Anyone reading this? Thoughts?

>>Skewing statistics
I'm listening

>skewing statistics

Butterfly, my opinion of your carefully cultivated persona has declined precipitously. The refusal to discuss black criminality is a throbbing tumor on the the liberal platform.

Does he mention that Obama made the bottom 60% of America pay for the financial crisis twice, cratering the wealth for 80% of whites, 98% of blacks, and 98% of hispanics?

>The refusal to discuss black criminality
That wasn't a refusal. I don't even have the stats but I can tell what that user is doing. Don't play coy with me.

Is this even the subject of the book?

It is a bizarre 600 page screed recreating with large amounts of magical realism a history of 8 years of drone strikes on Yemeni weddings, along with scenes of negro hedonism with Obama smilingly leading the throng. There are also bizarre chapters with run-on sentences of racial slurs against whites. Truly a post-modern exploration of blacks in power.

I wasnt referring to you, I was referring to the US left in general. The numbers for black criminality vs total population % is ghastly, and you can listen to NPR all day (I do) without hearing a peep for months.

Even the Antioch church shooting has been studiously avoided. It is grotesque, and certainly not a skewing of statistics. Yes user is a shitty /pol/ type, but your response was....inadequate.

nah

They love to rationalize dehumanizing black people though, so they take any opportunity presented.

>black criminality

wew, the meme that will never die

this post has to be a false flag.

Black on Black crime is as acceptable in the Black community as mass shootings are in American culture.

Poverty, the violence that capitalism causes, hurts us all, but the US, like a lot of places, has a deep seated hatred of dark skinned people and so the wealthy put them in a cesspool to bit at each other. The statistics are surprising but they aren't making "black criminality" any more valid a point.

>bit
Bite

butterfly I have to ask you sumpin.

white supremacists think the world is run by an all powerful cabal of jews

communists think that the world is run by an all powerful cabal of bourgeois

what difference does it make in our everyday life who is right?

The right (liberal-capitalists, fascists, "ancaps") are essentially fighting each other for dominance, often racial or religious dominance. Some of them are Jews, some aren't. To cut away only successfully wealthy Jews isn't a cure for what ails us.
It's cutting away the very idea that we can become wealthier than one another by such significant and horrendous means.
I don't need to see the wealthy hung or shot, I just want everyone to stop this cancerous system that creates monsters of people

Systems don't create monsters, people decide to become monsters.

They dehumanize themselves. I want them to act like humans. Unfortunately morality is relative, so for someone that recognizes getting robbed as being "just part of the game [of the streets]" and not to take such an offense personally, the Golden Rule does little to civilize such a mindset. This is a topic that must be addressed. While I don't have numbers on hand, black murders are perpetrated by other blacks on a, what, over 90% basis?

Ethics and morality must find their way to even the least intelligent among us if we are to raise the lowest common denominator to a level of peace and prosperity. Perpetual moral absolution is as treating someone like a child.

/pol/ and Veeky Forums are supposed to be separate but equally retarded. get to the back of the bus, faggot.

Do you deny that mass hysteria exists and that people operate differently in a group than they do 1-on-1 or by themselves?

I wish I could deny that /pol/ exists.

Why don't you try reading some Virilio?

>Environment means nothing!
>I was born a whole person

Stay pleb and blue-pilled to death, you piece of garbage.

Yes, we must stary cleaning up the ghettoes. They are just so filthy, aren't they? Perhaps we can organize eith our friends to buy low-cost property and improve the neighborhoods.

>stary
>eith
>low-cost property?
What on earth...

People don't own property. See? Glaring example of someone who has been molded by his current social paradigm

>Anyone reading this?
No, I'm intelligent and respect myself

Yep. There is no correlation between low intelligence, poverty and crime. Smart people are just as likely to be poor as the stupid. Idiots are no more likely to think crime is a good idea than anyone else

That is true, we do need to abolish property taxes.

...

>liberal capitalists
>right

do you realize you are the meme? honestly the Democrats embracing DSA/communism in America has driven me from them. y'all are completely without cognitive ability.

>Smart people are just as likely to be poor as the stupid
And the deciding factor would be poverty and how you want to parse "crime" out.

We need to abolish money. Government, poverty and taxes crumble away with that.

