At what age did you realize that heavier cars are better than lighter ones?
>more grip at low speeds >safer in a crash >better sound insulation
Idiots are always like
>b-but you need less power if it weighs less!
Sure, but a heavier car will always have a higher top speed with the same 0-60 time. For example a Lotus Elise is 900kg and has 130bhp, it will do 0-60 as fast as a medium-fast German barge, but a German barge will do 170mph and an Elise tops out at 125mph.
>y-you don't need to go 170mph!!!
That's not the point you retard. Above 60mph it will be slow as shit, holy fuck.
But which is more fun around the track. The one that feels like a go kart, or the one that feels like your mom's neutered sedan? How often will you get to 170 mph? Shit even on closed courses it'll be unnecessary.
Jack Jackson
>more grip at low speeds wrong >safer in a crash wrong >better sound insulation not related in any way
Benjamin Lewis
Weight has nothing to do with top speed you moron. It has to do with acceleration and inertia. There are merits to ultralight cars and moderately heavy cars for performance, all depends on what the design goal is.
Jaxon King
>>more grip at low speeds >>safer in a crash >>better sound insulation
none of these things have any direct correlation with weight
David Hernandez
You kids are so dumb.
If a car weighs more it will be slowed down less by an impact, meaning less force is transmitted to the driver as a result of a change in speed. Obviously the only exemption is if you crash into something which cant move, like a tree or some shit.
Go back to school.
Ethan Evans
Apparently they don't teach physics in school anymore. They did when I went though, which is how I know you are a complete moron.
Jordan Thompson
im gunna have a go at this
lighter cars are cheaper to buy and cheaper to work on. easier to work on and cheaper to maintain
Luis Smith
Are you saying a truck with an empty bed has more grip than a truck with sandbags over the axle?
Owen Lopez
No they don't Thats why I came out of school thinking a Morris minor can handle a head on collision better than a 70s eldorado
Henry Price
At low speeds as OP suggested, yes. With less weight to accelerate less available traction is required. In the case of cornering, which OP is obviously talking about, a heavier car wants to continue in a straight line to a higher degree than a lighter car, so same result, less available traction required. I get that they don't even teach Newtons laws anymore and are probably spending that time in your generation's public schools to teach you about transgender acceptance, but have some common sense. Do you see go kart racers adding ballast to their karts?
Austin Howard
I'm sorry that you are so angry about light weight vehicles. I mean even though they are way better in every way.
Nolan Thomas
Complete pleb.
Say you're driving a Mercedes S-Class and you rear end a Fiat Punto. Obviously you're going to demolish the Punto either way, but if you have a bunch of bricks tied down on the rear passenger seats and in the boot, you're going to obliterate it. Because you slow down less you're going to feel less of the impact.
Like, I said, go back to school.
Michael Flores
>He actually thinks the no sandbag trick will have more grip Roflmao typical retarded tripcucm
Thomas Fisher
An Eldorado has a 6 foot long sheet metal box that will deform in front the firewall, the Minor doesn't. Has nothing to do with weight. Even if all collisions were head on a lighter car is better because it has less energy to disperse. Why don't you fill your trunk with sandbags like the last guy suggested? Think how much safer it will be in a head on collision. Maybe you just just take all the 45lb plates from your local Golds Gym and put them in the backseat too, you'll be practically invincible.
Caleb Lewis
Yea an eldorado doesn't have a 7l engine and gearbox in front of the firewall and a Morris minor will always come out ahead against an 1800kg Volvo suv in a head on collision according to your minimum wage grease monkey knowledge :^)
Brody Howard
Yeah, nah. Fuck you, OP.
Robert Scott
How much weight do you have added to your current car? How much better has it gotten since you added 1000lbs+ of ballast?
William Diaz
Went from undrivable in rain or on loose surface to fine
Jose Roberts
is that why race cars are stripped out and use the lightest materials possible?
