History Stuff that Normies Ruined

Mainstream history ruined the Mongols for me.
>DA SEKRIT WEPIN OF THE MONGOLS IS THE COMPOSITE RECURVE BOW.
...known from Korea to the Roman Empire.
>DEY HAVE NOVEL TACTICS LIKE HIT AND RUN, NEVER MEETING THE ENEMY HEAD ON UNTIL THEY WEARY.
Standard Steppe Warfare Operating Procedure.
>DA MONGULS ADPT TO THE WAYS OF THEIR ENEMIES, SOMETHING LE NOMADS DID NOT KNO BEFO.
Yeah, all those Turkics busy doing bureaucracy in their Islamic Empires. Nomads sure did not adapt to their locales before the Mongols.

WWII and Cold War.
These are the most recent conflicts that affect and define us the most, but i am so disgusted by them being so much integrated into the pop culture. I could express my hatred towards that integration on many paragraphs, but i'm gonna assume you all understand me.

explaine

So first is the obvious demonification of the "bad guys". Mindless hatred of Hitler, Stalin, nazism, communism, totalitarism, racism etc. Its considered normal to hate those and abnormal to even consider them worth examining. I'm not saying they are good, i'm just saying we should be objective and everybody truly wanting to understand should try and force himself to like nazism/hitler etc. because everybody is taught from youth to dislike them.
Second, there are all these fucking manchildren going coocoo over the warfare itself. Just think of all the /pol/tards cumming buckets over Tiger tanks. If someone would actually be interested in warfare, they would have hundreds of more modern conflicts to pick from, the obsession with WWII specifically for no other reason than being a plebian retard makes me rage so hard.
Third there is the "muh shoa" issue, which we are all very much aware of.
Fourth is the issue of popularization itself. Now every fucking retard walking this earth talks like he knows everything there is to know about both of those wars, every other "historician" says his main interest is one of them, every other movie/videogame is based on it. This is maybe just me, but i am so fed up of that. It feels like WWII is the only thing that happened during history and everybody just forgot about the rest.
Fifth is the picrelated and all that it carries with it (i.e. the thread about it yesterday or when it was)
Sixth is the contrast of general awareness about WWII and Cold War and the lack of actual knowledge about it, making it more of a fantasy in minds of most.

I could come up with more, but i have to leave, so this is it generally.

> hundreds of more modern conflicts t
Which couldn't compare in scale and logistics.

agreed senpai

I agree 100%

...

God damn I love this meme.

> Japanese history

Seriously, Japan has a fairly interesting history. Thanks to weebs you can't read a book on the Sengoku period without looking like a jackass.

> The CSA, US Civil War history

Less so in my country, but a lot of people still have kneejerky reactions.

> WW1

I live in Australia, literally everything is WW1 history. Entire shelves of books about Gallipoli or Passchendaele.

Of course, I just read a fuckton about these subjects in private because they're interesting as hell. But when people ask me about what periods I'm interested in I'm gonna be saying the French Revolution or Rome or High Middle Ages.

And the way most aussies view ww1 shits me

"The young men were sent to gallipoli straight away"
No, they werent.
"Whats Beersheeba? Whats Hamel? Whats Pozieres?"

Sparta

>Communism

Spartans ever since 300.
Romans since forever.
European Empires because muh oppression.

I do still enjoy European history though, memes will never ruin it.

Why would you shy away from saying you find WW1 interesting?

It's WW2 you have to never bring up.

Everytime WWII comes up in conversation I brace myself for the inevitable retard to jump in with his 'le Soviets only won through human wave tactics' shit.

Also no one seems to know anything about the French Revolution besides le ebin guillotine maymay

>take welding and blacksmithing classes
>at least half to three quarters of the people in the introductory classes are a bunch of losers who want to make swords
>half of them don't finish the first semester, most of the other half don't come back for the second

STOP WASTING OUR TIME!
I NEED THE TEACHER TO SHOW ME HOW TO DO USEFUL THINGS NOT EXPLAIN FOR THE FIFTH TIME WHY YOU CAN'T MAKE WEAPONS AT SCHOOL!

