Why did, after WWII, Japan get off so easy compared to Germany despite committing so many atrocities themselves...

Because we needed an ally.

Morality != International politics, despite what America/West tries to argue.

They aren't under occupation retard. We have a military base there. If having a military base equals occupation, than Germany is still occupied too.

Being occupied by the US is a lot better than being occupied by communists. After WW2, Germany was split in half.

>If having a military base equals occupation, than Germany is still occupied too.

They are
That's what I said, both Germany and Japan are still occupied by the US almost a century after the end of the war

Let's see. You say Japan is occupied? Okay, then here is my list

1. Japan's fascist dictators and mass murderers and war criminals are worshipped in public.
2. None of Unit 731's participants were charged of crimes. A few actually became LDP politicians.
3. Multiple convincted war criminals gained high office in Japan.
4. Japan didn't get forcefully "defascistfied" like Germany.
5. Japan's history books were allowed to be whitewashed of historical facts.

literally nothing wrong with that

They are our de-facto colonies.

Wow it's almost like the Cold War ended?

My bad, I thought you said post-WWII peace.
But I still disagree that that can be considered occupation. And even if it was, Japan still got off easier for the reasons I mentioned in OP and expanded on.

>5. Japan's history books were allowed to be whitewashed of historical facts.

This one is due to Germany's own cuckoldery
The American occupiers doesnt force them to hate themselves

>Wow it's almost like the Cold War ended?

Never said it didn't. But you can't ignore the fact that Germany was torn apart after the war whereas Japan was not.

The crimes were commited against chink

Chink is numerous and no people cares if there is a few million less

Except when Americans dare to claim that Versailles was harsh

What you say? Nanjing no real.

This makes most sense to me. As a trade off, Japan is now very westernized.

American people are stupid, but generally the government ignores them

Ever heard of denazification? Read Patton's quotes about the treatment of German civilians after capitulation, shortly before he died in a car wreck.

Are you this fucking ignorant?

>whereas Japan was not
Japanese would disagree.

*tips*

>very westernized

Lmao no

>Japanese would disagree

How so?

>Read Patton's quotes

Because white folks don't care about chinks

Because you don't live in Asia and think they carried on business as usual.

For example, this idiot here says >
>MUH UNIT 731
A lot of big fucking Japanese names got the rope.

Tojo and Yamashita ring any fucking bells?
>Japan didn't get forcefully "defascistfied" like Germany
True, but you do know that Japanese society is pacified as fucking fuck? Military careers in Japan are seen as unglamorous and cucky. Don't let stupid anime like GATE and that new law easing the limitations of the JSDF fool you, Japan is pacifistic as fuck.

Japan dindu nuffin wrong tho.

>>MUH UNIT 731

Putting "muh" in front of a sentence is Not an argument

>Don't let [...] that new law easing the limitations of the JSDF fool you, Japan is pacifistic as fuck.
While it is true that Japan IS (still) pacifist, that law is a very dangerous step towards it ceasing to be.
Political culture and laws are reciprocal: Political culture defines laws, laws change the political culture; but once political culture is the last barrier towards militarism, because the limiting laws have been abolished, all hell can break loose very quickly, the moment political culture has changed.

In my opinion, there is a strong possibility that Japan may try to cozzy up to China in the near future, much like the Phillipines is doing now.

That's an interesting thought. With the US becoming increasingly isolationist and Japan still practically being surrounded only by countries with animosities towards it, they need to do something, at least.
It doesn't seem to be that they will manage to ease the tensions with the other neighbours, so they will have to try to find some new allies. China and Japan still have some territorial disputes, though, and islands like the Senkoku islands aren't just worthless rocks, but extensions to sea rights, like mining and fishing rights. They would have to forfeit them to China.

Something wrong with reading pattons thoughts on the matter? Whether you read about denazification through his view point or any other well documented source, it's true that the German civilian population caught hell post war from both the allies and the Soviets. I'm not saying it wasn't well deserved to some Germans like party members, SS, etc, but average German citizens surely were vastly reeducated, displaced, executed, etc.

