When did Slovakians become a people? What is their identity based on? What is Slovakian nationalism?
I ask because historically I don't see anything to draw upon. They don't seem to have been a people up until quite recently, and I fail to see what distinguishes them from say, Poles, Belorussians, Czechs, or Ukrainians. Why do they even exist?
Ethno-genesis general too I guess, since I can't imagine there are many Slovaks interested in telling me.
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Slovakia is a meme culture
Slovakians are just moravians who ended up under hungarian rule after the magyar invasion a millenium ago
So which cultures aren't "memes"? What makes those genuine and the others a "meme"?
...
>that sharp division between macedonia and bulgaria
meme map
I thought Bosnia was muslim, but the green is predominant. WTF?
Bosnia is muslim only in the two big cities that were held by the Turks, rest of the country is inhabited by Serbs and Croats.
To a great extent Slovak national identity was a response to attempts by the Hungarians to eliminate them and other nations by assimilation.
Many Hungarians today have Slovak ancestry and many places in Hungary have Slovak names.
And what the other poster is true Slovaks were initially Moravians and ruled over a larger area. The language is very similar to Czech, almost a dialect, but more archaic and with less German influence. Slovaks were also more religious and rural compared to Czechs. in another context maybe they could have been one nation.
They are slavs so they probably memed themselves unto existence.
WE WUZ MORAVIANS AND JEBÁÁŤ
So presumably, before Hungary (under the Austro-Hungarian empire) decided to try to assimilate them, Slovaks had little identity, or considered themselves Moravian?
My understanding of the Czechs is that the Austrians nearly succeeded in eliminating their identity and language, and although there was a wave of nationalism to save it, they remain very much Germanized slavs.
Slovaks weren't Moravians. They literally made it up to have at least some history. I'm a Czech (Moravian) history student and I literally never heard about this bullshit until now.
What the hell were they then? Generic slavs without a meaningful identity?
You know, what about their own tribe? It came to muh identity again. I knew the whole thing was about this. You guys are just too frustrated because you have no history to build your identity on, so you make shit up.
It's not "Slovakians" but Slovaks.
And they haven't became a separate ethnicity until the late 1800s. For most of their history they just viewed themselves as Slavic-speaking Hungarians.
See They were Carpatho-Slavic Hungarians.
>Carpatho-Slavic Hungarians.
>Slavic-speaking Hungarians
[Hungarist Autism Intensifies]
Read basically any source from 1850 and earlier.
“Nemuožeme teda powedať mi sme Maďari, mi sme Česi, ale len muožeme, ba aj musíme powedať, mi sme Uhria." - Priatel ludu, 1848
"Lingua Sclavus, natione Hungarus, eruditione Germanus." - Matthias Bel
Kek is that a Trianon party costume?
>Many Hungarians today have Slovak ancestry and many places in Hungary have Slovak names.
So do slovakians have hungarian ancestry, and slovakian places have hungarian name, so what.
We lived together for a 1000 year, of course we are almost the same besides language. Hell, your coat of arms is just a copy of ours.
Tbh before you jump on me magyarisation was the biggest crime in our history, I have nothing against slovaks, only those who say south-slovakian hungarians are magyarised slovaks, which is just an excuse to justify the fucked-up borders, which would had been fine in their 1938, post-first-vienna award state.
>slovakia
you wrote northern hungary wrong, my friend
Slovaks were just a ruse to steal Hungarian clay
>moldovans
no such thing
isnt your coat just copy of Nitra coat?
slow akians are just brainwashed hungarians who think they are slavic
>angry magyar intensifies
Tbh Hungary and Slovakia should be one country. Geographically and economically it makes sense, and even culturally we are similar. We don't have such hatred towards each other like we have towards romanians.
Only difference is language, but that didn't stop scotts and english making a Union, so why shouldn't we?
Add sub-Carpathia to it, and we have a pretty strong easter-european country. We could call it a Carphation Union or some shit.