>capitalism
>communism
Adam Smith and Marx traveled back in time to ruin the Roman Empire

>WW1

Le ebin "Haig the Butcher" memes and "The war was a big family feud that served no purpose."

>lead pipes
My chemistry teacher used to say this all the time
I cringed

What things do modern blacksmith make other than knives and other gimmicks?

>triarii!
Kek

the moors have been forever ruined because normies confused them with mali and wewuzifed them

now every time i think of a moor i think of some black guy wearing a turban

>us civil war /kneejerk reaction
Explain plz

John Green has doomed the future of academia.

I can't believe they actually play that pseudo intellectual in schools. Hes the Bill Nye of history.

>public bathes

Honestly it's mainly repair work (crosses over with welding), and making tools and art/commission work. "All the butchers knives and gate hinges you sell at county fairs pay for doing the fun stuff" as one teacher put it. Though one of my classmates went on to start selling artisan bondage gear for obscene amounts. Upper triple digits for wrought iron bar stock with scroll work and some stamped flowers/leaves she buys in bulk soldiered on.

It's similar to old-school carpentry and millwright knowledge. It takes a lot of effort, time and practice to get good, and most of these guys think they're just gonna be churning out masterwork katanas after a four month course.

I get ya, I just wasn't sure what modern blacksmiths would be needed for besides high quality knives and tools. Thanks for the info!

Isn't weaponsmithing a totally different skill with different tools anyway? For swords at least

agreed, its interesting how one man can end up the ruler of a nation in just one lifetime and cause so much.

>no one seems to know anything about the French Revolution besides le ebin guillotine maymay
That's because it's confusing as fuck desu
It was an incredibly violent clusterfuck that lasted years with many, many people dying (with lots of prominent people guillotined). To me it makes sense that that's what people take away from it.

Christians were degenerate and decadent compared to the traditional Greco-Roman pagans.

also the christians of the time were much more egalitarian and feminist compared to the highly patriarchal pagans

>confusing as fuck
oh fuck yes it is.
i could never follow the simple version in school. when i went back to researching it more later i started to pick up the main point but quickly lost interest in all the small details that are always my favorite parts of a subject.
love the time period, but now i just kind of skip over the french revolution as a topic when i revisit it,

Literally called their leaders patriarch, kill yourself you autistic LARPagan

So?

I don't know why Christians try to pretend their religion wasn't the 1st century equivalent of socialism.

It worked the same way as later socialism did, too. Infecting the upper classes and using them to rot and destroy the state from the inside.

>will never ruin it

I think you meant to say the memes make it even better, except for > > > that can die in a dumpster fire and never come back honestly.

What's it like having the IQ of a gibbon?

What's it like being in denial?

How is he wrong though?

Just came a day later and realized i forgot picrelated

French communists actively aided the German/Vichy governments in occupied France against resistance fighters until Germany invaded Russia.

>Hothouse Culture

That was a cause?

I have no idea why you felt the need to post that. It sounds logical.

What's it like to have such a crippling fear of ideology? I mean really, anyone mentioning sharing and instantly your brain blows a gasket about "SOCIALISM". Do you think you will ever grow up?

Japanese History

Eurasian nomads in general

greco-roman history, especially Greek exploration/colonies and pre-caesar rome

west africa, particularly trade kingdoms and the spread of Islam

Luckily, most of the other things I like are fairly un-memed, like the spread of Christianity eastward

>Its considered normal to hate those and abnormal to even consider them worth examining. I'm not saying they are good, i'm just saying we should be objective and everybody truly wanting to understand should try and force himself to like nazism/hitler etc. because everybody is taught from youth to dislike them.
This. The Nazis themselves have always fascinated me, but if I were to ever say that people would assume I was a sympathizer or something, when the truth is very much the opposite.

As an extension, I've always wondered how much we're told and is written about the Nazis is true and how much is exaggerated or flat out made up. But if I say this people immediately think I'm a holocaust denier.

Le it was hell 24/7 and you stayed in the trench forever and never left except to walk towards a machine gun through trenches and barbed wire, be a soldier, get shot. Le lions led by donkeys. Le gas all the time. Le only trench warfare. Le mooing cow looking at videos taken.

