Is the existence of a fiery eternal hell justified? I believe so. We are all given a chance here to better ourselves...

Since you seem to be having trouble with this line of thinking, what about this one: "If a god such as the one described in the bible existed, he would be a tyrant and evil god". Better?

No, and I have never had any reason to either. Much like I will never have a reason to read the entirety of the Unabomber manifesto.

God becomes Man so that He can save your life.

You: Tyrant! Evil!

Absolutely.

It's not "infinite punishment for finite crime."

It's "your dead. This is where the dead go. You asked for this. You wanted nothing to do with God. This is the place for that."

What a waste of quads.

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.

That's you. You're one of the small. Your life is recorded in books in heaven.

Just not the Lamb's Book of Life.

I have still not been presented with any reason why I should take the Bible more seriously than the Unabomber manifesto. I mean if I had to make a choice on which book I'd base my entire life and philosophy on I'd choose the latter.

Their like robots man, don't bother. They'll keep quoting the bible as if it was an argument and will keep doing it until they eventually short circuit and self-destruct.

Just smile and be happy you aren't wasting your life like they are.

Save my life from world that he created?

God wipes practically the entire population with a flood.
God demands that a father kills his own son.
God "saves" me from something I never did nor asked to be saved from with a human sacrifice.
God sends people who don't believe in him or don't follow his orders to suffer eternally in hell.
(...)

You: Merciful! The representation of all that is good!

The old testament should be dropped like the jewfairytale collection it is.
The cathars had good intentions.

Absolutely.

It's not "punishment for crime."

It's "you are enemy of state. This is where the enemies of the state go. You asked for this. You wanted nothing to do with Communism. This is the place for that."

Cause and effect.

Crime and punishment.

You can believe whatever you want, but you are not free from the resulting consequences of your beliefs.

I'm presenting to you an infinitely negative outcome, and if the chance of that outcome to you is any higher than absolute zero, your outcome is infinitely negative.

But you're "rational", right?

The world that your forefathers ruined, and in the process ruined themselves, causing you to be stillborn, yes.

You need to be saved from being stillborn.

>Its another "dude pascals wager lmao" episode

>God wipes practically the entire population with a flood.
There was only one pure human family left by that time. Everyone else was tainted. The pure humans were saved; the monsters were destroyed.

>God demands that a father kills his own son.
And God held back that man's hand.

But God did not hold back the hands that killed His Son.

>God "saves" me from something I never did nor asked to be saved from with a human sacrifice.
You were born dead, and unless you regain the life in you lost by your ancestors, you will be sorted out with the dead. Your unbelief will condemn you.

>God sends people who don't believe in him or don't follow his orders to suffer eternally in hell.
There's nowhere else to go.

God is made of much tougher steel than Stalin.

A hell where demons strap you down into torture lines is described no where in the Bible. Hell is described as a bad place and thats it.

It's "Are you a rational being?"

So far, the answer is "no".

Option 1: Jesus, and good, and life, and heaven.

Option 2: Satan, and evil, and death, and hell.

Pick one.

Outer darkness, lake of fire, weeping, wailing, gnashing of teeth, eternal torment.

Bible says enough.

It's a place to be avoided at all costs.

He isn't. People are fragile and dying from random accidents all of the time.

I don't have the energy to argue this a tenth time so I'll just link this.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager#Criticism

I would pick one if any of this options were real.

>There's nowhere else to go.
Can't God make a new place? Couldn't God make the tainted repent of their ways instead of killing them? Couldn't God have held back the hands that killed his son?

Why does God make so many harmful decisions when he can do literally anything he wants by any method and result?

Yeah, all those things. But things like the divine comedy make it sound like god is hiring demons to man torture devices. That isnt what hell is. Hell is simply God leaving the people who dont want him.

> he doesn't know about game theory
what else would you except from modern autheism

> everyone who died was like totally a monster XD
We seriously supposed to believe in that?

Exodus 12:29
And it came to pass, that at midnight the Lord smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that was in the dungeon; and all the firstborn of cattle.

Yes, yes, you're mimicking things you've seen smart people do without any understanding of the underlying concepts in an attempt to convert said smart people to your contrived belief.

