I can't get through this. I like Peterson and some of his ideas but god damn it's so tedious and wordy for the sake of being wordy.
It takes him 20 pages to give an example of how his cousin lost himself because he hanged with a friend who smoked weed.
Get to the fucking point, it's in the title of the chapter. Good friends are important. We get it.
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There's a wide gulf between him speaking and his writing. I don't think I've ever seen a good tweet from him.
Youll find he never gets the the point. Just watch his lecture, the book is trash.
Pic related captures the gist of it.
He needed another book to fulfill contractual obligations, and he generated this bullshit. Basically, it's advice from old Ann Landers and Dear Abby newspaper columns from the 1960s. Nothing new, nothing original, just a scam to get your shekels.
>There's a wide gulf between him speaking and his writing
is that because he can't breakdown into a crying fit of tears when he's writing?
It's nothing new, but if people read it who didn't see those simple points argumented out before, why not? It's also filled with pop-sci data and entertainment of this sort. What did you expect going into it? If it was an academic Jungian text, of course your average Joe wouldn't take much from it.
It's basically a bunch of boomer ramblings. "Why don't you get a job, house and a wife like I did at your age, son?"-tier like usual.
>He is complaining about verbose authors
T. Has never read Hegel, Marx, or Heiddeger
>Talking about the values of traditions and how degrading ad infinitum libertine pursuits are to society and the individual
>Is a boomer complaint
Have you just never read any conservative literature in your entire life? This kind of complaining goes as far back to the Roman Era as far as I'm aware of
fucking spoiler alert
His ideas are fundamentally flawed. He's a good speaker, which lets him obfuscate the inconsistencies in his lectures, but a shitty writer, which is why his shortcomings are so much clearer in text.
>His ideas are *fundamentally* flawed
Brainlet word for a brainlet person
Yeah, wish I hadn't wasted my money on it.
Which traditions have value?
Last time I saw Memerson he complained about Canada relaxing their divorce laws many decades ago, he's becoming a political dinosaure, and complaining about divorce is already a /pol/ meme so I wonder if he got it from there. There's nothing inherently wrong about divorce.
>and complaining about divorce is already a /pol/ meme so I wonder if he got it from there
It is amazing how informed you people think you are and how absolutely clueless you end up looking
>Brainer
Brainlet word for a brainlet person
>Which traditions have value?
The ones that promote high levels of trust, societal health, and cohesion.
>Complaining about divorce is a /pol/ meme
Are you fucking... Can leddit just leave?
>recognise voice
>TJ Kirk
>realise this is le amazing atheist
This is where I turned it off.
Holy fucking shit you're right
I was wondering why I was breaking out in hives before he even started making points
Leftists have their own set of hallowed traditions i.e. Abortion, sodomy 'being a slut', transgenderism being inherently virtuous in and of itself, its not a question of liberalism vs tradition but of conflicting rigid normative ideals which imply particular models of society. An "egalitarian" society of atomized liberated individual monads is paradoxically more restrictive than previous societies because the monad can only find its counterpart in a totalizing secularized managerial apparatus
Traditions are what society runs on. You do almost all your stuff because you're used to doing it that way. Hell, that's how you learn most of the stuff in your life. And traditions that are deemed not useful die off. Simple evolutionary theory. And don't come with the "But muh science knows better! why can't we just do X?" Science knows with 60% chance what to do, and even then, there are usually unforeseen side effects. Whereas we know with 100% accuracy how a tradition is implemented.
Almost like it's a scam...
>Traditions are what society runs on
we've been running real-life experiments on whether this is true for the past couple centuries.
It remains to be seen whether not having children will make everything collapse or not, and what will happen with immigration
Youre one of those "we'll just replace people with robots and immigrants" people? Should have guessed.
'it remains to be seen'. We have Japan as a sort of control
My guess is that we are heading towards total collapse, but that isn't actually proven
>don't change or oppose behavior because you have been doing it for a while and it would be, like, real hard if you stopped or something
>dude science isn't 100% accurate so you should just ignore it in favor of tradition
What in the fuck did they do to you people? Or were you just born this way, a product of your nigger tier traditions
>Science is always objectively superior to tradition
People are rediscovering lessons that are thousands of years old these days as we've strayed from tradition and it's ruined millions of lives. Liberalism, secularism, and materialism have resulted in total misery for billions of people.
>There's nothing inherently wrong about divorce.
Do you know what it does to a kid?
>Traditions are what society runs on.
Our "traditions" didn't even exist 40 years ago.
Then they're not really traditions, are they?
>Liberalism, secularism, and materialism have resulted in total misery for billions of people.
Can you actually back up this hyperbolic claim? Especially when many liberal values come directly from Christianity?