>Democrats. Embracing communism.
You aren't too up on what's going on, user.
The DNC are like most parties, pro-capitalist. Every variety of liberal is pro-capitalist. Progressives are simply reformists who want to fix teh inherent problems it has. The European progressives (social-democrats) have made a nice show of it, but the problems persist. Capitalism is bad for the majority. The left are anti-capitalist.

I always think of the makers of these things admitting to their autism.

>Progressives are simply reformists who want to fix teh inherent problems
You aren't too up on what's going on, little farfalla. Kids today want free college, free medical goods and services, free basic income, free childcare, free free free.

>We need to abolish money.
This is why I can't take you seriously. You insist on removing a necessary component of exchange. Might as well try to abolish breathing. Technology/AI is not sufficiently advanced to support a planet full of do-nothing pet humans yet, and you're not offering any solutions but the stupidest.

>free free free.
They want freedom. And since we are told that capitalism is the O N L Y choice, they know damn well there's money enough to pay the teachers, the doctors, the childcare. They know this because of all the spending on pointless cruel wars are skyrocketing, they know this since European nations have arranged things enough to pay for a good deal of it. Capitalism can be done better, but its big problem is that it's immensely corrupting. It's corruption itself.
No, actual leftists want people to work, a reasonable amount for once, for each others benefits. The moneyless world would work really well.

It's not necessary to introduce a piece of crap that spiritually represents wealth when wealth is already *in* the person and *in* the recourse the person grows, molds, transports for the benefit of his fellow people.

Technology is advancing to the point of putting everyone out of work. And some of the wealthy just want the excess humans to curl up and die. But you're cool with that I'm sure.

>actual leftists want people to work, a reasonable amount for once, for each others benefits.

You will never see a moneyless paradise without the literal destruction of civilization and the rule of law, and a return to barbarism, slavery, and tribal war. Without an incentive to work, what will motivate an economy? I'll tell you: nothing. Certainly not without losing the freedom you supposedly want. You think a moneyless society will respect the rights of the individual? Absolutely not. Beating, public shaming, leg irons, whatever it takes to get the lazybones out of bed and into work. Tribal groups know who the bad apples are, and they will cast them out. Woe will be yours, people of the We-Want-Free-Stuff tribe.

>The moneyless world would work really well.

You realize that money is not evil in itself? Money is just counting pebbles we trade back and forth for labor, a way to keep track of numbers. Its physicality is rather like blockchain tech that protects cryptocurrency; you own that value because you are holding it in your hand, it is self-evident. Capitalism has some problems, mostly leftovers from 18th century corporations and their cozy relationships with government. These demons need to be exorcised, and the system will run a lot cleaner. But don't tear it down just because the half-formed ideas are so much prettier in your mind.

>They want freedom.
No, they want me to be a slave and just *give* them my labor or be fined. Communists really make me laugh.

I don't think its correct to assert that capitalism is inherently anymore 'corrupting' than any other system that been seen in the world. I don't disagree that in many ways the modern capital-based system is to an extent corrupt, but this isn't to do with capitalism itself but rather the political systems of most major democracies having failed to keep up with the times.

I'd also disagree that in any way that people are being 'told' capitalism is the only choice. There have been other systems throughout years, and ultimately history has shown them to be more inefficient in bringing about global peace and prosperity that open exchange of goods through free markets. We are not so much told it is the only choice, but shown by history.

I more or less agree with you, but I think moneyless societies are feasible on small, commune-style levels, where the participants in it have willingly opted into such a society. Having said that, it should also be noted that the very fact a moneyless society in any widespread level would not be made up fully of voluntary participants, which would as you say, inevitably doom it to failure.

>You will never see a moneyless paradise without the literal destruction of civilization
This is why I fight FOR it. We will likely be driven to extinction by your type.
>the literal destruction ... the rule of law,
This would be good.
>a return to barbarism, slavery, and tribal war.
THIS is what we have NOW. You haven't the foggiest idea of your world

The system of money is evil itself.

>Freedom is slavery
>Weakness is strength
...Where have we heard this before?

>It's not necessary to introduce a piece of crap that spiritually represents wealth when wealth is already *in* the person and *in* the recourse the person grows, molds, transports for the benefit of his fellow people.

Even if somehow everyone in the first world is taking their Soma and we transcend into a moneyless wonderland where everyone is just chill brooo and everyone goes to work because they love to work and work is life, capitalism will still exist elsewhere on the planet. And this scenario isn't freedom either.

