Should everyone have some of their money in Bitcoin or some kind of cryptocurrency...

>goldnigger nocoiner coping this hard
lmao

>GOLD and PHYSICAL assets would skyrocket.
Gold would go up but never nearly as much as bitcoin. Bitcoin will literally make you rich.
>Internet would prob be offline for 50% of the world if US $ collapsed.
Is this the power of american education?
Internet wouldn't go offline just because the us dollar loses value. You can literally find internet in genocide-ridden shitholes in Africa, or in places like Venezuela that are weimar-tier for how worhless their currency has become.

>American dollar fails
>Riots
>Power outings
>Communication outings
>no means to use your bitcoins
Gold and silver is the way to go, and it's a great time to buy right now too.

>uneducated retards actually believe that buying imaginary gamblecoins will make them rich

>uneducated retards actually believe that their paper note can substitute the value of my ox

Note: "is".

Just wait untill "they" ruin the economy by printing away our purchasing power. Nocoiners will be on suicide watch without exaggerating or memeing.

I hate the "imaginary" strawman. Literallt everything of value is "imaginary", a social construct. Do you think the laws of nature considers gold or precious gems to be of "value"?

Things are worth whatever people are willing to exchange for it. Applies to crypto, rocks, pinecones and used panties.

coping this hard
tough to be a bagholder aye?

> death of USD
> causing a meme to skyrocket that is not backed by any real value, only exchangeable against fiat bin and is a speculation scam

I'll stick with gold.

Got a whole bitcoin!

>technology and infrastructure aren't valuable

You're avin a giggle m8. Global finance has never been so interconnected before. The death of the Dollar is the death of money and economies Worldwide. All bets are off. Food runs out in the shops within days. Riots break out. States likely implement martial law to maintain order. Shit would be fucked. With all this going on people aren't thinking "Let me just buy some of this BTC which is now worthless since I can't buy anything with it."

Internet might not go offline but this would precipitate major conflicts around the world. International trade would crawl to a stop. There would be no safe havens, no nice home where you're pretty sure you won't get bombed. Modern society and infrastructure is so fucking dependent on stability. No fucking sane person would trade real goods for electronic bytes in a meltdown. They would move to another foreign currency in a stable, prosperous country, where they can actually use it.

I can't emphasize that enough to get that into your fucking autistic head, you fucking chump.

>Muh free market
>Muh intangibles!

No one said that you fucking retard. It's just that your particular idea of valuable technology is moronic. 10,000 rounds of .223 will be worth 10x whatever fucking coins you have when shit hits the fan. You should buy a 20-brick and shoot yourself in the goddamn face.

You forgot secure transactions without a 3rd party. Oops. You forgot global currency free of regulation. Oh jeez you forgot that digital fiat is currently run by big banks and that they skim and oversee transactions.

bitcoin is propped up by the american dollar tho

>I don't understand blockchain

Hey bro, you should call up Larry ellison and tell him his software is imaginary bullshit.

>Currencies fail all the time
Currencies with a fixed value (either against another currency or a commodity like gold) fail all the time because the issuers lose their ability to maintain them at that value.

Fiat currencies are much more stable, and almost never fail. The exceptions to this are where governments print money and immediately sell it to make foreign currency repayments, and the even rarer case of where countries are blockaded (such as the Confederacy).

Because of the lack of fiat, cryptocurrencies are extremely unstable. They can easily soar or plummet.

The USD is the de facto world reserve currency. People, businesses, and other countries will by bonds in USD at an effective negative rate of return because it's considered safe as FUCK. This is because of a couple of reasons I won't get deep into (big one being the constitutional requirement of the us government to pay all debts), but the collapse of the USD would bring the whole house of cards down.

That's also why the debt ceiling shenanigans in D.C. hurt the Feds credit rating. Suddenly the USD wasn't absolutely safe, only very.

Also, here's to (You) and Buttcoins.

>projecting this hard
I'll send you a postcard from the moon

>this is what moron actually believe
if you have still a job and still money you'll survive without any problem. Eitherway btc value will to to Uranus.

>International trade would crawl to a stop. There would be no safe havens
Except with bitcoin you don't need governments to do international trade. So, in essence, you contradict yourself while admitting one of the reasons why bitcoin not only would be a safe heaven but would explode in popularity and use.
>They would move to another foreign currency in a stable, prosperous country, where they can actually use it.
So first you say that the destruction would be global, then you say people would move to a place where there is no destruction. Again contradicting yourself. You are very confused and quite obviously a retard trying to rationalize to himself why he's coping so much.
>I can't emphasize that enough to get that into your fucking autistic head, you fucking chump.
You never opened either a history or an economics book. Don't buy btc, stay poor, and when the third world war comes, keep buying from me at 1 million per coin; I honestly don't mind. Uneducated retards like you deserve it for being coping faggots.

