Is IQ genetic?

Is IQ genetic?

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sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960982213008440
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No, all organisms have the same potential for high intelligence, regardless of genetic makeup.

Nature/Nurture

IQ is probably 70% genes, 30% conditioning

[CITATION NEEDED]

It's more heritable than encoded in genetics, which are two separate things as everyone surely knows.

Now fuck off back to /pol/

It's 110% environmental.

If you starve a kid to death then its IQ will be 0 regardless of the genes so it's all about the surroundings.

>You can make down syndrome kids be quantum physicists if you feed them right!!

studies of adopted twin separated at birth have shown it is 60℅ hereditary at the most conservative.

Yeah I'd want to see a 180 IQ toddler outsmart my hammer. Til that happens it's all environmental.

The mental gymnastics you must be going through to justify your erroneous view of reality. Comparable to creationist, I wager.

>when i say environment i only mean one that suits my extremely specific conditions perfectly and NO deviation can be allowed or else what i said is false!!!!
I'M the one engaging in mental gymnastics, right?

>t. Brainlet

...

true, I for one always keep an E. coli colony in my pocket to do my DEs for me

IQ is entirely genetic.

There are people born in slums who show themselves to be super smart. They are stunted in growth due to malnutrition but still smart as fuck.

Of course there is some environmental factors, but like with height it is mostly genetic and the environmental factors can only decrease your IQ, not increase it.

What if I dedicated my life to solving complex puzzles/problems, would that not increase my IQ since IQ tests are mostly pattern recognition?

>Enviromental factors can influence IQ
Yes, and? How do from this conclude that genetics aren't a factor at all when it comes to IQ?

It seems like you want that to be the case rather than provide any proper logic that supports your claim.

it would, since pattern recognition is a factor of intelligence

>There are people born in slums who show themselves to be super smart
>but their parent (who should also be super smart) never managed to get out of slums

Children with 2 teachers as parents are usually smarter and do better in school.
>Genetics are a factor
But so is enviroment in which you grow up
>sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960982213008440

Being smart doesn't guarantee getting out of the slums. Did you think that being smart alone takes you out of the slums 100% of the time?

Yes, they are both factors. The genetic part is what causes discrepancies between different ethnic groups who live in essentially the same enviroment.

How much of your intelligence is determined by genetics is another question, but is clear that genes have a strong influence over an individuals intellect.

>genetics aren't a factor at all when it comes to IQ
>It seems like you want that to be the case rather than provide any proper logic that supports your claim.
Well then let me employ mathematics to demonstrate the reasoning:

First we must assume that when someone dies, their IQ becomes 0.

Second we must assume that no person alive has an IQ of 0.

Now let us assume IQ to be x and environment to be y.

x-y=0
(death by starvation removes 100% of a persons IQ)

That means there is no room for any other factor. If we were to add the factor for genetics, z, the formula would look as follows:

x+z-y=0.
(death by starvation still removes 100% of a persons IQ, regardless of z)

Clearly, therefore, I have shown now that z can not have any value for there exist no conditions whereby both x-y=0 and x+z-y=0 could be true other than z being 0.

>The genetic part is what causes discrepancies between different ethnic groups who live in essentially the same enviroment.
Where does this happen? Ethnic groups all have different environments, even in the most mixed cities.

different apititudes create difference conditions. brianlets do manual labor and retail with the other illiterates and the cognitive elite stay in their white collar safe space.

Nowhere are there 2 people that live in 100% identical enviroments (not even twins in the same family do). However all factors that can be deemed influential on an individuals intellectual development are essentially the same for individuals of different ethnic groups in modern society.

Yes culture is one factor that determines how intelligent an individual becomes, but there is no reason to believe that it is the sole determining factor of such a complex thing as intellect.

Looks like your mom should have fed you better.

Genes are part of what causes death in an individual. Y must then contain both enviromental and genetical factors. Even with your purposefully shitty logic we can conclude that IQ is part hereditary.

>all factors that can be deemed influential on an individuals intellectual development are essentially the same for individuals of different ethnic groups in modern society.
Holy shit no, not at all. There are lots of environmental factors. So fucking many. I'm not saying genetics is not part of it, but any person benefits from improved environment, and there's so much room for improvement. Go see how schools run in the inner city for instance.

>but any person benefits from improved environment
Nobody is disputing this.

Of all the ethnic groups that live in the inner city, some will be smarter despite them all living there and going to the same shitty public schools.

Y contains strictly environmental factors.

Stop trying to change the goal. You were trying to prove that genetics plays a role in intelligence, not death.

Of course. But we need there to not be shitty public schools among many other problems if we want to improve outcomes for minorities. Race realists will say you can't improve their outcome, which is bullshit.

