Why is it that Canada, Australia, and New Zealand together have failed to produce a single canonical writer, while the United States has produced at least five?
They all have similar backgrounds, ages, and demographic stock, but only America can be considered an aesthetic success. Why?
At the risk of sounding parochial, I must conclude that there is something unique to America alone, something in its culture and people which allows for boundless creative affirmation. But what?
Other urls found in this thread:
independent.co.uk
bbc.com
huffpost.com
gizmodo.com
twitter.com
>But what?
el creatura
The US is an exceptional place. Be it producing athletes, writers, serial killers, or what have you, we take the gold.
because USA has an enormous population
australia has a nobel prize winner, how is that not canonical? even harold bloom included him
richard flanagan won the man booker prize 3 years ago
it's a numbers game. look to population
...
the usa has more people and is a republic
thats literally it
>The CIA covertly pushing American modern art to oppose Russian realism.
>republic
Yep. America has had a couple of centuries to attempt to define "American' literature.
populations:
canada = 36 million (11% of usa)
australia = 24 million (7.4% of usa)
new zealand = 4.7 million (1.5% of usa)
usa = 323 million
bonus round:
russia = 144 million
britain = 65 million
I opened a Coetzee novel, how's that ozzie?
Richard Flanagan will be a part of the canon in a decade or two. The Narrow Road to the Deep North might be the best novel of the 21st century.
Massachusetts - 7 million
Canonical writers born in the 150 year history of Massachusetts
- Poe
- Dickinson
- Emerson
- Thoreau
- Hawthorne
- Longfellow
- Lowell
- Updike
- Leary
- Eggers
- Du Bois
- Seuss
Britain - 65 million
Canonical writers born in the 30,000 year history of Britain
- Shakespeare
- Zadie Smith
- Neil Gaiman
- ????
As much as i hate them, I have to say Americans have a pretty cool collection of national "myths". Shit like the frontier, the american dream, much freedumbs, jazz, much consumerism etc etc.
It's an interesting place for someone artistically inclined.
One.
>Eggers
leave now and don't come back.
terrible post
>forgetting about Thomas Pynchon
He might live in Manhattan these days but don’t forget, he was born in Long Island, Mass
>he hasn't read Patrick White or The Fortunes of Richard Mahony
Why do these fucking retards use "modern" as a substitute for abstract expressionism?
Anyway the really funny thing is that this whole affair shows how truly gullible are intellectual types.
:-/
Shakespeare is arguably more popular than all them mfs combined
cos we fuck them nigga bitches
like it fucking worked nigga check lit any day
fucking same dude that guy suck dick
>Same demographic stock
Lol America is not the same as a bunch of white nigger criminals banished to the bottom of the earth.
I'm pretty sure Robert Hughes is canon
>because USA has an enormous population
Nah, we have a huge chunk of inert minorities who do jack shit. And Melville, Hawthorne, and Emerson wrote at a time when there were only like 20 million americans, many being black slaves.
The truth is that New Zealand and Australia are just cultural jokes. Canada has potential, but their culture was soubservient to pleasing le big brother Britain that they never really launched out on their own until recently, with such writers as Alice Munro.
>white nigger criminals banished to the bottom of the earth.
kek
Because abstract expressionism is under the umbrella of Modern art
>Canada
Too many leafs.
>Australia
Too many kangaroos.
>New Zealand
Too many kiwis.
>United States
>at least five
Name bloody one.
check out this brainlet
>Harlem Renaissance
>remember that time the blacks were able to approximate 110 IQs
yeah, really impressive stuff, don't know how we'd survive without it
>Tries to refute with a comic defending the most brainlet of pseuds
I'm not even mad bro.
The average IQ in the USA is 99
now subtract blacks and mexicans
The average is quite high among the white population, it's unintentional eugenics, the most ambitious europeans with means came to America (I'm talking about colonists specifically not later immigrants)
This is similar to why european jew's have a higher than standard IQ than other caucasians.
t. two of my ancestors signed the constitution and I'm working my way towards genius level IQ
>"great" black literary movement
>don't know the meaning of the word renaissance
lol surely their work is worth reading
Australian here. There is definitely a huge cultural element to it too. I disagree with the OP’s complete dismissal, but he is right that the Cwlth nations have different attitudes which affects their output.