Mason Scott
There's definitely tons of cars out there that will just spin out if the road is wet because they are so light. That's how traction works of course. You're lucky your car just hasn't floated away into the atmosphere. Hopefully one day all the massive OEMs with tens of thousands of engineers can become as smart as one Veeky Forums poster, then they will figure out that they can just add lead shot to the car to make it do better in crash tests and handling comparos
Jayden Moore
Huur duur adding 1000kg to a lotus won't make it better!!! Of course not That doesn't change the fact that my truck has waay more grip when there's weight over the rear wheels
Nathaniel Brown
>cars without aero
Aiden Reyes
>You're lucky your car just hasn't floated away into the atmosphere.
that's not funny dude, my friend in his miata flew away into the stratosphere when he took a corner at 25 mph (it was rated for 15).
Jaxson Murphy
Except your brake distance increases and your cornering gets worse.
Sure sand bags will stop you from spinning your tires leaving from a stop, but that's the only benefit.
Juan Long
What a fucking retard.
You probably live in Florida and have never seen snow you dirty nigger. Rain is a low friction surface much as snow is, have you ever wondered why people load their cars up with sandbags when it snows? Ever wondered why manufacturers use downforce? You sure are fucking stupid.
Lucas Foster
I'm enjoying the lite life
Julian Hall
This may be too complicated to you, but I'm going to help you out just because it seems like you're having a lot of trouble operating your normal motor vehicle. Take a look at your wheels, somewhere on them is a stem, which will have a threaded cap on it. Remove the cap and push the little pin in behind it. This will let some of the air out of your tires, increasing your contact patch in the same way as putting weight in the bed.
Colton Hernandez
My cornering increases because my ass isn't skipping along the road
Sebastian Smith
See>ever wondered why manufacturers use downforce They rarely do on vehicles such as trucks and economy cars, and those vehicles with them rarely go fast enough around turns to benefit from the downforce. Spoilers are more about aesthetic on road cars.
Justin Thompson
Really? Because from my winter experience adding weight to the box makes oversteer more dramatic.
John Campbell
Letting air out of my 185s won't have same effect as 200kg of weight Literally stop posting you worthless grease monkey
Thomas Hernandez
>Spoilers are more about aesthetic on road cars. And gas mileage, and they help keep the rear window clean on hatchbacks/wagons/SUVs/crossovers.
Dominic Lewis
>increased load over driven axle increases the contact pressure between the tire and road, which leads to a different contact patch for tractive force transmission >downforce, weight, high speed cars will lift at high speeds, this lifting force is resisted more by a heavier car >dynamics of wet surfaces and grip don't even bother, tribology is already a heavily empirical science and adding fluids to the mix makes it even harder to wrap your head around
Luke Powell
>more grip at low speeds Friction is based on normal force, without down force barges have a higher normal force >safer in crash barges are likely to decelerate more slowly in car on car collisions due to increased momentum. safer >better sound insulation yeah you're right
Julian Price
15, but i started liking real cars when i hit 22
Jose Adams
>gas mileage I'll say "whatever" to that. >help keep rear window clean Aesthetic?
Ayden Bell
What the fuck is that
Thomas Rivera
It's the exact same concept you turd. Putting 500kg of bricks in your car is exactly the same as using downforce, the difference is the bricks will work from 0mph and the downforce wont.
Obviously the bricks will hurt your stopping distances and acceleration where as the downforce wont, no one is arguing otherwise.
Oliver Allen
No, they can actually help keep dirt off the rear window by reducing turbulence (and with it dirt deposits). It's kinda neat.
Brandon Young
Because they're built for speed, less weight less power same speed. They do however need downforce to compensate not being thicc enough.
Dylan Torres
Gee I don't know user sure looks like a truck without the body panels and box
David Jackson
I think you may have spent too long in your shop huffing fumes because what you just said sure is stupid.
Grayson Sullivan
jesus, the bait here gets more retarded every day
Jaxson Wood
Yes, it will
Did you really raid the thesaurus to post that and still not understand even rudimentary physics at the same time? When do you need traction? When trying to accelerate or turn. When do you need more traction? When your car is heavier. This is some super advance shit that only someone with 5 PHDs can understand, but I'll share it with you, maybe if you stare at it for an hour it will get through
-An object at rest stays at rest and an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force
Jeremiah Sanchez
>Because they're built for speed, less weight less power same speed.
you mean, less weight, same power, more speed right?
Carson Hernandez
Please stop posting you are embarrassing yourself.
Grayson Ramirez
m8 have you even been through a dynamics class?
