I have a question about Martin and in particular the pharmaceutical and drug insurance companies

Same user, switched to my computer.

>Turing recently announced discounts of Daraprim for hospitals, and Shkreli says that for people without insurance it will cost only $1 a pill. For everyone else, insurance, which he argues is paid for by corporate America’s profits, will cover the cost. “I’m like Robin Hood,” he continues. “I’m taking Walmart’s money and doing research for diseases no one cares about.”
vanityfair.com/news/2015/12/martin-shkreli-pharmaceuticals-ceo-interview

I don't know if this applies to patients with insurance that won't cover it, but that seems likely.

>of course the media just posted clickbait headlines all over the place.
To be honest, I think some of them were doing it so public outcry would force him to stop gouging their friends in the insurance industry.
I'm certain that's why Hillary criticized him, although I think Bernie was just ignorant.

The only thing I can find is what he said.

Either way, I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and let's say it is $1 a pill for the uninsured.

He's really doing nothing noble there since that was the original price in 2010 and that could have been because a competing drug company competed Martin with a $1 drug. It's also extremely cheap to produce. It's good he did it, but his act isn't Robinhood, lol, all he did is make it the 2010 price for the uninsured. but I'd like to see more than a quote.

This isn't Martin's fault, but let's just say I hope nobody with Martin's mentality pulls this bullshit on a costlier drug that is $10k or even $100k. Can't imagine the uninsured paying that.

Stop with the "what if..." scenarios, please. There's a shit-ton of insurance companies out there that support high cost drugs like these. Deraprim isn't the only drug that's like this either; throw a ball into the pharmaceutical drug field and you're bound to hit a drug that has high costs.

>it's also extremely cheap to produce

The 2nd pill costs $0.02 to make, the first one costs 100 million. Companies must not only recoup their expenses, but need to make a profit, otherwise the drugs won't be produced at all.

>He's really doing nothing noble
Not by discounting the pill he hiked up, no. He is using insurance company money to both provide profit for his shareholders and research drugs that aren't necessarily profitable, though.

In fairness, the drug is 60 years old.

I understand that was a "what if", and I understand that Martin can't be blamed for it so it's not his fault.

I'm saying that's his mentality, and it's a scumbag mentality to have. Had the drug been different, which it wasn't, so this isn't Martin's fault, I'm just saying, had it been different which it easily could have been, martin's action would fuck over many.

Either way there is literally no proof to his claim and there has to be more to the story. It could be an application process and takes months to actually receive the drug. We don't know, it was all quite vague, he didn't even mention if it applies to the patients whos drugs weren't on the insurance companies' list.

>it's a scumbag mentality to have
psychopaths do well in business, but you have to execute one every now and then to keep the others in line.

I remember when I was 16. You will grow out of that as you mature, buddy. Don't worry.

Shkreli's whole life is very sketchy and vague. His life explains that he started a hedge fund at 26 with a friend. Next thing you know they have 32 million shares of a company and sell all the shares when the price falls from $9 to $2.50 after the drug fails.

Next thing you know his company, 26 year old him and a friend, bids $378,000,000 on a company.

Next thing you know he founds biotech company and buys fucking drug licenses (Thiola).

It's all so sketchy, it's like this 26 year old faggot is grabbing millions from nowhere, obviously probably a loan, and getting rich. However this kid got a loan to buy a drug license is beyond me.

so much shit about his life we dont know about

>ll so sketchy, it's like this 26 year old faggot is grabbing millions from nowhere,
>from nowhere

OPM, man.

Do you even know what hedge funds are?

Martin is master race Illyrian

You are seriously going to sit here and tell me that this 26 year old kid starts a hedge fund, somehow manages to get 32million shares of a company for his "hedge fund", manages to lose over $224,000,000 in one fucking day , and THEN is able to start up another company and somehow still be able to acquire the funds for a new company and buy a fucking drug license again? no way investors would trust him for his little "hedge fund", the only way is other work in his portfolio, which I highly doubt was anything after fucking obliterating through 32 million fucking shares.

Go ahead, tell me more about hedge funds.

he's a cunning albo scumbag that has had a lot of lucky breaks

>But isn't that literally wrong? Ultimately, insurance companies are the ones paying for it and have the final say.
Right, but they can't if it's a liability. What would happen if I came down with the disease and my insurance refused to pay for it? Well, technically, in this case, I would just ask Martin, since he just gives it away. Good business scheme, actually. Give away your drug for free, seeing as how it has incredibly low demand, and jack up the price 4000% so that insurance premiums still have to pay you for it.