He's an absolute hack.
His oversimplification of Derrida's philosophy is laughable.
Thank you for typing that out instead of me my dude.
>Fucking snowflakes! You bitches need to man up, only struggle can build strong character!
>ablooo blooo mummy and daddy don't love each other anymoreeee ablooo blooo
grow up, your parents aren't your servants
They come from the reformation not Christianity. You're way off the mark my dude.
surprisingly decent for TJ but he kinda dropped the ball at the end
Pretty much this, divorce is shit for a kid but growing up in a toxic household is also horrid.
Those aren't the only two options though, are they? Here's how you do it:
1. Marry a good person who you really love
2. Have kids if you think you can handle it
3. Be communicative, honest, and work out issues the second they come up before they spiral out of control
4. Don't be a promiscuous slut, regardless of sex
5. Don't consider divorce the "emergency escape button" without putting serious work into fixing shit
If people did all that, divorce would plummet
t. americant
Nah we need to allow women to divorce their husbands because they couldn’t agree on baby names. If you don’t agree you hate all women.
The idea that you would read Jung and come out with the conclusion "get married, have kids, be a plumber" is totally fucking preposterous.
He has never once (1nce) made that claim.
Those prescriptions come from him and he admits that
Wtf it was so easy all along! Thanks for saving western civilization user.
Exactly my point.
"Muh tradishuns" is a nonsensical argument.
I never said it was easy, I said that's how you do it
I didn't say he said Jung made those claims, but he certainly uses a lot of Jung to justify his admonishments to a traditional middle-class Canadian lifestyle. Even if his recommendations aren't premised on Jung, it shows a staggering lack of insight on his part
Do you know what being raised by two people who hate one another does to a child?
Gosh, if only everyone were as smrat as you.
Look, I agree with Jordan Peterson concerning many of his arguments but he is just a nice face that serves to guide the greater tide of a reactionary movement plaguing the minds of american youth from extremism. Maps of Meaning was his real contribution to psychology/mythological studies and is a good read if you're a masochist. This book is just his ramblings aimed at an audience which is quick to embrace taboo ideas due to liberal accelerationalism. JP is an amiable face, and instead of reading Houellebecq or Nick Land, kids are reading a cheesy self help book which is neither extreme nor depraved and I can't say that's bad
I haven't successfully done all of that yet so I'm not going to claim I'm smart enough to nail it
I've tried to stick to the same ideas in my relationship though, and we've never once had a fight that lasted more than a single day. We've been together for over two years and still get butterflies on our way to see each other. There are ways to make your relationships more stable and healthy that most people don't do. You're delusional if you don't accept that to be true
Commie pls leave
Nothing wrong with divorce, as long as theres no alimony and the child stay with the father
Were you people born yesterday? It's a self help book focused on "mental health." Self help books on this concept are 100% always shit.
Didn't he write a story in there about how a little toddler was stepping on his baby daughters fingers when she was on the monkey bars and how that kid was fully conscious of his actions, attacking his daughter as retaliation to adults and authority. I think he said he wanted to punt the kid but he imagined the kid would say "Up yours Daddy-O!" and instead he opted to do nothing; he got cucked by the toddler.
It was a dumb anecdote imo.
even my mom who is a jungian gestalt therapist is less obnoxious than peterson lol
Why are memerson threads universally an absolute steaming pile of shit?
>. We've been together for over two years
gosh user u sure are a golden couple huh
the chapter about children and being a good parent was a bit much but the rest wasn't all that bad. buck up
butthurt commies and over-enthusiastic redditors
>still get butterflies on our way to see each other
You mean you do. Fuckin fag
...
the average duration for a marraige before divorce is 12 years my dude
like 2 years is virtually meaningless.
Tradition pertains more often to human values. Science itself isn't concerned with that. So these are largely different domains.
>Liberalism, secularism, and materialism have resulted in total misery for billions of people.
It's really just capitalism, the fetishization of commodity and the advent of mass culture. Only an idiot would look at the massive wealth disparity, the mediocre pop culture productions and the seemingly endless stream of new tech products released at a breakneck pace and proceed to conclude that it must be the lack of god in our lives what is driving us insane.
