2015/16 Audi A4 vs Lexus IS 250 who wins in the long run?

2015/16 Audi A4 vs Lexus IS 250 who wins in the long run?

Audi never wins in the long run.

Scratch that, Audi never wins.

Audi has nothing compared to the lexus except for the better look

>FWD w/ expensive parts and maintenance versus RWD Toyota with decent interior

The only thing Audi has going is that you can probably get an A4 in manual if you really wanted one while Lexus only offers thigns in auto now.

Neither. They're both small engined hunks of shit.

audi actually looks good

>hunks of shit
>NOTHING LIKE DETROIT IRON, NOT LIKE THOSE GOOK CHARIOTS AMIRITE CLETUS

The only IS worth getting is the 350. The only audis worth buying are the S models.

2nd most le mans wins :^)
better interior, better handling, better looks, comes in a manual, faster... hmm hard choice

The audi looks better but the lexus absolutely destroys the a4 in terms of engineering and reliability
>fwd
Audi quattro is awd

>haldex
no it's FWD.

the a4 doesnt come with haldex lmao. it does come fwd if you get the base model, but then again youre a dink for getting that.

Only the RS (and not the RS3 or the RSQ3) and A6 and above models have proper quattro

Lexus because comfy, reliable and fun.

Haldex is still awd tardo
My b6 quattro was a BEAST in snow kinda miss her rip :_;

>Lexus
>Fun

Lol

t. bus rider

>Audi quattro is awd
Does the A4 get Torsen-based quattro as an option or only Haldex?

just haldex, whats wrong with HALDEX?

>owning an Audi after their superb owl cuckmercial

I literally just gifted mine to my female neighbor

In the long run? Chances are the Lexus if long run means reliability.

I would take my bet on the less stressed, naturally aspirated 2.5 L 6-cylinder engine in the IS 250 than the higher strung charged engine in the A4.

But then you're getting a laughingstock of a small 6-cylinder engine that only makes enough torque to get around comfortably and has no sport pretense whatsoever. All of the turbocharged 4-cylinder engines in the competition will be more pleasant and potent to drive.

This guy is correct. However the 4-cylinder models are more than acceptable for normal use.

The audi looks better but the lexus absolutely destroys the a4 in terms of engineering and reliability

What engineering is there when Lexus took the coward's way out of offering a small displacement 2.5 L, 6 cylinder mated to a 6-speed automatic transmission in 2016?

Their 2.0 L 4-cylinder in the 200t models is rough, coarse and unwilling to rev. Available only on rear-wheel drive models. Getting an all-wheel drive IS 300 drops you to a detuned 3.5 L 6 cylinder from the IS 350. Also still only mated to an archaic 6-speed automatic transmission. What kind of logic is this? It's 2017, their model, engine, drivetrain lineup needs an entire rehaul.

Lexus because comfy

Have you ever driven any left-hand drive IS for any amount of time?

There is a significant bump in the _driver_ footwell that protrudes where the gas pedal is. That alone is a very poor driving experience and should be a good enough reason to stop most people from purchasing it.

Y'all are plebs getting the inferior generation compared to this master piece. Pic most definelty related

Nice IS

hello?

>What engineering is there
not falling apart after 5 years like the audi

>What engineering is there when Lexus

Oh look a retard who has no idea what he is talking about.

In case you didn't know the engine in the Lexus includes both direct and port injection. That means you are not gonna have problems like the competition (Mercedes, BMW, Audi) where the intake valve get all fouled up and carbon build upon them.

That alone means that the motor in the Lexus will last a lot longer and have a lot less issues going forward.

Here is a picture of intake valves on the German competition. Your warranty will not cover that, by the way.

>gifted car to female
now you are the cuck

You said destroys the A4 in engineering and reliability. I've acquiesced that in the long run, I would take my bet on the IS 250.

However where is pushing the envelope of what an engine can do?

We're talking about sport sedans. By your logic, manufacturers should create an engine that is bulletproof and keep it forever because it works and is reliable. Read: most Japanese manufacturers.

Where is the innovation and drive? Other manufacturers are not afraid to start over from scratch and offer us new and improved technology. The current stock of 4-cylinder, turbocharged, small displacement engines offer more accessible power, broader power range at little to not extra cost to the owner compared to their 6-cylinder predecessors.

