So Veeky Forums is the challenger the worst objectively...

i mean i only buy old cars but im trying to understand others motivatins

like do people just buy them because muscle?
would you conside 11-14 gt muscle since 15-17 def isnt? how about 2010-15 camaro?

The Mustang and Camaro aren't actually as comfy as their sole size suggests. No comparison to the Challenbarger.

so the compf of chally is biggest upside?

No Mustang or Camaro has ever been a muscle car.

The Mustang is a ponycar (get it? Mustang? Horse? Pony?) and it popularised the ponycar as well. The Camaro was a direct reaction to the Mustang's success.

>Comfy
>More horsepower
>An actual muscle car
That's why it still sells.

To give you an idea why the Challenger is what it is, for 2015, Ford engineers completely revamped the Mustang, adding IRS, power, great suspension and the likes, to make it a great sportscar. For 2016, GM did the same thing to the Camaro, lightening the entire car with the new Alpha platform. Meanwhile at Dodge, in 2015, they threw a biggass blower at their Hemi, made 707hp and called it a day. Right up untill now that is, when they decided that industry-leading power wasn't enough, and they added another 101hp just to be sure.

hmm alright, so just nothing competes with it?

as far as
>more horsepower
goes that i dont get
higher horse power makes car go faster
but a lighter car with less hp can be just as fast

The Mustang and Camaro are not big and only comfy relative to stiff-sprung hot hatches. The Challenger has an adult sized back seat and is good for long highway cruises.

The prices (at least in Canada) are pretty awful though. The 5.7 HEMI isn't much more powerful than the Camaros V6, and 392 models start at 50k, while a Mustang GT is only 40k.

when i think of compfort i guess im only thinking of driver comfort because of my 2 cars 1 is a miata without door panels and the other i just pulled the back seat lol, maybe i need more friends first.

>392 starts at $50k
but that's wrong.

t. $38k R/T 392 Owner

did you buy it in canada?

It does wheelies.

>Canada

Canada is not a relevant country for anything other than maple syrup and chinese-owned housing market.

You want a muscle car, move to America or stop asking stupid questions.

>reading comprehension

I said Canada

The Demon and Hellcat have so much horsepower their weight doesn't matter. Besides, what do you brag to your mates about: weight or horsepower? Thought so.

The Scat Pack with the 485hp 6.4 (392) actually starts at 38K MSRP in the States.

lel

>mobile posting
>a fucking leaf
Goddammit

Anyways, you don't get the Scat Pack, which is the 485hp, 40K USD steal of the decade. It even has skinnier tires than the SRT-8 model, so your burnouts are easier and cheaper.

i mean hellcat is 65k and lel deamon
weight always matters, why zo6 is faster than hellcat even though less power

i mean i would brag about quarter times to my mates, hp is one thing but driving is another.

camaro is faster and cheaper tho

Camaro isn't a muscle car though.

>392 Scat Pack Shaker literally in the screenshot

Holy fuck learn to read.

yeah but under that logic what is?
chevy nova?

its because its the "SHAKER" hood shit cost like 5k extra here

>yeah but under that logic what is?
>chevy nova?
With the right engine options, yes.

R/T also has a scat pack.

A full size car with a powerful engine

is a win because everyone drops out a win?

what are the sales figures on challengers anyway?

prob a lot higher after deamon release and fat-n-furios 8 but man isnt Chrysler having some issues?

mannnnnn BMW M6 is full size and has powerful engine but idk about muscle car.

Actually, it could also be a midsize, and often has been. Hell, some compacts were muscle cars, like those experi-mental Hemi Darts.

In short, a muscle car is:
>2 doors
>4 seats
>RWD
>big V8
>fun
>cheap
>designed for street/strip use
>doesn't give a shit about corners

An M6 isn't cheap though.

didnt say cheap at first i was just having a laugh, but man that list sure sounds like camaro and mustang

both are all those things while being cheaper and only thing that off is that corners matter.

He's right
Technically the Camaro is a pony car because it was created to compete against the mustang, same with the original Challenger
But since Chrysler doesn't know how to put the fucking fork down this Challenger is a muscle car

>doesn't give a shit about corners
That doesn't sound like Mustang and Camaro to me. Ponycars always gave a crap about corners.

