Car Wash Thread

my car sat under a tree for months and has sap and other stuff on the roof i cant get to come off what should i try

Blowtorch.

If that doesn't work maybe a little soapy water and elbow grease might work.

thread jacking, I've got water spots which aren't going away with a mix of one third soap and two thirds water

it's single stage miata paint which has been assaulted by a combination of dust from a nearby dirt road and lawn sprinklers

is it fucked?

You can try water and vinegar.
Just wipe it off fast, don't let it set. Also rewax afterwards.

use this, best one ever

>Don't see a wash thread here, so here we go.

There's plenty of them in the archives. One such car washing and detailing thread is at:

archive.4plebs.org/o/thread/15054456/#q15054456

This, accept no substitutes

>I've got water spots which aren't going away with a mix of one third soap and two thirds water

Some detailers remove water spots on chrome such as Turtle Wax ICE detailer. If you read the back label, you see it says water spots. I used it on my chrome and windows, and it removed the sap and water spots. Certainly more far more effective than windex. For windows, I spray a little on the window then use a paper towel. I don't care if it smears initially since having the detailer on the window and not absorbed by the paper towel is how it should be done. Then switch to the other side of the paper towel to wipe up most of it. Then follow with microfiber to be streak free. no more sap or spots. On chrome, I put a little on finger and gently rub on the chrome trim. You could spray it and then wipe with MF. As long as your method doesn't scratch the chrome it is good.

Some detailer sprays do remove water spots. Some do not. You can switch to a detailer spray from a different company if yours doesn't remove water spots or has excessive staining of trim and rubber.

>Some detailers remove water spots on chrome such as Turtle Wax ICE detailer.

I'd rather use a detailer to remove water spots than one of those dedicated corrosive products like CLR or calcium spot removers. Those products are so strong they have warnings about getting it on your paint or any metal. They are just for water spots on glass because they will chemically burn your paint. And some of so-called chrome trim is actually a thin coating of aluminum covered by clearcoat.

gasoline. seriously. there's other stuff that might get it off eventually but none of it is as fast or as easy as gasoline.

Petroleum-based bug/tar remover.

>none of it is as fast or as easy as gasoline.

Nothing else keeps your hands smelling for so long as gasoline does. Even after soap and water, people smell you in a room. So no thanks. I want to be remembered in a good way and not for my gasoline body odor.

>Petroleum-based bug/tar remover.
No need to buy separate products for everything. Some detailers already have some petroleum distillate such as Turtle Wax ICE Detailer. So it works on pine tree sap, bugs, and tar.

I have never washed my car in the 5 months I have owned it. How degenerate am I?

>tfw using my leaf blower to dry off my car

>I have never washed my car in the 5 months I have owned it.

Bill Gates doesn't wash his car since it's not worth his time to do so. Same with many people. Instead, they have other people wash the car for them.

>gasoline
Careful with that shit, you can etch the clearcoat and potentially damage it. Gasoline is a solvent, and remember like dissolves like.

>C8H18 (gas)= non-polar solvent
> CC is also non polar
Add some shitty imfs, and now you need paint correction.

Pressure washer and a product like Car-Pro's Tar-X will do the job. Just make sure you wash it off of the black trim. That stuff tends to stain when left to dry on plastics

You don't need to wash the paint as much, but brake dust that is left to oxidize is extraordinarily shitty news for your wheels.

What is the longest lasting wax/sealer? Willing to give up some shine for longevity

>Some detailers remove water spots on chrome such as Turtle Wax ICE detailer.

Turtle Wax.
Just no.

Etched watermarks, you can remove the minerals with Mothers Watermark remover but you will need to polish to get rid of them for good.

As long as it's not the type of gas-powered leaf blower that gets any of its oily exhaust onto the car. Even the wind can blow some of that exhaust onto the car.

>What is the longest lasting wax/sealer?
Some people say Zaino and would then post the results of their own testing. Certainly you can go online and compare how long various sealants or car waxes last.

For example, Meguiars is the shortest lasting by far. Mothers lasts longer but not too much longer. Those carnauba wax-type products don't last particularly if you use a sealant underneath. The sealant seals off the surface pores and protects the surface. But what does that mean? It means many other materials that float on top of that sealed surface such as dirt, grime, carnauba wax, bees wax, crayon, and the dried on minerals from water spots will fall off easier. What sticks better are those products compatible with the way that particular sealant works. Unfortunately, carnauba wax is pretty much alien to all the polymer sealants. It likes to fall off faster from a sealed paint surface.

