VW MK4 GTI VR6 vs. VW MK4 GTI 1.8T : Discuss

I'm in the market for a new car. Currently driving a 11 Subaru Impreza OBS 5 Speed, and I've been wanting to move more into performance for cars. Ive grown a liking towards the MK4 GTIs, because they are respectively good cars, and quite cheap.

My budget is $6,000, and I have found quite a bit of well built GTIs (more so the 1.8's) for a great price..that would leave me with at least $1,000 to spend on more upgrades or repairs for the car.

As most know, the 1.8's are 4-cylinder 5 speeds with a turbo, and the VR 6 is 6 cylinder, usually 6 speed, but does not come with a turbo, and is pretty expensive to add a turbo.

I have driven a VR6, and must say it was a beastly car. It pulled hard, and had the meanest sound to it. It had a all around good feel to it.

I have yet to drive a 1.8T, but I like that in comes with a turbo.

Whatever car I end up getting, it will be my daily driver, and I won't really be able to afford maintaining it to its full potential (atleast time wise).

SO TL;DR: What do you think is better? What engine is better for flat city driving? What engine is better for hills? What will have the most potential if I end up dumping a fair amount of money into it?

Any advice or opinion helps. Thanks

...

LOL he bought a VW because he couldn't afford an Audi

Unless you like throwing away money to keep a 10-15 year old shitbox from breaking down (which will happen very often) or you like seeing your gauge cluster lit up like a Christmas tree at all times, don't bother with either.

Audi's aren't my taste. Would take a VW over an Audi any day

If it's manageable, wouldn't even mind. I love the MK4s. I understand there a ticking time bomb but I would do everything I could to make it last.

vr6 is nose heavier and not as nimble as the 1.8T.
the turbo is surprisingly reliable too.

you're better off with the 1.8

why get a gti if you can get a sexy variant with the same engine, and double the swag points

All I've heard in other forums. Why get a GTI though? Fits my liking, I love hatchbacks. Pretty damn cheap. Cheap cheap cheap.

What attracts you to VWs? I never got the appeal. When I was shopping around for my latest track/autox/mountain road toy VWs never even entered my mind.

>buying someone else's project for a DD
I sure hope you guys don't do this.

MKIVs are objectively the worst GTIs built. Get a BMW E46 330i/E36 M3 if you're going to deal with stupid repairs and """"maintenance"""" at least then you'll have a car that delivers a good driving experience to match.

1.8T if you must go gas, but a mk4 TDI with 2k in bolt-ons will go very far both in terms of reliability and power, plus nobody expects a TDI to be fast

My heart just has a liking to VW's. I'm not all for performance. I like to have a good balance between performance and satisfaction.

I'm not trying to buy a full project. Obviously wanting to start with something a good amount of useful mods. I don't have time to start my own project, nor the money. As of now in my situation. I want something ready to go, that will get me scooting through traffic to and from work, and be a blast to drive on the weekends. When I get more time off from my job, and a little more income, that's when it will become a project. I'm not some 17 year old kid getting mommy and daddy to spend their money on a suped up car, I'm a working adult saving up for a car that I have interest in.

I respect a good E46, but not interested

Thank you for your positive and informing response. I defiantly favor the 1.8T more modification wise

MkIV gtis are the second worst gtis.

Stupid cunt.

Thanks for your opinion!

At least get a mark V you shitstain.

Then do yourself a favor and save another $2000-3000 for a MKV GTI/GLI, best kept and newest example you can find in manual.

The MKIV platform drives like fucking shit. The suspension geometry is fucked from the factory, it's heavy, and the chassis is floppy. They're horrible little cars and there's a reason you only see them as stance buckets. And like I said before, the extra time/money you'll spend in repairs isn't worth the driving experience over a comparable Japanese car. At least with a E36/46 BMW or a B5 S4 you'll get a better driving experience thatll make owning it worth it.

Having had two audi cars in the past years I'd highly recommend a different manufacturer. I had a c6 s6 avant and a c6 avant 2.8 both were the most problematic vehicles I've ever had. If your just in it for the dub slammed bagger scene then that is different I suppose as your option are limited for that look (especially in the states) but if your going euro you might want to look into the annoyances of parts prices for a measly little 1.8t or tdi or 2.0 (whatever) that your going to be living with. The suspension will be bust quickly with it slammed, the ride is horrendous in fact I'd recommend riding in someone's at a show. If your going bagged it'll be a bit better but costly and will require a bit more maintanance versus a static ride which will destroy suspension faster and give you constant problems (clearances, potholes, driveways, speedbumps!, exhaust etc..) Also as far as performance goes a gti will fall short, my old roommate had a 08 gti that was tuned for his custom meth, turbo, dp, etc etc built engine and it gave him issues very frequently. Not to mention when he lowered the car on stasis coils a popping constantly occurred in the passenger front strut during full lock. My s6 was a whole different story with failing alternator, radiator, oil issues, and most importantly electronic failures. My a6 was the same, who knows maybe I got unlucky with the a6 but the s was brilliantly maintained with extensive paperwork.