I meant that the confidence in currencies fails. Having fiat money doesn't make you impossible to go bankrupt: ask Venezuela or Zimbawe. With this I don't mean that your country will become a Fallout game irl, but that you'll have political, economical instability and people will simply abandon your currency thus making it de facto failed.
>cryptocurrencies are unstable
Cryptocurrencies have the ability to be broken down into smaller pieces of value. That is effectively making it practically unlimited. Crypto also espouse both characters of a currency and of a store of value. It's basically the perfect combination between fiat and gold.

>when the third world war comes, keep buying from me at 1 million per coin
seems like you're betting on a thing that only works with internet to protect you in a situation where the first thing to be taken down would be the internet.

>bagholder
>bitcoin nearing ath since 2013

I know nocoiners aren't exactly known for their smarts, but c'mon

> in a situation where the first thing to be taken down would be the internet.
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Nigger ALMOST ALL THE MONEY IS ALREADY ELECTRONIC.
By that logic your bank would lose your money too in that event. In fact, Bitcoin being decentralised means that as long as there's someone in the world with an internet connection, then your money keeps existing.
In a scenario where civilization ends completely we're all fucked anyway. Even gold won't save you if that happens.

Either way it doesn't matter. Bitcoin doesn't need a world war to succeed, it will win regardless of that.

you know the funniest thing? The only reason they can find for bitcoin not succeeding is
>w-w-well what if the w-world ends and we all die?
oh the ironing

If you really want to speculate on the third world war, stack up canned food, clean water, guns and alcohol, but not fucking bitcoins.

Also stop trying to predict the future. You don't reason that Bitcoin will become worth a lot, you are HOPING for it. Good luck anyways.

>I meant that the confidence in currencies fails. Having fiat money doesn't make you impossible to go bankrupt: ask Venezuela or Zimbawe. With this I don't mean that your country will become a Fallout game irl, but that you'll have political, economical instability and people will simply abandon your currency thus making it de facto failed.
I know what you meant, but you're wrong. Having fiat money, floating exchange rates and all its debt in your own currency does make it impossible for a nation to go bankrupt.

Venezuela and Zimbabwe had fixed exchange rates. Had the Venezuelan Bolivar been freely floating rather than tied to the US dollar, the market would have devalued it when the oil price crashed, and the country could have exported its way out of trouble.

Zimbabwe also had a managed official exchange rate. But they had the additional handicaps of a large amount of sovereign debt, government policy that disadvantaged foreign investment, and a government that regarded its main export industry as an enemy of the state. So in their case just floating their dollar may not have been enough to save them.

Fiat currencies won't simply be abandoned because they're needed to pay tax. They're also usually what prices are in, and perhaps more importantly, what debts are in. They're too useful to fail.

>Cryptocurrencies have the ability to be broken down into smaller pieces of value. That is effectively making it practically unlimited. Crypto also espouse both characters of a currency and of a store of value. It's basically the perfect combination between fiat and gold.

When you need more money, the ability to break it down into smaller pieces is of no help. The absence of fiat, combined with the absence of any intrinsic value, means cryptocurrency's worth is purely speculative. It's far too volatile to be used as a reliable store of value.

Btc or nothing. Network effect

All the other crypto are pump and dump schemes now and probably forever

>Also stop trying to predict the future. You don't reason that Bitcoin will become worth a lot, you are HOPING for it.
where the fuck do you think you are? Predicting the future is the exact thing you need to do when you invest and trade. Nigger YOU have to prove Bitcoin won't succeed, I don't need to do shit because it's happening right under your nose.

>floating exchange rates and all its debt in your own currency does make it impossible for a nation to go bankrupt.
t.mosler

>Zimbabwe also had a managed official exchange rate
So fiat doesn't exist, because literally every country intervenes and regulates the exchange rate of their national currency
The mmt niggers are just as bad as austrian memesters. When nobody accepts your currency and your own citizens use every other currency except their own, then yes, your fiat currency has gone bankrupt.

>The absence of fiat, combined with the absence of any intrinsic value, means cryptocurrency's worth is purely speculative
First of all fiat doesn't have intrinsic value either, nothing fucking does.
Cryptocurrencies are used as currencies, in a way that is much simpler than fiat money. What you have is a store of value that can also be transferred. Also that store of value can never be taken away from you, either by taxes or a hacker (inb4 bitcoin was hacked: no it wasn't, exchanges did! Which btw is deterrent to speculation, not to bitcoin being used as store of value). I can name a thousand advantages why bitcoin is better than fiat money. Btw a coin can be hard-forked. It's not impossible to foresee a future where an increase in supply of a coin is determined by consensus, and every single citizen contributes to keeping the network secure. That is, in the event of national cryprocurrencies. What you don't understand is that the world is going to change, bitcoin will be what gold is to fiat currencies today, and fiat will disappear as it is now

No, predicting the future and making trades based upon your ideas to make a profit isn't investing, it's speculating.
Anyway, please tell me what makes you smarter than 99% institutional investors that actually make money based upon data evaluation.

