I'm finished this recently. Wtf! I HATE the EU even more now

Do you know nothing about this book? Yanis became Greek minister of finance AFTER the economy got run into the ground, he doesn't blame the EU for that, he blames it for KEEPING Greece in the ground.

btw, is The New Totalitarian Temptation by Todd Huizinga a good read? I have been thinking about reading it.

Well, the choice Greece was given was to be kicked out of the eurozone and being reduced to a inflationary and possibly worthless Drachma, with all the consequences.

The only other choice would basically be to tell the creditors they fucked up and will never see their money again.

>an American burgertard Christian conservative who works for a neoliberal think-tank writes a book about the EU

Sheesh that will end well

We can all

>>The only other choice would basically be to tell the creditors they fucked up and will never see their money again.
Which would've been the right one. They knew this from the start and were gambling for an EU bailout.

>the banks deliberately sabotaged themselves and bound immense capital to dead assets just to make Dimitris eat less souvlaki
The levels of delusion are hitting all time high.

Greeks also knew they couldn't repay the debts when they borrowed the money. It's a conspiracy to steal money from productive member states.

Yes, this is what he said. Retard.

Yes, that's literally what he said.

Nope. You just wanted to hear that.
And you are implying that the banks didn't come out as the winners in this scenario.

>You just wanted to hear that.
It's not a he said she said argument. The posts don't get deleted. This is literally what he is saying on every level.
>implying that the banks didn't come out as the winners
Well, yes, if you're utterly financially illiterate and only able to reason based on emotions then I can see how you could consider holding unsafe long-term debt with yields lower than treasury bonds is a "win".

kek, that's the most brutal book review I've ever seen

>The EU intentionally got Greece to shit the bed in order to lower the value of the Euro so as to keep German exports strong
I don't see how this is news to anyone. Leftists always go on about how Germany could turn into a conquest hungry machine led by a new LITERARY HITLER at any moment, yet you point out what the EU is (A scheme to prop up the German economy and control Europe's politics) and their eyes cross in mental confusion as they think about how an organization that is DIVERSITY and PROGRESS could possibly be designed with ulterior motives.

What does he say about Dijsselbloem who is pretty much a hero back here?

I hope you dont mean the Netherlands with 'back here'.

Both left and right praised him to high heavens these past god knows how many years.

Yeah, the banks totally didn't win anything, this is why they own all the industry now, right? Fuck you and your attitude.

He goes easy on everyone in terms of what his opinion of them but in terms of how they act Djiselbloem is a top tier scummy politician. He's constantly lying, shutting down debates, and completely unwilling to contemplate that Greece may not be able to pay off its debts while getting economically straitjacketed and thrown in a river through the EU's loan conditions.

I'm not European but I've been reading a lot about politics there recently so I think I can speak. Most Europeans are imperialists and that's why they're pathologically attached to notion of the EU. A unified Europe can be a massive geopolitical power and that's what people on the "left" and right are attracted to. You can point out that the EU is at it's very roots a neoliberal project but they won't care because there's always an ongoing "dialogue" of "reform" to reassure them progress is always being made in the right direction.
It was the Greens in Germany in the 90s that pushed so hard to help break up Yugoslavia, under humanitarian pretexts of course, and it was the same people who pushed for assassinating Gaddafi to prevent a "humanitarian catastrophe" in Libya.
The majority aren't engaged/concerned with what's going on around them and see no viable alternative and are to scared to disrupt the smooth functioning of the markets.

lmao retard posting on emotion pay debts XD

Austerity is supposed to be able to make Greece able to pay debnts.

It's working too, we are just crybabies that like to complain about no tbeing able to afford 2 houses.

Shame the Greeks cant devaluatie their money, was kinda looking forward to a cheap holiday.

And then pvda got btfo anyway.

>holding liens
>owning
Again, you shouldn't engage if you're an economically illiterate brainlet. I sympathize with the Greek plight, but blame shifting and emotion-fueled reasoning is not going to lead anywhere good.

This. Greece got screwed by (((Goldman Sachs))), then the krauts put the jackboot on their neck.

>start with the Greeks

You are not answering and you are conveniently putting words in my mouth. I said that the banks got good things in return, not that Greeks didn't do anything wrong.
Posting on Veeky Forums recquires you to actually adress the points of the other poster and also, being able to fucking read. But yeah you can call me an economically retarded person withouth actually proving anything you said, teenagers usually do so because they think they have figured everything out.
Tax evasion was rampant though.

Both my posts addressed precisely your claims of banks being in a winning position, pointing out precisely why they're not. It's okay to be wrong sometimes. You don't have to pretend being retarded or engage in passive aggressive comments on my character just because you don't have a valid counter-argument.

You neven pointed out anything besides using labels to argue with me. You never pointed out shit basically, perhaps in your mind it seemed proof-like, but you literally just posted "nuh-uh" but a bit mmore eloquently, while being condescending as you didn't have anything to offer to the arguement after all.
>you don't have to be passive aggresive
Oh, you mean exactly like you did? Are we playing charades now?

