Dark dances to signal the joy of its own release, or perhaps merely to taunt foes as it veers towards them. Hexes are an expression of human depravity, of which this dance is a perfect example."

Lifedrain Patch "Consume a number of souls and affix dark to a certain point. Inflicts damage upon those who touch it. This distorted dark, brewed by hexers, drains the life-force of those who touch it."

Both of these are interesting because they directly reference some familiar themes. Outside of just being dark like every other Hex, these specifically reference traits of humanity ("human depravity"), and Lifedrain, things associated with the Dark Soul. I propose Hexes are only possible because humanity has both the soul and humanity, and drawing on the power of the humanity within them as a hybridized dark art.

Again, purely conjecture. But if you want an explanation for these things you keep trying to use as proof, I believe this is more plausible.

Because they aren't spread far and wide, there are scraps floating around but most references to them are in the long forsaken ruins of Lordran that the game takes place in.
Bullshit, the Way of White is a widespread and widely praised order that worships Lloyd and Gwyn and never fades throughout time even when the order changes homes by the time of DS3. We know this as a fact. Knowledge of the gods never fades.

This is Dark Souls, the gameplay and the lore are tied together very deeply.
You shouldn't rigidly apply the belief that gameplay must reflect lore because sometimes it just doesn't make sense. Learning Miracles easily is a mercy to the player, not realistic, which is why we can wield any weapon or spell well the moment we get them.

Techpill
Techpill

@Firespawn
@Skullbone
I did say I don't know for sure. We're talking about a being that showed up briefly in the original Demonbane, and is a fragment in DYN. Of course I'm not saying anything with certainty, but at the same time these things do seem to have extremely vague limitations if Demonbane could defeat them at all. So I'm lowballing a tad instead of assuming Yog-Sothoth is literally omnipotent. I mean, the Silver Key stops Mugen's space manipulation dead on with but a wave and we have basically no lore on that thing.

That said, I do think a Yog could do something that would APPEAR to be like making avatars. But it's fundamental nature means they are all technically one thing. It's like saying your hand is the avatar of your brain.

およびそれらの間の空間に 海の変更 空の変更 スペースの変更 時間の変更 世界---変更 新しい世界が虹の球で作られています

If you need a quote from the game, there's this that talks about his spheres becoming reality.

@Stark_Naked
It's actually pretty easy to understand if you think of him as a human, and the universe as one of his stomach cells, and his avatars as Yog giving himself a colonoscopy. Everything is part of him, but part of him is also outside everything.

@StonedTime
He did say they were all horrifying. So not tiddy monster-like seems a safe assumption.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Gigastrength
which is why we can wield any weapon or spell well the moment we get them.
Except there are stat requirements.

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Techpill
It feels even more ridiculous to assume that the limitation that let Demonbane beat Yog was that it couldn't make weak avatars that were human sized.

You just don't seem to have any evidence for this claim that Yog cannot do this and keep bringing up very strange examples and reasons for justifying this, like saying that Yog being able to make smaller avatars to act through is the one difference between it being omnipotent and it not being so.

RavySnake
RavySnake

You know what I want to do. I want to get Kuzco and Gilgamesh in a room together and see what happens.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Firespawn
You're kidding. Stats do not equal skill and training with dozens of different weapons. They're your basic capabilities.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@RavySnake
What are Kuzco's Noble Phantasms? I know he'd hate using the one that turns him into a llama as much as Vlad hates using Legend of Dracula.

Dreamworx
Dreamworx

@Techpill
I suppose it boils down to what an "avatar" is. I suppose if we're talking about a completely separate existence that exists outside of oneself then it'd be accurate to say that Yog can't form an avatar because there isn't anything outside of him. But if we're talking about an avatar as in "a smaller existence which can more easily interact with the mortals" then he certainly could create a physical body out of matter and energy that isn't an infinite cosmic horror, even if it's just a glorified voice box through which he's talking to himself.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@RumChicken
Yes, and if you actually watch your character wield any weapons it becomes immediately obvious they're not doing it with much skill. As for "knowledge", that's what the times and scrolls are for.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

@RavySnake
Kuzco
Still no Emperor's New Groove jump
Reminder that it needs a Snuff Out the Light/Kingdom of the Sun 600 CP drawback where there's an elder god who wants to eat the sun.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@whereismyname
The Emperors Groove A Rank?

Spamalot
Spamalot

@iluvmen
You're explicitly using conjecture to fight with what little lore we have on how things work.
No I'm using conjecture to fight your conjecture, you have claimed that miracles work a given way with no evidence with the only quotes you've given not in any way contradicting what I've said.