Have you ever considered the fact that there is a potentially infinite number of possible beliefs a person could have thus rendering the entire concept of pascal's wager null? Or that any one of those potential beliefs can just say "Oh yeah well our version of hell is TWICE as bad as yours!" and thus render the concept meaningless?

And God remains unscathed.

what's this chart supposed to be? what are those random numbers?

>You were born dead, and unless you regain the life in you lost by your ancestors, you will be sorted out with the dead. Your unbelief will condemn you.
Just look at this blatant pretentiousness. Don't you have any shame?

Quads confirm Bible is useless.

Best example of Pascal's Wager right here.

There is only one true God.

Your chart is moot.

Pascal's Wager is lose-lose. Hiding behind it is complete fail.

>Implying I'm the one who brought up Pascal's wager in the first place

Pascal's wager is a meme
what if God sends you to hell for trying to apply game theory to religion instead of having true faith? what if he favors rational heathens to irrational believers? It's all stupid as hell desu

Yes. Like serial killer who remains unpunished for his numerous murders.

>he doesn't know pascal didn't intend it to be a serious argument.

>god won't be able to see through calculated faith.

So which interpretation of Christianity is the correct one, Christposter? Catholicism? Orthodoxy? Protestantism?

Ay man, I ain't complaining, ex-Muslim here; and a proud one too. I'm just saying the dude's obviously fell for the meme.

> potentially infinite number of possible beliefs a person could have thus rendering the entire concept of pascal's wager null
Are you retarded? You can calculate the expected value even for infinite number of games. Concept is still here just fine, not somehow rendered null.

Mormonism

Pascal's wager is effectively a zero-sum game where the more number of "games" (ie, beliefs) there are the less powerful any single belief is

Also
>ignoring the second part of the post

There is nothing bad at calculated faith. Being good at math isn't a sin, you know?

> ignoring the second part of the post
How can their hell be twice as bad than our worst hell ever?

>Let's believe in so won't send me to instead of genuinely agreeing with it, I'm so smart
>God would totally never chalk it up as a sin

>mormons
>christian

The same way people can just say "Oh yeah well infinity PLUS ONE"
In other words get two such people together and they'll fall into a mutual feedback loop of one continuously saying their version of hell is even worse than the one described a few moments ago.

>God would totally never chalk it up as a sin
Why would he? God is merciful after all.

>merciful
>sends you to boil alive for eternity

>And God held back that man's hand.

Actually, it is widely believed that the narrative concerning Isaac being SAVED is an addition from the fourth century BC, and that the original story had Isaac being slaughtered. This is strongly implied due to the genealogical snippet (verses 20-24) right after the sacrifice verses. First of all, the description of a rash of newborns placed right after the main story suggests the existence of some direct cause-effect connection. Second, in a sacrificial economy, such a numerous progeny could not have been conceived without the preceding payment in an appropriate "currency", and it is well-established that child sacrifice was common among Levantine tribes in the time period corresponding to Abraham. Lastly, the names of these newborns are not actual Hebrew names: the names of these newborns actually make a sentence to the effect of "somebody has been blown, slaughtered, put on the tabernacle, and burned"

There are other indications (mainly from the Yawhist/Elohist storylines) of Isaac's death, and it is likely that Isaac being saved was added as a story element in a time period when child sacrifice had become taboo.

>sends you to boil alive for eternity
He doesn't. It is a lie created by Satan.

Because the idea is literally about tricking God into not sending you to Hell. Pretty sure wanting to outwit God is vanity and blasphemy.

> Tricking God into not sending you to Hell
Nice way to prove that God literally sends people to hell, dude.

If there is a hell, does God condemn to eternal punishment those atheists who have done good in their lives? What about the peaceful followers of other religions? It's such a simple question and I've searched fucking everywhere for a decent answer that doesn't end in John 14:6.

It's what the theory says, if it's not real then it renders the theory moot.

I agree with you though, a literal eternity of suffering doesn't sound like something a merciful god would come up with.

Everyone who has ever lived has done evil, and the good men do doesn't cancel out that evil.
Also there will probably be alot of people who were atheists or followers of other religions in life in heaven, and alot of people who called themselves christians in hell.