Some Veeky Forumstist said he used this stuff in another detailing thread a while ago.

soft99.co.jp/english/products/carcare/wax/fusso_coat_12.html?pid=00298

>soft99.co.jp/english/products/carcare/wax/fusso_coat_12.html?pid=00298
Fluorine polymer sounds just like those old teflon car wax ads from long ago. Fluorine is highly reactive so it would have reacted long ago to the other materials around it.

Since the can is not marked "hazardous" that means it is probably teflon additive. Otherwise, reactive fluorine compounds are classed as hazardous chemicals. They would react with your hands or the applicator pad much more readily than the car paint. And as soon as something reactive (oils) hit the car paint, they'd react with that more than the car paint and thus fall off, leaving a microscopic pit on the paint where it had eaten its way onto the surface to maintain its chemical grip.

The other problem about products that market themselves as "nothing sticks to our wax" is that it also means their wax doesn't like to stick to anything else like your clearcoat. Fusso wax instructions recommends it should be maintained daily with their detailing product, so improper maintenance would mean it has less than its bragged about max one year lifespan.

Because of those factors, I think Fusso is more marketing gimmick than anything else. It's the "Slick50" of car waxes.

There was that can of $1000 blended sealant plus white brazilian carnauba paste wax too from Chemical Guys. Unlike other companies that sell sealants and waxes separately, this one combines both together. Official MSRP list price at $1064, and now it floats to $800 or so. Black Carnauba Matters too, but apparently Chemical Guys preferred white carnauba.

Descriptions and company supplied images of the wax job for your evaluation of "Chemical Guys J97 Paste Wax - White Brazilian Carnauba Wax" at:

chemicalguys.com/Project_J97_Paste_Wax_p/n_002.htm

.

""" Project J97 was born from a request from a Chemical Guys friend in Japan, Mr. Hayao Miyazaki. Mr. Miyazaki's car collection contains vehicles that are considered priceless – meaning money could never replace them. All of these cars are detailed using Chemical Guys products. On a trip to Japan, we actually had the opportunity to meet with him and view his collection when he made a simple request - produce the best product we possibly could and consider money no object. He said, “Cars are like totoros. Life may possibly go on without them, but if it did, it just wouldn’t be the same. Anything worth doing is worth doing right and in complete excess.” His words resonated with us and set forth with a vision for this product that was similar to the passion we have for cars: “If you are going to drive a car, drive it fast. Make it scream – let’s see what she’s got. Punch that gas pedal to the floor so you can feel its heartbeat as you race in and out of the canyons. Remember, if you don’t live for the now, you are not living.”"""

>What is the longest lasting wax/sealer?
These are all the full synthetic products. The 100% carnauba wax products all have short life. The products that are a blend of synthetic and carnauba waxes have longer lifespan but the carnauba part still comes off. When these blended waxes claim 3 months or longer, it's because of the synthetic part that remains on the car and only in a minute form.

Usually, the instructions for that wax product say to use their related detailer product which is basically a diluted version of their wax product mixed with cleaners and lubricating silicon oil to remove sap, bugs, water spot minerals, and grime. This is what lets them say the wax lasts so long because it is being partially replenished by the detailer. This feels like deceptive marketing to me about how long a wax lasts. The duration should be measured without any "replenishment".

Well there are "ceramic" (read: extremely durable urethane) coatings you can apply to paint now that are guaranteed for up to 7 years.

>extremely durable urethane) coatings

That just sounds like applying a variation of "clear coat". Sounds like it would be bad if it accidently got onto trim or rubber.

>ceramic
>extremely durable urethane coatings
What brands of products are these? As they wear off, do they look unsightly like peeling layers?

Can they be stripped off by the commercial automated carwashes which use stronger chemicals and acid washes?

This isn't a fucking forum.

This is the ONLY wheel cleaner worth buying. Every other "non-contact" cleaner is dog piss compared to Meguiar's.