I've claimed that Miracles work the way they do in game, you've said they don't they work in this different way you have not given any evidence for and is contradicted by your own jump that uses gameplay mechanics that wouldn't work under your interpretation.

iluvmen
iluvmen

@Spamalot
Since it seems like it's basically an argument of what either of you believe with neither of you accepting any evidence the other proposes, if there is any evidence, why don't we just drop the argument and skip ahead to the part where no change is made because no argument will be made that convinces the jumpmaker.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Dreamworx
That's pretty much what I was getting at, yeah. I'd even say an argument could be made he might be able to if he were to somehow exist in a setting where there are weird between-spaces or unreal dream dimensions that could be construed as also sufficiently outside space and time by mashing his gate-face into one.

But in the sense that "Yog can make a little dude-shape do stuff to things" then yeah, I would say he could make that kind of avatar. It's just that like you said, in reality it's more like a glorified voice box tha a distinct existence.

TreeEater
TreeEater

@iluvmen
Clarifying, not meaning any trouble to either side, I just really want to avoid what is very clearly going to turn into just another "But I'M right" "No I'M right" argument.

Snarelure
Snarelure

@Techpill
He did say they were all horrifying. So not tiddy monster-like seems a safe assumption.
What about a horrifying titty monster?

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@Techpill
The spheres thing is also how he looks in regular Lovecraft. I don't see how it proves anything. Look, Yog is the god and embodiment of space, time and knowledge. Is really that far fetched that he can manipulate space to create an avatar or know an spell to use create one?

@Techpill
He did say they were all horrifying. So not tiddy monster-like seems a safe assumption.
Yet one of his forms is simply a tall man. Nyarly has various human forms

@RavySnake
@whereismyname
Is this regular Kuzco or Pillar Man Kuzco?

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@Poker_Star
Well, you did a shockingly poor job of communicating your intent and even with that purpose, you made some truly strange assertions and comparisons and I still don't understand how making a separate existence makes him omnipotent. Still, glad it's cleared up.

StonedTime
StonedTime

@Snarelure
Nya is not a horrifying titty monster, and IIRC the 3 eyed monster is technically the Haunter in the Dark being overlapped onto the titty monster mask.

whereismyname
whereismyname

@BlogWobbles
There's a pillar man kuzco? I was talking bout the Disney one.

Nojokur
Nojokur

@StonedTime
Nyarly can look however she/he/it/they/we want

Lunatick
Lunatick

@BlogWobbles
@LuckyDusty
It's almost like Demonbane is more ridiculous, obscure and difficult to articulate than fucking Nasuverse in parts. And I brought up the omnipotence thing because making avatars is Nya's main shtick in the Demonbane franchise, and the series goes out of it's way to distinguish their wills as distinct characters (Yog helps Demonbane, Nya is arguably the final boss if you don't count) and inferred from that.

Also I dunno which Kuzco, it was anon's idea.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

@whereismyname
I think /coco/ Kuzco is a Pillarman, but normal Kuzco isn't.

MPmaster
MPmaster

@Poker_Star
Yeah, that's what I figured. I guess it came down to miscommunication.

Also now I can't get the image of Yog cramming his metaphysical head into some bizarro alien dimension like some creep with his face up against the glass.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@Techpill
He did say they were all horrifying. So not tiddy monster-like seems a safe assumption.
Wasn't Lovecraft terrified of women, or am I thinking of a different author from the period?

massdebater
massdebater

@Sir_Gallonhead
That just means I can get another Kuzco then. Perfect.

Inmate
Inmate

@MPmaster
*get the image out of my head

idontknow
idontknow

@Soft_member
Terrified of fish
Terrified of women
Terrified of black people
What DIDN'T scare this weeny?

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

@Lunatick
No, this was just you. It's not the series' fault you're not able to distinguish that you are arguing about a different kind of avatar from what everyone else is.

You go back to making no sense too. Why does Yog being able to make avatars like Nyarlathotep make him omnipotent? It doesn't mean he can do anything.

Playboyize
Playboyize

@whereismyname
/co/co/'s Bizarre Adventure was fun while it lasted

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Soft_member
I think it was racial minorities, but only in his youth; it was basically his chuuni phase. He seemed more horrified of sex in general, but it doesn't really come across as directed to a specific gender in his writing what with the Deep Ones and Whateley family having pervs on both sides of the bathroom.