IQ IS NOT A REAL THING

>IQ is probably 70% genes, 30% conditioning
>this is true because I feel like it's true.
Fuck off retard

>Fuck off retard

Hit a nerve?

On yourself.

Yeah, You weren't even wrong
Fuck off retard

>Lurks through comments
>Only one person supports their argument with a source

Jesus Christ Veeky Forums

Bullcrap, Veeky Forums is proof you are born smart or stupid there is no choice.

The difference between being an apple and a porcupine is genetic

But why are then rich blacks then still dumb as monkeys

What else would, please respond, its extremely important

it's no more real than mathematics
there is no gene in the body that says "this person has an IQ of 100" if that's what you mean
do you wish to imply that a statistical metric used to measure someone's fluid intelligence doesn't exist?
if so, lol

>Race realists will say you can't improve their outcome
No they don't. Why are you even on Veeky Forums when you just argue against your shitty strawmen?

>reddit spacing
>bacteria is just as smart as anyone else, it just needs more opportunities

when did Veeky Forums become /minority IQ/? Who cares, you're a fool if you think you can't put any random black kid in a culture/environment that values science and math and he'd be far better at them then another kid, from a different ethnicity, thats glorifies over priced shoes and basketball.

The same reason rich whites are still dumb as monkeys

>is intelligence genetic
Idk user go ask a lizard if they can do algebra.

HIDE PSYCHOLOGY THREADS
IGNORE PSYCHOLOGY POSTS
DO NOT REPLY TO PSYCHOLOGIST POSTERS

The thing about genetic expression is that you have predispositions to many things that never wind up coming to light.

That's to say, your genes aren't all in use all the time. Your genes will effectively turn on and off during your lifetime based on environmental factors. For instance, many genetic diseases only show up later in life, but this can be sped up through drug use. Changing genetic expressions can also be seen more commonly in hair color and eye color, even before pubescence. Behavioral expressions and, yes, IQ can be reasonably associated with genetic predisposition, but it's not one pretty number like says. People with more intense environments will be more harshly shaped by those environments and are more likely to have the conditioning factors add up. A child can go through some screwed up warzone experiences and wind up just as psychotic as a child who already had a sociopathic genetic predisposition and was locked out of his house one time.

I've literally heard it before. Just my experience.

>implying the root cause of downs is not environmental in nature

Debatable: A.
Highly debatable: 2.
Objectively incorrect: 6.
Unproven: 6A, 6C.

>Using a single paper to confirm each point
try looking at the entire body of literature instead

They aren't my poor commie friend, its why they got you buy your boipussy

Doesn't mean it's causal, the father who skips town or the mother who fucks a guy who would skip town would be naturally dumber right?

>a literal retard
Relative to someone of other culture doesn't mean anything when compared to his white peers who outperform him infinitely

>a fish has the same potential for high intelligence as a human

This. I taught my dog calculus.

bump

>tfw most people on Veeky Forums don't understand that statistics about heritability has nothing to do when people ask about IQ being genetic.
>tfw people think 50% genetic means 50% of their individual IQ is due to genes.
>tfw people don't know that heritability statistics only concern variation in a population.
>tfw when people dont know you can't decompose an individual person's IQ into percentages of environment and genetics because each of these inputs to whatever ontogeny you talk about is completely interactional.
>tfw when people on Veeky Forums use anecdotes of individual people "super smart but living in shit" to counter statistics about heritability when as said above, this doesn't make sense.
>tfw people don't understand that heritability estimates are completely dependent on the attributes of the population you look at i,e. they are relative and change easily based on who you are looking at, where they are, how old they are etc.
>tfw people don't understand that heritability has no necessary baring on how changeable a trait is.

Nigger culture is toxic

Not at all, synaptic connections and long term potentiation is defined very little by genetics but a lot by the environment, this is where the famous synaptic pruning kicks in which is what actually determines how "smart" a person is.

Also as an interesting note... aberrant synaptic pruning is used as the best current model to explain pathologies as schizophrenia and severe bipolar disease.

>if you murder someone they can't think
>this somehow proves a point
Really makes me think, until someone kills me that is.

lol wut?

Interestingly, synaptic pruning has nothing to do with genes >(?)

Interestingly, schizophrenia is one of the few mental illnesses without an infamous hereditary component.

No, incorrect quoting. I never said it has nothing to do with it. of course as everything it has something to do with genetics but what is as important as genetics is the environmental changes that certain individual experiences during its development and it is common sense come on... if you educate someone he will be smarter than someone who hasn't been educated, it is not rocket science at all.