Non contact cleaners are retarded. What are you doing putting something that aggressive on your car? Use Sonax Full Effect, agitate with a wheel brush, and rinse. It doesn't stink like the rest of the iron removing cleaners, kinda smells like limes, and it's cheap and effective.

You do have to be very careful, and yeah, it does bond permanently to the clear coat, but it is much tougher than clear coat, it's the new functional surface of the paint.

There are dozens of brands of coatings out there, I use what I think is the best and most durable, made by a company called Gtechniq. Their coatings can't be removed even with paint thinner. I wouldn't recommend an automated wash with the coatings simply because if you do it consecutively for years, the coating will not last as long, but there is no visible change to how to coating wears off, apart from a difference in how the water beads on the paint.

That Meguiars clear plastic meguiars bottle isn't even the actual color of the meguairs liquid inside. The meguiars plastic bottle is colored neon pink by Meguiars for meguiars' marketing purposes.

what i always do is after i'm done washing the car body the same bucket with the soap and water i use a brush to clean the wheels. they come out ok but is this much better?

>but letting the water evaporate (leaving deposits), does even less.

If there was a good long rain, then that is good. But if the rain was very short, then the rain may be acid rain. That's the kind you don't want because acid rain is the type that can etch into things if it's followed by a hot sun.

No. Just no user. Shiit tier, turned my red powder coated calipers pink. You should not be using a harsh cleaner on modern wheels, they all have clear coat on them. Same soap you use on the body.
1) Dont ever ley uor wheels get so bad they require a harsh wheel cleaner
2) Sonax if you fuck up

>I use what I think is the best and most durable, made by a company called Gtechniq.

Lol no.

Would you recommend removing hubcaps for easier access to clean the actual wheels themselves? And leaving them off afterwards.

>Turtle Wax.
>Just no.
Best wax for the price desu. Does its job and sticks around a good long time.

Results don't lie. I've coated multiple cars and compared the longevity and gloss to other competing coatings, Crystal Serum and EXO is the best I've come across so far.

Zaino all the way

>Shiit tier, turned my red powder coated calipers pink.
The label on meguiar's All Wheel & Tire Cleaner says it cannot be sprayed on bare metal, anodized rims, uncoated rims, aluminum, etcetera. It eats everything that isn't coated with clearcoat or other protective coating. Your high temperature caliper paint by itself is not enough evidently.

In a thread a few weeks ago, someone answered the formula request for that product and posted a list and percentage by WEIGHT (not W/V) of the ingredients. It was 95% by weight some base liquid. Then various nasty ingredients. The person also posted animal tests that meguiar's subjected rabbits, rat, guiniea pigs to. Including how much it took to blind the animals. How much to kill 50% of them. Apparently it is pretty strong because very small injections would kill a rabbit.

There is no best wax, closest thing I have encountered is P21S. It depends on paint, application, etc. And then its really a trade off between durability and quality of finish.

Claiming one wax is the best is bullshit, DIY'ers and pros have spent time and money looking for it and haven't found one yet.

If you go a few posts up, you'll see that what I'm talking about isn't a wax at all, but something that someone looking for the best possible protection might be interested in.

>Best wax for the price desu. Does its job and sticks around a good long time

I also am a fan of the Turtle Wax ICE series of products. They are much more affordable and easily used versions of Zaino and those other boutique items. Turtle Wax ICE is fully synthetic, so there is no more carnauba which is nice, but also falls off sealed surfaces easily.

Because good clearcoats shed contaminants easily (you surely don't want clearcoat that bonds with contaminants), that means carnauba falls off easily. We think of carnauba as a desirable object, but good clearcoat has no emotion and simply considers carnauba was to be yet another contaminant that is trying to stick to it.

Polymer waxes and sealants approach the clearcoat from a chemical perspective instead of the more physical one that carnauba has.

Another plus of turtle wax ICE is that the wax is non-staining of trim, black plastics, and rubber. Meguiar's various carnauba formulas always stained trim and rubber. In the case of meg gold class, the trim would be stained a few days later when the last of the solvents evaporated and left the yellowish white wax to stain the trim.

On youtube reviews, people found that turtle wax ICE stayed on a lot longer than the carnauba forumulas such as meguiar's gold class.