@Inmate
Yog cramming his metaphysical head into some bizarro alien dimension like some creep with his face up against the glass

The reverse of this is basically what's happening in the last 2 Epic of Remnant scenarios in GO from what I remember. First you have that evil sorceror servant guy in Shimosa talking about finding a universe inhabited by alien gods, and talking to someone who might be Nyarlathotep. Then Salem turns out to be Raum summoning not!Yog out of desperation.

So it's more like these idiots are trying to yank Yog into the Human Order for terrible, terrible reasons.

@idontknow
Both his parents were insane, he has fairly decent excuses for being afraid of literally everything.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@iluvmen
neither of you accepting any evidence the other proposes
Neither of them have any evidence, it's Dark Souls, the games don't go into detail on how stuff works.

Methnerd
Methnerd

@haveahappyday
I'm not saying it's impossible to teach people in other settings Miracles, just real difficult. It's still a focus for casting Miracles with scaling elements, no reliance on durability and the power to be shared.

@WebTool
While it is the description, it does back up the idea that Miracles and casting them are intrinsically linked to stories and belief in those stories. That's also why Miracle casting tools always manifest as objects that aid in prayer.

It's actually pretty fair to say that Miracles don't have to be rooted in the acts of gods with proof like this though. So I'll rescind that part of my argument.

@Garbage Can Lid
Heal Aid is also very weak, which is notable.

Lightning Stake and Magic Barrier stand in stark opposition to all previous references which certainly do rely on belief however.

Seek Guidance I'll argue does show proof however, given that it's noted as passed down from person to person as a means of giving hope.

Force was explicitly said to be the tattered, lesser version of Wrath of the Gods within its description.

@Firespawn
See @RumChicken

@Lunatick
That really depends on the weapon given some movesets are more basic while others are more complex with techniques and moves the player shouldn't know. What do you mean by times and why do you say just finding the scrolls is a good stand in of learning time given not much discernible time passes within the world over the course of a story?

@Spamalot
I'm claiming that we're not dealing with a world reliant on game mechanics to exist and function while trying to assert that claim with lore of how such things can be said to work in the world.

and is contradicted by your own jump that uses gameplay mechanics that wouldn't work under your interpretation.
Do you mean in the perks or something else?

@iluvmen
@TreeEater
Yeah, fuck it, I'll give it up. I've got a raging headache anyways since I usually go to bed hours ago.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

@Methnerd
I'm pretty certain you are completely missing the point of what I'm saying and/or I'm saying it very poorly.

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

@VisualMaster
I'm fairly certain it's the latter, the two of you seem to at least agree it's the stories that hold the power. Far as I can tell you started arguing because you want to know how to teach people the miracles, and you think the Way of White perk is redundant. There's never been any blanket assumption about you being absolutely unable to do something a perk can unless it's explicit somewhere in the jump.

So...since you both agree on the stories having the power, don't you have your answer? Just make some stories and distribute them, maybe give people Dark Souls-style souls if you think they need their oomph to give the spells energy. Boom, miracles.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@Spazyfool
Damn, why is Dio so tall?

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@Stark_Naked
If you're going to make me laugh so hard this early in the morning, I'm going to need more caffeine

Emberfire
Emberfire

@King_Martha
I figured it's just the JoJo version of scaling ethnic physiologies, like how regular brits are on average taller than japs. Because Josuke is already a big guy, Dio and Jonathan have to be drawn incredibly massive.

DeathDog
DeathDog

@VisualMaster
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if I was completely off the mark. I've got a headache and a history with misunderstanding another party's point, fiercely debating a point, and then finding out way later in that I'd been arguing something different all along. I got into one of those types of arguments just last week. Sorry if that's the case, that'd be on me.

@Stark_Naked
Sweet Jesus that's abominable and terrible and I'm definitely saving it. Good god I hate/love it, mostly love.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

@Emberfire
Josuke
You mean Jotaro?

And meant more that specific picture, where he's like twice as tall as the ring/the other guy (Mac?).

Lunatick
Lunatick

Here's a dumb but funny mental image. Everyone's benefactors get together and vent about their respective Jumpers. How does that go?
@Stark_Naked
That is glorious

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@Gigastrength
more caffeine
I hope you choke on it.

Soft_member
Soft_member

@King_Martha
@GoogleCat
Punch Out always made the other guys absolutely massive compared to Little Mac. Little Mac was short, sure, but some of them made him look like a grade schooler.

Methshot
Methshot

@Gigastrength
this early in the morning
How early in the morning is it?

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

@Boy_vs_Girl
Why so salty

eGremlin
eGremlin

@DeathDog
I definitely haven't gotten across what I've been trying to say and I don't think there is any actual point to this argument since this is about the setting's lore rather than the jump.

