Can God create a rock that He cannot destroy?

autistic questions are to be ignored

I don't think you understand omni
It'd be like adding to infinity

logical paradoxes exist. weird huh? moving on.

No because he doesn't exist.

Omnipotence is a spook.

you can have bigger infinities

then it's not infinity

if you add an infinite number of 1's together, that's infinite, same thing with 2's. Yet one is bigger than the other

1.111... Is bigger than 0.111...

An infinite amount of things can add up to a finite thing.

>being this retarded
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleph_number
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infinite_set
or try any good book on set theory.

You're fucking retarded
Infinity = everything
You can't add to everything because it's already there
atheists are retarded
fuck...

There are infinite integers, and there are infinite real numbers, but there are also infinitely many real numbers for every integer.

Yes, but in this case it doesn't.
The limit as n approaches infinity(sum from i=1 to n (i)) increases without bound.

No. God is a rational entity. He would never submit Himself to a paradox merely founded on language games. This question is irrelevant.

>I don't know basic mathematics but I sure will post bullshit about it hurr durr
I'm a Christian myself, but fuck, this had better be bait.

lol you don't understand infinity is the problem. Which is fine, you're a theist so it's usual for you to co-opt beliefs without scrutiny.

Infinity is anything that isn't finite or limited in a sense. This is reflected in the maths and studies of many genius theologians and scientists who hold faith. So you have no excuse, yourself. But if N=infinity, then what is N+1? N+N? N^N?

If he's rational, why doesn't he give proof he exists and let us worship him without a doubt?

>God is a rational entity
What fresh heresy is this? Rationality is a human constraint, God has no need of such things.

Reason is limited for humans, God's reason is purely perfect.

Are you guys seriously arguing about what a fairytale does or doesn't think?

Because it's up to us. Some will, some won't but we are free - to a certain degree - to worship him or not. However, faith is purely transcandental, you can only experience it but never explain it.

M'lady

>LOOK AT ME I'M ABOVE 2000 YEARS OF INTELLECTUAL AND SPIRITUAL QUESTIONS, IN THIS MOMENT I AM EUPHORIC

>I can't explain it but it's real trust me
If he gives me a rational brain to dismiss his existence, why would he punish me for it? Why doesn't God encourage critical thinking?

Name one of those questions that is even in the slightest bit mystical and unexplicable.

Platinga sympathizers, the lot of you.

>tfw there is no maximally excellent being

>Let's reduce the validity of an argument using greentext.
He'll punish you if you're a bad person. It's as simple as that. However, atheism is morally nihilistic. Read The Brothers Karamazov.

Nope, atheism is the lack of believe in God. Anything else depends upon the individual. Why do theists always keep loading the term atheism with a bunch of bullshit? Why would God punish me if I'm a good person but don't believe in him?

the bibelle

*tips fedora*

...

Religion works on the same fundamental principle as chain emails.

>forward to 5 more people or she'll get you tonight
>go to church and give us money or you'll be damned eternally
>and don't jack off, either, we need more people

>Why would God punish me if I'm a good person but don't believe in him?
I never said that. I only claimed that atheism is morally nihilistic. Read Kant.

I cannot see how God could make something so big that he could not lift it because God in the first place created the matter energy time and space for that object to exist. He could will a conundrum and then simply will It away. Fedora checkmate

Literally the definition of being god you fucking retard

The question assumes that God of the present and God of the future are separate entities, but that doesn't have to be the case. If God is unchanging and eternal, then there is no future self to overcome, only one will that applies permanently to all time.

God is beyond logic itself. He surpasses human reason. He can create something out of nothing and he has no beginning since he create time itself.

>it's a Veeky Forums discusses set theory thread

go back to /aco/ faggot

Right, so why did you even say it then?

>this fuck ingredients thread
It's a mathematical fact that some infinities are necessarily larger than others. You can rigorously prove it.

>christfags
Always a good lel

So it would be theortically possible that "God" could create another God with a bigger infinity?

That's interesting.

The point

---------

Your head.

>one everything can be bigger than another everything

>infinity means everything
You're a special kind of moron.

...

wouldn't the rock be God then?

The Islamic view would be that objects in contact with God have no properties. Weight is a property and thus Allah would nullify it.
This is also why everyone who looks at God dies. Living is property and thus it leaves anyone looking at God.

But could God make it so that this was not the case, and then create such a rock?

It comes down to the same question of omnipotence.

Kryptonite shits on superman, but it doesn't become one itself.

No. That is one of his properties along with omnipotence.

>comes down to the same question of omnipotence.

Objects ceasing to exist in the face of the Absolute truth is one of the property's of the universe. He could do it, but doing so would be stupid.

Everything that god has created is a part of himself.That rock is a part of him.

youtube.com/watch?v=9eKc5kgPVrA

I'm going to take this guy's word for it.

