"If God exists, then why do bad things happen?"

Benevolent in what way? We may be mere ants in he's eyes. Are we unbenevolent if we disregard ants?

not an argument

>Avesta
>Torah
>Neviim
>Ketuvim
>Talmud
>Pentateuch
>Historical literature
>Wisdom literature
>Major prophets
>Minor Prophets
>Gospels
>Acts
>Epistles
>Apocalypse
>Ante-Nicene Fathers
>Nicene Father
>Post-Nicene Fathers
>Quran
>Hadith
>Guru Granth Sahib
>Kitab-i-aqdas
Looks like a lot of books to me

>doesn't know Aquinas or Augustine

besides, God being dick doesn't disprove God; just means He is evil (though He is not)

it's called the problem of evil, and it is a legitimate question that some people have. people smarter than you. 1/10 bait made me reply.

what if god rebelled against an even greater power and made the universe, now he has been punished and sent to the nether-realm, while his creation is left to rot

Benevolent in the Christian's "God loves you" kind of way

What if God, using the non-genocidal New Testament one as an example, exalts the concept of free will to the point of never interfering with it for good or ill? I

>brainlet and petersonposting count as "philosophical discussion"

Not to mention this thread is pretty much unfolding in the other thread on God.

A personal God is very doubtful, I would guess he sees things more in a grander scale way. Of the entire well being and evolution of the universe.

All Aquinas does is bolster a platonic conception of deity but he never convincingly reconciles it with a personal God prone to fits of anger such as the one depicted in the Bible.

>uhh the problem of evil isn't real!

Well obviously that's because of the fallen state of man due to inherited original sin from the fall of mankind.

The real question is why do bad things happen to cows?

>if God doesn't exist, then why do good things happen?
see how retarded your question is now?

'God', 'good', 'bad', etc. are just concepts

#damn #woke

Woah..........powerful

>she doesn’t know about objective morality
How did you even find this board?

user, I...

Karma

i kno rite like damn who wouldn't want to create the only intelligent beings in the universe just so they could destroy their environment, suffer, and hate each other all the time u kno wut i mean i mean that sounds like somethin i would do fore surre

>he doesn't know infinity is capable of contradicting itself and acting without reason
you live up to your avatar brainlet

Assuming that you know better than an all powerful being is arrogant. It's perfectly possible for God to love you and to cause what you may see as suffering in much the same way that a child will view many of their parents actions as unfair.

objective morality is a concept

Because god is either hardly conscious of the material world, extraordinarily cruel or unbelievably psychotic

there is no other explanation, if you choose “its good for you” then admit God’s cruelty and cannot claim an All Good God since no pure Good should incorporate evil

If you choose unconscious then its not an omniscient god, but it can still be eternal and omnipotent though obviously it is trending towards a finite conclusion which casts doubt on its ontological status RN as god

if you choose psychotic then there’s a chance that God is evil and then we don’t have to argue anymore because now one wonders if its a miracle good is possible in a universe with an evil God, further still Gnostic conception of demiurge+All becomes tennable but then even All is culpable for Evil though not claimed to be Good

if you say Karma you admit all 3 of the above so choose wisely

given that man comes from a place of ultimate ignorance and god comes from a place of ultimate knowledge man can neither assume god's motivations, malevolence or benevolence as man does not know man's ultimate fate.
we live in a state of ignorance - buttressed by faith

concepts describe reality

something something free will
something something deism

>tfw you're God's failed fifth grade science project

Good God this is a bad post

He does and quite extensively. Unless you are from a Protestant dominated country where God is primarily seen in anthropomorphic terms.

>if God is the creator then who created God lol rekt religiousfags xd
I'm not religious but it always pisses me off when retards think they are smart for saying these kind of shit because they believe that these questions were never raised and adressed in 2000 years somehow

Isn't this what the garden of Eden is all about?
Humans had it perfect until the woman succumbed to sin.

a conception of reality, that is indeed truthful

You and me, user. I'm a professional fedoratipper who loathes christianity but this and OP's post really grinds my gears because people who spout this can't put themselves in christfags' warped point of view.