>how much we're told and is written about the Nazis is true and how much is exaggerated or flat out made up
I don't really think the numbers or any quantifiable information is made up. This actually make me rage even more. Because the whole propaganda about hating nazis/commies is purely based on emotions. Its pretty much information bending rather than flat out lying.

Like, when you ask people why the hate nazis, they say its because they killed innocent people. But literally every fucking ideology in history of mankind has killed innocent people, from ancient greeks to modern-day USA. First world pigs see peace as the normal state of affairs and thats why they see the last war as embodiement of all evil, whereas there were thousands of years of (relatively) same or worse wars where much more people died (again, relatively).
They don't understand why those wars happen. They don't understand the cause-consequence relationship, they don't understand WWII was escalation of protest of transformation from traditional to consumption society or any other reason leading up to WWII and rise of German nationalism. They don't understand that the reason why Germans even became nazis in the first place.
Only thing they see and only thing they are taught is how nazis were evil and killed jews and we shouldn't be nazis. They are taught how to face the consequences (apparently with mindless taught hatred) but they are not taught how to prevent the cause.

Fascism

>I don't really think the numbers or any quantifiable information is made up
Not made up, just unreliable. At this point anyone who cares probably knows that the myth about Nazis being autistic record keepers and extremely organized is just wrong, but I think it was fabricated in order to delegitimize questioning the "official" death count of the Holocaust. I'm not saying it didn't happen, I just doubt it's the 12 million mark. There are so many unknowns I'm wary to say a number at all, but if I say this without extensive explanation, again, I sound like a denier (also I hate when people call their opponents "deniers" in order to delegitimize them. even when people in question do seem to be acting out of denial, I prefer using actual arguments rather than appealing to a buzzword).

>Like, when you ask people why the hate nazis, they say its because they killed innocent people. But literally every fucking ideology in history of mankind has killed innocent people
On this we also agree. And if this is people's only reason for hating the Nazis, they should hate the USSR or PRC even more.

>Jewish influence
/pol/ is never wrong

I think the really interesting thing, especially looking at modern day political climate. Is that nazis are evil from top to bottom, and everything relating to them is evil, rather than what specifically went wrong.

ie There's this modern backlash against nationalism and nazis are cited as the justification, when strong nationalism ideas is also what helped the west resist nazi conquest.

I always love reading texts from pre WW1 and how vastly different the perspective on everything is. It feels untainted by good/evil nonsense

>I always love reading texts from pre WW1 and how vastly different the perspective on everything is. It feels untainted by good/evil nonsense
Wow, it just hit how awesome must studies from interwar era be. Hundred of books from academic elite that believed in communism/nazism/racism/whatever, untainted by all the Cold War propaganda.
Anybody got some recommendations?

>academic elite that believed in communism
you can find that today, there's been a large effort to paint it as though socialism/communism is "a dirty word" because of cold war propaganda.

[spoiler]that's technically true but I actually hate communism so I shed no tears over it, far as I'm concerned it'd do the world good if people just stayed the hell away from it, but suppressing that information/supporting propaganda I think is also immoral so I won't advocate an irrational delegitimization [spoiler]particularly when there are rational ones available [/spoiler][/spoiler]

slavery has largely been replaced with wage labour

Are there any books that look at numerous dictators and compare their motives/ascents?

I don't understand this. Just read about what you find interesting it doesn't matter what others think about it.

How has steppe nomads and the like been memed?

I really like the pre-christian Norse. Sadly, all people know about the subject is bloodthirsty vikings.

>egoism

Ancient Japan, or heck, Japanese history in general. Unfortunately I can't look at it without feeling like a weeb.

It's the quiet acceptance of being on a losing side

Living vets either
>steamrolled over everything in their way in Germany/Japan/Kuwait/Lebanon/Basically all of Latin America
>are butthurt about Vietnam/Iraq/Afghanistan

Are you the guy who posts all those /yawn/ threads on r9k?

They would load up a hundred people on a raft, and then sink the raft. That's way cooler than a guillotine

Chinese history because idiots will always keep Communist China in mind.

People think of the Nazis as being especially evil because of the Holocaust. The thing about using modern industrial techniques to murder millions of people just because of their race. That is pretty unique.