I want you to imagine a lazy workshy piece of shit NEET. How do you get a drain on society to contribute?

MONEYLESS HARDMODE: You can't offer him green pieces of paper he can trade to fulfill his needs and desires.
FREEDOM HARDMODE: You can't beat the shit out of him either, he's a special snowflake with rights.

You can't. Production will inevitably drop, and the capitalist states that still have growing economies will row over here and take your resources.

>Technology is advancing to the point of putting everyone out of work. And some of the wealthy just want the excess humans to curl up and die. But you're cool with that I'm sure.

The obligation to work and be a productive member of the state is not freedom, whether it is enforced by a strongman upholding a social order or by a faceless entity hitting you with property taxes. Even a moneyless technocracy where individuals are tended by a robot workforce is not freedom.

>than any other system that been seen in the world.
Such as what? The system of money that was gold coins? That was primitive proto-capitalism. The corruption of the medieval, antiquarian and ancient world was in religion and rulers as well, but people were just as much out for gold as land, slaves and converts.
Capitalism corrupts everything it touches, lawmakers, law enforcers, wealthy people. It poisons familiar discourse, sex even. This is manifestly so. Stop to think about it. Try to imagine a world without it.

People are not allowed to not use capitalism. They become outcasts living on the streets or out in the woods. Heard about that guy who lived out in some thick forest in Vermont. What law did he break? Petty theft and burglary? He's in prison now.

You really are the kind of person that should be thrown out of a helicopter.
We have built the most prosperous and successful civilization in all of history and you just want to throw it out because your paradise is much better than what we have now. In your mind anyway, in reality it might require a few million people killed in the revolution and many more shipped off to camps but surely afterwards we would reach that glorious paradise you dream of and it will all have been worth it. This time it will work, if just our glorious leader butterfly would lead the revolution to implement it.

If we are driven to extinction then most assuredly by people like you. Ungrateful bastards that demonize success and want to destroy civilization for some figment of their imagination because money is evil? Trading with other humans is evil? Getting rewarded for your work in a universally valued currency is evil? You want to take us back to prehistoric times.
I'd rather be ruled by an Islamic Caliphate than your ilk. At least they would take us back only one millennium.

I'm a lefty and to me this sounds cringey

>People are not allowed to not use capitalism.

There is a reason for that, dummy. Capitalism is inherent to human nature in the activity of exchange. It is inevitable that wealth gathers into few hands, and money is just the token used to represent quantities of wealth. The world is made of economists and rubes. The foggy notion that workers have dignity is disproven every goddamn day.

>Heard about that guy who lived out in some thick forest in Vermont. What law did he break? Petty theft and burglary? He's in prison now.

Yeah, petty theft and burglary are crimes you dip. Property is another one of those fundamental human concepts that you can't erase. Let me prove it to you. If you don't believe in the right of individuals to own property, I want you to break your monitor and throw your computer onto the floor. Break it to bits, because I said so. I have just as much right to that property as you do. Not going to do it? Why not? The answer you give is why anecdotal Vermont burglar is in prison.

To be honest I'm sure you're just trolling me now. Or you really are a psychopath who believes they are entitled to everyone's labor.

>thrown out of a helicopter.
No surprises here.
Like jihadists to muslims, the fascist is the most fanatical capitalist.

>There is a reason for that, dummy
First user says this isn't even true.
>Capitalism is inherent to human nature
The human nature meme.
Again, your type will be the death of us all.
Is it anti-natalism on purpose though, or are you just a stupid brute?

I'm not the butterfly guy, not even a commie, but you sound bluepilled as fuck.
> Capitalism is great because capitalism is good.

>The human nature meme.

Even my beautiful baby girl knows the cat toy belongs to her, and her food bowl is full of her food. She understand the concept of "MINE!" and the sound of her name. Only the obstinate Communist tricks herself into believing the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to her.

Human nature is animal nature. Dominance hierarchies are real things, look it up. Humans, being tool-users, have a tendency to accumulate tools that improve their chances of survival: shelter, clothing, personal defense weapons. And lately because capitalism and free trade has given us so much luxury time we collect what is pleasing to the imagination: radios, racecars, books, yachts, etc.