If I wanted reliability, I would not be driving a sports sedan. When spending at the $50,000 mark, I am not looking for a boring, reliable, cheap to own and service vehicle. 90% of the purchase decision is emotional other than budget limit.

Life is too short to be planning to use and care for the Lexus IS 5+ years with an antiquated drivetrain when there are more satisfying options at the same price point.

Every Audi with a longitudinally mounted engine has TorSen you mong

Please read my post again where I said I would be willing to take my bet on the IS 250 vs. the A4.

Please do not be insulted if I bring up the simple facts this and last generation's IS, in any single trim, were using antiquated engines mated to positively ancient transmissions and drivetrains. Compared to the competition which is moving forward with newer and better technology, the IS models are simply not catching up at all.

Regarding "the Lexus will last a lot longer and have a lot less issues going forward.". See my previous post: Life is too short to be planning to use and care for the Lexus IS 5+ years with an antiquated drivetrain when there are more satisfying options at the same price point.

When shopping for a sports sedan, I simply do not care for long term reliability when I will be returning the vehicle within 36 to 48 months.

Long term reliability is a non factor for me. Therefore I get to choose the best option available to me within my budget. And Lexus offers nothing interesting in this segment unfortunately.

Not anymore. Look up "quattro ultra".

not sure why you keep bringing up power/displacement as the lexus wins there too.
lexus just makes a superior product, that's why they hold value better. it's a no brainer desu

>more satisfying at the same price point

like what?

im planning on getting a IS 2015, but it seems that models after that are totally different. Is it worth just getting a 2016 model and pay the premium?

Eww, RIP Audi in that case. At least that will hopefully fill the gap between economy of the haldex and the grippiness of the TorSen, all time AWD is great but I can see why you'd want to design something like Haldex where it's off in regular driving. Unfortunately Haldex turned into a complete compromise, but this "ultra" thing seems reasonable, assuming it can provide AWD before grip is even lost.

I'd get a mint second gen IS F over a base new model personally

The IS 200t makes less power, is more coarse, is rougher, unwilling to rev, compared to any turbocharged 2.0 L of the competition.

The IS 300 is a detuned, bastardized version of the IS 350 mated to a 6-speed automatic.

The IS 350 makes less power, is barely as efficient as any of the competition's turbocharged 3.0 L.

I'm sorry but Lexus doesn't win anything in the performance department. They are using antiquated engines combined with old drivetrains and transmissions. The competition has left them in the dust. They are scrambling to replace the powertrain line up.

I do not purchase a sports sedan to have it hold value.

I would be very partial to the ATS or 3-series, both thankfully available with adaptive suspensions as well as manual transmissions.

The Q50 is a perfectly acceptable alternative if you can accept the significantly, to me, larger footprint and weight that goes along with it.

I do not find the A4 appealing as I always feel the back half of the vehicle being dragged around the corners instead of the back pushing the front around in the previously mentioned models. I do not find any run-of-the-mill Audi appealing to drive in a spirited fashion.

>3 series

which one in particular? also 2015 or 2017

>sports sedan
people can't seriously care this much about miniscule performance differences in base model luxury sedans right? IS seems to appeal to people who want a toyota with nicer interior/looks with the same reliability which makes sense. For someone who actually cares about performance, neither car will ever be enough. Like wtf are you ever going to do in an a4 that you can't in a IS? high performance tailgating on the interstate? makes more sense to me that lexus is starting to invest more in its performance models instead. I'd rather them keep the shit models reliable instead of adding "new technology" to the drivetrain every other year.

>"antiquated" drivetrain
I honestly do not care about this, why do manufacturers need to constantly change shit? what real world differences are you noticing between a fucking base model A4 and IS that justifies the lesser reliability/cost of ownership?

I wouldn't be buying base models if I could afford a new one every couple of years desu.

...

Vehicle functions as FWD until slippage of the front wheels is detected. It's not controllable and unpredictable, but advertised just as "AWD" instead of part-time AWD under specific circumstances in which you're already fucked if you don't know what to do.

>buying an overpriced VW
>ever

>buying an overpriced Toyota instead

So Toyota, or the European equivalent to Toyota?

Would rather the upmarket Camry tbqh.

>I do not purchase a sports sedan to have it hold value.
Then buy an audi and leave the proper rwd sedans to those in the know.