Good answers

This guy gets it

You won't be able to talk about the great war without some reatrd bringing this up now

FUCKING EGPYT, ANYTIME YOU LOOK THAT SHIT UP OR WANT TO WATCH A VIDEO ABOUT IT ALL YOU GET IS
>DUDE PHAROS
>DUDE PYRAMIDS AND SPHINX
>DUDE MUMMIES
AND MAYBE, JUST MAYBE
>DUDE THE NUBIANS

LOOKING UP ROME SHIT IS A BITCH TOO SINCE ALL THEY DISCUSS IS THE DECLINE/FALL SHIT

>Centralization and Decentralization

Is he carrying a fucking sterling by his hip?

Fucking DICE, they could have easily added black soldiers and kept it historically accurate.

>most germans don't know shit about their history, and even the ones that do hate americans and assume your some prussia-pro muh heritage sperg
>stormfags and wehraboos know fuck-all about germany apart from a decidedly warped view of a single 12-year period and dubious territorial claims of muh groBengermanium
>whenever a semi-productive discussion actually manages to get off the ground, grzegorz brzęczyszczykiewicz gets triggered and starts spamming the thread

fucking this

I've debated stormfags on German history and they had no idea who Frederick II and Bismarck were. I bet most don't even realize that the >H>R>E was Germany before Germany, or that Germans have spent most of their history fighting each other. Yet these are the same people saying "muh superior germany was killed by teh joos!".

>groBengermanium
>groB
>B
jesus christ if you are going to be lazy just use a double s you shitter

>the joke
>your head

They were even in the beta. Still have no idea why they were removed

I think it was one of John Green's videos about WW1, he was explaining how the war started, he said something along the lines of 'and finally, Germany invaded France...for some reason'. Nearly killed me, and to think the next generation is being educated by this fuck and his attempts at memery rather than actual history.

The reason they are considered so evil is not because they started a big war (lots of people in recent history started big wars and are admired, or at the very least not thought of as that bad for it), but because they killed using industrial methods on a scale not seen before, just because of the race of a group of people, not for rational reasons.

You talking shit about tigers son?

The same is happening here. For the most part of the 20th century, my university here in South Africa received a few German professors and statesmen.

Now, it is impossible to investigate the diplomatic ties and academic contributions between the two countries without the departments having a fit, calling for an immediate cultural transformation and dismissal of any evidence beyond that which fits their narrative of evil nazis = afrikaner nationalism.

Most people don't know the connection, but those that know go on as if it's a conspiracy at the roots of the nationalist movements that needs to be shouted from the rooftops in the form of fast-food history.

To be honest,whenever im reading a history book in public some dumb retard always make fun if me, or wannts to tell me that i shouldnt waste my time in stuff that "doesnt effect me anyway". God, i fucking hatte these people.
Also, i live in Germany, so reading books about Nazis and WW2( read: boom has a Swastika in the cover)always gets me dumb comments.

>akshaully, (smirk, snort) did you know that (heheh) the Holy Roman Empire was neither holy, nor roman (snoink sniffle squeeul uwu) or AN EMPIRE?

Fucking this right here. If you have some general interest in Japanese culture (and are not Japanese), you'll get branded as a filthy weeb despite hating or not watching Chinese cartoons. If weebs find out you have interest in Japanese culture, they'll only annoy the shit out of you with their broken phrases and anime-oriented understanding of how Japs function in society.

>much candle stick holders

That is a Bergmann MP18 submachine gun, which was used in WW1.

>Dad had a history book about the third reich on a living room bookshelf when I was growing up
>It had a swastika on the spine
>My friends would have suspicions we were nazis when they would come over to hang out

I've found that if you start rambling about the Tokugawa shogunate or the Invasion of Manchuria, even Weebs get confused and lost.

Weebs can be kind of interesting on their own though

Like when some kid who grows up in a trailer park with redneck parents but somehow ends up being obsessed with anime and japanese culture, thats interesting to me. Same with black weebs in the ghetto, getting their ass kicked when the bullies finding a copy of Shonen that they were hiding in their jacket.

A lot of mainstream black celebrities are known to like anime too, like Yeezus, or Lupe Fiasco.
Shit, its not even confined to famous black people.
/a/ has threads about it occasionally.