Once we both got out of our dub phase and drove some friends benzs and bmws we made the switch, I bought a poorly maintained cheap e39 m5 (needed suspension and tires brakes etc) and he bought a facelifted 335i in a similar form. He had issues with oil (common) and I had absolutely zero issues besides needing rear tires faster than normal and gas. I still have my m and I went from 62k to 238k without a single issue at all, like not one. Nothing has ever broken on it, same goes for me e36 m3.

Lol that's cause old VWs are pure shit. I have a current gen Audi with a bigger turbo, meth, drop, etc and it gives me 0 problems and is a smooth, quiet, quick, comfy as fuck commuter car. I take it to the track all the time, launch the fuck out of it, get it to over 160 mph on the highway, blast through snowstorms with my quattro and take on ramps going three times the speed limit and the thing never so much as squeaks. You get what you pay for.

Oh and you don't get cheap garbage 'stance' suspension parts and eBay performance turbos. Buy real shit and your car won't be an unreliable trash heap.

Anyway I'm sure I'll get flamed immediately about how I just got lucky but that's not the truth. Yes I am a maser/rolls/bentley tech factory trained and could fix anything on both these cars that wasn't basic maintenance/sensors easily....but the main thing I did before pulling the trigger? Independent inspection by a highly respected bmw m race studio in my city. This is a must, you can't really predict sensor failure but a boroscope, comp. check and a few other tricks can save you from massive headaches. Honestly if you really want that dub look don't get a 1.8 or a 2.0, get a rabbit and be happy with it. If you want performance don't get a vw unless your ready for an r32. Stay away from k03s and k04s they're not cheap like everyone says, all the ones on ebay for 600 are chinese etc etc..6k for performance isn't enough in my book unless you go Japanese. You could get an e30 for 3k and build it up yourself pretty easily but I'm not sure how mechanically inclined or prepared you are (workspace tools troubleshooting etc). Hope this helps some way, all my friends want bmws or mercs because they see how "cheap" they are on cl but don't be fooled...one maf for my car is around 412$ and I've got two... (I know poor example of 80k car vs. a 25k car originally) you get the point though...Germans love money!

Also I don't mean to kill the dream at all, just saying to do serious research both on the net, at the dealer/indy and when you pull the trigger dont, drop 150$ on an inspection if you is in luuuvv.

Happy hunting!

I work right next to the audi service area, every single tech that works there says the complete opposite. In fact they love vw's new horrific 4.0 bi turbo with di that has constant problems, makes us a lot of money (it's in Bentleys too). From oil circulation issues to incorrectly facing coolant check valves, supercharged engines etc etc.. I've honestly never heard guys talk more trash on a brand and I thought bmw and mercs di/oil issues were bad. And all that sucks cus I almost leased a new s3..but then I drove it...honestly all cars feel like shit to my spoiled ass besides 991's/m4/3's and obviously exotics...everything else is just built for a tubby doctor who wants to go fast.. then again nothing feels like classic porsches or just any top tier car from the similar time frame. New cars are boring :(

Day one stuff man. Don't even bother saying it..

Well yeah, they spend all day working on them. Of course they're going to hate them. They never see the ones that don't break. And all brands have those esoteric performance engines that cost an arm and a leg to maintain, mostly anything over 8 cylinders or with more than one turbo. VAG 4 banger parts are stupid cheap though and so easy to work on any bozo could do just about anything with a set of triple squares and a free Saturday afternoon.

S3s are crap, I'll agree with that. I'm not surprised you had trouble with your old S6 but the A6 does surprise me a bit. But yeah, I dated a chick off pof with an M4 and that was a sexy car. I destroyed her in it though, partly due to it being a stick and she had a bum leg from a motorcycle accident, lol. They're pretty much identical performance-wise anyway. But I would like to own one someday, when they're cheap enough to not give a fuck about modding the hell out of.

Cool bro!!!! That's awesome to hear. But I think you don't understand that owning a current gen Audi and dropping so much money into it is wayyyy out of my budget. Going above 160 really does give me a hard on either. When the fuck am I going to need to go 160 on my daily commute to work? Did you just miss that part? I can give a shit less about squeaks. I don't need to have a luxurious feel for my car. And buying parts off eBay? I never said I was thinking of getting a Honda Shitvic. I'm may not have that much money, but I wouldn't be that cheap when it comes to parts.

I agree you get what you pay for. I also believe put your mouth where your money is. This isn't going to be some car I roll up with next to a BMW or Mercedes or even a fucking track trying to race. It is to be a quick, hard pulling mean machine. Stance is way out of question, I think it looks stupid as fuck. If the suspension and handling is so bad, then whatever money I'm left with will go towards things to improve handling. Anyways thanks for your raging comment. Honestly made me look at you and the car you drive in such a shitty way. Some ego you got

I was mostly replying to the other guy. Sorry if you got the wrong impression, wasn't talking shit about you at all. Still though you seem to agree with the main point of what I was saying in that you get what you pay for. Whether you're driving a $6k car or a $60k car, do things right and buy quality parts for it and it'll treat you right. My 2.0t is very similar to the 2.0ts in the VWs so at least as far as the engine is concerned there's not much I can do to my car that you won't be able to do with yours. Anyway, good luck buddy, sorry if I rattled your jammies. Was not my intention.

