Are visual novels a giant waste of time that should be used on real books?

>Muramasa
>Mareni
>Shuumon Yuu
>Good Romeo
>Jackson Ou

There are a few others, but yeah that is kind of my point. There are thousands of Visual Novels out there, and only a handful are worth reading. And if you have access to Japanese VNs, you have slightly more good VNs to enjoy. But not enough where I think it justifies the time it takes to learn Japanese. There are plenty of reasons to learn Japanese, but if somebody's reason is simply to read untld VNs, I don't think it is worth it.

Subahibi unironically rekindled my love of literature and got me to start reading again.

VNs worth reading:
Subahibi
Grisaia series
Saya no uta
Kikokugai
Symphonic rain

There now you can move on to actual books.

>grisaia
why

It's fun, reads well.

Out of the many VNs that I've read, there are only two that truly impressed me and affected me in some meaningful way, those being Subahibi and Clannad (I'll give an honorable mention to Tomoyo After). Everything other than that was time that would have been better spent with books, I think. I doubt I'll read any more unless Sakura no Uta gets translated; I liked Subahibi enough that I'd like to give it a read.

remove grisaia and replace it with fata morgana and it's a decent list

is subahibi better than 1Q84?

And add Swan Song and Narcissu as well.

Only if it's Kamige like Dies Irae.

I am appreciating Kabbalah more

scratch that and add everything here except the moege titles

there are a lot of mediocre or outright bad things in that list

Some of this still is out of date. There are several games that only have their old fan TLs listed even though they've gotten improved official releases.

>real books
Books are just words that tell a store. So visual novels are technically books, hence the word novel.
Pick up a manga while you're at it

I think what it comes down to is you had real talent you probabaly wouldn't work on VN. Regular writing gives you more freedom. Adding static pictures and a sound track accomplishes nothing. Also the self-insert protagonist limits the type of stories you can tell and always leaves you with a shallow, vague MC so that he is relatable.

>Adding static pictures and a sound track accomplishes nothing.
You'd be surprised. It's like saying that watching a production of a play can't add anything. Images and sound affect people just as the written word does.
>Also the self-insert protagonist limits the type of stories you can tell and always leaves you with a shallow, vague MC so that he is relatable.
Good VNs don't have self-insert protagonists. That isn't some sort of requirement of VNs, even if it's common.

>You'd be surprised. It's like saying that watching a production of a play can't add anything. Images and sound affect people just as the written word does.

So would you say we could improve Dosovitskiys work by turning them into VN's and adding sound effects, music, and anime portraits?

I'll attempt to restate my objection since you're interpreting it in a silly way. My point is that art can take multiple forms, including sound and image. If a given work utilizes other forms of art beyond the written word, I don't see how this, per se, counts as a "negative" against that work. It's like saying "If you could really write you wouldn't write a film script." I'll readily acknowledge that the majority of VNs are awful trash and the ones that are good aren't on the level of actual literary classics, but discounting them simply because they contain other forms of media is silly. It's even in the name *visual* novel that it isn't solely a written work.

You're sounding a little pretentious user. His books were written as books and vns are written to be vns, so that means the story was made to work together with pictures and music to build the work as a whole. Whether it's done well or not depends on the vn, just like books.
Speaking of turning literary works into vns, some russians made Eugene Onegin but anime. It's hilarious.
vndb.org/v4105

I/O

Yuki >>> Kimika >>>> the rest

>Images and sound affect people just as the written word does.
Well they both affect the world, but certainly not in the same way. More sensory presentation is not necessarily better; ambiguity can be just as useful. With writing, I can make you see your friend's house. In a movie, I can't really do that. I could shoot footage at someone's friend's house, but that'll only apply to a couple audience members at most, if any. Pure text lets you do evoke images which couldn't be seen any other way right now.

If VN had merit as a medium you'd be able to convert a book to them and sometimes improve it; sometimes the movie version of a book is an improvement in some way

I'm not really trying to make an argument that one is better than the other. Different mediums necessitate that works be constructed in different manners so as to take advantage of what each medium offers. Your example is a good one. But suppose you wanted to show a very specific image. The clearest way to do that would be to actually present an image. One isn't better than the other; it's dependent upon what you'd actually like to communicate. Personally, I think that visual novels are well-suited to delivering cathartic emotional experiences.

