Look, let's be real for a minute

Stop talking out of your ass, retard.

Mazda already said they won't be making another rotary car because they're focused on trying to become a premium brand LOL.

>platform
>Courage C65

So its actually based on a french race car..?

Man, that's fucking crazy.
But look man, no need to get so defensive. If they made a car that can't handle being driven around a track without exploding it is a failure as a race car. You have to finish the race. No matter how cool it looks.

>It weighed 675kg, which is only about 30-50kg more than an F1 car. This gave it a power/weight ratio of .66, or three times better than a Bugatti Veyron.

>Its chassis was based on an Le Mans series spec Courage C65 chassis.

Yeah it is based on race car. Sadly it got destroyed.

Source? Can't find it.

Everything I found says the RX-Vision isn't happening but that Mazda is still developing rotaries behind closed doors.

You are talking out of your ass again like fucking imbecile. But I guess you were there and now every little detail right, faggot?

Are you OK? Do you need to talk about something?

Are you implying that the Top Gear team somehow set the car on fire for some reason?

Nah all my posts so far have implied that you are a huge faggot.

Please stop imputing anything else.

>Top Gear Apologises For Priceless Mazda Furai's Fiery Demise
>Top Gear Magazine has revealed that they were kind of responsible for the untimely demise of the stunning Mazda Furai concept in 2008. In the five years since its secret death
>Top Gear Magazine was shooting the vehicle for a feature, and with writer Bill Thomas pleased with his stint behind the wheel, works driver Mark Ticehurst jumped in for the fateful run. Ironically, the photographer wanted to capture the licks of flame from the exhaust on downshifts - he got more flames than he bargained for.

That's the problem with shitposters like you, You guys never bother to google anything, just post crap like a monkey.

I am out.

It would've happened sooner or later.

>Driver downshifts
>Car sets on fire
>Somehow drivers fault

that's some wonky logic there mate

>not even Twin Turbo Inline 6

i'd nuke JDM

OK, so driving the car caused it to explode.
Which I already knew. Whatever, man, see you. Thanks for shitting up the thread.

>Mazda's been back and forth for years over whether they are or are not producing a wankel sportscar. The most recent deluge of clickbait says they will not, though individuals say they will.

My opinion is that Mazda has abandoned the rotary. I think they've decided to focus on the 4-cylinder ICE across all their portfolio in order to streamline development costs. The hybrid and electric offerings are far enough in the future for me to think they're just lip service.

>But no matter what, beforehand, they promised to have something to show off for the Tokyo Auto show. Do you think that's still on?

Could be something relatively minor like the MX-5 RF or a presentation of the HCCI powerplant.

>Additionally, if Trump actually manages to crash the EPA, will that change things for them? I don't know much about JAPANESE regulations.

Import tax would hurt the new Mexico plant. A strong dollar aids the Hiroshima plant. However, Trump has also made noise about the Japanese trade deficit and has quite a lot of leverage. Prior to opening the plant in Mexico, Mazda was the Japanese automaker with the least overseas production. A plant in Kentucky or Tennessee like their Japanese siblings would have been a safer bet, in retrospect. EPA relaxation shouldn't aid Mazda more than it would any other overseas diesel powerplant manufacturer and the rotary faces the same skeptical consumer sentiment that it always has.

say what you want, but HCCI is a meme.

sure it does/may improve efficiency "by 30%" but it doesn't solve main problems,
that is cars being pigfat;
average customer not needing even 1/4 of all hp while driving in a city and lugging engine;
pistons and rods weighting 430g each;
pumping losses;
being locked to one, maybe two cam profiles;

i personally believe that making high revving engine (non-rotary) engine with some kind of continusly variable lift, would actually provide more benefits to fuel economy, than using exotic methods of ignition, that are nearlly impossible to control properly.

>it's okay when mazda does it

>Mazda's just meming

>Because first they'd have to address this list

>Lists the main focuses of Gen1 Skyactive

I have a feeling the rotary will be their idea of the premium engine option.

IMO they axed of the Mazdaspeeds to make way for mid to high tier rotary performance cars. Surely something like a 30K rotary sports coupe is more "premium" than a FWD turbo hatch?

>>Lists the main focuses of Gen1 Skyactive
show it to me meemer

>people really are this stupid

Remember where you are. There's an entire thread full of people double-clutching for no fucking reason receiving replies as we speak.