What does this mean?

sorry, i simply inferred that when you answered the question "is iq genetic" with "no, not at all".

> of course as everything it has something to do with genetics but what is as important as genetics is the environmental changes that certain individual experiences during its development and it is common sense come on...

really didn't come across in your original post especially with the "synaptic connections has nothing to with genes bit".

>if you educate someone he will be smarter than someone who hasn't been educated, it is not rocket science at all.

i didn't actually say anything about this topic.

Opression knows no bounds.

Traducir

You just can't say that any physiological process depends solely on genetics or solely on the environment. If you study biology long enough you will realize that it is not just black or white but grayish. Everything is in perfect interaction, if not then you get sick and die.

well this was a big fail...

I agree... I was quite vague in my original post I do apologize

And wealthy people will always have near perfect conditioning so that really only applies to poor and middle class people with shitty lives. Though the wealthy have IQs 115 on average, I think it would be 105 if they were born poor (compared to 90 average). So if your IQ is 115 and you were born poor, you are likely much smarter than any rich person, you were just born into the wrong environment.

>Being opressed makes you stupid
Even if that was the case, there is no major oppressions that effect entire ethnic groups in the western world, quite the contrary.

Retard parents can occasionally, very rarely give birth to geniuses. Also, this . Environmental conditions like a recession or depression can also trap you into poverty. Not to mention some people with IQ's of 140 become bums, though I'd say 9/10 of those bums are due to genetics, but that 1/10 are due to environmental factors. Genetics are definitely dominate, but people should not exclude environment.


Also, can we ban IQ posting on Veeky Forums, I admit it's a guilty pleasure, but it's such a brainlet thing to care about IQ and not real science.

what do you mean 9/10 are due to genetics? so they were suddenly born homeless and made no decisions or came into any situations that led them to that position?

Hah you're a funny guy

>assuming the relationship is linear

Why the obsession with black people?
I know this is a shitposting thread but why do idiots obssess over shit solely for the reason to shit on blacks?

for people who lack personal accomplishment, they must create inherent accomplish

yes to an extent

no matter how much I study I am never going to be as intelligent as this man

Alexander Grothendieck

Definitely more than 80% genetic.

>making assumptions about someones accomplishments and motives based on their choice of scientific discussion

Grothendieck had a rare intuition of the generality of math that many others lacked..

It's true that he worked insane hours (often 20) a day, but he had a certain intuition that others lacked, that allowed him to look at math problems differently

rather that be a skill learned from genetics or environment is unknown, but i don't believe Grothendieck's intelligence was the result of purely enviromental factors, remember that he lived in poverty, in refugee camps his whole childhood

>Is IQ genetic?
Does it matter? Since we don't know what environmental factors, if any exist, that can be used to increase intelligence, then in practical terms it might as well be completely genetic (of course, some environmental factors such as abuse or malnutrition can decrease intelligence)

>but he had a certain intuition that others lacked, that allowed him to look at math problems differently

That intuition came from his experience.

Not only that, Im correct too

But there were other mathematicians who were just as experienced but didn't accomplish anywhere near what grothy did

As an example could be 9/10 genetics, meaning despite having high IQ their genetics might have caused them to make decisions resulting in homelessness. Just trying to appease the fags in this thread who don't believe in unlucky situations, more fairly it's probably 5/10 with it slightly leaning towards genetics.

This is a gross oversimplification. Nuture and nature play off of each other. In other words certain upbringings could make my genes stand out more or less. It's not a fixed percentage.

Its 80% genes, 20% random biological noise and dumb luck. Environmental factors have little to know measured influence on most traits, including IQ.

9/10 of what? 10 what?

>genius babies die if you dont feed them
>that means they have 0 IQ and its all environmental
whoa

9/10 genetics

FPBP as usual. That's why I taught my Reeses monkey how to complete intro calc II equations

You're implying a lot of interesting facts. Could you please elaborate or point to a reputable source that does?
/pol/:
>Nigger culture is destroying black communities through its glorification of violence and greed. (They also talk a lot about media brainwashing and stuff like that)
Also /pol/:
>Don't be stupid, videogames (and other media) don't cause me to be sexist (or racist or whatever), there's no proof for it and (inser anecdote or something).
I never understood this meme. Can anyone explain?
>Not at all, synaptic connections and long term potentiation is defined very little by genetics but a lot by the environment, this is where the famous synaptic pruning kicks in which is what actually determines how "smart" a person is.
What are the implications of what you're saying when it comes to intelligence?

actual /pol/:
>Nigger culture is destroying nigger culture because they are niggers
Also /pol/:
>Niggers
You don't understand it because of how poorly you represented it to start with