You're not choosing life, and good, and God, and heaven.

Doesn't matter how peaceful or well-doing the unbelievers and atheists were, they'll go to Hell for not accepting Jesus Christ. There's that's your answer.

There's only two states of being. Alive and with God, and Dead and Separated from God.

There is nothing else.

Yes. Leaving them alone, and in the dark, and on fire, forever.

I find the truth easy to believe.

Random verses?

The pharaoh was killing all of the children of the Hebrews as population control.

Never. I'll never be ashamed of my Lord, the Word of God, or the gospel.

> Separated
> from omnipresent God
Wow, just wow. Read the Holy Book user.

It's an interesting answer, but it seems to me like that view is only taken by the minority of Christians (I might be wrong about that).

I was reading an interview with Pope Francis who said “You ask me if the God of the Christians forgives those who don’t believe and who don’t seek the faith. I start by saying – and this is the fundamental thing – that God’s mercy has no limits if you go to him with a sincere and contrite heart. The issue for those who do not believe in God is to obey their conscience."

What gets me is that last bit, if unbelievers are destined for hell anyway, why would the Pope tell them to listen to their conscience? Surely it wouldn't matter?

Oh, is he?

Is he really?

Or is he alone, in the dark, and on fire, forever?

The one where Jesus is God, crucified to pay the sin debt of humanity, and rising from the dead on the third day.

Again, God is omnipotent. He can make more states of being. Why doesn't he? Does he enjoy death? Is it that he doesn't know better?

Hell is worse than hell, and continuously so.

Another Bart Ehrman victim.

Don't you get tired of believing liberal scholars who always lie to you?

>giving random weights
>implying that it only exists a couple dozens of religions
>implying that every religion is right in their concept of what their god finds proper or not
If you did this with all the religions, the numbers would get so huge that even a X000 difference would seem irrelevant.

He does. It's a lake of fire created for satan.

>It's an interesting answer, but it seems to me like that view is only taken by the minority of Christians (I might be wrong about that).
Speaking as a Christian it is. But that doesn't make it any less valid. Lots of people use Christianity (well, religion in generally really) to say that people they don't like God doesn't like and people they like God also likes.

>Why doesn't he?
He does. He created infinity states of being. There is world where you are immortal with your dreams coming true. There also is world of horrible death, murder and torture. God give everything the right, right to exist in reality in his infinity love.

Dead people doing good deeds are dead people.

Dead people go where dead people go.

All of their "righteousness" is as filthy rags to a holy God.

For example, let's say that I murder your mother, rape her corpse, steal $100 from her purse, and give $5 of that to a homeless man.

Did I do a good act in giving the homeless man $5?

God is where God wants to be; He is not a slave to any of His attributes.

That He can be everywhere does not mean that He must be everywhere, and He is not in hell.

He is in heaven because he believes in Jesus and that is the only requirement.

Omnipotence doesn't mean 'can do anything' it means all powerful.
There are certain things that do not posses the trait of being doable. Such as making a circle with four straight lines, or touching the number four, so on and so on. Making something other than life and death is one of them.

Yes, the pope is leading people to hell by focusing only on God's mercy and completely obliterating God's holiness, justice and righteousness.

The pope is leading people to hell because he wants people to go to hell.

> God is where God wants to be
And he wants to be with all his creation because God is love. Read the book. God is nice guy, not crazy torturer who would abandon people to burn in hell for an eternity after creating them.

You keep trying to change reality.

Why don't you just accept reality the way you found it?

Are you stupid?

So now he's not an uncaught serial killer, he's an honest to God, Holy Spirit filled born again Christian who's running around murdering people.

Care to name such a person?

Are you okay with God killing all the first-born in the land of Egypt?

>why would the Pope tell them to listen to their conscience? Surely it wouldn't matter?

Christians think that it would inevitably lead to Christianity because it's the true religion, and God's gunna step in and help make it work or something.

I have a profound knowledge of the Word of God.

I suggest you start reading it if you think God will not do what God said He would do.

Revelation 19:20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 20:10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Revelation 20:14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

>asks the guy listening to Bart Erhman.

>taking the book of Revelations literally

These passages was inspired by Satan. God is good and would save people any chance given.