Do you think people with Bitcoins in Venezuela have an edge on those without right now?

Can you actually imagine realising (in the literal sense) the value of those coins through a local transaction?

>predicting the future and making trades based upon your ideas to make a profit isn't investing
I don't make trades based on my idea but on what I think will happen in the future. Which then influences my ideas, of course.
Keep believing smart people can't see things happening in advance and stay poor. You'll be buying from me at a high price in the future anyway.

Are you unironically this retarded? Considering their national currency loses value everyday then yes, you have an edge. Also the transaction costs (which in general are not even too high for african shitholes) are a lot less than what you would spend by waiting another day for your curreny devaluating 100%

There's a huge difference between participating in the market that determines the value of your currency and setting it at a fixed rate regardless of market demand.

The term "fiat" refers to the taxation that creates a demand for the currency. As long as the country has an effective tax system, your citizens won't use every other currency except their own.

Maybe intrinsic was the wrong word. My point is that gold has a value due to industrial demand. Even banknotes have numismatic value. But all that's holding up the value of bitcoin is speculation (plus its actual use as a currency, but that's not worth much as it has plenty of competitors).

>I can name a thousand advantages why bitcoin is better than fiat money.
How about trying to name a single unequivocal advantage?

>What you don't understand is that the world is going to change, bitcoin will be what gold is to fiat currencies today,
A largely obsolete precursor that's retained some speculative value?

>and fiat will disappear as it is now
That makes as much sense as predicting milk will disappear as it is now!

No..
Silver low after.

Buy bars

>There's a huge difference between participating in the market that determines the value of your currency and setting it at a fixed rate regardless of market demand.
not really. The fixed rate is also just indicative in the end, it doesn't change much when it comes to people participating in the economy.
>As long as the country has an effective tax system, your citizens won't use every other currency except their own.
Objectively wrong. People use different currencies all the time. FFs right now we are discussing about bitcoin which is a different currency and is used worlwide by lots of people. You are absolutely retarded.
>My point is that gold has a value due to industrial demand. Even banknotes have numismatic value.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Wow you are really dumb. Ok by that logic bitcoin has value due to tech and financial demand, seeing as blockchain technology has created a sector of the economy that affect both those areas. Plenty of financial and tech services are using bitcoin and expanding it into many use different use cases.
>But all that's holding up the value of bitcoin is speculation
objectively wrong
>plus its actual use as a currency, but that's not worth much as it has plenty of competitors
So what? Nothing says that the presence of competition stops Bitcoin from thriving, especially considering that the competition is getting stumped left and right.
>How about trying to name a single unequivocal advantage?
No taxation, no middle-men, security from hacking, partial anonimity (complete anonimity will be achieve in the future), low international transaction costs. Do I need to say more?
>A largely obsolete precursor that's retained some speculative value?
I should have said gold STANDARD. Bitcoin is the STANDARD, get it?

>That makes as much sense as predicting milk will disappear as it is now!
To you maybe, but people with a brain already know that's going to happen. While we speak banks around the world have already started sneakily buying BTC.
Stay poor.

> While we speak banks around the world have already started sneakily buying BTC.
Source. Right. Fucking. Now.

Cuz from my understanding, banks are using blockchain technology to create their own settlement system. They're bypassing Bitcoin, not embracing it.

Can someone explain the viability of bitcoin if fiat hits the fan?
I mean gold always has weight -- no wifi needed......

you understand that by putting together a lot of different news.
For example this:
theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/22/city-banks-plan-to-hoard-bitcoins-to-help-them-pay-cyber-ransoms

The cyber ransom stuff is obviously a shit-tier excuse because they cannot say it explicitly.

Also major banks like Goldman Sachs are leaving the R3 consortium which was one of the banking projects designed to have a blockchain for the banks without bitcoin

There is a reason silver and gold have been currency for thousands of years

Why do you think its held in reserves?

By all memes diversify into fictioncoins but dont be greedy, get the hell outta there on a spike

As USD collapses companies would search for a valuable alternative to prevent from dying.

As the USD is collapsing there will be bailouts everywhere in the world and people will flee to Bitcoin as a safe haven.

The US Gov is aware of this, so they also have an interest in Bitcoin. Thanks to Bitcoin we can avoid the world ending.

The Chinese also are aware of this, plenty of smart people are. It's going to happen, we just don't know when.