Swear to God, I was just watching "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" and it was just like watching you people chronically non-unfuck yourselves.

pleb tier philosophy

Can mathematicians make a set of all sets?

Checkmate

hi spinoza!

Yes. Since a rock is a physical object and God has a physical body (Jesus), he can.
Jesus ascended into heaven with his earthly body, which probably means that he has the physical (bodily) strength of a normal human.

>then its not infinity
The set of odd numbers is an infinite set.
The set of all numbers is also an infinite set.
The latter is bigger than the former.

Why do people bother with philosophy if they lack simple maths knowledge?

Yes

No, he can't.

Jesus could just use his magic powers to levitate the rock.

Infinite is a concept not a real number. You cannot apply mathematical jewery tricks applied to real numbers such as
>if N=infinite then N+N or N*N are bigger infinites
>see the logic of it, silly goyim

2.11111etc is bigger than 1.1111etc but those are not "infinites" but numbers with a limit in the infinite.

Your time of pulling tricks on the gentiles is over, Shimon.

Can God kill himself?

Anything is possible if you use your imagination. Since you believe in God you are already well on your way.

This statement does not reflect any fundamental limitations on God's power, it reflects a limitation on human language. It's the same thing as asking "what does infinity plus one equal?" Nonsensical questions get nonsensical answers: at best God can/can't make a rock so big that he cannot destroy it: both statements are equally correct and equally false.

The nature of God is that as a transcendent being he defies classification and identity, as such concepts are meaningless in the face of the infinite. This is why there is no proof of God's existence in reality, and why we can only indirectly infer his existence using the language of metaphor.

>You can't grasp the concept of his existence but I can
>I can't describe it with language though, but trust me he exists

Nonsensical claims, such as omnipotence, attract nonsensical questions.

>>You can't grasp the concept of his existence but I can
Nah, I can only grasp the metaphors which gives me a broadly rough, indirect idea of the transcendent

>I can't describe it with language though, but trust me he exists
But God does exist -- as a human conception of ideal benevolence. Whether God exists in the universe is irrelevant, as we live in a world defined by physical laws and only physical laws. God exists as an influence on human society.

They reflect the innate inability of language to ever define the totality of reality, for the same reason why the map will never be the countryside.

If his universal existence is irrelevant, why bother worshipping him?

>They reflect the innate inability of language to ever define the totality of reality,

I other words your sole argument that the case for an omnipotent being is solid is "it's impossible to describe it with language".

You better step up your game.

Because these are millenia old narratives that countless people amount countless and diverse cultures have found compelling. By understanding what makes religion special, we understand how to better influence and shape human society.

Because when we don't do that, we let the silver tongued demagogues and the snake oil salesmen take over.

>I other words your sole argument that the case for an omnipotent being is solid is "it's impossible to describe it with language".
>You better step up your game.
It's an idea as old as Taoism and as new as contemporary philosophy.

Religion has been diminishing for the last two centuries and right now life on earth has been better than ever. How do you explain that?
And before you're going to try to convince me it isn't: child mortality is down, poverty is down, illiteracy is down, worldwide wealth is up and life expectancy is up. Not to mention we can browse memes now.

>It's an idea as old as Taoism and as new as contemporary philosophy.

Claiming an idea is old makes it true or invulnerable from criticism is a fallacious argument.

>Religion has been diminishing for the last two centuries and right now life on earth has been better than ever. How do you explain that?

It's reflective of the decline in antiquated interpretations of the scriptures despite the entrenched social institutions which have become plagued by reactionary groupthink and are driving away new converts.

It's worth remembering that two generations of Russians grew up under the Soviet education system which taught that religion was obsolete mythology, and as soon as the repressive regime collapsed under its own weight, Rates of Orthodox attendance returned to its pre-repression levels.

People are finding that they don't need extensive church networks to examine their beliefs, they can do it in small clusters of like-minded individuals.

>Claiming an idea is old makes it true or invulnerable from criticism is a fallacious argument.
And ignoring them is bad demographics

>Ignoring them is bad demographics
Just because a certain belief is very popular doesn't make it true. Religion developed along with the ability to abstract think and to personify shit like plants, animals and rocks.
>Hey guys, what if this plant has a soul like us?
The most basic byproduct of abstract thinking. With the agricultural revolution it evolved into polytheism, which in turn evolved into monotheism in the west. All religions are variations on the fundemental notion that life isn't what it seems and that there are supernatural beings that dictate our way of life.

>And ignoring them is bad demographics

That doesn't even make sense.

All "rocks" are destructible. So maybe we go with a more general term?
There are actually indestructible objects in this universe. Black holes are virtually impossible to destroy. Even smashing two black holes into each other will just result in a huge blast of energy and an even bigger black hole. Only god might know a way to destroy them.

Batman could destroy a black hole.

A black hole would only make the Incredible Hulk stronger.

any created object can be uncreated

Can god create a five sided square?