Maybe you could? I'm not aware that it's been tried in any serious capacity.

umineko is quite literally the final boss of written words

Ever since I got into VNs I've liked the concept of adapting novels or short stories to the medium, but to my knowledge no one's ever tried it.
Honestly, if the adaptions become popular enough, I think it would be a great way to get people to stop thinking that all VNs have to be porn in order to sell

You'd have to change things to accommodate the new medium. Movies that try to be exactly like the book are usually worse because good book pacing does not translate into good movie pacing. Ones that do something new are better. Taking a book and using the strengths vns have as a medium to enhance it can work, but since most vn fans are hardcore weaboos there is no interest for someone to do that.

It's fun but has too much useless padding. 10% of the dialogue is "kyahahahahahahhihihihihihihihinihihihohohohuhuhhukuhyahayyahaha"

Most VNs could use a good editor.

Novels and VNs are much more similar mediums than novels and movies, though. VNs are still mainly text that could exist on its own, everything else is just supplementary.
I feel like to adapt a novel to a VN well, you'd just have to keep the text exactly the same, but just add visuals, music, and voice acting.

Yeah, this. I really think that R07 is a great writer and storyteller with good ideas, but he has so much fucking padding.

What's the last VN you played, Veeky Forums? I recently finished the new release of Little Busters. It was very good.

There's nothing inherently invalid about the medium, it just happens to be that there are only like three worth reading at most.

Higanbana no Saku Yoru ni. The stories are very hit and miss.

dude bullying lmao

>dude bullying lmao
Have you played Subahibi yet?

Simultaneously started Fata Morgana and Subahibi. I don't know which one to continue first since neither are shorter than the other. The straightforward romance story or something that's apparently going to be a crazy fuckin ride? Subahibi has better music, but FM has prettier art. I'm conflicted.

Subahibi is fantastic. Unless you're going to replay the beginning of it, I'd suggest sticking with that since the apparently innocuous beginning actually has a good bit of clues and foreshadowing in it.

>Kikokugai
The one masterpiece of VNs.

EN:
Subahibi
Saya no Uta
Himawari
Kara no Shoujo
Symphonic Rain
Remember 11
Fata Morgana
Dies Irae
Chaos;Child

JP:
Muramasa
Kajiri Kamui Kagura
Sakura no Uta
White Album 2

Fata Morgana is WAY shorter than Subahibi.

I loved Subahibi, but god damn where is there so much porn?
>Man I'm really enjoying this writing!
>"Crossdressing and sucks dick"
>STOP
>"Gets raped by a dog"
>NO
>"Teacher fucks her dad"
>WHY IS THIS HAPPENING
>"Sucks his anime wife's dick"
>God damn it

i think the author probably expected the game to sell really badly so he added 12354 weird porn scenes

...

Himawari was so fucking good. I really enjoyed how everything connected. Shame the Aqua After is not translated.

because japanese popular culture is driven by extreme indulgence. pretty much anything they make is produced in the mindset of a pornographer even when it doesn't feature sex. you've noticed that there are porn scenes, but you've missed the less obvious fact that everything in between those scenes is also a quasi-pornographic indulgence.

>remember11
love this one to death.
The amount of foreshadowing stuffed into every other line was unbelievable for a vn to me.
Even now I find out something new skimming through it again.

VNs are unironically better than most Japanese literature.

I think plays would be a better source of adaption than books. I'd like to see a VN version of Hamlet for example.

Good taste.

t.Read Murakami once
Jap-lit is pretty neat.
Same with Chinese literature.

t. assblasted gook

>GOOK
Not an argument

I haven't seen anyone else suggest this, but I think the thing with the dog may not have actually happened. If you recall, Zakuro isn't told about it, but sees it in a vision that the girl shows her. Now, unless you think the girl actually has some sort of magic power (I think supernatural stuff was going on in the game but that aspect of it was bullshit; they likely just found Zakuro on some bullying forum she posted on) then it's just something that Zakuro, who was going insane by that point, just made up in her head. It's probably more of a representation of Zakuro's mental state and how defiled she feels than it is anything else.

I had thought for the longest time of adapting my erotic novella which is the summation of all my desires into a visual novel. But I don't know dev stuff, and my book didn't sell all that well.

That makes a lot more sense, her story is pretty fucked up, but by imagining someone having it even worse, she can calm down a little, like, hey, at least I didn't pee myself and get fucked by a dog!

Looking-Glass Insects was definitely a difficult read. I'm glad the Kimika ending was available to balance it out.

Truly the VNs highest point, I loved the purity of it.

