Why did the Catholich Church go full retard and start selling indulgences?

And you should burn using a hammer when you could of used your head and been nice and be with the system to ask the Pope to please stop this paying money for indulgence.
Martin Luther is a supporter of the Jews.

To be really fair, both the Catholics and Protties started to ignore the parts about usury and got really rich off it.

I mean how can something that was illegal and a mortal sin for 1000 years become OK to do.

I suppose even the Church turns a blind eye to money making when it lines their pockets.

Martin luther did try to ask them nicely though. Then they tried to have him burned for it.

>Didn't they realize people cpuld get quite pissed from it?
DLCs were not a thing yet, They could not know about people opposing buying upgrades.

>Post shit on the door
>nicely
That's the wrong way to do it.

He was just posting a rant on their time's facebook

Then maybe he should of kept his whore mouth shut on the message board and thought up of a way to go to Rome and go ask the Pope about the indulgence situation.

>Martin Luther is a supporter of the Jews
Either you are trolling or you are ignorant as fuck about what you are talking about. Martin Luther was extremely hateful of jews and openly advocated jewish genocide

Only after he stopped being funded by the Jews you kike loving protestant.

Maybe the pope shouldn't have burned thise that tried to do that at the stake.

Maybe Martin Luther should of again, kept his whore mouth shut and not nail the fucker on the goddamn door.

By the order of the Holy See, these individuals are hereby excommunicated:

This individual in particular is double-excommunicated:

And for the first time, maybe the Pope should have kept true to his humble duty rather than becoming so corrupt people like the Borgias could become popes.

You mean die in Rome because pagans got triggered that he was trying to spread the word of Christ?
Maybe you should realize that it doesn't matter and money for indulgences work because it makes the damn Church look better.

>Protestant hate

Why is this so common on Veeky Forums discussions? This is a humanities board, so surely you must understand the Protestant Reformation was inevitable? Regardless of specific theology, it was ultimately a matter of authority and control. The rise of the middle class and the redistribution of authority since the early middle ages made the matter of church authority an obvious target, it's like being upset that your sand and rock dam collapsed in a stream.

I think it's counter autism against the fundies on here

Pure contrarianism.

Sniff

Because of what happen next. The whole:
>sola scriptura
>Sola Fide
>Fuck Peter
>lets support the Jews
>lets ruin the art here and act like Muslims
>let's help jews make up shit like atheism and nihlism
>lets help push back actual science back like evolution
Name me one fault in the Catholic Church.

When a group is in power for so long they tend to forget that they can be overthrown.

I always suspect it's a bit of that ethnic barrier that Catholics/Protestants run into with one another and is more culture/class/national origin related. Get two atheists together and you will hear, "Well, I don't believe in God, but Catholic theology makes WAY more sense..." and vice versa, and the two will still argue.

Fuck off Marxist.

It wasn't like they almost got btfo by an irrelevant shithole to the east of Germany afew years prior to that.

>let's support the Jews

How can you be this wilfully ignorant? At least read On the Jews and their Lies

>medieval Bohemia
>irrelevant shithole

This thread is embarrassingly retarded

>How can you be this wilfully ignorant?
I'm assuming that you are an American. And, with that. You support Israel, because Israel is the state for the Jews.
Now, if you're going to say that Martin Luther hated the Jews, now let me ask you this, is Martin Luther a Prophet?
Protestantism in America mostly support Israel and the Jews. If you ignore that then you are willingly ignorant of the situation, you goddamn kike.

>>Name me one fault in the Catholic Church.
Corruption.

I could be really snippy here and point out that they seriously believe in the christian god when there is no good reason to do so anymore, but really ignoring that you still have the matter of tremendous amounts of corruption.

Especially if we're talking about the catholic church of the late middle ages/early renaissance

>I'm assuming that you are an American.
No.

>You support Israel
No.

>is Martin Luther a Prophet?
No.

Are you actually retarded or just pretending? What the fuck does Luther have to do with American imbeciles if he existed centuries before America was a thing and most Americans aren't even Lutheran?