>$224,000,000
no I dont think so...

Actually I read it wrong.

But the actuality might actually be worse.

This fucking idiot waited until the stock dropped from $9 to $2.5 in one day (-110%-) after the trial failed. Then what he did he do with all his hedge funds investor money?? HE FUCKING SHORTED IT. He spent all 32m fucking shares shorting a stock down over 100%! Clearly not expecting a fucking DCB or recovery, just what in the fuck kind of dumb shit move was that.

what in the absolute fuck

Yes, it is very much so a shitty situation; however, the chances of it being his decision alone to hike the drug's price are very low. This was a company decision that was made with a majority vote from company chairmen.

Sure there isn't definitive proof to his claim, but major news outlets have brought up many other drug price hikes since then. A recent example was the price increase on epipens, and in every other news story Shkreli's name was brought up again.

Wouldn't you think someone would have come forward and talked to CNN or MSNBC about not being able to afford Deraprim? Or that an investigative journalist, believe me someone has probably been working on this, would have found someone who couldn't afford the drug? This doesn't happen because Medicaid more than likely pays for the drug.

Wall Street is a place where people boom and bust. He certainly didn't just open a hedge fund out of nowhere. If you read into anything about the guy, then you would've known that he started reading introductory books on corporate finance at the age of eleven and trading stocks at thirteen. This means he adopted a mentality early on that his main purpose was to analyze and assess ways to create maximum profit legally and effectively at the corporate level. He talked about being a social outcast in high school (he's more than likely autistic), and then he won an interview at Jim Cramer's hedge fund (probably found a mentor who had connections to him, at this stage, he was more than likely at the same qualification level knowledge-wise as an entry-level broker.)

At Cramer's hedge fund, he posted up high returns with biotech stocks (probably luck), and went on to graduate from college. At this stage, he would've been a hot commodity and it'd be stupid for someone not to bank-roll a hedge fund for him.

In regards to the possible fraud that happened at this hedge fund, it might've happened. Who knows? We'll find out whenever his trial is finished.

oh and incase you didnt realize. he was dead wrong. and he lost a fuck ton of money

Shkreli seems good at one thing : convincing dumb fuck investors to give him money lol

Then when the investing gig didn't go his way, he had to drop investing and turn to passive income like buying a drug. lol what a retard, he made up ~20% of the vol after it fucking crashed and that was from his short hahaha

Yes, this happens all of the time. People and organizations with a shit ton of money to throw around take these risks.

Look at the bail out of the big banks and Donald Trump.

He somehow convinced investors to believe in him. There's no conspiracy behind it.

Drugs expensive for the same reason college is.

How is it very low? He was the CEO, he has final say. It's his company, he doesn't need a company vote or majority vote. I believe I remember him saying something along the lines "an employee I had told me to slowly raise it over time but I knew everyone would find out eventually, I just wanted it all up at once."

>shkreli's name was brought up again
What is the relevance? I'm not arguing he's demonized by the media.

>someone would have come forward to not be able to afford Daraprim?
Well they're probably either dead, dying, or nobody gives a shit so no. But actually, someone has, Patrick Rice. Drug was $1 now its obviously changed. And, like I said, his insurance can't cover it and he has to pay 30k /m.

Oh, and look, my suspicions above were correct! The process for applying to get the drug for free, or "$1" if you're uninsured or insurance doesn't cover, is said by a victim "the process to access the drug for free is too complicated for very sick patients."

I don't give a shit about him reading books early or caring about money at 13, lol every kid wants money. This guy is a dumb fuck. His life is full of failures. Even before MSMB bankruptcy he failed another hedge fund before that! He's worth 100m, props dude. But he has fucked over, not even drug patients Im talking about, a shit ton of people and investors. Sick bro

>People with shit ton of money around to take risk
Taking a risk and starting a business is much different than fucking burning money (e.g. buying 32m shorts after a stock drops over 100% lmao) that is just beyond retarded

>There's no conspiracy behind it.
Actually there is considering he's on bail. We shall see whos right in due time. ;)

The CEO doesn't make all of the decisions by himself. You're right, he did say something along the lines of "an employee I had told me to slowly raise it over time, but WE knew everyone would find out eventually, WE just wanted it all up at once."

Nobody would work at his company if he didn't allow the company to vote on the issue.

Patrick Rice receives the drug for free. The drug is available at a discount at hospitals. Anyone making under 56,000 per year gets it for practically free.

>What is the relevance?
It shows that they're hot on his trail to attempt to burn his ass again.