Since we're talking about Subahibi, here's my interpretation of the plot (I'm going to leave out End Sky II for practical purposes)
1. In the past, Tomosane kills Takuji, Yuki dies protecting Hasaki, and then Takuji and (later) Yuki's souls both enter Tomosane's body. Takuji does it through his necromancer powers and Yuki does it in order to help Tomosane.
2. Looking-Glass Insects occurs, Zakuro falls in love with the Yuki personality of Tomosane, Zakuro kills herself (or doesn't, obviating most everything else that follows), and then (from Jabberwocky) Yuki's soul is pushed out of Tomosane (and replaced with Yuki2) by Takuji.
3. Down the Rabbit-Hole 1 occurs. This takes place after Yuki is ejected from Tomosane, and is in something like an afterlife. Zakuro's soul goes there to bring Yuki back to the real world (and also starts the ghost scare in the real world by sending the first text message as a "prank"). Yuki can either stay with Kagami/Tsukasa or go back with Zakuro. If she stays with Kagami/Tsukasa then she never comes back to help Tomosane in Jabberwocky, and thus you get the Kimika ending of It's My Own Invention in which Tomosane never shows up to fight Takuji again and Takuji dies from jumping off the roof. If Yuki comes back with Zakuro you get one of the Jabberwocky II endings.
4. In the Hill of Sunflowers ending, Yuki returns as a spirit not in Tomosane's body, and Tomosane and Hasaki are able to see and communicate with her due to their necromancer bloodline.

/ourguy/ literally saving visual novels

mimidoshima.wordpress.com/2017/12/15/theater-theory-is-12-days-of-anime-material-right-question-mark/

get out of here with your meme recommendations

A lot of them are way too long, completely put me off the medium. It's fine if you can justify the length but a lot of the ones i read could cut down at least 30% or even more in a lot of cases. Doesn't help that the prose is a chore to read a lot of the time as well, i can only read english though, so translation could be an issue.

Not a lot of interesting stuff is done with the interactive element most of the time either, which makes me wonder what is the point of essentially making a long static anime. Does seeing the same 5 backgrounds and listening to the same 5 tracks for dozens of hours really add anything to the experience?

Is it actually bad?
Then why did people hype it up so much when it was untranslated.

I played it recently and I don't know if I'd say it's bad. It depends on your taste, I guess. If you liked F/SN (I didn't) you'll probably enjoy it. It's just extremely long, and after 100+ hours of rambling, prolix chuuni babbling I finally lost interest and skimmed through a lot of it. Play the free demo and decide for yourself.

The first couple chapters are great - decent character dynamics, amazing sense of humor, some neat pseudo-philosophical monologues -, but once it switches gears and turns into a full-on shounen most of the writing is dedicated to describing duels, weak antagonist backstories and your typical anime romance. It starts dragging on for hours and hours without giving you any justification for continuing to keep reading, except 'I bet you want some answers to those questions we left hanging in the background, don't you?'. Reminded me of the way playing virtues last reward felt.

>Play the free demo and decide for yourself.
I'd caution you against that. The demo is by far the best Dies Irae has to offer, so you might actually be fooled into buying it.

>I'd caution you against that. The demo is by far the best Dies Irae has to offer, so you might actually be fooled into buying it.
You're probably right. Now that I think about it, the common route was probably the part I enjoyed the most.

This kid was a goddamn psychopath. What in the world did he have to gain by mocking everyone while they're in a constant near death situation, even when it put his own goals at risk? Fuck you yuni, you damn brat.

Books are a giant waste of time that should be used on real life.

Reading books is something people do in real life.

he needed his own route :(

No, reading books is taking part in fiction that someone else created from hours of thinking up scenarios that have little resemblance to how people actually act and how the world actually functions

agreed

Its not shitty

What's some good books to read if you love Umineko ? Christie and Knox ?

Re'reading Higurashi since I've bought the MG bundle

Take this shitthread to /a/, you illiterate virgins.

VNs go on /jp/ and Veeky Forums, not /a/.

Zhuangzi, Christie, Knox, and Jung's writings.

>long static anime
No, they're books with visuals and sound. I've never seen anybody whine about normal books not being interactive enough.
I'll admit that when I read VNs I usually don't actually pay too much attention to the visuals, but I think having background music adds to the experience in a significant way.
Also, if the VNs you're reading only have 5 backgrounds and music tracks, you need to read some better VNs.

...

How about you shut up pretentious cunt

It's the rule, though. If you make VN threads on /a/ they'll just get deleted.

cringe

Fata Morgana. Very very good.

>he does not appreciate the specific commentary that nazis were never going to be Overman, just birthing a few of them would abuse it for their own fill

Pleb.

>Rin
this

Oooooooh! Beatoricheee!

most of them yes