Japan's occupation seemed to be a lot less violent to the average citizen, though they remain occupied and ended up Americanized to some extent as well.

Nothing like how the west and east Germans were reeducated and everything else.

The Germans got bombed too you fucking fuck
The Japs got off far too easily for their crimes

>Something wrong with reading pattons thoughts on the matter?
He was pretty biased on the matter, likely due to his hatred of Russians and Jews. Not to mention one can hardly learn much from paragraph long quotes.

Because the Americans needed allies in East Asia to counter the Soviets and - eventually - the Chinese and North Koreans.

>With the US becoming increasingly isolationist and Japan still practically being surrounded only by countries with animosities towards it, they need to do something, at least

That's what I mean. I mean, without naming any names, there is a major US presidential candidate that implied the US might not automatically defend certain allies if they are attacked. If you're Japan, and you pretty much have China directly in your face, and with the US all the across the pacific ocean, it might be a good time to start thinking about shifting loyalties while you still can. But you're right about the mining and fishing rights thing.

Japan surrendered before boots where ever on the ground in Japan.

Germany fought to the bitter end to absolute annihilation.

I mean, I believe your just looking at the Korean boom time and saying "WOW how unjust".

The Japanese actually had at least a million men after the war was over simply not come home after being taken into the Soviet Union and worked to death.

That and they were nuked and starving harder then the Germans ever had, with near total destruction of industry, housing etc.

A better question is; why the fuck would the American occupiers care about enacting justice? A Japan in ruins can't pay for it's own occupation. It can't act as a buffer for China or the USSR. It would just suck up resources. Not rebuilding Japan makes no sense.

>The Japs got off far too easily for their crimes

At some point the killing has to stop otherwise you just have an endless cycle of retaliating for atrocities which were committed to retaliate for other atrocities. Or as somebody once said: an eye for an eye makes the entire world go blind.

probably had to do with them having the sense to surrender. might have been a lot uglier if someone had to actually fight their way to the capital.

>4. Japan didn't get forcefully "defascistfied" like Germany.

Not true at all, many shinto practices associated with the state were discouraged and the media was subject to heavy censorship. The germans chose to censor themselves to the extent they do.

1. Because the Germans killed jews and there were a lot of high ranking jews in the Allied governments. While the Japanese killed "literally who" ethnicities.

2. Everybody in Europe was interested in what happened to Germany so that it's occupation was argued over relentlessly by the countries it invaded. While Japan just dealt with the Americans.

>many shinto practices associated with the state were discouraged

The only Shinto practice/belief that was suppressed was the idea that the Emperor was descended from the gods, though.

>muh narritive
Nope, they actually mistakenly identified the Japanese problem as the same of the germans.

These three alleged doctrines were specifically banned: (1) that the Emperor is superior to other rulers because he is descended of the sun goddess Amaterasu; (2) that the Japanese people are inherently superior to other peoples by their special ancestry or heritage, or (3) that the Japanese islands are spiritually superior to other lands, being specially blessed by the goddess Amaterasu.

additionally there's this:
All teachers' manuals and text-books now in use in any educational institution supported wholly or in part by public funds will be censored, and all Shinto doctrine will be deleted. No teachers' manual or text-book which is published
in the future for use in such institutions will contain any Shinto doctrine.

It's not that japan got off easy, it's that germany was villified, and yes, this has a lot to do with the jews and hollywood, coming from somebody who could care less about jews and niggers and general /pol/ material.

japan has done wonders with it's education when it comes to WWII though. "it happened, we got nuked, next chapter".

Fuck off, all responsible for leadership decisions in Japan in WWII should have been hanged

>"it happened, we got nuked, next chapter".
Germany: 46,268.64 USD (2013)
Japan: 38,633.71 USD (2013)

Yeah he preferred German people to Russians indeed, so he is biased. I don't know how antisemitic he was, but my point is that he thought the allies effort to effectively passify Germany for the forseeable future went too far in its brutality. I merely offered his view, biased or not, because it was contemporary and he was part of the allies high command until his demotion.