The point is that god, if he exists, gives me no reason to care for him.

By looking at the unjustified pain in the world, we can see that he is not benevolent, or has a different idea of benevolence than humans.

If he IS benevolent, then suffice to say he must NOT be omnipotent, because otherwise he would not let so many innocent people live a life of suffering.

Whether he is supposed to be a benevolent impotent god or a powerful evil god - neither are respectable enough to worship.

My brother committed suicide when he was young. My priest pretty much said there is no way he is not going to hell (i am Anglican). I have decided that it is not worth it for me to go to heaven if my brother is in hell. So i am not going to take communion anymore.

bitch do you know about free will? God gave us it. Why? The hell if I know. We don't know why He created us. However, by giving us free will, He lets us do as we want - this means He refrains from interfering in our will. So we may cause pain to each other, and that is our right, even if He does not approve of it. Just like a mother or father may let their sons engage in acts that cause harm to themselves, only this is a being fully commited to it. All the "unjustified pain in the world" isn't reason to just say "well, then fuck God", because you're just a child. We are children. We do not know shit, being only a small part of an infinite whole. This is literally what faith is about. I can't go around explaining every earthquake, natural disaster, or whatever happens on this Earth, because I am not God, and if I try to use my infantile reason to say categorically that God is this or that, I'm just like a child saying "my parents are mean because they don't give me ice cream". Only this is in a completely otherwordly, incomprehensible level. It's "ok" if you don't believe in it, but in the eyes of any believer your reasoning sounds stupid and childish. Look at what you're saying, "hurr durr God is not respectful", bitch, if God exists, he does not give a rats ass of what your miserable mind thinks is "respectful". Your idea of respectful is one now, another later. He is infinite. get a grip

>gives us free will
>except genetics, social class and conditioning determines much of our dispositions and ultimately our choices
>not to mention the role played by chance areangement of circumstances

if I wanted to read a demented rant I'd pick up a holy book thanks.

Read Job.

your brother is a faggot and so are you

please go back to /pol/ or reddit or wherever

Oh ouch. I am really hurt now.

did i hurt your feelings?

you are getting retard everywhere and you need to go outside

That all plays into free will... You're just inputting your own human notion of what's "freedom". Do you think being free is being able to make choices in a vacuum? Or taking account the circumstances and choosing? We don't know how that happens, not on a molecular, organical or subtle (aka "spiritual") level. But as believer, I can literally only believe it exists. Just like you can believe it does not. Also, your genetics is just a result of the free will of your ancestors. The choice they made to have sex at a certain time, after influencing their genes in a certain way through their choices, made you who you are. You cannot change that. You can only act upon the circumstances using your will.
See, this is the problem. You want to tackle your definition of God, your ideas of what should and shouldn't be, and I'm telling your outright it either 1) does not matter, because things won't go "your way" and this is precisely the idea of the Fall (the corruption of Man by directing the love towards oneself, that is, the finite, the changeable, that which causes suffering and death, instead of directing it towards the infinite, immortal); or 2) because, if you want to argue with me that my God is evil, you can do so by the terms of my God, and I just told you it's literally impossible for you to prove it that way. "waa waa but my reasoning..." nobody cares. You can keep saying God is evil or impotent, but that is not my God, but instead your idea of it.

Someone else imposing their choices on you is not "freedom" it is actually tyranny and in the case of genetics you are absolutely helpless against it. And even if it is only a partially unfree will, it is still not free. The free will argument is not in the bible, it was invented by 2nd rate philosophers who did not know about genetics or psychology. You might as well base your beliefs of medicine on their contemporaries and treat everything with leeches.

See:

Official Catholic dogma:

>We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. the Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

thats really an awful thing to say

>if god doesn't exist then how come i believe in god
>check mate atheists

What does cancer have to do with free will?