Look there was Slavs living in the area before Magyar invasions. Slovaks were just the ones living in the area. Slovaks are thier own identity, they are not Czechs becuase they have different experiences and history, culture etc. Czechs and Slovaks were in one state before, it was apparent to both nationalities that they are distinct. Czechs tend to be atheists and dealt with Germanisation, Slovaks were more rural and lived seperated from thier Czech cousins for a millienia, this is why we have two nations instead of one.
>TL:DR State does not equal nation
Czechoslovakia was better
The idea of Hungary is dumb, as a Slovak I can communicate with Polish and Czech, Hungarians don't even speak a Indo-European language they should learn a Slavic language if they want to be prosperous in a sea of Slavs.
Although genetically we are the same, if Czechoslavakia wouldn't work, a Hungary and Slovakia union would be completely retarded. The Czechs know; don't mix multiple people in one state, we have the v4 and the EU what more is needed?
Hungarian in this context means subjects of the Hungarian king, not Hungarian as in ethnic speaker. Thats basically what Hungarian meant before 1848.
This.
Hungarian kingdom existed for 1000 years, Czechoslovakia didn't even last 80. Not to mention Czechoslovakia was created by the French only as an eastern buffer against Germany, if there ever was a complete non-country it was this.
>Hungarian kingdom existed for 1000 years
Irrelevant, from 1526–1918 it wasn't even an independent country, but for certain periods an Ottoman Pashaluk, Habsburg province, then a Habsburg "kingdom" with some autonomy
>X country was created
Hungary was created by the Papacy to serve as a buffer against the Orthodox Byzantines and the Pecenegs
See, I can do it to.
Czechoslovakia wasn't perfect, but it had way more legitimacy than Hungary ever did.
>Ottoman pashaluk
Felvidek was never conquered and remained Hungarian during the Ottoman conquests.
>freemason republic
>legitimacy
lmao
It was conquered by the Habsburgs.
>freemasonry
>bad
Wew lad!
>implying most great statesmen and national heroes of the 19th century, including the Hungarian ones, weren't Freemasons.
>we have the v4 and the EU what more is needed?
the v4 is more symbolic, the EU is cancer
A united Slovakia and Hungary makes sense, as both of these countries tiny, and doesn't really have a big political or military power. Geographically it also makes sense, both countries could support each other economically.
I was getting more at the republic part, I have yet to see a post WW1 republic with a semblance of legitimacy.
All in all Czechoslovakia was shit.
>created by traitors and literal agents of the French government
>most of its wealth was generated by flat out stealing the Austrian industrial base
>no legitimacy whatsoever, the secession of Felvidek in particular was only backed by 200 unelected literal whos in Martin
>it destroyed southern and southeastern Slovakia like the formerly rich Gemer region by severing economic ties to Budapest
>almost 80 years of extreme anti-Hungarian propaganda brainwashing the people
>bolshevik puppet state for 40 years
>it went out with a stroke of a pen, after its politicians couldn't agree on whether they should use a hyphen or not
I get this is bait, but I'll still comment
>created by traitors and literal agents of the French government
I never quite understood why some say this. Even if it is true, they allied themselves with those that could offer them help. What's the problem ? Who were they supposed to turn to? The Germans? The Hungarians?
I'm sure the last two would have helped the Czechoslovak movement wholeheartedly.
>bolshevik puppet state for 40 years
Like most of Eastern Europe? I mean they were occupied by the Soviets.
Just out of curiosity, do Hungarian nationalists think Poland post-1918 and especially and post-1945 was a mistake and that Germans were innocent victims?
Czechoslovak movement wasn't even popular with the population until after Trianon. Hungarians tried to conduct a referendum in Slovakia regarding the future of the country and the Entente completely dismissed such a notion. I don't understand why a handful of unelected intellectuals educated in Prague and Paris should represent the will of the people especially if they're literal agents of a foreign government.