The whole "process to access the drug for free is too complicated" bullshit is bogus. All it takes is going to a hospital financial office and they'll walk you through how to do it.

Now I know this is bait.

>The CEO doesn't make all of the decisions by himself.
Do you know basic business? He is responsible for his company, anything that happens is under his name. Your argument "well it wasn't technically only him!!! coulda been sum employees vote!!!!" just shows you know nothing about business.

>Nobody would work at his company if he didn't allow the company to vote on the issue.
Holy shit, listen, I want to keep this civil, I don't want to be ad hominem. But you cannot be serious. There's no way. Look Im gonna guess you're 17 or 18, never had a job before. But just so you know, when you are employed, you are there for your work. The boss does not care about your opinion, you do work, he pays you. If you don't like a company policy, this isn't high school, you cannot complain and get it fixed, instead, guess what : pack your bags because you're fucking gone

>It shows that they're hot on his trail to attempt to burn his ass again.
No, buddy, it's because the Epi Pen situation was literally almost identical to his.

>All it takes is going to a hospital financial office and they'll walk you through how to do it.
Sigh, if an insurance company says no, there is nothing instantaneous the doctor can do. The process is not quick and easy, and obviously time is of the essence when you are sick.

You have a lot to learn, buddy.

>now I know this is bait
Classic, the bait meme. Sweet d00d !

Everything in regards to him raising the drug price was ethical and legal.

It is unethical to have relaxed legislation on the issue from politicians who have been bought off by big pharma.

Keep getting mad at someone for doing something that is perfectly legal to do.

Your post is shit bait.

>There are all sorts of loopholes the insurance companies can use.

>You can appeal, but it is a long process you do not have when you are ill.

The issues you've attempted to laminate aren't tied to the overpricing of drugs at all, but relaxed policies put in place by lawmakers on purpose.

>Everything in regards to him raising the drug price was ethical and legal.
Legal, yes. Ethical, I've already explained why it's not, you are just edgy, 15, a psychopath (unlikely) or all of the above.

>Keep getting mad
Confirmed 15

>Keep getting mad at someone for doing something that is perfectly legal to do.
I've discussed with you his not so legal past ;)
And I am perfectly allowed to discuss why he is a fucking scumbag.

Btw, keep getting mad I offended the man you asslick and worship because his net worth is super high. When you hit about 25, so about 9 years for you, like I said as you age you will mature and understand why what he is a scumbag.

>The issues you've attempted to laminate aren't tied to the overpricing of drugs at all, but relaxed policies put in place by lawmakers on purpose.
No. If the drug cannot be gotten through insurance or the insurance company rejects it, it easier to buy the $1 in 2010 than the $750 drug now. Yes? Yes.

And part of my post was aimed at politicians and other pharmas as well.

>this post is shit bait
This isn't bait, but if it was, it obviously would not shit for your long responses lol

Now go jack off to and dickride Martin in his livestreams kid.

>, you are just edgy, 15, a psychopath (unlikely) or all of the above.

Triggered.

>Confirmed 15

Confirmed 14

>I've discussed with you his not so legal past
Your question in your original post, "But isn't that literally wrong?" Was like... literally ... like answered DUDE. What he did was legal.

>No. If the drug cannot be gotten through insurance or the insurance company rejects it, it easier to buy the $1 in 2010 than the $750 drug now. Yes? Yes.

No, insurance companies shouldn't be allowed to reject a drug based on price. This is immoral and hurts the lives of many.

>Now go jack off to and dickride Martin in his livestreams kid.

Don't have time to watch them. Go back to /b/, kid.

top fucking kek, all of your advice is good for working a min. wage job but nothing more.

or wait no do you maybe work at PwC or something, something that's REALLY big time work!

Are you retarded? By "isn't that wrong" I was referring to his statement "drug companies will pay for it", which is wrong since drug companies will not always pay for it.
>Don't have time to watch them. Go back to /b/, kid.
Oooooh, you must be super busy, eh?? Busy guy what can he say lol

>No, insurance companies shouldn't be allowed to reject a drug based on price. This is immoral and hurts the lives of many.
What the fuck are you saying? I'm talking about why what he did was immoral since it restricted the access and literally DID make it costlier for uninsured. Again, you're wrong.

Also remember when you said there were no victims lol youre a clown

It's ok, youre typical Veeky Forums, lol knows nothing about nothing, edgy, thinks he knows about business but in reality a senior in HS.