Joshua Turner
>If a car weighs more it will be slowed down less by an impact, meaning less force is transmitted to the driver as a result of a change in speed. Holy shit you're stupid.
Fnet = ma, nigger. It's slowed less because the same force causes less acceleration.
Heavier cars might have more safety features or a stronger frame, but adding weight in random places has no impact of passenger safety. If anything it makes you less safe because it means the vehicle has more kinetic energy at speed.
Asher Scott
Not only do I have no idea what I'm talking about, the same goes for every single race team in every series on earth, both on and off road. The only benefit of light weight is top speed of course, has nothing to do with grip. But for some strange reason the only place people racing deliberately add weight is for top speed runs on the salt. Isn't it weird that everyone that actually knows what they are doing with cars does everything wrong, while an uneducated Veeky Forums poster casually thinking about something with no grasp on physics figures it all out instantly? Strange world we live in.
Liam Cox
So you're saying if you had to be hit in the face by an object travelling 40mph you wouldn't care if it were a brick or a box of tissues?
Josiah Sanders
At 60 mph a heavier car will have more kinetic energy, and more force in a crash as a result
Ryder Cox
Such a fucking moron. The damage to the body of the driver is a direct result of the change in speed following the crash.
Take crumple zones out of the equation entirely. If you hit a stationary 500kg object with a 1500kg moving object, the 1500kg object will slow down quite a bit, but a 3000kg one wouldn't slow down as much.
Luis James
Nigger it's not the KE of the car that matters, it's the impulse of your body's deceleration. As long as that weight isn't hitting you it doesn't fucking matter. Ever considered that you're the uneducated one?
Lincoln Murphy
>take everything that matters out of the equation entirely, and then assume that the crash is the type that constitutes maybe 1% of all auto accidents, and then maybe I may be right sometimes! Does it hurt when you think? Everything you are saying is not just easily dismissed by actual physics and results of all crash testing statistics, but common sense.
Jacob Smith
So? Impulse involves acceleration, not velocity. Heavier = momentum.
Lincoln Gonzalez
You do realize the aim of crumple zones is to slow the rate of deceleration in an impact, right?
You do realize making a car heavier does this exact thing...
right?
Kid has brain damage I think, go back to fitting FRAM filters kiddo.
Caleb Moore
Want me to write out the equations for you you dumb fucking nigger? It isn't easily dismissed by physics, it's fucking supported.
Jacob Jones
to put it in terms you'd understand, when the fat footballer runs into you (social outcast malnourished faggot) you get rekt and he doesnt.
Go watch smart car crash videos and tell me the lighter car is safer.
Kys too.
Sebastian Moore
This thread made me realize how little everyone here actually knows
Robert Nelson
The force has to go somewhere though, and if your heavier car doesn't have better crumple zones to compensate for its weight, it's going to get torn apart and you're going to get fucked up.
Acceleration on the driver is only critical in accidents involving stationary objects that aren't going to move when you hit them, like trees and walls - cases where being heavier doesn't change anything.
Samuel Price
itt OP is a troll
Veeky Forums goes crazy
Elijah Campbell
>The force has to go somewhere though Yeah, straight into the dumbass I rear ended.
Ryder Perry
>If you hit a stationary 500kg object with a 1500kg moving object, the 1500kg object will slow down quite a bit, but a 3000kg one wouldn't slow down as much. This depends entirely on whether or not the stationary object will move when struck - ie how much force it is capable of exerting on the car. If you hit a 500kg tree it doesn't matter whether or not your in the 1500kg car or the 3000kg one - you're gonna get wrapped around it.
Justin Moore
Why don't we just do a simple high school example so you can understand it. I'll even use your head on crash with an El Dorado as an example
Crash A: two El Dorados collide head on at 60mph. Their engines and transmissions have been removed and their weight per car is 3500lbs. Crash B: two El Dorados collide head on at 60mph. They are in stock condition and their weight is 5000lbs. Crash C: two El Dorados collide head on at 60mph. They are in stock condition, but there is 10,000 lbs of ballast added in the trunk. The total weight of each car is 15,000lbs.
Ye I should have said the 500kg object is movable, a Fiat 500 sat at some traffic lights, for example.
Christopher Price
>Which car is safest to be in? Stupid example because you're dead in any case, you aren't surviving a 60mph head on collision with another car no matter what you're driving.