Sorry if I've contributed to your headache.

FastChef
FastChef

@Soft_member
Ah. Thanks, nibba.

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

@Lunatick
Why are people so obsessed with potatoes recently? Just make a multiplayer supplement if you want it so badly, it'd probably get accepted in today's thread.

viagrandad
viagrandad

@Lunatick
My benefactor skips it because they are busy playing vidya with me in the warehouse, companions yell at us for being neets.

kizzmybutt
kizzmybutt

@Lunatick
How are your "jumps" coming along?

Methshot
Methshot

@Lunatick

Here's a dumb but funny mental image. Everyone's benefactors get together and vent about their respective Jumpers. How does that go?

Drunken halfhearted complaints about I don't stop trying to impress her with various degrees of success. I ain't ever gonna give up until I win her over and then my chain can start it's act 2.

Firespawn
Firespawn

@Lunatick
Will we have blueberry waifus in time for Christmas?

SniperGod
SniperGod

@eGremlin
Nah dude, don't apologize to me over anything like that, it wasn't anything to do with you anyways. It's just been cold and raining here nonstop and I've been up a really long time.

@FastChef
No problem dude.

@Raving_Cute
Has there been a recent uptrend? I don't think I've seen any real potato talk. Even the prompt just looks like fun fodder.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Lunatick
HeavensAnon
Meh. It's better than Valeria.

Lunatick
Lunatick

@Boy_vs_Girl
That seems overly hostile. Is there something you need to get off your chest user?

@Methshot
Huh. It's 10am. I guess it's not as early as I thought. It's just overcast. Stupid winter sunlight playing tricks on me.

@Lunatick
Original!Chain
"Do you know how much energy it takes to transport all those Companions across dimensions? I mean, he's an entertaining little ball of lust but he just keeps adding onto the list! It's wearing me out!"

Restarted!Chain
Warmonger: "You said it was my turn with him!"
Debtor: "No, last time you had him you broke him."
W: "I just gave him what he wanted!"
Love Guru: "I sincerely doubt he wanted all his Companions shoved into his soul!"
W: "It's more economical that way. Now he can have entire armies at his disposal."
D: "But how am I supposed to bet on any of the stuff in the Slice of Life category now?! You don't think!"

Prinny Sidechain
"They're just crashing through settings barriers on their own! I haven't even gotten to introduce myself yet because every time I find them again they're already gone! They could have at least stayed still long enough for the introductory speech. I had such a lovely one prepared. All sorts of thunder and lighting. But noooooo! They're tearing holes through the Multiverse in that pile of junk spaceship they made!"

Glitch Sidechain
"Four Jumps and he stayed in a world! FOUR JUMPS! Do you know how hard it was to find a backdoor into the system? A first in the history of this whole affair and I pulled it off! And now everyone just laughs at me because the idiot Tinkertoy dug his fists in and threw a temper tantrum when it was time to leave that damn world of songs and Halloween."

Dual!Jumpchain
Man in Grey: "Seriously, everyone knows the Harem league is where the major betting action is, but no matter what I do, this guy just stays with one woman. Two harem perks under his belt. He should be beating off women with a stick. But noooooo!"

Heavens, you were right. That was fun.

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

@Emberfire
Was Josuke really that big of a guy? I thought he was more normal-sized.

idontknow
idontknow

@Lord_Tryzalot
He's less built than say, Jonathan, and looks younger than Jotaro despite Jotaro technically being his junior. But he's still pretty broad and built under that school uniform. It's partially the artstyle changing over time, I think.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

@Lunatick
I took their names to try and coax them into accepting new identities.
Now their conversations and internal monologues are cloyingly sweet since they just give each other lovey dovey nicknames.
If I have to hear one more variation on sugar, baby or honey I'm banning those words.
I don't care if they have one later, they'll have to call it "small human." No more I say.
Based on what some people have mentioned, this sounds vaguely accurate?

Sharpcharm
Sharpcharm

@idontknow
Jotaro isn't his junior. Josuke is in high school whilst Jotaro is working as a marine biologists, years passed since he graduated.

WebTool
WebTool

What are some jumps with good biotech? Im not looking for magic or infections but good biotech that I can use to program and built a creature from base dna up.

RumChicken
RumChicken

@Sharpcharm
Probably misremembering something he said when they first met.

@WebTool
The Polity, you can make whole ecosystems with it.

ZeroReborn
ZeroReborn

@Sharpcharm
Maybe he's mistaking the fact that Josuke is Jotaro's uncle for Josuke being older than him.

