are the LMP cars competitive against Formula 1 cars?
for instance, if they had a mixed race of around 7 hours, could F1 and LMP1 compete against each other?
Are the LMP cars competitive against Formula 1 cars?
Noah Miller
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Liam Cox
Speed or durability/reliability?
from what i heard LMP1 is still slower. for example there are some tracks where LMP1 and F1 have posted laps on the same configuration track. on Laguna Seca for example the fastest LMP1 car did a 1:10 from 2008.
a CART/indy car in the year 2000 did a 1:07. the current record holder for the fastest anything going around the track was a F2003-GA Ferrari F1 car doing a 1:05 which was .100 of a second faster than a 2008 indy car that also did 1:05.
F1 cars and indy cars have gotten faster since then. that F1 Ferrari was from 2003 and still went around faster than newer protos from LMP1.
Maybe the current hybrid protos would be closer to current F1 than the old days but i doubt it would even be close.
prototypes can have much higher top speeds than F1 though so on le mans (where there are long straights) they could very much be faster.
i don't know how long F1 cars can usually last in a prolonged race but It;d be interesting to see who would be faster around Le mans though. a high top speed prototype or a high top speed Indycar.
Aaron Fisher
roadandtrack.com
Read that. Basically, P1 cars, while fast and aerodynamically superior, have a massive weight penalty. They're about equivalent to a backmarker F1 car on a track that's not terribly tight and twisty.
Jackson Fisher
well Gran Turismo 4 lets you race LMPs against F1 cars and test this theory. The Formula GT series has no restrictions on car type so you can enter an LMP car. iirc the only way to stay close is to go really long on pitstops.
F1 and LMP1 are only comparable in terms of cornering speed and short braking distance.
The current LMP-Hybrids have their top-speeds nerfed by the FIA but are flat-out through the corners. They're faster than the Group C cars that had high top speeds but weren't as nimble in the corners. The Hybrids do better laptimes than Group C cars without the chicane on the old Mulsanne straight. So the new Hybrid cars are covering more distance in less time. and gaining all of that performance while using less fuel.
so no is the answer to your question. but on the tier of motorsports Le Mans Prototypes are one of the fastest categories that you can drive outside of F1. (not counting Super Formula or another single-seater series or rallying)
Adrian Lopez
Seeing a purpose built F1 Le Mans car would be stuff of legends.
Jackson Roberts
>i don't know how long F1 cars can usually last in a prolonged race
Depends if Alonso is behind the wheel. But to make the year on the engine & gearbox limits each will need to do over 22 hours with most doing more than 24.
The P1s were pushing a little past 340 clicks and that's well within the range of a current F1 car despite the aero disadvantage of open wheels. F1 cars turn better and accelerate better so it would be a slaughter house.
Ian Nelson
F1s would be way faster, then they'd all self destruct after 2 hours. They often fail during a 1,5-2h race so imagine a 7h race.
Ryan Mitchell
Around Spa LMP1 cars did a 1:54.097 this year, and last year Rosberg did a 1:46.744, and that time will crumble to probably low 1:45s or high 1:44s.
But speaking of endurance, LMP1 could easily win because after 2 hours of running an F1 car will blow up.
Cooper Gomez
Whoops
:^)
Jacob Peterson
If I had to choose between F1 and prototypes I think I like prototypes more than F1. Prototypes are my favorite they've always looked cooler than F1 cars.
Caleb Young
In an endurance race I suspect the LMPs to win, but in a 'grand prix' style race the F1 car would win.
The three 'triple crown' cars are all specialized at something.
The F1s are the fastest at the grand prix courses. They accelerate and more importantly brake the best. The breaking is what really makes them impressive.
The INDYcars are also open wheel but race both street and oval. Ovals have emphasis on top speed and not downforce or braking to the INDY car goes faster than the F1 because it has different aero kits and there is less emphasis on breaking. I doubt the F1 cars would be successful in a full Indy 500 against the INDY cars. They aren't built for maintaining 220+ speeds for 2 hours. And more importantly the INDY cars weight more because drivers need to be able to survive crashing at 220+ mph. F1 drivers don't have to worry about that.
youtube.com
The LMPs are designed for a third purpose which is to race for 24hours. They race in the rain and at night and with heavy traffic. Thats why they are closed wheel and have a closed cockpit. All the extra paneling though means they have different aeros and weights.