Easton Cox
The El Dorado example wasn't mine, and I was talking about rear ending someone/hitting something that will move.
Way to move the goal posts, gutter sucker.
Ian Butler
Change it to whatever speed you want. Change the car on the right to whatever car you want, it can weight 200lbs. There is no situation in which having more force in the car you are in to disperse will help you in the case of a crash assuming the construction and characteristics of the structure is the same.
Aaron Ramirez
>Yeah, straight into the dumbass I rear ended. When two objects collide they exert normal forces on each other. The exact force you apply to his bumper will also be applied to the front of your car. Your car is heavier, so it will accelerate his to match velocity, pushing it forward into the intersection. That takes a lot of force, force that could be pushing the engine of your landyacht into your lap.
John Young
checkmate tripfag
Julian Taylor
>assuming it's a perfectly inelastic collision
Austin Lee
Top speed is more gearing and aero rather than acceleration and intertia. Sure, acceleration helps you get to top speed faster which is always nice, but I'm not sure what inertia has to do with it.
Dominic White
>doing more work than you have to for someone who already doesn't understand it
Robert Rivera
not in any universe. bikes weigh less than a car and no car has acceraion rate of a bike unless stuck bike motor in a car so i call bullshit on your theory dingus. old equasion: lots of power no weight = go fast
according to your BS a F1 car weighs as much as a bus
Lincoln Jenkins
In what universe does a bike have as much power as a car?
Dumbass.
Camden Collins
busa universe, nigga..
Zachary Gonzalez
...
Ryan Torres
Your bait is shit, sempai. Might I recommend mackerel or squid next time.
Thomas Taylor
F=delta(mv)/t whilst the car slows down less and thus has a smaller change in velocity, its mass is greater proportionally so the change in momentum is the same you fucking mongoloid
Luis Davis
>Weight has nothing to do with top speed Not true, a heaver car produces more normal force into the tyres, this creates additional frictional and hysteresis losses. These values are repetitively static and compared to aero have a negligible impact but not nothing.
Logan Scott
On the other hand the change in momentum for the occupants is less as they have decelerated by a smaller amount and there mass is the same regardless of the mass of the vehicle surrounding them. Look at what happens when a train hits a car. Both vehicles experience the same change in momentum and the car almost always has a better safety structure but guess who walks away.
Chase Russell
What a shitty piece of bait, the occupants aren't part of the car, fucktard.
Ryan Richardson
>but guess who walks away. The train *will* be damaged, but locomotives are so big that no part the car hits is really important.
In the example where you add ballast to a car as a safety measure in car-car collisions that is not the case.
Basically, while added weight will help you "win" a crash with another car, having actual safety features is still more important. Being heavy does not make cars safe on its own, but it can be a factor.
Sure just because some Jewish agency says it's safe you're going to pack your kids in there? Good goy.
Easton Lopez
>>>more grip at low speeds yes and also more weight to move, which cancel it out. Fucking retards, take a physics course.
Brayden Gray
Way to make the dumbest post of the year, in what way does more grip cancel itself out? Fucking virgin.
Carson Diaz
So you're saying that those 2000hp racing trucks are actually handling gods and no one knew?
Damn son Formula 1 see yourself out.
Jayden Martin
Way to miss the point entirely.
The GTR would be slower to 60mph if you shed 500kg of it's weight. Ever see those 2000bhp Vette drag cars? There's a reason they dump a bunch of sandbags in the interior.
Chase Howard
>The GTR would be slower to 60mph if you shed 500kg of it's weight.
No it wouldn't and I'd like to see you prove that it would. Unless you shed the weight by removing the prop shaft, rear diff and drive shafts.
Caleb Hernandez
>The GTR would be slower to 60mph if you shed 500kg of it's weight.
Adrian Evans
More momentum means more force is required to move the car in a turn. The force required to move all that mass is the same as the benefit of extra mass Pulling down on your car
Force of static friction = Force in turning your car around a turn.
Jaxson Watson
>go over pothole in heavy car >kill car and make pothole larger meanwhile >go over pothole in light car >nothing happens gee I wonder which is better
Matthew Taylor
>lighter cars are always safer because they have less energy to disperse t. tripfag