He's probably the same kind of shithead that posts "hurrr apex seals" even though they've barely been a problem for the past decade so far as detonation goes, and doesn't know that simple compression testing makes it fucking easy to tell when you'd need to rebuild to pre-empt seals blowing, otherwise.

It caught fire because it had the wrong fuel in it. Or something.

topgear.com/car-news/concept/exclusive-how-mazda-furai-burned-death

I'm too lazy to read it again but here you go, faggots.

Race cars catch fire all the fucking time.

You gotta give props to mazda they went far beyond just making a concept mockup with the furai.

Yeah, like one of five that actually ran.

For what it's worth, all of its related vehicles look like very shades of utterly retarded, but the Furai is fucking gorgeous, and it's powered by some miraculous 4R god engine.

It might have had some rather...Explosive quirks, but it's insane that Mazda just ceased development on it. It was a god machine.

By 'R' do you mean rotors? Because I'm pretty sure it only has 3.

Rotaries suck ass. Any advantage they had in any respect is overwhelmed by the innately shitty design of the motor.

Emissions are bad, efficiency is bad, torque is bad, reliability is bad.

There is no reason to make your halo or flagship car a rotary.

Shit, you're right. I could have sworn it was based off the 26B.
Whatever, still, that it got 150 HP / rotor proves how detuned they had to make their production engines. That's awesome. I bet that thing was a monster to drive. 3.3333/1 weight/power ratio is fucking sick

>emissions
who cares?
>efficiency is bad
who cares about MPG? just buy a cuckmobile
>torque is bad
lol, sure, if you're looking at benchmark statistics, what goes down to the wheels is alright enough.
>reliability is bad
see

>emissions
>who cares?
Clearly you should. Why else would you buy a sports car if not for the environment?

>Why else would you buy a sports car if not for the environment?

JUST

... I took the bait. This has to be bait.

B-but the RX8 got 240 out of a 13b. 120/rotor doesn't sound that bad to me. Not only that but if my memory serves me right the FC rx7 had a 250 twin rotor engine.

If you think about it, it doesn't seem that far off.

Or maybe that's just be being a Wankel fangirl.

What if it's not?

>B-but the RX8 got 240 out of a 13b.
Really bud, that's 232 at the crank. At best 116/rotor, realistically closer to 100 whp / rotor.

>if my memory serves me right the FC rx7 had a 250 twin rotor engine.
...With turbos. To my knowledge, naturally aspirated it's weaker than the RX8.
What's strange is how much stronger the Furai is than all their other engines, even the last outing of the 20B, the Cosmo. It was a 3rotor with a sequential twin turbo setup and it still only managed 300 HP! And here we have an NA Renesis 20B 3rotor in the Furai and it manages an awesome 450, presumably at the crank but regardless. That's awesome.

It's a real shame if it actually exploded because of that though.

It ran E85 and was not really a true Renesis engine. It was a 3 rotor that had more in common with mazda's racing rotaries than the renesis.

>What's strange is how much stronger the Furai is than all their other engines, even the last outing of the 20B, the Cosmo. It was a 3rotor with a sequential twin turbo setup and it still only managed 300 HP!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_Furai
>450 hp (336 kW) R20B RENESIS 3 Rotor Engine
topgear.com/car-news/concept/exclusive-how-mazda-furai-burned-death#1
>The Mazda Furai growls threateningly on the runway. No trailer-queen concept car, this is a living, fire-breathing breath of fresh air. Under its carbon-fibre bodywork lurks an LMP2 Courage chassis and a 460bhp rotary race engine. Running pure ethanol.

Do we even want a new rotary? It just seems like their promise hasn't been lived up to. Greater power at a third of the displacement? Maybe before but they've just sort of stagnated. It doesn't seem worth it to get a temperamental engime that makes LESS power than its contemporary piston engines.

>tfw no RWD rotary coupe with electrically driven front wheels

>Do we even want a new rotary?

I'd say no. Piston-driven engines have been able to make great strides in the last generation by making the combustion event variable in time and shape to gain more productive energy at every RPM. How does one apply this to a rotary?

...

did you even see the cars that were at the tokyo auto salam this year????

i dont think there was any car manufacturer there

its literally sema for japan

go watch effspot's video and you will see that mazda isnt going to associate its brand or image with that show

>salam
If this is a joke I really don't know if it applies here.

turbo FCs were 200-215hp

double clutching is fun though

Posts like this remind me that it's pointless to seriously post on this board because everyone is a retarded underage nocar shit.