The animal that has the least tools is least able to defend himself and protect the resources he needs. A human with zero tools is standing naked in the scrub desert picking corn out of mule shit. He will die early. A human who owns many many tools -- accumulated over time by trade and the security that comes from laws that protect life and property -- is much more suited to survive. Other humans are competing for the same resources you have, you see. Access to mule shit or oil fields, or the very marrow in your bones.

This example is true, and can be applied to individuals or superpowers.

No surprise your reading comprehension is shit.

I didn't say capitalism was great, I said it was inevitable and its the best system we have and should not be thrown away lightly (esp by idiots).

It's not "great"
>It's the besssssssss
>Everything else has been tried. Not gonna tell you where or when.

It was our turn, cracka!

I'm waiting for you to tell me all about these other systems that are better. So far you have offered:

-slavery
-some imaginary moneyless nonsense (slavery)

Your mother ever tell you to share?
Is your mother an alien, inhuman, then?

Capitalism, greed, makes sociopaths of people. Slave mentality runs this prison you insist is normal.
All I'm telling you is the simple fact that you can't own a thing. The land you live on is a borrowed place to put your personal property. You die and the land takes you back. Your hand is a different hand than it was seven years ago.

Oops forgot the arrow.

Is Coates worth reading in anyway? He just seems to appeal to white brooklynites and media elites because he validates the liberal consensus.

No money is moneyless. Lets go back to that.

No really. It can work. Guess where value is found if not in the bits of crap we pretend has value. Go on guess.

I'm more keen on how the value is transacted.

>reading books by blaqqs
lmao
it's like training a parrot to regurgitate nonsense.

>You die and the land takes you back.
>Your hand is a different hand than it was seven years ago.

Bugs.. easy on the mushrooms.

>You can't own a thing.
You are the ultimate Commie LARPer. Sitting on your property, typing on your property, telling me property does not exist.

Also you didn't answer .

>Guess where value is found if not in the bits of crap we pretend has value.
I've already explained to you they are not bits of crap. They are tools we need for survival. Luxuries might be crap, but there are definitely some things even a delusional maniac like you "needs." Shelter, clothing, running water, etc.

>Go on guess.
There is no such thing as dignity. And shit like "the dignity of work" or "SOCIAL OBLIGATION" is non-transferrable and just as evil as money.

This is not me, but this is exactly the answer I would have given. GJGE user.

How did you transact at home?
Your mother paid you in cookies for cleaning the dishes?
What did you pay her for the meal? Did you measure the value of the dish cleaning a a fair exchange?
How did your family handle inflation? Late fees?

Doesn't this sound absurd to you?

Are you implying we have a social obligation to produce? How do you deal with sub-standard workers? Shame them? Beat them (as some parents may)? They have rights, you pig.

cite something. anything.

And how do you reward overachievers? Where is the incentive to produce? How is an emotional reward superior to a monetary one? Doesn't this system disenfranchise the emotionally disabled? What if I want to purchase something and not have everyone knowing what it is?

What's to prevent a crazy society like this from devolving into a Sicilian mob where unsavory favors are traded for unsavory favors and a ledger of good boy points is used instead of cash?

This is ridiculous.

replying to such a pig

>telling me property does not exist.
Personal property. It's yours as a borrowed thing. You can have it. "Private Property" is a lot of stuff rich people claim is there's because they can "afford" it. A magic trick pulled off by well paid lawyers paper and state violence.

The rest of what I said is obviously true. Don't die, user. Breath.

>They are tools
Your tool is designed to manipulate men's minds and enslave them.

>There's no such thing as dignity
What the actual fuck?
Value is in the resource and the labor. We are the wealth. Sharing with one another instead of stabbing people in the back would be a much better world.

Stop babbling and think on it for a while.

youtube.com/watch?v=Z5c06iiukF4

>We are the wealth. Sharing with one another instead of stabbing people in the back would be a much better world.

Already explained to you, little farfalla: dominance hierarchies are inescapable. Humans are trapped in the same cage with wolves and orcas and earthworms and ebola and the black death. "Stabbing people in the back" is nature's capitalism. It's thermodynamics, you can't get something from nothing. In order to continue experiencing your trippy stereoscopic hallucinations and lucid dreams, something must die. Please insert blood money.