>We're talking about sport sedans
The A4 and IS aren't a sport sedans unless you're looking at their performance trims. S and RS models are a completely different ballgame.

>better handling
>audi
lel no. it's nota BMW

The IS doesn't share platform with a Toyota fucking imbecile.

Sounds like something Audi has been doing since 2013 with its E85-compatible 2.0t motors. They have a 5th injector in the intake manifold to compliment their direct injection system which fires during warm up on cold start for the sole purpose of preventing carbon buildup. It helps, but doesn't completely eliminate it. I've done multiple carbon cleanings on my own 2.0t motors from both a 2009 and 2013 A4 and there's just no getting around it on a direct injection motor. The only thing that helps is water/methanol injection, which I highly recommend.

If you want to actually knock Audi for something, give them shit for their piston ring fiasco which resulted in a class-action lawsuit requiring them to fix (aka replace the motor in) every 2009 2.0t A4/5 made, including some '10 and '11 A4/5s, Q3s, and whatever else came with that shit motor. They installed poorly-designed or just plain wrong piston rings in them which didn't meet tolerance specs resulting in massive amounts of oil burning. 1 quart every 2-500 miles would become the norm after 60-80k miles.

Or you could always go with timing chain tensioner systems, something which Audi has spent the better part of the last decade trying to figure out how to make last more than 100k miles reliably.

Or their balance shaft gears which walk themselves off the shaft, causing the chain to ride them at an angle, shredding teeth off of them, sending them into your crankcase to spend the rest of their life making yours as miserable as possible (although that one was probably my fault, with the bigger turbo and 100+ AWD drag strip launches).

Anyway I could go on, but carbon buildup is the least of Audi's concerns.

The current generation 3-series is on its way out so there are no significant differences other than the new engines in the latest model years.

The great thing about German models is their ability to let you customize your vehicle to the dot, however you like it. Assuming you are purchasing or leasing it new. Picking a model already available on the lot is acceptable as well as most dealers will have a broad range of options available.

Assuming North American market, 320i for absolute base budget, 328i or 330i for baseline acceptable performance and prowess, 335i or 340i if you can afford the price premium. They are all customizable with aesthetic packages, performance packages and every available combination choice of engine, transmission, drivetrain. Unlike Lexus and their bastardized choices.

I would test drive the ATS, 3-series, XE and Q50. Pick the options and packages you want and select based on budget after.

>people can't seriously care this much about miniscule performance differences in base model luxury sedans right?

They may be entry level, luxury sport sedans, however in the right configuration or combination of features, they are quite possibly more capable than the vast, vast majority of cars out there.

I do not ever want to feel the back wheels or back half of the vehicle being dragged around against physics whenever I turn. It's intolerable to drive that way. Therefore, I choose my vehicle to be sports sedans or coupes with a modicum of performance oriented design and engineering.

>IS seems to appeal to people who want a toyota with nicer interior/looks with the same reliability which makes sense.

That's fine, however this means the IS is the bottom of the barrel when compared to its rivals. I am simply saying it's a ridiculous choice given all of the competitors are priced within each other, why would you ever want one if you care at all about performance? This is why the average age of the Lexus owner is 60+. Older people looking for a reliable vehicle and want a pseudo performance vehicle.

>For someone who actually cares about performance, neither car will ever be enough. Like wtf are you ever going to do in an a4 that you can't in a IS?

No, of course not but this is why we have the expression: ballin' on a budget. We're all trying to get the most out of our money. The question is, why would you ever spend it on an IS when there are better options out there for a similar price? I just can't fathom the logic other than getting a reliable vehicle.

>I honestly do not care about this, why do manufacturers need to constantly change shit?
>I'd rather them keep the shit models reliable instead of adding "new technology" to the drivetrain every other year.

By your logic, manufacturers should create an engine that is bulletproof and keep it forever because it works and is reliable. And that's what's Lexus has been doing with their embarrassing, compromising engine, transmission and drivetrain choices that do not make any sense.

When Lexus' shit models are worse than competitors' shit models, you have an issue.

>what real world differences are you noticing between a fucking base model A4 and IS that justifies the lesser reliability/cost of ownership?

Then you are just an average driver who can't discern any redeeming engineering qualities your car has to offer.