>ICE

The 20b existed in a time of the gentle men's agreement
Furai is very modern car that doesn't have to adhere to any production regulations etc
The 20b makes 260hp with the turbos scrapped and long intake runners by the way

I'm going to drown you like a sack of dumb puppies.

On the topic, is there any way to tune NA 13bs from the rx7/8 to get much more HP?
I've heard about using different Apex seals (like "sport" seals you have to get from Mazda, allegedly) but are there any other mods you can do to wring more power out of them?

bigger air and fuel holes

Traditionally the two options to make power with the 12A and 13B were to either turbo or enlarge the ports. Turbo put additional strain on the seals. Porting, like the performance cams of muscle cars of old, changed the characteristics of the engine so that it moved fuel and air faster at higher RPM but really sucked at idle and generally made even less torque down low, which is always a weak point of the rotary.

>no torque down low

So why not a supercharger? Too great of parasitic losses?

They existed as I recall but the turbo was much preferred. I can't give you details--I just had a 12A NA and was generally happy with it as my cars were already 25+ years old. The recirculating ball steering in both of my first gens was so sloppy I couldn't imagine putting serious HP behind the front wheels.

rx7club.com and racingbeat.com were the two leading resources on rotaries back in the mid-2000s and may still be.

RX7 Club is full of dicks, the community is pretty dead because of it. Well that and the fact that using the search function about anything comes up with 9 threads of 'Use the search function to find out' and 1 on the subject, but it's full of dead links/red X's.

That's a shame. There were some very nice guys on there a decade ago. I recall one metallic blue first gen that was supercharged, I think he was in Spokane but his username escapes me. LongDuck had a beautiful yellow GSL-SE down in Arizona. Both of those guys knew pretty much every detail about the cars.

IIRC, the 1st Gen guys were actually really decent people, I have an FC so my exposure to to the membership mainly pertains to that area.

2nd gen discussions about Renesis swaps are 'It's a shit engine, go do X port work and give up tons of gas mileage to make 160WHP, because RX8 guys only see 180 WHP stock'

Where in the 1st gen it's been done, documented, and there's even videos of them autocrossing.

I guess I got it wrong, lol. Nevermind.

You sound upset. Is something wrong?

They've said time and time again they're working on it. One retard with no connection to the project said it wasn't happening once in like the last 2 years. How is this a question?

Skyactiv-r here we come.

chews up the main bearings im not sure

They shouldn't NEED to have add-ons to get more power. NA piston engines now have like 700+ HP, is it possible to get a rotary up past that while naturally aspirated and at a fraction of the displacement? If not, there's little reason to use the engines at all.

>NA piston engines now have like 700+ HP
Yeah... When they are worked as fuck. No different to a high powered turbo rotary. Seriously who the fuck makes a 700hp+ na engine that "doesnt need addons to get more power"? You make no sense.

He's saying can a worked NA rotary reach 700hp because a worked NA piston can, so that's the only measure of a good engine.

Really idc so much about the numbers i'm more worried about how the engine feels to drive, i've had more fun in some 4 bangers than with shitty truck V8s. Haven't owned a rotary yet but i'd love to. Seems like Rx7s are going up and up though and i can't bring myself to like the styling of the rx8

A 26b can make 700hp naturaly aspirated without going crazy.
Mazda developed a version of it producing 930hp naturaly aspirated for racing, but reduced the power for its famous 787b LeMans race car.

Thanks, exactly what I needed to know.
How the hell do they do that? I wanna squeeze more power out of a 13 I'm going to buy, man.

Wich 13 do you mean exactly?
13a
13b-REW (RX-7)
13b-MSP (RX-8)

REW
Like a friend and I changed the cam in his car and it was an easy change that added some HPs
We were going to try to similarly tune a different friend's RX7 but didn't have the money to shell out for a turbo, but I don't know much or really anything about Rotaries...It seems like there's so few internal parts there wouldn't be much room to change anything. Idk

You could port it.
Changing the ports is basicly the same as running a bigger cam.

Wich RX-7 generation are we talking about?

Pretty sure it's an FC, just know for sure it doesn't have a turbo

Don't know what year, though

>FC
>no turbo

Befor I can help you, you should know wich car you are talking about.

We'll never see another FD3S type car.

The RX Vision concept has been to a good few auto shows but it'll likely never turn into a production vehicle, much less a rotary production vehicle.