>Like most of Eastern Europe?
The point is that unlike the Kingdom of Hungary, Czechoslovakia was literally a communist puppet state for more than half of its existence.
>most great statesmen and national heroes of the 19th century were freemasons
Gee, I wonder who could be behind this post..
How can Slovaks be real if Slovaki isn't real?
>people can't exist if they don't have an ethnic country
I'am the same poster you are replying to
The V4 and the EU although not the best they do put Hungary and Slovakia closer to each other on all spheres economically, military etc. Slovaks would not prosper in a Hungarian state and history shows that Hungarians can't make a good multiethic state. In both Czechoslovaka and the Kingdom of Hungary Slovakia was always the mismanaged underdeveloped part. Whilst under self rule Slovakia seems to manage itself well with the Hungarian minority in Slovakia being richer than the Hungarian in Hungary proper.
I think if Hungarians Slavicised themselves voluntarily a single state might make more sense, otherwise it would make more sense to be part of Czechia or Poland or god forbid Ukraine.
>history shows that Hungarians can't make a good multiethic state
>the world didn't exist before 1848
Few things:
>In both Czechoslovaka and the Kingdom of Hungary Slovakia was always the mismanaged underdeveloped part.
Felvidek along with Transylvania used to be the richest part of the kingdom until the early 1800s when the mining industry started collapsing. The "it was always undeveloped and agricultural" meme Slovaks often parrot is literally a myth created by Czechoslovakists trying to project 100 years on entire history of the land and implying only glorious Czechoslovakia could save their ass.
>history shows that Hungarians can't make a good multiethic state
Somehow they managed to have a perfectly fine multiethnic state between 1000 and 1800.
>otherwise it would make more sense to be part of Czechia or Poland or god forbid Ukraine
>Ukraine
Now you're just shitposting to the max. Ukraine has absolutely nothing to do with Slovakia other than speaking a remotely similar language, it's a completely alien culture.
>moldovan ethnicity
Are you retarded lad?
Look at the name of the author of the map.
>sebok laszlo
Why is Hungarian historiography so shit-tier?
>misusing the word historiography
>Many Hungarians today have Slovak ancestry and many places in Hungary have Slovak names.
And many Slovaks have Hungarian, German, Rusyn, Polish or Czech ancestry, yet it's never brought up by you retards.
From the fact that a thread about Slovakia turned into a discussion on freemasonry I can only assume that the culture of Central Europe is more confusing than I thought.
>Are you retarded lad?
Officially they are a separate entity. Its stupid but thats how they are supposed to be represented on the map.
No that's incorrect. Each city, that is, cities that were founded before and during Ottoman rule have a sizeable Muslim population. This is because Muslims had speacial statuses in the Empire, but also because of the Danak u krvi (tax in blood), in which Christian children were taken and taught the way of the Ottoman/Islam.
Countrysides are Serb/Croat, but during Tito's rule, lots of Serbs from Herzegovina moved to then and now German cleansed Vojvodina, but most stayed.
In the last war it is true that there were expulsions of Muslims from Serb held territories, but it went the other way around, too. Croats and Serbs didn't have the best relations either.
There's like three posts about freemasonry, stop memeing.
Has memeing as a word been bastardized so much from meme that it now means propagating a common piece of misinfo?
Meme means whatever you want it to mean, just like cuck.
No they aren't. They are closer to Romanians than Hungarians are to the Szekely in Transylvania.
Their national anthem is a copy of a hungarian folk song.
>Slovakia, nice meme
It's name is Upper-Hungary (Felvidék)
That folk song exists among all ethnicities in Hungary.
>officially
Can't you read nigger?
They are romanians of course, but OFFICIALLY, they declared themselves as a separate entity.
And Szekelys are Hungarians as well.
Actually we should have gone either the Turkish way assimilating the natives or the Manjurian/Bulgarian way getting assimilated by the natives. These two pathetic non-states are just suffering. We fucked up.