>Sigh, if an insurance company says no, there is nothing instantaneous the doctor can do. The process is not quick and easy, and obviously time is of the essence when you are sick.

kek. yes, there's nothing instantaneous the doctor can do. "I'm sorry sir, I know you're about to die, but we're not going to give you these pills. lol sorry :("

The world doesn't work like this. Everyone who has filed for insurance through the Healthcare Marketplace knows this isn't how it works.

You just admitted that you're either not old enough to purchase insurance or you're a brain-dead moron.

LMAO

If you guys legitimately think that anyone under CEO has any power to change the price of the product they are selling by 1%, let alone 1000%, you are LEGITIMATELY retarded. They can suggest, but Martin decides. You guys are so downs lmao

Veeky Forums back at it again with the great memes!!

guys take a Business 101 course, fuckin ASU is smarter than you retards lol

protip: you start a company, you own it. you think a boss, let alone martin, wants to operate his company off your shitty wageslaves opinion? keep telling yourself that buddies :)

If you are uninsured and meet eligibility critera, you can get DARAPRIM for no cost

If you have commercial or private insurance, you are not obligated to pay more than $10 out of pocket for your prescription

If you have Medicare Part D insurance coverage, Turing Pharmaceuticals makes contributions to a charitable foundation, which may assist with affordability for your disease treatment

source: daraprimdirect.com/patients

Your argument is null. Give up.

Haha, fucking idiot! Get trolled!! I'm totally using the snipping tool on this thread and showing all of my friends on /b/ how I trolled THE SHIT out of Veeky Forums!!

jay2kETh, the 18 yr old in HS, knows more than doctors everybody.

Let's hear what this bright 18 year old has to say about pharmaceuticals, shall we???

>kek. yes, there's nothing instantaneous the doctor can do. "I'm sorry sir, I know you're about to die, but we're not going to give you these pills. lol sorry :(" The world doesn't work like this.

Actually, sorry buddy, but like you said, it's a capitalist world. :( Poor little jay2kETh doesn't realize jacking up a price restricts access and increases costs, not only on insurance companies.

Now let's hear from a legit doctor, shall we?

" Dr David Kimberlin, a leading US pediatric infectious diseases specialist based at the University of Alabama, said that he had had a problem getting hold of Daraprim since Turing acquired the drug and changed the way it is distributed.

Kimberlin said he experienced problems accessing the drug in the liquid form that babies need.

“This has directly put the lives of patients with this severe infection at risk. Babies’ lives literally hang in the balance here,” Kimberlin said.

He said his healthcare system had seen the cost of a typical course of what he termed pyrimethamine, the medicine in the branded drug Daraprim, for adults rise from $1,200 to $69,000 under Turing’s ownership, with some serious cases costing “no less than” $500,000, having cost $8,500 before, he said."

"Fortunately, after a trip to the outpatient pharmacy, his pharmacist found a supply of the stuff already on the shelves—a break Kimberlin says saved the baby’s life."

Welp, that's awkward... I guess the world *does* work like that!!

Poor little Dr. jay2kETh doesn't realize that increasing the costs to "fuck up the insurance xD XD XD and free drugs for everyone ! haha XD" isnt so easy when you're ill.

you poor uneducated soul. lol
btw no victims, right? lol

>there are no victims
>proven wrong

>its not martin's fault guys even tho its his company
>proven wrong

>this is bait!!

Would you like to try again, buddy? lol

>If you are uninsured and meet eligibility critera, you can get DARAPRIM for no cost
We already talked about this, read above you fucking idiot. Lol do you have dyslexia or Alzheimer's?

L, poor guy has taken Ls all thread. Lol, try again. You can find one argument, I believe in you !

He's neither immoral or righteous. There are over 7 billion people that exist on the planet. People demand access to health care in at least the first world countries. People also wish for it to be free, or at least affordable. These demands and wishes are simply not met without the supply resources necessary to manufacture, design, research, and further distribute them. Everybody wants something, but not everyone can have it. Medicine is a scarce resource. While not having any knowledge of the specifics regarding drug manufacturing, the simple nature of supply and demand can answer most of your questions. The problem isn't that drug companies are corrupt. They may be corrupt, but the problem is that there are a lot of humans, almost all of which demand access to medical care/supplies. Not everyone's needs can be met, and even if they could, they'd come at an increased cost of production.

Research and development for future endeavors are also a factor affecting the situation. You're going to have to pay out the ass for drugs, because there aren't enough of them to suit everyone's needs.

There aren't many solutions that don't end with people either dying in large volume, or costs skyrocketing. Overpopulation is the answer to almost every question pertaining to the rising costs of land, labor, and capital.

It sucks that medical care is expensive, but resources are limited and price is the only proven method of distributing limited resources in an effective manner.