>Does its job and sticks around a good long time.
I waxed my car with turtle wax ice in november 2015, feb 2016, and may 2016. It's always shined a lot between waxes despite rain. All I need to do is dust. It needs another wash now due to tree sap from those acidic white oaks or turpentine pine trees. The part of the parking lot with the shady maple trees is hard to get a space. There's no part of work parking that isn't sprinkled by tree sap, so the maple tree spots are the most popular since the cars are much cooler there. The least popular are the pine trees since there is almost no shade and lot of turpentine sap balls that are the most resinous of all the tree sap balls in the lot. They are too many and too resinous for any detailer spray. It's car wash or not.

>I also am a fan of the Turtle Wax ICE series of products

ICE is trash tier, I do like their QD spray but that is the only exception to the entire Turtle Wax product line.

Also Zano is urban legend trash that quickly identifies retards to anyone who knows what they are doing.

I am not a detail snob, I believe there are a lot of bullshit products that exist only to be expensive to be attractive to the idiots who assume if $=quality then $$$=moar quality with no upper bound. The only worthwhile normally available over the counter waxes I have used are Megs NXT 2.0 and Mothers California Gold Caranuba.

Right now I stock 4 different soaps, 5 waxes, 2 QD sprays, and ~25 other trim, glass, and specialty products Soaps have different uses, if I use a foam cannon or want to strip old wax/sealant before correction. Some waxes work better on light colors or metallic paint.

If you detail as a professional then having a wide selection of products helps, if you are doing it for yourself then selecting what works best for you paint and can be applied per by someone with your skill level (Some hybrid products are not novice friendly)

would degreaser be fine too? pls respond

would this be okay too for cleaning the engine bay?

Simple green extreme version (blue bottle). It will degrease and won't corrode aluminum, it also rinses clean.

ProTip; Rinse with a hose nozzle that has a "mist" setting.

I spent like hours washing, clay bar, rubbing compound, polish compound, and waxing my trunk. Just the decklid. It turned out rather nice. I might get an actual buffer cause I did that shit by hand and it was exhausting, but turned out well, and I want to do the whole car.

Pic related is how it was when I bought it, and I want to restore that shine. I don't care if it has rust now, I want that shine back.

neat, this thread isn't dead

this did it, 1/4 distilled white vinegar with warm water, thanks mate

I normally use the Mothers California Gold Wash & Wax and it does a pretty good job, but they did not have it at the store I went to and so I got what is in OP. The hydrophobic bit actually has some merit to it.

Some quick detailer (QD) sprays also remove those dried on raised mineral spots on windows or chrome trim. One such is turtle wax ICE quick detailer. I've used it successfully many a time on windows and trim. It also wipes off easily.

>The stuff you guys use sucks
>Oh look, I have a lot of stuff you don't have
>You can't buy my stuff in stores
>The stuff you guys use sucks

>Are these bullshit or do they actually allow less water to mark your car?

It will be deionized water or distilled water that doesn't leave mineral spots when it dries.

archive.4plebs.org/o/thread/15054456/

$16 RV 100 micron filters I get from Amazon are great. Keeps minerals from the surface, keeps hard water from killing my pressure washer and seems to make my foam cannon even foamier.

Seems like they'd plug up right away? Or do they have a bypass to continually keep them clean?

The de-ionized water system is basically a reverse osmosis type system. The water pressure output is low, but all that is needed is for that water to sluice off the other "bad" rinse water on the car. Based upon the cost of buying a de-ionized water system and the frequency of use in car washes, it would be cheaper for me to buy distilled water at $0.79 per gallon and use that to do the final final final rinse of the car. One gallon if applied properly with the pump sprayer wand would be more than enough to rinse the car off.

I have never cut one open, I dunno.

I have seen some pretty crazy treatment setups, $16 is about as spendy as I will get as we dont have bad water around here.

>I have never cut one open,
You've seen reverse osmosis water filtration systems for home use? The ones that fit under the sink? Another name for the water output by a reverse osmosis system is deionized water. But since that is a lot of words, it's faster to just call it deionized water. Car wash deionized water system looks very similar except that it has fittings to connect to a water hose and output its water to a hose and spray wand.

purewaterproducts.com/articles/reverse-osmosis-faq

I just like to think of car wash deionized water systems as reverse osmosis systems with osmosis filters that were rejected for drinking water standards.