The comparable 4-cylinder engine in the 200t models of Lexus is coarse, rough and unwilling to rev when compared to any similar engine in competitor models. It's embarrassing when the outgoing 2.5 L 6-cylinder was smoother albeit making little to no power.

If you cannot tell the difference between different vehicles then this conversation is not for you anymore.

>Then buy an audi and leave the proper rwd sedans to those in the know.

You may have me confused with OP.

Not to mention I have already stated I do not find any run-of-the-mill Audi appealing to drive in a spirited fashion.

My current vehicle is a compact, rear-wheel drive German coupe, I'm not sure I follow what you're trying to say.

>The A4 and IS aren't a sport sedans unless you're looking at their performance trims.

They will perform vastly better than any other run-of-the-mill family sedans. I mean, they are engineered, designed, marketed as sport sedans. How else would you describe them? If they weren't, we would all be driving Altimas, Accords, Camrys, Passats and the like.

They are not sporty vehicle, however the sum of their parts do make them better than what most of your parents would drive.

>I choose my vehicle to be sports sedans or coupes with a modicum of performance oriented design and engineering

a4 because its comfy and isn't an overmemed gookmobile

>he thinks his a4 is a sports car

>If they weren't, we would all be driving Altimas, Accords, Camrys, Passats and the like.
Well technically, if you're driving an A4...

I would rather own a Toyota for a long time than a Volkswagen just based on maintenance and reliability, I assume that carries over to their luxury brands as well.

Please don't put words in my mouth. I have said it is a sport sedan. I did not say it is a sports car.

Don't be a child.

I don't believe the Passat shares a platform with the A4. A quick search on Wikipedia says they are on separate platforms altogether.

>Is250

Kill yourself for wanting a woman's car lmao

T.is350 owner

It's like it goes exponentially, Lexus gets even more reliable then Toyota whereas Audi gets even worse than VW.

A sedan is a car captn retardo

Don't be a child.

A sport sedan is vastly different from a sports car. Please take note of the spelling as well.

A Panamera is a sport sedan, a 911 is a sports car.

I'm wearing a suit jacket, I'm not wearing a suit.

this

>a sedan isn't a car

retarded newfag spotted

I'm sorry you can't tell the difference.

A sport sedan is a sedan first and foremost. It has 4 doors, a usable trunk, space for 4, if not 5 people. They tend to be more driver focused, offer an above average experience. Available performance oriented options or packages. Generally all-around better car than your run-of-the-mill vehicle your parents would drive.

Altimas, Accords, Camrys, Passats and the like are sedans.

A4s, 3-series, CTS, C-Class and the like are sport sedans.

A sports car, please take note of the different spelling in sports, is a sports oriented or sporty variant of any given vehicle. It could be a sedan, a coupe, a convertible. It will make some compromises in your use such as limited available space, little to no trunk available, it may not have a back seat. They are for driving in a spirited or more involved way first and foremost.

You are clearly no longer interested in arguing the initial premise as I have shut down your every statement so you now nitpick obvious things you already are aware of?

Dude, don't be a nigger.

There's nothing sporty about an unreliable 4000lbs car sedan that makes ~200hp.
Sorry you drank marketing department kool-aid, but most people aren't that gullible or stupid.

pic related is you

>There's nothing sporty about an unreliable 4000lbs car sedan that makes ~200hp.

You are being ignorant at this point. It's like talking to child.

A4s, 3-series, CTS, C-Class are all under 3,500 lbs and all have near or over 250 hp.

Most have available adaptive suspensions. Some have available performance upgrades such as engine, exhaust and brakes.

You are now redefining an entire category of cars to not be sport sedans because of your random, arbitrary definitions. You ought to quit while you're behind.

>pic related is you

This wasn't posted by me, by the way. I'd like to be at least factual when I argue with a child

Pic related isn't me. I don't give a shit about what you're talking about. Idgaf if you call an rs6 with a mattress in the back a fucking motorhome. You're being a nigger and you should stop because you sound like a retarded person.

You're being a nigger too. Who the fuck cares. Go outside the both of you. Wahh you're being a child waaahhh. Guess what, adults don't do what you're doing. Get a life. Nigger.

>~4000lbs, ~200 hp, fwd
>""""""""""""""sporty"""""""""""""""


haha wow what an extra dumb faggot

how are people this stupid in 2017?