Mazda probably keeps developing the 16x just so they can maintain licenses and patents on the Wankel.

take a look at the cars that """""""""""""made it""""""""""
into this years tokyo auto salon

youtu.be/UTzqMVN7jLI?t=886

do you really think mazda is going to unveild anything historic at this show?!!?!!??!

>The Series 4 (1985–1988) was available with a naturally aspirated, fuel-injected 13B-VDEI producing 146 hp (108 kW) in North American spec. An optional turbocharged model, (1985–1988) known as the Turbo II in the American market, had 182 hp / 185 PS (136 kW). The Series 5 (1989–1992) featured updated styling and better engine management, as well as lighter rotors and a higher compression ratio, 9.7:1 for the naturally aspirated model, and 9.0:1 for the turbo model. The naturally aspirated Series 5 FC made 160 hp (119 kW), while the Series 5 Turbo made 200 hp / 205 PS (151 kW).
????
Then again, I'm just really unsure in general, I've only talked about the potential project with my friend, and it's his friend that we'd be doing it with. So I've never seen the car in person.

Anyway Wikipedia says we got NA models so yeah

Where I live NA FCs are insanely rare.
I was just curious.
I suggest to use slightly longer intake and exaust timings and a small increase in the port sieze in the casting.

Depending on the mileage, you could build in new apex seals as well.

Alright cool thanks man
you're a pro

Just be carefull with the water ports, if you increase the port sieze to much, you will hit them and ruin the engine.

I don't know where you got that... the article says it caught on fire after downshifting

Youre fucking stupid and so is your friend.
Just stop. Youre going to ruin that engine.
Fucking stop

No? He'll fucking ruin it if he wants to, it's his car, not yours, faggot.

(You)

I bet you voted for trump
>its his country
>he will ruin it if he wants to

Difference is that the guy who owns the car wrenches for a living so I trust him, meanwhile trump's untested. Whatever though man.

Getting off track here.

The real question is, is there anyway to actually make the wankel an attractive option instead of a bigger engine? Is there anyway to fix the "fuel economy" shit that freaks all the casual car buyers out?

>RX7 Club is full of dicks, the community is pretty dead because of it. Well that and the fact that using the search function about anything comes up with 9 threads of 'Use the search function to find out' and 1 on the subject, but it's full of dead links/red X's.

This is what happens when you have a community full of people with broken cars.

first step is probably dealing with apex seals, or just scrapping them and finding another way of creating a seal between the rotor and housing, then they can go for a higher compression ratio for better efficiency. trouble is electric motors are taking over, there is literally no reason to cling on to the rotary as any money spent on r+d will be wasted when electric cars become a proper alternative, which is a matter of maybe a few years. even with trump tearing down the EPA, literally every other country on earth is moving to electric cars

>thread on rx8 forums
>guy asks about what engines can be swapped into an rx8
>thread immediately devolves into mods raging about muh doritos powur
>anybody suggesting that engines other than rotaries is immediately drowned out in autistic rage

>find thread on some other forum by the same guy
>same question
>everyone helps, gives him some meaningful answers and not autistic rage

RX8 forum : rx8club.com/non-rotary-swaps-196/rx8-v6-engine-conversion-255238/

Locost forum : locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=185939

memeritos are cool engines and all but holy fuck is the community full of major autists

“When another person makes you suffer, it is because he suffers deeply within himself, and his suffering is spilling over.”
-Thich Nhat Hanh

It caught fire because they realised they could replicate the flames consistently and so they did it over and over again trying to get the perfect shot.

Hardly normal track driving.

Mazda did heaps of testing with it without fault. it was only when it was driven in a manner that isn't normal that it burnt up. How many lambo and ferraris have we seen do the same thing??

>clueless kid makes dumb thread asking to be spoonfed (a STOCK mx6 v6 into rx8, really?)
>gets told straight how retarded that idea is
>"huur so cancerous"
what the fuck do you expect user.

and the nonrotary forum is just full of even more clueless people saying literally nothing that is worthwhile just to get their post count up

You did a horrible job of trying to prove the community 'is full of major autists'.

The anti rotary retard in the rx8forum saying its near impossible to get 100k out of an rx8 was the only raging autist... You dont know what cancer is you fucking idiot!

meanwhile Veeky Forums doing a great job proving that it deserves to keep the "most autistic auto forum" crown

i dont like when idiots talk shit
i have autistic desire to prove them wrong because i am better than everyone