Hey Veeky Forums i have a few detailing questions.

Am I supposed to clay bar before buffing out scratches? I don't have a buffer, I was hoping to take the scratches out with the clay bar but I don't think a clay bar does that very well. I think the order is wash, clay bar, buff, wax. Is that right?

Also is it ok to clay bar the car and just use spray wax and buff the scratches out at a later time?

Also any cheap orbital buffer recommendations?

I look at as exponential money for incredibly minor gains. I am drying the car anyway, this just reduces any buildup in panel gaps and removes minerals form any hard water that will reduce foaming.

>Am I supposed to clay bar before buffing out scratches?

Yes, remove any contamination from paint before correction, the only abrasive should be the compound or polish,

Your order is correct. Get a cheap Harbor Freight buffer and pick up a decent 5" backing plate when you get pads if you want a serviceable buffer and pads for

Thanks for the info dude

>Am I supposed to clay bar before buffing out scratches?

Why do you need to buff out the scratches? Presumably, these are circular scratches put in there by the dealer's detailing service before they delivered the car to their first customer. Typically, they save time by using power orbital buffers. But they don't do it in a dust free room, so the grit in the atmosphere gets onto the car's surface and is ground in along with the wax.

You've washed your car before. But did you notice in the next 10 minutes as the car's surface slowly had atmospheric grit settle down on it? The same thing will happen when you use your orbital buffer to "polish" the car.

Polishing is going to wear down your clear coat of course. You are lowering your clear coat down to the level of the scratches in order to make them less visible. The advantage of having a thick clear coat is that it provides more UV protection to the paint layer underneat the clear coat. If you thin out the clear coat, that means more UV will reach the paint.

Instead of doing that, why not just wax more often? Or use a longer-lasting 100% synthetic wax instead of carnauba wax blends? The wax hides scratches. And use of the quick detailer spray hides scratches too.

Dust the car and apply quick detailer. Do that between wash and wax jobs.

Why would you hide scratches instead of removing them? Cars can be corrected multiple times before the clear coat gets too thin, and with the proper sealants, a car should only need to be corrected once or twice in its life, as long as the owner cares for it correctly.

The only time my car gets washed is when it rains. Sometimes i'll take it to the pay-by-the-minute power washer place and spray the salt off

For minor stuff, it's why glaze exsists. Let it get bad enough to need correction and do it as few times as possible.

Does anybody in Veeky Forums use those waterless wash-and-wax products? How do they compare to washing your car with water?

I wash mine at least once a week, but just got done cleaning the inside for the first time since I've owned. I bought it as a Christmas present to myself last year.

Who /Griots/ here?

>Why would you hide scratches instead of removing them?

I guess I am from the school of do the least changes necessary to fix the specific problem while you are from the school of complete fix. My dentist is like that. He's from the "try to repair the tooth" while many other dentists are in the "pull the tooth and replace with titanium socket and all new tooth".

>Does anybody in Veeky Forums use those waterless wash-and-wax products?

It's basically the same as a quick detailer (QD) BUT has added ingredients to make it foam up to lift up more of the grime and dirt than a quick detailer would do. The usage is also slightly different because you use up a lot more microfiber (MF).

If you don't really have a wax job to maintain with a QD, then you can use the waterless wash/wax. But if it was already waxed and you think enough of the wax remains, then you might as well use the quick detailer instead.

The waterless wash and wax is almost the same as a quick detailer too in usage. You still have to dust the car of all the loose dirt for either type of product. Because you are probably using the waterless [noun] in a slightly dirtier situation than the QD, remember to gently stroke in one direction instead of using a circular motion as you would with QD. This keeps the lifted detergent wash residue from being re-rubbed back on the surface. Thus, the MF is better able to do its wick and hold action to keep the surface clean and shiny. With waterless, you'll be using up a lot more MF cloths than with QD.

When done, as with the QD, you do a final pass with a clean MF and stroke in one direction. Of course, you can skip this step if you are out of time. But this gives a slightly better shine.

I detail professionally. I take people's money to fix the problem, not conceal it. If I slap some wax on to hide defects, only to have them reappear weeks later, I wouldn't have a very loyal customer base.

It's all pretty good, though for most of their products I've found alternatives that I prefer. Their polishers are boss though.