People that are inside of the deep inner workings of the US Gov. have to be aware of this, there's no other way.

You think they'll all rush to BTC, which is a new technology (relatively speaking), rather than going into Gold which has been used as money for thousands of years and has historically been the goto safe haven asset? Because I don't really see it to be honest. Not saying some wouldn't, but everyone? They're going to pass up Gold in favor of BTC? China is currently buying as much Gold as they can. Russia is hoarding. Germany is repatriating their Gold from the USA. Can't really see this changing.

>Implying Bitcoin will be useful if the USD becomes worthless
USD becoming worthless would be a doomsday scenario. Good luck making any serious transactions without electricity or internet. It'll be Mad Max tier.

>b-bagholder!!!!
Is this how you cope?

>gold

marketwatch.com/story/potential-gold-import-ban-by-india-could-be-biggest-bombshell-since-nixon-2016-11-22

Good luck with that buddy boy

>not really. The fixed rate is also just indicative in the end, it doesn't change much when it comes to people participating in the economy.
Tell that to the Venezuelans! The fixed value of their currency prevented them from properly participating in the global economy, and the real value of their money crashed despite the high official rate.

>Objectively wrong. People use different currencies all the time.
Poor comprehension on your part. I never said otherwise.

>FFs right now we are discussing about bitcoin which is a different currency and is used worlwide by lots of people.
But with the possible exception of a few criminals, none of them use it exclusively instead of their own currency.

>You are absolutely retarded.
Well that's the pot calling the kettle a nigger.

>Wow you are really dumb. Ok by that logic bitcoin has value due to tech and financial demand, seeing as blockchain technology has created a sector of the economy that affect both those areas
Financial demand is something that exists for all kinds of currencies, but for the cryptos it's very volatile precisely because there's no other source of demand.

You claim tech demand... what exactly do you mean? What is the technical use other than speculation and as a medium of exchange?

>So what? Nothing says that the presence of competition stops Bitcoin from thriving,
So there's nothing that can be relied upon to keep it thriving.

>No taxation,
Taxation depends on the country you live in / do business in, not the currency you use.

>no middle-men,
But it is possible to avoid middle men when using a fiat currency.

>security from hacking,
ROFL

>partial anonimity (complete anonimity will be achieve in the future),
How will it?

>low international transaction costs.
Finally a sensible reason! But as the financial system improves its technology and gets more competitive, that advantage is likely to diminish.

>Do I need to say more?
No, you need to think more.

>this whole post
not even going to bother with all your retarded replies. You are one of those people who will never see truth, even in front of them. When bitcoin reaches one million per coin you'll still be repeating that it's a meme, that it's bound to fail, that there's no market, that fiat reigns supreme etc. etc.
And the funniest thing? You'll keep repeating that while you reluctantly buy a fraction of bitcoin at 1mil per coin from me

>I should have said gold STANDARD. Bitcoin is the STANDARD, get it?
The gold standard was a catastrophic economic policy that held back development and enabled hyperinflation to occur. Good riddance to that largely obsolete precursor to the current system.

We don't need a standard - a free market does the job much better. But Bitcoin is too volatile to be a standard anyway, as indeed are all other cryptocurrencies.

>literally contradicting yourself in your own post
Why do I even bother? I guess there's a reason why some people's investments end well other people lose money. Some people are simply too stupid to get it

That's rich coming from someone who failed to understand that no floating fiat currency has ever failed without a blockade, sovereign debt, or lack of an effective taxation system.

You also seem to have failed to comprehend that the main thing that gives fiat currencies their value isn't even the fiat (significant though that is) – it's exports. But Bitcoin doesn't have the native user base to gain value that way; most sellers paid in Bitcoin will immediately sell the Bitcoin.

Bitcoin's not bound to fail, but unlike fiat currencies it's not bound to succeed either. It may eventually be worth a megabuck, or maybe just a few cents. As I said, it's highly speculative.

I was not contradicting myself. The apparent contradiction is merely the result of your poor comprehension.

>I was not contradicting myself.
you were, but good luck with your life and your low IQ m8

>the main value of a currency is export
ahahahahahhahahahahhahahahahahahahahah

I buy all my games on Steam with Bitcoin. Cheaper than both credit cart and boleto.

actually lack of trust interest and need would be the main reasons.

i would buy games on steam if they didn't install spywares on my machine

Another example of your poor comprehension!

Exports aren't the main value, they're the main source of value. Particularly in the long term.

the problem with bitcoin is that there's no one marketing for it. no one's invested in its success but miners and holders and none of them want to spend money.
it's great tech but no one is pushing it while big institutions are pushing their own blockchain projects

I got a bitcoin wallet but it's empty.

Pic related