CodeBuns
CodeBuns

@Sharpcharm
Think he's referring to Jotaro being Joseph's grandson while Josuke is his son.

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

@Lunatick
Mine is a hikikomori, so she hides in the corner until she can escape.

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

@CodeBuns
Makes more sense, even if it seems weird to point out in that manner.

King_Martha
King_Martha

@ZeroReborn
That could be it.

Techpill
Techpill

@WebTool
Go to one of the marvel jumps that lets you buy a phd and major in biotech, you cant get much better than that.

BlogWobbles
BlogWobbles

@Booteefool
Hey Val. If you have Too Cool For Screen Time, would other perks that enhance your sword skill even have any effect? I'm going through old builds again, and I really don't know if I have any reason to take Unnatural Skill (Swordsmanship) in Percy Jackson if I already have that perk.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

@WebTool
I think whatever base you find, you should swing by Jurassic Park at some point after. It has an entire perk line for genetically engineering shit that may interest you.

eGremlin
eGremlin

@WebTool
Eclipse phase, like there is an entire line of science devoted to making extreme shit like sun whales.

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

@BlogWobbles
I mean...probably not? I guess it depends on how you personally handle that stuff and things like soft caps and whatever.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

@BlogWobbles
It makes you better than perfect, they have to redefine what they thought "perfect" looked like.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

@StrangeWizard
Mhm, just asking if your skill is literally perfect or if it's like some of the immunities we have that don't actually make you immune to the thing they're about. Though apparently it's the former.

Really, that perk should be fun in Desolate Era.

Skullbone
Skullbone

@Gigastrength
Nah, it's meant to be perfect as can be.

Emberburn
Emberburn

@WebTool
Warframe. Get orokin tech and literally everything can be meat.

farquit
farquit

@Emberburn
It bothers me that space tech is all meat based. For what puerpose? It seems stupidly overcomplicated.

Bidwell
Bidwell

@Gigastrength
some of the immunities we have that don't actually make you immune to the thing they're about
Which ones are those?

TreeEater
TreeEater

@LuckyDusty
Say. Rubber Body + Hi Spec, would I be a discount Reed Richards?

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

@Lunatick
These Benefactors are too loud
My mists hurt
Do you people even fanfiction?
Oh, they do. Well, there goes my last scrap of street cred
Just gotta smile and act natural
Fuck, why did I tell them I dropped my Jumper a few times?
W-why are so many of you married? I'm still young right...
I don't like this soda, should've brought the superior Japanese brands with me
It's too warm in here
If I fidget hard enough maybe they won't notice how bad I smell
I wish I was at home crushing Jumper at Mario Kart

eGremlin
eGremlin

@Bidwell
Something I remember off the top of my head: Supernatural Durability in Teen Titans says that you become "completely immune to extreme heat and freezing cold". Then in the next sentence it says that molten lava and cryogenic temperatures can still kill you.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

@TreeEater
Probably, yeah. I could definitely see it. More specifically I imagine it being easier to achieve more complex applications for your rubber physiology.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

@farquit
You know how in dune they use navigator mutants to travel because there was an ai uprising? Same principal.

massdebater
massdebater

@TreeEater
That's kind of lame, to be honest, and just having both is the worst kind of OC result. However, I can't think of a good fusion for smart and rubber.

Unless you want to go really conceptual and apply the flexibility to your intelligence? Be impossibly good at lateral thinking and reaching conclusions in roundabout ways?

idontknow
idontknow

@Gigastrength
Really, that perk should be fun in Desolate Era.
Yeah, you'd be able to get up to some sheninigans.

start the jump as a Xiantian Lifeform
immediately master the Grand Dao of the Sword and make your own Omega Sword Dao.

Supergrass
Supergrass

@idontknow
It means supernatural shit. "Magic" is just a fluff term. Also it's not a Sailor Moon Crystal Jump, just a Sailor Moon Jump.

@King_Martha
Being a head on the body of a big buff guy can do it. Also everyone was fucking massive in the 80's, it's just how you drew shounen stuff.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

@massdebater
Hi Spec probably already is flexible. Look at the Principal when he was going easy. He was able to stay ten steps ahead in the trails, granted his opponents were two idiots, but still he was able to entrap then while leaving them a way out (or so he says). All the while sitting on a crane, sipping tea. He couldn’t see, hear, or know where the students were. Yet he was able to knock buildings down in their direction and force them to go where he wanted.

@AwesomeTucker
We talking more Plastic Man stuff or Luffy?

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