>Perfectly logical
>Perfectly logical
>Yet, Catholics: "Fuck Paul, fuck scripture, fuck St. Augustine."
>Let's worship icons
>citation needed

If your definition of Protestant is purely western Christian denominations that are not in union with Rome, then of course you can make any generalization you want and attach it to the term "Protestant". How about I focus on some Mexican woman's belief that fulfilling God's will is to endlessly reproduce?

>Corruption.
So what? Do you not like art?
>What the fuck does Luther have to do with American imbeciles if he existed centuries before America was a thing and most Americans aren't even Lutheran?
>people in the Lutheran Church were forced to apologized about what Martin Luther said
>Protestants, the fucking stem of Martin Luther autistic sperging now helps the Jews out
It doesn't fucking matter what Martin Luther said if the fucking people don't do it.

American protestants are mostly baptists and reformed, not Lutherans. You fucking mental cripple. Also nice backpedalling.

>>corruption is no big deal because of pretty paintings and statues
lol

Besides which abrahamic religious art isn't really my thing. My artistic tastes run closer to the pornographic and the violent then they do the sacred as defined by monotheists.

>muh art

Your art can get fucked, idolater.

I was just playing retarded for a comedic effect.

>sola fide is perfectly logical
It isn't, you aren't saved just by knowing Christ, you must act like Christ, be Christ-like, to know that you can still sin and must repent.
>"Fuck Paul, fuck scripture, fuck St. Augustine."
Augustine is Catholic doctrine famalam.
>Let's worship icons
You don't worship a fucking icon, it's called revere.
>citation needed
Israel being a state.
>How about I focus on some Mexican woman's belief that fulfilling God's will is to endlessly reproduce?
Then I'll tell you that it's the Mexicans belief.
>American protestants are mostly baptists and reformed, not Lutherans
Proofs?
Are you a Muslim? Because only people who act like Muslims endorse shit like that.

I try not to be judgmental of statements or motivation of statements. But you are an absolute edge lord

scripturecatholic.com/salvation.html
scripturecatholic.com/justification.html

protestanterrors.com/
youtube.com/watch?v=kd66KXIbAjc
youtube.com/watch?v=xL2Hyve-kwg
youtube.com/watch?v=K_4RFoknrwc

If you didn't live in the shittiest country of Europe (Poland) you'd look religious statistics yourself.

Reminder boys.

See

I don't live in Poland. I live in America, no I'm not a spic.

I just wanted to have a fucking discussion on the Catholic Church selling indulgences.

It was acceptable during the time, money was needed for repair to make the Basilica great, something else for it too, etc etc etc.

>this triggers the papist

>being a Muslim is okay

...

>Ephesians 2:8
>St. Augustine's writings and beliefs much more readily conform to Reformed Protestant theology than post-Counterreformation Catholicism.
>Because it's called something different it is different!

You bow to it, you invoke Saints in prayer. But it's not worship just because you call it "reverence"? If I were to be in public "naked", and I inform the police officer that I am "nude" not naked, do you think I will not be arrested?

>The Mexicans' belief does not have to line up with Church doctrine, but the Protestants should.

>>But you are an absolute edge lord
How so? I like violent computer games and various sorts of pornography more then I like religious art. The only thing that is "edgy" about that is my willingness to admit it.

>only muslims hate icons

Ever read the Bible you cuck?

Reverence means respect.
>Mexicans are a people
>Protestants aren't, it's a split off of the Catholic Church
Have you?

> He thinks Poland is the shittiest country in Europe

Works done without faith are purely for selfish temporal purposes. Works are a result of faith, but they do not lead to salvation. An atheist, heretic, or pagan doing good deeds is surely not righteous just pro-social, for what is his motivation if not to be as Christ?

Help those around him?

Please.

>And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Matthew 10:22

>For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.
Matthew 12:37

>And he said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one who is good. If you would enter life, keep the commandments.”
Matthew 19:17

>He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
Romans 2:6-8

>For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.
Romans 2:13

>For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
Hebrews 6:4-6

That argument makes no sense, you conceded that Mexicans can believe something, something that happens to be non-existent in Roman Catholic doctrine. Yet the fact that Mexicans are "people" a vague term allows them this right, that Protestants do not have?

>Proofs?

Less than 5% of Americans are Lutheran. If you can't look that up in 5 seconds you're truly a lost case.