Sharing is fine, and advisable in limited quantities. But it doesn't create wealth, and absolutely cannot be compulsory. Then it becomes theft. Taxes, for example. Or communism. Tell me when slavery starts: 25% tax rate? 50%? 99%? 100%?

>Your tool is designed to manipulate men's minds and enslave them.
Look in the mirror and ask: "who is obligating others to surrender their property and labor?" It's the man in the glass, champ.

I'm gonna fuck off for a while and think. Nice talking to you Red.

literally we are the only creatures who could escape the dominance hierarchies by placing ideals ahead of independent action, but we choose not to because of emotive variance

you're really just preaching some sort of Darwininan evolutionary hierachy which doesn't exist from a scientific perspective (trait selection is inherently chaotic, and neutral mutation theory dictates that it is inherently unpredictable from an information standpoint).

>Surrender
You have just interalized your surrender to the myriad of societal obstructions in your day to day life. Not admitting isn't alpha, its hilarious and absurdist. You are not the master of your destiny

lol at that title

we wuz preznits fo 8 years nigga

I wish I was a middle-class black intellectual.

You can write any bullshit you want and still be celebrated.

High 2 digit IQ and you're golden. Then next Baldwin.

I don't understand the point of discussing with anti-capitalists who believe that capitalism (or class society, monetary exchanges, the division of labour, etc) is the reason for everything bad in the world.

I can see Karl Marx believing that in the XIXth century, before modern archeology could dispel Rousseaunian myths about pre-civilized society and show that it was just as violent and superstitious as what came next.

There is no reason to believe that even if we achieve True Communism™, the patriarchal family is abolished and everything is organized by worker's councils, these councils won't just engage in perpetual warfare like all those tribes who have lived or are living under primitive communism.

Specially if the only thing you can claim to counter this argument is a vision of a future that only exists in your mind.

So yeah, to the helicopter it goes. Why not? If you propose revolutionary politics as war against established reality and disdains the rule of law, why shouldn't established powers in reality go to war against you?

Yeah, I wish you were a black nerd kid growing up in a crack infested burb where the cops bust your sorry ass for living there.

I doubt you'd go into journalism though.

[Tried to figure out what this book even was. Neoliberal apologia?]

>...the reason for everything bad in the world.
And don't forget the global warming which is on track to wipe us all out, you sad sacks of shit.

It always makes me sad to see that the more thoughtful posters here can be so full of shit.

What an odd backhanded compliment.

What part do you find shit?

Has anyone mentioned reading it simply for understanding's sake; just a desire to know where someone or others are coming from to engage with that or is that too tall an order?

It was a /pol/ bait thread the whole time. Too tall an order for these Veeky Forums poster

Everyone already gets where they're coming from. Nothing is ever their faults. Obama is automatically a moral authority and good President because he's black. Beyonce and Jayz went to the White House! Trayvon could be his son!
I get that the environment/culture/power/whatever you want will shape you and guide your actions, but the decision to pull the trigger is always theirs.
thegrio.com/2012/05/31/two-bystanders-shot-in-detroit-after-heated-kool-aid-argument/

Yeah, I'm deep into race and womens issues to make up for the fact that extremely conservative with regard to sexuality and transgender issues. It's a great book in my opinion.

literally we are the only creatures who could escape the dominance hierarchies by placing ideals ahead of independent action, but we choose not to because of emotive variance

>yes we can
>oh wait no we can't

Which is it Poindexter

coates is terrible
>muh destruction of the black body
>muh we dindu nuffin
>muh the system's rigged but I won't propose anyway to fix it
pathetic

Holy shit, Veeky Forums is triggered by this guy. Love him or hate him, Coates can write circles over anyone here. His prose are exquisite. I haven't read the book yet but the recent Atlantic essay "The First White President" was raw, powerful and beautifully written.

bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf

for the lazy

WE

If you liked that bullshit you'll like the book. It's just a collection of his essays.

WUZ

>raw, powerful and beautifully written.
That's one way to describe a series of bloated metaphors, I guess.

"powerful" in the vernacular is "I'm being ironic/this is bait"

Without money, what incentive is there to do all the shitty jobs that need doing?

We can't have a planet full of billions of people where nobody does any of the hard or dirty work.

This is patently not true.
So not acceptable at all. Correct.
This.

I guess you're one of the lazy ones. Here.