Is the Byzantine Empire the most overrated empire of all time?

...

>Arabs
You mean Turks.
>Veeky Forums in charge of history

Who allowed the Fucking French to cuck them ?

>overrated
that would imply everyone having general knowledge of it, which in the US, not many people do.

high school textbooks usually only mention the Byzantines in passing, getting most notable mention in playing their part in the first crusade. before or after that, there's really nothing on them in your typical European History class.

At least, I never heard of Justinian or Basil II until my second year at Uni.

So because Byzzies were once weaker than "the west" that means they always were?

Are you insinuating that All of western Europe is the HRE? Because if you are that's retarded.

no but HRE was the strongest western power

Byzantine was weak all the time. Even a shitty italian city state could beat them

Seeing how mainstream, Westerncentric European history talks about it, I'd say it's more of an under than over case.

>Even a shitty italian city state could beat them
Venice was merely the mind during the 4th crusade, the Franks were the muscles.

And did the rest of Europe fare better against the Turks? Europe got its ass handed to it during the first couple of centuries of Ottoman expansion

>HRE was the strongest western power

"Overrated" doesn't mean shitty, it means shitty relative to how it is generally perceived. Nobody cares about the Byzantines except some LARPING autists on Veeky Forums, so it would be hard for them to be "overrated."

ever heard of third crusade?

yes, HRE actually beat the Ottomans

venice fleet could easily wrek byzantine. nice empire you got there family

I fail to see how the Third Crusade pertains to the HRE being the strongest western power, elaborate.

They had a bigger army than both France or England, and crusade fail because of the death of Friedrich Barbossa

>venice fleet could easily wrek byzantine.
Is that why after the massacre of the Latins happened, Venice declared war but still couldn't do shit because the Byzantines had a stronger navy?

its because venice trusted that Byzantine wanted to negotiate about peace, but they were just buying time until the winter came and the fleet couldnt attack, and by the time spring arrived, the fleet was hit by a plague and was in no condition to attack.

Seriously, seeing how Byzantines genocided the Latin population and have proven to be utterly untrustworthy, I dont understand why there are so many Byzantboos here

>seeing how Byzantines genocided the Latin population
MUH 6 GORRILION LATINS WHO DIDNU NUFFIN WRONG

>have proven to be utterly untrustworthy
Funny how this is coming from a Veniceboo, the Latins were just as untrustworthy towards the Byzantines. Even before the massacre when shit like the Venetian Crusade happened increased the Byzantine hatred for the Latins.

I cant really see how you can justify the murder of civil population. Are you a greek?

>I cant really see how you can justify the murder of civil population.
It's not justified, but you can see by the small things why the Byzantines would slowly increase their hatred towards Latins even when they kept giving them chances.

Why is Veeky Forums so totally obsessed with The Byzantines, the Ottomans and the HRE? I feel like that's all you guys ever talk about besides the general /pol/ shitposting

Actually it's the most underrated. I reckon most normies haven't even heard of it.

>HRE beat the ottomans

You spelled Spain and Poland wrong

well, for me it looks like Byztanines were backstabbers who first asked the latin for help and later betrayed them, even allying with arabs.
To be completely honest, I rather prefere the Ottoman Empire. At least they were honest and had actually power

>Spain and Poland
those countries are and always were jokes

Yet they did more against the Ottomans than the HRE

>H
>R
>E
>Stronger than the Roman Empire

Please kys

The only contemporary source for the Massacre of the Latins is William of Tyre. Contemporary Venetian and Genoese sources only mention great damages and an expulsion of merchants and moneylenders.

Venetians are the real life actualization of the /pol/ caricature of Jews

>Having a bigger army means you are stronger
Tell that to the Aztecs or the Inca

>Byzantine Empire = Roman Empire

lol

>denial of the Latin holocaust
nice try, greek scum

>Having a bigger army means you are stronger
at the same technology level, this is true, yes

It's Rome. It's not a separate entity.
Why the hell would you make this thread?

Read a book, nighty. You're falling for HRE propaganda yet again.

>muh ducats!
>it's another-a fiasco!

It was the continuation of a legacy. Don't be a cunt.

The West went full Germanic and Frankish, whereas the East was Greek. Since Romans emulated the Greeks with a hard-on, I'd say the Byzantine Empire was a fair continuation.

yeah except Roman Empire wasnt shit

I would like to know this too
I have seen more discussion of HRE on Veeky Forums than all my interaction with history buffs combined

It was the Roman Empire. Is the US not the US because the capital moved from Philadelphia to DC at some point?
Due to politics, the HRE didn't want to recognize Constantinople as the Roman Empire because muh HRE. Their arrogance doesn't make the Roman Empire magically disappear.

>What are generals, discipline, morale, army's rations, fortifications, pay, etc.
Do you just think having a bigger army counts when you can't feed it, clothe it, supervise it, command it, and so on?

this is your brain on /pol/

>the most overrated empire of all time?

Am disappoint Veeky Forums. How can we discuss overrated 'empires' without mentioning the pretentious and eternal Anglo?

Yes, actually. The Portuguese mopped the floor with the Ottomans routinely in the Pacific and Indian Oceans thanks to this badass motherfucker.

stronger? no. More stable? Kindof. The ERE at least made attempts to expand and sometimes succeeded. The HRE spent too much time banging it's head against Italy. Quite unsuccessfully too.
The ERE was very centralized, which translated into big wins or losses. The HRE was more fragmented, less able to project power, but in some ways more resiliant to invasion. Not that it dealt with much of that, since it was shielded by Poland, Lithuania, and the ERE for awhile.

>those countries are and always were jokes
>the first global empire and the dominant military and naval power of the world between early 16th and late 17th century is a joke
>the juggernaut of Central Europe who only fell because of their greedy nobles is a joke

Anyone who thinks Spain or Poland "were always jokes" should just fucking get out of Veeky Forums and read few books on world history 101. Hell, HRE was propped up by Spanish wealth in 30 years war and would get completely devastated if not for Spanish armies.

>overrated

>ask Latin's to build their navy
>genocide Latin population
>Latin's get mad and don't build your ships then attack your shitty navy
>FUCKING VENNIGERS

The original dindus.

This. Their only real conquests were India and Potato Island. The rest were fighting disorganized, unnequipped, emasculated-from-disease natives and the Boers who were always fucked.

We still had da most land mass n sheeeeit

N-no y-you dont get it, b-britannia rules the w-waves....hehe....
Anglo revisionists need to die desu

they were the foremost naval power for a long time though.
>india
>conquering
The first time they started to acquire clay relentlessly, the BEIC went from one of the biggest corporations in the world to a fucking joke.

>foremost naval power for a long time
How long is a long time?

How is the HRE overrated?

Crusade didn't fail because of that reason, Richard 1 decided not to take Jerusalem because he knew it would just get taken again anyway. If he decided to take it he would have easily since it was lightly defended after all the defeats Saladin suffered

It's pop history top 10 dick waving contests

it was HRE crying to Poland

You mean the not-holy, not-Roman, non-empire?

venice is gay

aka couldnt beat the celts like the peninsula could
>tech comm line maxes
>no control
>dissentergration/fragmentation