Is sealant a good finisher or should it be topped with something else after?

Depends on what you're after, and what product you're using. If you can only do one thing, I would suggest a sealant because generally it will provide better protection.

If you have more time, generally it's good practice to put a wax on top of your sealer, that way you build layers of protection, and you get the gloss and other properties of wax on top.

Hand polishing peasant race. Spent hours on the van and still not done.

Slider door is done, nothing else

It's coming out nicely, user.

Nose done

It's mostly just knocking off oxidation I think

>I take people's money to fix the problem, not conceal it.

Hmm. You didn't really fix the problem. Instead, you eliminated the problem. What is concealed to the customer is that the clear coat is thinner over the whole car wherever the swirl marks and another scratches are.

This type of problem elimination protects the reputation of the profressional detailer though.

As for professional detailing, my dealer hires professional detailers. They work on the dealer's property and all they do is detail. There are so many cars on the lot that there is no shortage of cars that need to be constantly dusted off or have their windows washed right after a rain. They are the professional detailers that professionally detailed my car using their professional orbital buffers with professionally obtained atmospheric dust that was professionally deposited on the professionally cleaned surface of my new car. The professional detailers who detail professionally full time as their jobs, professionally applied was and professionally buffed swirl marks with all their professional skills into my clear coat. Of course I was pleased. Because. They detail professionally. They take the dealer's money to fix problems and do so successfully. After all, the car was sold and not returned for faulty detailing. Truly. Professional Detailing. And they are efficient too. Instead of wasted motion, the microfiber towel was allowed to touch the wet ground as they wiped the car dry. I saw it. Since they are full-time paid, that makes them full-time professionals. Full time paid. Fully professional.

Dealership detailers are a joke. The kinds of guys you're talking about? I'm the guy a customer takes their car to after the dealership fucks it up.

As for thinning the clear, as long as it meets film thickness requirements, it's not a concern. UV attacks the urethane clear, not the base underneath. If you know what you're doing, you can polish and even sand an area up to 5 times typically without being in danger of reducing film thickness too greatly.

As for dust, you clean in a controlled environment, and you clean your pads properly as well.

>Dealership detailers are a joke

So much this, talking with a member of the detail crew at a local dealer he said un-ironically they had three different waxes, grape, cherry, & apple scent. Also none had ever washed cars before being hired.

Dealership detail = swirlmark installers.

>I guess I am from the school of do the least changes necessary to fix the specific problem >My dentist is like that. He's from the "try to repair the tooth"

That is a pretty shitty analogy, since hiding scratches with wax doesn't even come close to "repairing" the paint.

>What is concealed to the customer is that the clear coat is thinner over the whole car wherever the swirl marks and another scratches are

The namefriend already said it best
>Cars can be corrected multiple times before the clear coat gets too thin, and with the proper sealants, a car should only need to be corrected once or twice in its life, as long as the owner cares for it correctly.

It seems like you are just trying your hardest to justify the shit detail job you got.

How do you deal with paint chips/scratches down to bare metal on a car that's not worth the time to fill in said scratches and chips?

Sort of a tricky question, you always want to fill in a chip or scratch that is down to the substrate. Left exposed, the substrate will start to corrode, whether it's steel or aluminum.

If someone doesn't want chips filled with touch up, or if it's not available, then I'll go about business as usual. The coat of sealant I apply to the whole car will hopefully protect the substrate long enough for the customer to get ahold of some touchup.

>That is a pretty shitty analogy, since hiding scratches with wax doesn't even come close to "repairing" the paint.

Cars come with a finite amount of clear, polishing off a fraction to correct some minor imperfection is retardrd.

Products have fillers to hide these. I detail professionally and have only corrected my personal car once. There are some issues that can be polished away but it's best to keep the surface clean and protected until the buildup of issues requires correction.

Good detailers care about maintaining the finish, on expensive cars the factory original finish adds tremendously to the value.

The name of the game is prevention. Ideally you would correct the car as perfectly as possible, then apply the best protection you possibly can. For many, that's a strong sealant and good wax, reapplied at appropriate intervals. I prefer coating cars for ultimate protection, but that is prohibitively expensive for most.

>that's a strong sealant and good wax,

Doesn't a strong sealant make it harder for the wax to stay on?