Even if you were to argue that the FDA favors drug companies through lobbying, without the favoritism, new drugs would emerge at a very limited rate. Martin may have a punchable face and a weeb attitude, but at least he admits to seeking profit for his shareholders. Without profit, there is nothing being manufactured. At least you have the option to pay for expensive drugs. You could just be fucked.

You know what, you're completely right. You have opened my eyes up. Deraprim certainly DID make it costlier for the uninsured. What you have showed me today is irrefutable evidence that the supply of Deraprim is massively scant to a level that makes what Turing did irreprehensible. I just read a report out yesterday about the number of deaths due to toxoplasmosis rising to insane levels due to the price hike. It is just crazy. It is just insane.

What he did was incomprehensible. I can't believe this. Like wow! This just doesn't make sense to me! I think I am going to start making threads about this on underwater basketweaving forums. Yeah! yeah.. that sounds good. Call them names and shit. That'll certainly back up my argument.

If you are uninsured and meet eligibility critera, you can get DARAPRIM for no cost

If you have commercial or private insurance, you are not obligated to pay more than $10 out of pocket for your prescription

If you have Medicare Part D insurance coverage, Turing Pharmaceuticals makes contributions to a charitable foundation, which may assist with affordability for your disease treatment

source: daraprimdirect.com/patients

>company website says "you can get for no cost"
>victims who tried say "[Turing's] process to access the drug for free is too complicated for very sick patients."

There ya go pal. Btw nice memes are sarcasm as your main point, lol youre too funny, big ol clown. stick to comedy bro lol

>gives information on an isolated case.
>drug is more than likely available at a hospital nearby.

Find data that shows more people are dying from toxoplasmosis for me.

"My insurance would no longer cover the cost of Daraprim, a vital medicine in my Lyme disease treatment. They said the drugs would cost me $30,000.

“Thirty thousand dollars a year?” I asked, flabbergasted.

“No, $30,000 a month,” they responded."

It's harder to get and costlier, thus it's easier to die. Are you dumb

>everyone has to profit you idiot!!!
>the insurance companies will pay for it!! duh!!
You shkreli fags are too retarded lol

>It's harder to get and costlier, thus it's easier to die.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_probability

bro do you actually have autism? honest question

price = increased
demand = consistent
ability to acquire = more difficult
cost for people like Patrick = increased

Its not fucking rocket science dumbass

Actually, I do have autism you immature jerk. Grow up and learn a thing or two about finance before coming to this board spewing your nonsensical shit.

Can one of you do me a favor and ask Mr. Shkreli about $NWBO? Is it another $MSTX?

I'd do it but I don't have a Twitter

Wouldnt be surprise if that faggot was browsing biz

>Everyone else is charging $100 for a thing
>You are charging $1 for that thing
>Decide to raise it to $80
>People still buy the thing from you but you make way more money

ITT: people who think the CEOis the dictator of the company and who are also entirely unaware that there are entire departments of companies that do nothing but handle employee concerns and problems.

>Veeky Forums
>2016
>the actuality might actually
>-110%
>-110%
>-110%
>Veeky Forums
never change

>Veeky Forums
>2016
>stock drops over 100%
>drops over 100%
>over 100%
>100%
>%

wow. had to post again this is just incredible...

omg OP I can't stop laughing. you are by far my favorite person on Veeky Forums right now. you're lecturing people about business while saying a stock dropped over 100%. this is the hardest I've laughed in a long time on Veeky Forums thank you kind sir. if you ever need a job on the east coast let me know bro.

truly enjoyed reading all your posts bro. thank you again.

>"drug insurance companies will pay for it!!!" is his rebuttal. And essentially I haven't seen anyone counteract that point well.
its that kind of thinking that has our healthcare system fucked.

the money has to come from somewhere, they dont just magically have the money.

we end up with higher premiums to pay for this bullshit.

Your country is a failure, your whole education system relies on an individual hording debt. Your government revises its GDP numbers down and fudges its inflation numbers. Your economy has some of the largest bubbles in history. Why do you continue being ignorant of the fact retards like you are the problem?

Just translate it to your higher premiums will pay for it.

I really, really hope that is a troll post and you are not that retarded.

That's great, britain is good, america sucks, stay on /pol/ and keep that shit away from here faggot

A stock can't lose more than 100% of its value. If a stock were to lose more than 100% of its value, it would have a negative price. If a stock is worth $9, 100% of that stock price is $9. If that stock were to then lose 100% of its value, it would be worth $0.

Y O U F U C K I N G R E T A R D