Aus has decent writers, it's just that brainlets on Veeky Forums dont live here or even take the time to research it. Patrick White, Gerald Murnane, Andy Griffiths (kek), Thomas Keneally, Richard Flanagan and Peter Carey to name a few
zozzle
>most important writer is unironically named "Banjo"
such a rich literary culture
It was a Renaissance for blacks in America who had been kept in a dark state of illiteracy by slavery. Remember 80 years, just a generation and a half before the 1920s, it was illegal for 90% of blacks in America to read.
Also /pol/ pls go.
>wrote extensively about outback culture
>disregarded because his name is Banjo
this is the level of analysis on lit
I'm really not sure if you two are saying abstract art was positive or negative, but the usual opinion seems to be that it was a negative thing. I hear a lot of ignorant people calling it "ugly" or "lazy" but that is so far from the truth.
If you spend even a small amount of time learning about art history you realize what a complete revolution it has been - from cave paintings to expressionism there was never a more profound stylistic discovery. Abstract art was like discovering a new continent psychologically - it's effects and influence are so widespread that they are impossible to measure.
of course whites have a higher iq. iq was invented by and for whites. check your privilege bro
git r done, mate
>It was a Renaissance
This has nothing to do with your all too easy sob story shtiposting. When was the Naissance?
Not doing our country’s literature any favours by being so obviously butthurt
It was invented as a test of cognitive functions, and the questions are completely free from being dependent on knowledge of language or math - it is mostly pattern recognition, and can even be given fairly to someone who was isolated from civilization like rain forest tribes.
probably 2% of users on this board have any grasp of art history. the rest are pseuds who lust for realism
do you participate in mensa?
A little indulgent in your final judgement. If it had seen so far it is only because it stood on the shoulders of giants.
I wasn't saying it was positive or negative, but that it was invented by the CIA as a cold war tactic
if you think what im saying comes off as butthurt then you're the softest faggot out
...
10 times the people.
But why are you wrong? And why has America never produced a philosopher while Canada has many world-renowned?
Terrible attempt.
except you're wrong. Picasso had established abstract impressionism by 1920 based on cubist pieces and "Nude Descending a staircase." He is the continuation of a long line of post-impressionist painters like Matisse, van Gogh, Gaugain, all the way back to the impressionists Cezanne and Monet. who in turn were influenced by Manet's 1863 paintiing "Le Déjeuner sur l’herbe," which is where modernist visual art began. Beside Picasso, abstract impressionists in the teens and 20s included Theodor Doesburg, Paul Klee, and Wassily Kandinsky at the Bauhaus in Germany. Dada was also established by the 20s, another branch of modernist art which included Duchamp's "urinal," probably the 1 piece people hate on most when they talk about modernism.
Modernism wasn't "invented" by the CIA, let alone in the 1950s as you say. It has a long history rooted in European avant garde culture.
God, Amerimutts are so damned insufferable.
Remember during the fall, this is why the world hates you.
Abstraction isn't abstract expressionism, mutt.
>calling a loose tribal federation an empire
>never
We are winning in ways that you haven't even considered. You really do not understand how completely improbable it would be for the American empire to fall this early.
>, the most ambitious europeans with means came to America (I'm talking about colonists specifically not later immigrants)
Why is this meme statement so popular? It was the opposite actually. People who couldn't hack it in the Old World fled to the US in a last ditch attempt
now subtract the Juden
The average is low again
>to fall this early
The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long
Why would you subract white jews?
>Canada has potential
You have no fucking idea what you're talking about
One is an explanation of the higher iq among American whites than their European counterparts, the other is eurocoping.
They're both incorrect, though. The US attracted all manner of people.
>the world
Kek, who gives a shit
We haven't even bothered tapping the resources within our own border yet, and considering the rest of the world gives us free money and then takes it back in trade for theirs I mean... we definitely are not even at the halfway mark yet. You aren't thinking logically, but with our new merit based immigration policies I'm sure you could come join us, if you have something to offer.