Not him, but you didn't counter his points at all, really.
Meanwhile global.handelsblatt.com/finance/germany-profits-from-greek-debt-crisis-796637

>You never pointed out shit basically
I did. Again, you being unversed in basic financial terms does not mean that any statement containing them is devoid of meaning.
We're talking about private banks, not government held obligations. Please, don't drag this into poltardian nonsense.

>I did. Again, you being unversed in basic financial terms does not mean that any statement containing them is devoid of meaning.
You spamming that sentence won't make it true you know, no matter how long you keep at it.

Are you inferring that private banks didn't "win" anything? Many people have lost their enterprises because of the new tax rates, and the banks swooped in and took hold. Granted they didn't do anything illegal, but only after the debt crisis were they able to act like this, so you can't tell me they lost more than they gained. If you continue to be of the same mind please enlighten m illiterate ass instead of insulting me, I promise I will try my best to understand, really.
Why are you so obsessed with not understanding what I am trying to convey is beyond me but whatever it's Veeky Forums after all.

The tax evasion bit is true but in the book he talks about the EU throwing away Syriza's tax evasion programme aimed at high earners after Varoufakis leaves and Greece capitulated

I can't really trust him since the Greek goverment)both present and ex) has been always using lies to save face and shift blame to other states.

>Most Europeans are imperialists and that's why they're pathologically attached to notion of the EU

What, you think your average man on the ground willed the EU project into existence? It was imposed from the top down by an elite.

Foreclosing on loans is neither an extraordinary measure "only allowed by crisis" nor is it a winning position. Liquidation of liened assets is itself cumbersome and rarely profitable, in case of real estate it's basically never profitable since consumer protection in EU requires all residuals to be reached over to borrower and in case of Greece it's triply unprofitable since non-prime assets in financially and politcally unstable country with full blown recession most likely won't be realized for years to come.

But they aren't liquidating, or else I wouldn't be arguing with you.

While its true that many assets in Greece are worthless, the few profitable assets, such as ports, were also bought by often German investors.

There are lots of winners of this situation on the German side.

Ah yes, this is why the EU is throwing a hissy fit about the deals with the Chinese.

What are you even arguing about? So banks have their active reserves and cashflow constrained and a fuckton of dead assets on their books for years, but they're the winners. Do you understand how the banks make money at all?
>bought by
This would happen either way and isn't somehow unique to the whole austerity business.

>Most Europeans are imperialists and that's why they're pathologically attached to notion of the EU
wew lad

I am arguing that the banks have had obvious benefits from the whole debacle.
>So banks have their active reserves and cashflow constrained and a fuckton of dead assets on their books for years, but they're the winners.
>having an entire country's industry, assets (those sweet bank owned beaches aren't dead assets) under your thumb is somehow not beneficial for you
I have been owned!

The point is, the investor/creditor/bank side made false investment by buying risky Greek assets.

By rules of the market economy, Greece should be allowed to default, with the investors losing their money.

>owning all the mud huts in somali is great
You keep returning to emotional reasoning based on how your kindergarten understanding of economy works. Banks don't want their capital tied to barely performing assets for years. The cost of lost opportunities far outweighs the pennies they're gaining from reclaimed collateral.
Greece defaulted on more than a few debts and received massive restructuring for others. A total default which would necessitate Euro exit as well would render it a banana republic for the next few decades.

Argentina defaulted on its international debt and did not turn into a banana republic. Albeit this may be due to the fact how localized their economy is.

>owning all the mud huts in somali is great
>implying eceonomic colonialism hurts the banks
I want eceonomic undergrads to leave Veeky Forums as they can't argue for the sake of their lives.

Argentina later restructured and repaid their debts and only then was it allowed to return to borrowing market still with pretty high interest. Plus as you rightfully remarked Greece's economy is much more tightly wound together with EU.
Well, I want all the pointless contrarian teenagers that shit up discussions with edgy memetext to leave, but you're still here, aren't you.

I am from Greece, but i have to admit we knew all these years before crisis that we were producting nothing and our economy was a bubble. We just like to have a good and easz lifestyle without working so much, thats he truth. Although there are hard working people in Greece, the most people want to have fun with Europes money and make conspiracies all time about Jews, masons and nazi Germans

you're stupid

Oh hey I read an article about this recently. How basically Germany's ruthless as fuck and has the entirety of the EU under its boot while putting on a front of shame and humility.

Like I said most sympathize or are indifferent with the project otherwise it would quickly end. Every revolution seems to be carried out by a vanguard, all developments have been imposed to a degree.

It's true, Europeans invented imperialism, there's not much of a tradition of just minding your own business. An anti-imperialist force in Europe would have to oppose the EU and counterpoise some type of viable alternative forms of localism.

Why is this always in airport stores? It's the only place I see it in Australia