>For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
2 Peter 2:20-22

Read the passages in again. I could go on and on.

You are Biblically illiterate.

scripturecatholic.com/salvation.html
scripturecatholic.com/justification.html
youtube.com/watch?v=kd66KXIbAjc
youtube.com/watch?v=xL2Hyve-kwg

Okay, let me reword it.
One is a tribe of people, a fucking ethnic group. The other is a religion. It's like Arabs and Muslims.

Ephesians 2:8-10 (NRSV)
>8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Romans 4:6-7
>6 So also David speaks of the blessedness of those to whom God reckons righteousness apart from works: 7 “Blessed are those whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

Romans 3:27-28
>27 Then what becomes of boasting? It is excluded. By what law? By that of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 For we hold that a person is justified by faith apart from works prescribed by the law.

>Conflating works as a result of faith with acceptance of a life of self-centered hedonism and rejection of works.

Is this why your church had to label Luther a heretic instead of actually debating with him?

Why should anyone listen to a heretic?

>Conflating works as a result of faith with acceptance of a life of self-centered hedonism and rejection of works.

But that's what Catholics actually think, they are that retarded. No idea how you can spin "God has blessed you with his grace, which results in faith, which results in works" into "YOU CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT :DDD", but Catholics are apparently capable of performing such mental gymnastics.

>YOU CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT :DDD
But that's wrong. You can't do whatever you want.

...

How is pointing out basic facts and laws strawman?

>Catholic reading comprehension

Faith without works is dead.

Faith without works is not faith, yep.

okay so let's say someone after a lifetime of being an asshole accepts Jesus on his deathbed. does this man not actually have faith and is still doomed to hell?

Depends.

Do you understand grace? We as humans do not know who is saved, to say whether or not another we ourselves are saved and another is not is vanity and judgement.

You can't consciously accept faith, you have to be blessed by grace, which is irresistible. It's not your choice.

but this is pretty black and white. according to you faith without works is no faith. he has no works. therefore he has no faith

alright Calvin

as always fall back on "it's a mystery"

What has he done? Was it mortal or venial sins that he committed?

both

Then he's damned to hell.

even though he's seen the error of his ways and asked God for forgiveness?

>Marxist being used correctly for the first time in Veeky Forums's history

Amazing.

Yeah, his body has sin.

so then God is not merciful nor has Jesus paid the price of sin

I don't see how Catholics can put so much faith in the Church.

It's obviously prone to corruption. It was at least originally made with God in everyone's hearts but clearly being man-made makes it susceptible to man's follies.

The mental gymnastics used to justify thIs shit is Creationist-tier.

No one has bothered to answer the OP's question. I'll do it.

The Catholic Church sold, and indeed continues to offer, indulgences BECAUSE IT CAN. Because it has full power to do so, and that power was granted to it by Christ himself.

"I shall give you the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven. Whatever you bind on Earth will be bound in Heaven, and whatever you loose on Earth will be loosed in Heaven."

That is the Church's great power, given to it by Christ: the power to forgive sins. Moreover, Christ was not specific, but instead affords the Church great discretion in how she may go about binding and loosing.

Indulgences are the Church exercising the power of the keys. They are people paying a fee and receiving time off from penance in Purgatory. They are completely in their rights to do this. There is absolutely nothing wrong with indulgences from a theological perspective. Luther was right to call out the bribery and corruption of his time, but he went too far in condemning indulgences themselves. The Church has God's permission to offer them, and whatever other form of forgiveness for sins they see fit.

Because Christ said the Church wouldn't fail. He said it would endure to the end of time. That's pretty powerful.

>Didn't they realize people could get quite pissed from it?
Yeah, kinda, but like every other retarded economic policy since the dawn of complex societies:
"Yeah, this is probably gonna screw us in the long run, but LOOK AT ALL THIS MONEY WE ARE MAKING, DAWG!"

...

What don't you get? James actually supports sola fide. Works are a product of true faith, not something separate.

But that's entirely what the Church teaches. The whole point of "justification by works" is that works are a manifestation of genuine faith.

This is yet another instance where Martin Luther was actually pretty stupid and misunderstood things. It's like if Larry The Cable Guy had decided he was going to invent his own brand of physics.

Luther was a wreck desu.