Luckily, I'm not with the whole stance trend, and believe it's stupid as fuck. Having a Subaru not even being turbo'd, I lifted it and did some handling mods to it. I live in the mountains during the winter/spring. I'll tell you, for a stock engine 4 cyl, she was/is a fucking blast in the snow and mud. Summer is coming quickly, and I'm pretty much being forced to move to the beach/city for job reasonings. I have to sell my subie just to be able to move. I'm going to be left with $6k and nothing more for a vehicle. So trust me, if I wanted something that scoots and is a good daily driver, perhaps a WRX (let's hope I don't get bashed on that either because I love some rally cars) then I would. Its just under my circumstances that I want something cheap, with power and torque. I drove a MK 4 VR6! Shit was amazing! And it fitted the kind of feeling I'm in search for. I'm rambling now but the point is, in the area I will be living at, GTI's are in my price range. I'm pretty much set on hunting for a well maintained GTI. It'd make me happy to own one and that's all that counts. Thank you for your input. Very respectable points

Jimmies were defiantly rattled at first lol. All good, sorry I had to bust back like that. Glad you know I'm not trying to be some ricer. What you even call a German made car that was riced out?

>quick, hard pulling mean machine
>MKIV

don't kid yourself

honest to god do yourself a favor at get a mkv gti and if you feel that's too much effort a 06-11 civic si

$7000 should get you a decent example of both.

>if the suspension and handling is so bad

you'll spend more than its worth spending for a car that had crap steering feel and understeer for days when it was new. the suspension geometry is fucked enough you can't get them to turn anywhere near well without aftermarket spindles, its comically bad. it was literally the worst of its contemporaries when it was new (mini cooper s, svt focus, civic si/rsx, srt4, wrx).

there's very little they shared with their mkiv platform mates (tt 225/r32/s3/cupra r) that actually were set up to corner well out the box in terms of suspension bits

get a bmw if you want a car that'll cooperate with you when you chuck it into a turn. fuck, get a used wrx if you find one that's not rusty and beat to shit with a ton of miles.

mkivs are fucking GARBAGE i should know i had one and fixed a bunch of others. coilpacks, bad turbos, window regulators, dogbone mounts, sunroof leaks, bad gearboxes, chains on vr6s and timing belts on 1.8ts (that broke at EXACTLY 60k). they didn't even drive well to justify all the shit that broke on them.

I dunno, strudel maybe? It's cool, I didn't mean to call all old VWs shit, I really meant what I generally see from kids who buy them, plastidip the wheels and cut the springs is shit, like the one he was mentioning his buddy drove. I only related it to my car because a lot of the parts are so similar and I was using mine as an example of how they can be when you do things right. No need to stance your car out so bad that you can't even turn the wheels or go over speed bumps. Get a quality set of springs/shocks with a modest DD drop and you can look good, perform good, and not break into a cold sweat everytime you have to pull into a driveway, taking out your protractor to get the angle just right so you don't rip off your oil pan. Kids these days..

I kid you not, buddy has a MKIV GTI VR6. He bought it for $1k!! Timing belt was going bad. But once he got it fixed up, he said it was like driving a whole new car. And I believed him after riding in it before and after the car was fixed up. When I drove it (and obviously I'm gonna need to drive it again and pay more attention to be handling), it felt fine to me. Great throttle response, and the torque was just unbelievable (atleast compared to my stock engine Impreza). Beyond that rush, holy shit did she sound mean. Sounded like a monster, wasn't raspy at all. I mean it's got to be best beefy sounding car to me. Besides all the headliner issues and it looking like garbage, it seemed to me like a well functioning car. Anyways, I'm staying away from Civics, I despise them. A WRX is a car I'd like to ultimately end up owning, as of now in the area I'm searching for, they're out of my budget, and if they are in my budget, they're fucked up. I won't have time to be fixing it. But anyways thanks for your comment.

>strudel
Good one lol. Yah no. Plasti dipped wheels
>ohlawd adds 50 hp

I knew kids when I went to high school who'd cut their exhaust off. What the fuck. But anyways there's a fine line between being low, and being slammed. The whole slam thing is in the whole JDM department it seems. I think it looks disgusting, especially when I see a WRX slammed..oh my god I want to rip the driver out of the vehicle and throw him off a bridge. It's a fucking rally car!!! With some street to it, but anyways that's my 2 cents on slammed. Lowered on the other hand, with a nice suspension, is sexy as fuck. When it comes to modding cars. How my car looks comes way after I do work with the engine and handling, all the internal stuff. Then I would proceed to a decent set of tires and go a little bit lower than stock. That's just how things would roll in my book though, if I could get into starting a project car.

>balance between performance and satisfaction.
Satisfaction? How's that? Do you like the shape of the badge or something?