Because it would be boring af otherwise

Well, you always have a choice

What about children that are raped before they even hit double digits in age?

What about children born deformed?

What about the mass rapes and genocides that tend to have many casaulties under the age of ten?

Where were these people's choices? What are they being punished for?

Why does this not extend to people of all religion, no religion, every state of sin, etc.?

>A question the greatest theologians and even the church fathers ruminated on, one that has been commonly asked throughout the millenia
>"i poest dum woajk"

Their souls have chosen their path before they were born. It‘s what they‘ve chosen because it was the most valuable experience for growth.

>nothing is true
>nothing exists
>you are nothing, I am nothing, shut up!

How do you people even have dialogues?

How would you quantify good if bad was not a thing?

I was asking those questions when I was 13 years old... then I grew up

t. expert theologian

>progress

Stagnation might not be bad but progress is better

So this... is the power of christfaggotry... woah

>dude like everything is pre-determined by genetics and society
>like, it's in our dna
>implying you can't think for yourself

Genetics allows you to resist Circumstance.
Circumstance allows you to be more than just your genetics.

This idea that your genetics are somehow imposing on you is fundamentally flawed. Your genetics are part of you. You didn't choose to be you, but what's that got to do with free will? Until you are you, you don't have a will.

Also free will is in the Bible, in the same way that "Jesus is God" is in the Bible. Jesus never says I am God, but he does say things that only logically make sense if he is literally God ("before Abraham was, I am"). Likewise, Jesus says things about the Israelites rejecting God. How could this be possible without free will?

>Do you think being free is being able to make choices in a vacuum?

He does, because he was born in a liberal world

Oh wow the god works in mysterious ways defense. Even your analogy reveals how weak your concept of god. If god is genuinely all powerful and benevolent, there would even be an ability to conceive of suffering and unfairness let alone of its existence. The fact that someone, anyone can understand and recognize suffering is proof enough.

>Are we unbenevolent if we disregard ants
Yes. Seems pretty straightforward. Discarding a living organism on the basis that it's 'puny' or 'insignificant' is literally unbenevolent .

How else would they be able to hold up the image if a benevolent god?

>Empty response that feels like bait
standard religious response then

has someone come up with a better one yet?

>blaming God for human beings' actions

>a child being born deformed is the action of a human being

w-...what?

no this is not even remotely christian

>I aM toTaLLy FrEe GeNEtiCs plAY nO PaRT bEiNG BoRN iN RwANDa DuRInG a GeNOciDe isAlso A ChOIce

I‘m about to blow your mind
m.youtube.com/watch?v=3VGav3jm_8c

>Don't think the bible is true? Well the bible says the bible is true silly.

p.s. you are willfully minimizing the impact of genetics, of childhood development, of socio-economic status, of extraneous circumstances etc.

>but ideally those discussions of philosophy that take place on Veeky Forums should be based around specific philosophical works to which posters can refer.

Juat shut the fuck up. Nobody wants to read that.

>Walsch believes in a pantheistic God, who tries to communicate itself as being "unselfish". Walsch's vision is an expansion and unification of all present theologies to render them more relevant to our present day and time.

yea ok

That's not dogma, that's the catechism. The catechism is a collection for practical use of various levels of teaching, be it prudential or dogmatic.
As for is his brother in hell, there's no way of knowing, but it should be assumed that people who commit suicide really do go to hell because suicide is a mortal sin and everyone who dies with unrepentant mortal sin immediately descends into the fire. But then again, it's not particularly relevant because he died an Anglican, that is in the moral sin of heresy anyway.

>communicate itself as being „unselfish“

That‘s exaclty what an unselfish would say

So the catechism lies to people? Good to know.

>you are you
That's where youre wrong kiddo

>knows about genetics
>knows about
>knows psychology
>knows
or

That's Catholicism for you

YOU CANT KNOW NUFFIN!

This is actually a good question that Aristotele had some trouble addressing. Idk why christfags pretend that it isn't.