>same with the original Challenger
The original Challenger was a full-size two door luxury car though. You're thinking about the original Barracuda, which was technically the first pony car, and then Ford launched the Mustang and dominated the market.

>But since Chrysler doesn't know how to put the fucking fork down this Challenger is a muscle car
To be fair, that's what happens when you start with an aging Mercedes platform. Imagine what Dodge could do if they got their hands on the Alpha platform instead.

No, I'm thinking of the Challenger and Hemi Cuda from '70-'71
You're thinking of the original Charger

>Imagine what Dodge could do if they got their hands on the Alpha platform instead.

make a camaro wanna-be?

The first Challenger was a trim package on the '59 Coronet.

Anyways, those E-body Challengers/Cuda's? Muscle car. Just go look at the kerb weight of a 318 example.

No, throw more horsepower at it.

and make your nose even heavier
like no doubt would be faster in quarter with 30 more hp but the nose weight could ruin all the balance.

>The first year Challenger was a trim package on the '59 Coronet

And in that same Wikipedia article not a fucking sentence later:
>From MY 1970 to 1974, the second generation Dodge Challengerpony carwas built using theChrysler E platform, sharing major components with thePlymouth Barracuda.

Which was the years I was referring to, specifically '70-'71

In 2016 64,614 Challengers were sold. The Challengers has decent sales and the dodge brand over all makes money, but it can't sustain all of FCA. Mustang sold 105,932 in 2016 for a comparison. Also, both of these figures are US only sales.

Just adding to this, the Camaro sold 72,705 in 2016. The Challenger is slowly closing in on being the second best selling sports coupe in the US. Chevy has seriously dropped the ball in recent years regarding the Camaro. The Camaro a few years ago had like a 20k sales advantage over the Challenger and at one point was neck and neck with the Mustang.

Because they look like over-stylized shit and try to appeal to benchracers.

Out of all those sales, how many were V6 vs V8.

>>Out of all those sales, how many were V6 vs V8.
Unfortunately only the auto makers know this. Every month all the car manufacturers release their sales for the stock holders, but no one knows the trim levels. I'm guessing that most of the pony/muscle cars sold are V6. For every one V8 Mustang, I'll see ten V6s.

What is best street able cam for 392?

LS3 cam i know i like because my friend has no problem streeting it.

texas-speed.com/p-79-texas-speed-stage-3-ls3-231236-640615-camshaft.aspx

Specs 231/236 .640"/.615" LSA 111

I'm assuming no one knows because no one that owns a hemi is man enough to cam swap?
or is there no such thing as streetable cam that has more lift than the 392 already has?

They're expensive and don't provide much more power than stock.

Canadians are the only ones who can afford muscle cars still... Dat oil boomer money yo.

for real? cause man you put a comp stage 2 on ls3 and youll pick up 50 whp easily. cost 800 for cam and all other parts then hardest par of install is getting motor out of the car

>people calling pony cars muscle cars
when will it end?

>You're thinking about the original Barracuda, which was technically the first pony car
It is the first and only fish car.

>cost 800 for cam and all other parts
That's out of this world.

You keep telling yourself that Chow-mein

from my groups ls1 build
cam 400
pushrods 100
springs 100
fluids/ misc parts 100
self install with friends cost a day and beer
then tuner you should have one at this point of ownership so remappin from my tuner is 100
all comes out to 800 not including beer

Meanwhile you can probably get whatever cam kit you want for a 350 for about $300.
You got got by the balls.

link me this magical cam package

Go to Nissan dealership and ask for gtr magic juice. Instant 300hp

summitracing.com/search/part-type/camshaft-kits/make/chevrolet/engine-size/5-7l-350/engine-family/chevy-small-block-gen-i

do you have a particular suggestion?

No because the Smallblock family can't interchange parts with the LS family.
The LS meme ends here.

cool ty i was like ready to link to the gen 3 lol

So let's say we have two cars

>both 2 doors
>both RWD
>both V8
>same price
>same horsepower
>same torque
>same 1/4 mile
>same 0-60
>same top speed
>car A can turn
>car B cannot

Is car A "not a real muscle car" while car B is true muscle? Because that's the impression I'm getting from this thread. Is a 375HP Challenger R/T more of a muscle car than a 435HP Mustang GT, even if the latter has more muscle AND can turn?