None of the three top performance cars can really do what the other does better but I think they could all race the same track and it would be about as competitive as the typical F1 race. That is, only the one car has a real shot at winning, even if they look kind of close.
COTA testing shows all three would qualify for an F1 race based on times but we all know the Indy car wouldnt have a shot at beating the Ferrari or Petronas.
Same goes for the other styles of racing.
Just for a last bit.
The Indy car is a v6 with 700 hp give or take.
The F1 cars are v6 with 650ish hp and a hybrid engine that gets it up to 790hp.
The LMP1s are 400hp with a hybrid engine that boosts to 900hp but that can only be deployed sporadically.
I dont see a reason not to watch all three desu.
Carter Hall
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Benjamin Hall
:^)
David Morris
>F1 cars and indy cars have gotten faster since then
this is not true, 2003 f1 cars were the fastest ever they are only getting to the same speeds this year
James Davis
I miss the v10's, and Ferrari's old v12
Connor Kelly
1991-1994 Group C is what you seek
Christian Fisher
>INDYcars are also open wheel but race both street and oval
Ovals aren't racing. Inferior american 'formula' discarded.
Lincoln Hughes
good question.
by current regulations f1 engines are required to last at least 5 sessions. however f1 can "release" up 8mj/lap from ERS , that means by lmp1 rules maximum fuel flow would be limited to 80.6 kg/h.
because even smallest and shittiest f1 teams had to submit to new "engine" formula. they have more experience with usage of fancy hybrid system, more downforce, etc.
i think that f1 would be 6-8s/lap faster than lmp1
Kayden Stewart
If I was a billionaire I would start my own fucking class, the rules would look something like this.
>Go around the track the fastest
Where the fuck did we go so wrong?
But no, the billionaires seem to be content with spinning their corvette into the wall every time the enter a race. Fucking Krohn.
Asher Carter
2005 F1 engines were the most powerful, 1000hp NA in race trim that's even more than the 80s turbo cars, only now they are getting back over 900hp with the hybrids
Ian Flores
you've clearly never oval raced
you've probably never tracked your car
Benjamin Ward
you never had your car
Jack Thomas
Wasn't it in some instances that a maxed out Sauber C9 could actually outperform a Formula GT?
Jayden Stewart
Basically NO.
An V8 F1 car in low drag set up can do 250mph without any problems.
A taller top gear and more power like with the modern turbos would push that even higher.
Their frontal area is tiny.
Daniel Flores
In the 80s on a long track like LeMans a group C car would dominate a F1 car. F1 cars didn't have the top speed.
A 90s prototype car would depend on the track.You can see this on tracks like Fuji Speedway that had both F1 and prototypes racing on it along with GT3 cars.
Julian Cruz
yeah I think it was the Sauber C9. i don't remember how exactly but there's a way to beat the F1 cars with the Sauber Group C. and the goofy F1 season would make you do Nurburgring, La Sarthe, and the Motegi oval with an F1 car.
Joshua Morris
They're faster this year, the multiple broken track records prove it
Luke Harris
burger ring f1 is what you need
they were running it there and on some worse tracks right up till the 1970s
Blake Collins
some how f1 cars flying trough the air does not look right
Samuel Rodriguez
not really no, F1 cars achieve much higher speeds on a low draw setting, the same speed with high downforce settings and can take corners much faster
LMP cars are only able to last longer
James Cruz
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Joseph Robinson
modern f1 cars would not last 24 hours
not without de tuning the engine
and making the suspension parts allot stronger
Ayden Evans
>down force ?
Lucas Jenkins
I don't get how racing at the highest speed possible isn't racing to you. Its a whole different type of race when you are going 220+ because your car behaves totally different.
Just ask poor sebastion bourdais.
Only yuropoor teenagers actually think F1 is the only good motorsport.
Joseph Cruz
It's 5 weekends including Friday and Saturday practice, qualification and the race.
Dominic Myers
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Jeremiah Perry
The older cars would still probably be quicker if they ran on slicks.
Josiah Kelly
wouldn't surprise me if an F1 engine could do 24 hours tbqh
Xavier Butler
Pikes peak no restriction class is for you then. Only have to comply to safety standard.
Grayson Robinson
F1 and LMP were pretty close in times until 2017 when they added aero and wider tires.
Brandon Gomez
>that horrible shiftlag in GT4
is it true Polyphony Digital were biased against gaijin LMP cars and sabotaged it in game to make the Japanese cars look better? or was that shift lag supposed to be realistic because of the Peugot F1 engine?