That's why I never did and never would claim that our relationship has been miraculously long
The fact that we're still just as excited to see each other every day as we were when we first started falling in love, and that we handle conflict and hardship quickly and honestly, is something worth pointing out though, I think. At least relative to the other relationships I see people our age in
>It's really just capitalism,
Doritos. Now with Cultural Marxism.
youtube.com
>relative to the other relationships I see people our age in
that's the issue, most people i know that are involved in a relationship have been in one for at least a year.
even nowadays, 2 years simply isn't long enough for it to be worth mentioning as an exception to the rule. either your perception is skewed, or by "people our age" you mean 16 year olds (which wouldn't be surprising, considering this is the peterson audience we're talking about here)
it's not really "cultural marxism" what bothers me here, but the blatant explotation of people's good will, concern and means of identification for fucking advertising.
and also how petty can you be for being mad at rainbow colored crisps lol
I'd buy that
It's pop-sci/self-help so by nature of its genre it's going to be padded.
I think the subversion of society by homosexual ideologues is a more pressing concern than 'capitalism'. 10 years ago, I would have dismissed such concerns as the ravings of ignorant backwoods fundies, but things have changed. Something truly evil is afoot, as it is evident to any even moderately reasonable person. these people do not want 'to be left alone' they do not want equality before the law, they want to indoctrinate your children, they want to impose alien social norms by force, they are dogmatic, tribal and think themselves morally superior to the rest of us
I think the endless reproduction of contextless outliers in the form of image macros and their influence on weak, shitty minds is more of a concern, really.
>I think the subversion of society by homosexual ideologues is a more pressing concern than 'capitalism'
then you're out of touch with the world and are a danger to the survival of the species politically, there is no homofaggot crisis
Gee, Isn't it weird how all colleges all major mainstream media outlets, hollywood, cnn, google, all publishing houses and the new york times adopted the exact same ideology out of a sudden? 'Cultural Marxism' might not be up to your standards of etymology, but hey, weren't you the ones saying only white people can be racist regardless of what the dictionary says because the dictionary was written by white people and is hence irredemably racist? leftist youtube personalities disgust me, they literally spend their days defending mass culture products and multinational corporations, but muh sargon amirite?
>all colleges
no
>all media
no, do you not watch Fox?
>hollywood
is largely liberal but not all films are made in Hollywood so its just a propagandist canard
>cnn, google, nyt
you just restated what you had alluded to with your “media” in particulars that revealed what you really were targeting
>cultural marxist
you mean progressive liberal humanism?
>progressive liberal humanism?
leftists have effectively deconstructed all possible basis for humanism or liberalism. It's too late, only thing left is tribal warfare against an encroaching monocult that wields cultural marxism to corporativist globalism.
>
>I didn't say he said Jung made those claims, but he certainly uses a lot of Jung to justify his admonishments to a traditional middle-class Canadian lifestyle.
Probably because he's used to living a traditional, middle-class Canadian lifestyle. Since he's, you know, Canadian.
>deconstructed
i positively think you meant to put destroyed here, because what does it even matter if "leftists" have "deconstructed" any ideology whatsoever, or are you so incurious and mediocre as to be scared of students and teachers analyzing ideologies?
Lmao, cuck. Good luck with number 1
Self-help books are for brainlets. All they do is regurgitate philosophy.
As for Peterson, I'll definitely check out his next book provided it's not self-help.
I can confirm. I grew up with parents who have been hating each other more than 30 years, but never divorced. I am really fucked up.
Are you Asian by any chance?
...
>Get to the fucking point, it's in the title of the chapter. Good friends are important. We get it.
Fillers maybe? If its meant to for a general audience they would harp on to make a point.
You could just watch Peterson on Dave Rubin's show talking about the book, they go through all 12 rules and elborate on them.
>or by "people our age" you mean 16 year olds
20, and I know plenty of people my age in 2 year+ relationships, my point was that most of them seem pretty unstable and unhealthy, sometimes even admittedly so. I've had friends come to me asking for advice about big issues in their relationships and I've had to spell out to three separate people why you need to bring tough issues up and be completely honest and willing to talk it out. It's just not something they've figured out themselves, even though most of them are perfectly smart people
underrated post
>20
Not that user but you sure as hell aren't helping your case here. How about you brag about your relationship after you reached adulthood
Oh for mighty moses' sake, I was just trying to point out that my relationship does relatively well because we deal with things maturely, not that I'm a romantic genius and success story
>uses someone's theories and ideas which led him lived a vastly different and unique life to justify living your current and mediocre life.
Is this supposed to make me feel better?
Just coz you are surrounded by morons and are too moronic to find out about your own problems doesn't enhance your suggestion. The problems surrounding divorce is far more complicated and systemic for a 20 year old to use his 2 year old relationship as a basis.
That's a valid point, I understand. The only reason I said it is because I've watched a few divorces happen from the outside and it's been clear from conversations with the people involved that they weren't really trying to work it out together at all. It seems like a common sense thing to me, not much more. I'm no expert
Stick with it. your reading speed can't be that bad.
The audiobook is where it's at with this book
Correct.