This.

My hellcat will dust most things south of 100k from a stoplight and is a joy to drive, and most people are scared to take their cars near the limit and I can probably beat them through the bends as well. It won't win any bench races, but it's fantastic in the real world.

save the defunct G8 and SS, none of those are/were big and comfy.

If it can't run on a track, then its a muscle car.

Muscle cars old and new are designed to understeer. Detroit considered this a much safer condition then oversteer.

Before someone gets all bitchy about the subject i'd like to remind you that it's not particularly hard to get any RWD to oversteer.

Point of the car is that you don't have to drive a cuckbox

It's like riding in a huge comfy land barge that hauls fucking ass if you get the right engine. You just don't understand it OP. I drive a 6.4 Challenger and the size is one of my favorite things about it. I wish it were even bigger. I've always loved fuck huge cars tho

Challenger Hellcat owner here, this post sums it up.

>96 month
Good lord what the fuck

'Sup, hellcatbro?

My old roommate is in sales. These guys will stretch out a loan as long as it takes for people to be comfortable with the payments. It blew me away when he told how how a guy financed a 12k dirtbike for 10 fucking years

Christ I thought my 72 months was bad enough. At least I got 0% APR.

If you pay attention, the auto loan market right now is mirroring the housing crisis of 2008.

Yeah if it's 0% it doesn't really matter but that one above is 3.4% over 96 months

>financed a 12k dirtbike for 10 fucking years

>10 years

Post yours pls. I just got mine and haven't had time to take glamour shots to shitpost with or anything. I got the 2017 scat pack w the Dynamics package. It's basically just pulling shit from the Hellcat. 6 piston brembos, Hellcat wide forged wheels, Pirrelli tires. I also got the appearance group which is overpriced but I have zero regrets because those small differences made it perfect. Manual trans, I didn't order any sound group but they put in Alpine speakers anyways.

>that beltline
how am i always disgusted?

all a challenger is is a giant cuckbox, dodge cucks your wallet and you get a slow fat pos.

>slow
youtube.com/watch?v=N6fc_LZLWfI

youtube.com/watch?v=6qItrfYVw-E

>NHRA stock bracket car
>8.99 pass
youtube.com/watch?v=7bfOtTwcVx8

youtube.com/watch?v=0lnEjOuQGBc

I've been so busy with work I haven't had a chance to get a good photo yet. My gf and I are going to the grand canyon at the end of the month. I'm hoping I can get some good shots there. You got android auto with your scat pack, right?

>not a bowtie motor

when did i make that rule?
i just said challenger is slow.

>slower than a vega strapped to a monopropellant rocket
ok then

Yes sir. Have fun at Grand canyon, it's amazing. Post pics of car and grill. I got Android auto, still not entirely sure what it does. I hope I have the time this week to really get to know my car and maybe take a picture. She is shy.

lol yeah
i mean when you get that blown 354 you build me one too ill be a Chrysler cuck with you but when R/T cost same as 5.0 and the ss cost less than the 392 I lel

I'm still kind of pissed off about android auto/car play. FCA said they would offer anyone with the 2016 uconnect8 a free upgrade to android auto, but now changed their mind. Android Auto is a way to connect your phones UI to the screen on your car. Car play is apples version. Take some pics when you can man, its fun to shitpost with your car. Half these fags shit all over Challengers when they drive shitboxes.

>drives shitbox
>looks at challenger
>challenger over steers off grand canyon

hit me up when y'all kill yourselves thinking you can actually drive.

>hit me up
Sure bro, lets race. I'll even give you a 3 second start lol

>thinks people need to take shit to the limit to beat a boat in the twisties
Nigga a 90's Honda could smoke you on any bendy road or track.

Your overpriced midlife crisis mobile is for fat losers who can't actually work on cars. Since a old mustang with a few boltons can smoke your ass from the stoplight too...

But whatever you need to tell yourself I guess...