>Veeky Forums poster
>merit
Oh my sides
Yes, probably the most subtle joke I've ever written.
>Muh tribes
> I must conclude that there is something unique to America alone, something in its culture and people which allows for boundless creative affirmation. But what?
America has a more turbulent history than Australia, New Zealand and Canada. The Revolution, Slavery Debates, Civil War, Westward Expansion, Robber Barron capitalism, the Great Depression and Civil Rights movements have created a vibrant culture where people feel compelled to express themselves on the ideas of their day. It's not a coincidence that America's best, Whitman and Melville, were writing during the most emotionally charged period of American history.
> poet uses pseudonym
> too confusing for burgers
It’s ok. I understand the concept of a poet being published in their lifetime can be hard to grasp.
> Franklin
> Philosopher
Jefferson would’ve been a better idea, but all the founding fathers are Europeans.
Canada has more guns per capita than America. The guns aren't our problem.
I think it’s just because those countries are incredibly insulated from the problems of the world. When the worst social issue you have is having massacred a few illiterate natives 100+ years ago, there’s not much to write about.
The fact that they’ve been settled for under 2/3rds of the time doesn’t help that much either.
Australia does not have a culture conducive to artistic production.
>all the founding fathers are Europeans
Imagine being this stupid
>Why is it that Canada, Australia, and New Zealand together have failed to produce a single canonical writer
Western Canon writers fro Canada:
Malcolm Lowry, Robertson Davies, Alice Munro, Northrop Frye, Anne Hébert, Jay Macpherson, Margaret Atwood, Daryl Hine
Western Canon writers from Australia and New Zealand:
Miles (Stella) Franklin, Katherine Mansfield, A. D. Hope, Patrick White, Christina Stead, Judith Wright, Les A. Murray, Thomas Keneally, David Malouf, Kevin Hart, Peter Carey
Real answer: the way writers become canonical has nothing to do with quality but popularity and spread. If you think a little you’ll notice how almost all canonical writers come from a time and place that was internationally relevant. Greek writers during the golden age of Greece city-states, Roman writers at the height of Roman dominion, French writers and thinkers during the French revolution, German writers during the hey of the HRE or Prussian empires, British ones during the industrial revolution and so on. Also, power nations have a way to make their cultivation icons relevant to the rest of the world. If English wasnt the defacto language of our age, Shakespeare wouldnt be as known and the Canterbury Tales would be relegated to second class status compared to the Decameron. American writers are known internationally because they are American.
Hate us cuz they ain't us
>They all have similar backgrounds
Sweetie...
>I can be proud of the achievements of people I have never met and are not related to me besides having been born on the same landmass.
because they are constantly impaired by blood rushes and red-outs
Imagine being this burger.
Veeky Forums famously is a neo-confederate board. Coon sympathizers keep walking.
Franklin has always been regarded by foreigners as a symbol of America, in the same way that people from your shithole are regarded as a symbol of low iq.
>/pol/lacks actually think their spaghetti revisionism works outside of /pol/
go back
Foreigners regard fucking Carnegie as more of a symbol of America than Franklin(I’d use Trump, but you cunts embraced that meme too hard). I’m not entirely sure if you can claim Australians a symbol of high iq, given that we get the same average as you even after 30 years of poofters in government trying to their hardest emulate your education system.
To be clear, around 7% of Australians are illiterate, the same as the best US states.
>australia is scooby doo
what does this image mean?
Niel Gaiman over Alan Moore. That's some low quality bait friendo.
(You)
Abstract expressionism is LITERALLY the foundation of the second wave of modernism, dolt.
While Pollock's action painting was a fucking genius stroke and I'm not particularly pro or against abstractionism and it's offshoots, I feel compelled to rank the CIA meddling with modern art as a negative thing. Just compare Pollock or Rothko to someone like Yves Klein or Daniel Buren, who managed to stretch the limits of painting while also managing to critique art and art history, it makes the american painters sound tame and even kind of pointless in retrospect.
How fucking autistic do you have do be to pick a bone with this?
Lol. The greatest short story writer alive is a Canadian WOMAN, and her name is Alice Munro. Read more brainlet