Either way my point remains that the Japanese were not nearly as culturally changed by post war occupation, though they too were heavily disarmed.

1. Germany took the fall as the big justification for WW2 with the holocaust
2. The Japanese were needed as a capitalist ally
3. Geographically the Japanese are far around and surrounded by insignificant Asians who's feelings didn't matter to the west, unlike Germany surrounded by Europeans who are the west
4. For all of Japans crimes and atrocities, they didn't actually try to wipe an entire people off the planet through systematic murder

>For all of Japans crimes and atrocities, they didn't actually try to wipe an entire people off the planet through systematic murder

user, I have some bad news for you......

maybe you should be hanged

the english and the americans are guilty parties because they kept instigating germany financially. also, they denied germany the right to rescue german ethnics from genocide in poland.

FDR, for example, was literally on a cruise during some of the most critical negotiations. there's evidence that he and alger hiss wanted to see europe destroyed so they could buy out europe. which is exactly what happened.

or you can look at the morgenthau plan, which saw half of all the factories in germany demolished for... what purpose?

oh, right, to make room in the german market for american goods

kill yourself

lol just kill yourself

fucking nazi conpiracy theroist

Gönn dir etwas Bildung du degeneriertes Stück Scheiße.

>or you can look at the morgenthau plan, which saw half of all the factories in germany demolished for... what purpose?

So that the Germans wouldn't be able to the wreck the entire continent again?

German is such a disgusting language.

No wonder they want to exterminate everything.

I'm less pro nazi and more anti-american exceptionalism.

americans wreck 9/10 countries they reconstruct. it's either gross incompetence which should be punished for its arrogance, or malevolent.

they got their factories back once americans had turned a nice profit, and started becoming afraid of the soviets.

What japan did in china was barbaric, but there was no plan to exterminate all the world's chinese people. Or are you some edgy memelord claiming the holocaust didn't happen?

Conspiracy theories?

I'm not the guy you responded to but if you think there were no financial motives for the second world war you are just naive. Call Hitler the antichrist if you want, but things are rarely black and white. It isn't a coincidence that Britain, the financial capitol of the world at the time, had serious grievances against Hitler and his new fiscal policy that built up German manufacturing and brought it out of the depression and into the realm of a continental super power.

Hitler may have been delusional in blaming the British financial cabal on Jews and freemasonry, but he didn't portray Jews in his propoganda posters as fat, ugly, rich financiers because he dreamt about it one night.

You should read some Carroll Quigley, like Tragedy and Hope, or The Anglo-American Establishment. Those books should give you better insight into the financial motives of the war, which should be glaringly obvious as no war is fought without financial benefit as the motive. Like England and France gave enough of a shit about Poland to start a war that would kill millions in order to defend it, not even bringing to mind that they allied with the USSR that also invaded Poland a mere week or two after Hitler.

>It isn't a coincidence that Britain, the financial capitol of the world at the time, had serious grievances against Hitler and his new fiscal policy that built up German manufacturing and brought it out of the depression and into the realm of a continental super power.

Except Britain didn't declare war until after Germany invade Poland. Try again.

>americans wreck 9/10 countries they reconstruct.
carnegieendowment.org/files/Policybrief24.pdf
Going by this they have a 26% (four out of fifteen cases) success rate when it comes to nation building.

I never said they did. Read more carefully. Also take note of what you just said, Britain and France declared war on Germany, not the other way around.

Tell me, why didn't they declare war on the Soviets as well once they invaded Poland?

>ctrl+f "pol"
>Nobody being told to go back to /pol/.

What the fuck?

Maybe you should fuck off to Facebook. Not every discussion about WWII has to do with /pol/.

Go take your hurt feelings somewhere else, discourse is allowed and welcome on this board.

Almost every WWII discussion involves somebody getting triggered (read: you) and demanding somebody go back to /pol/. I was attempting humor but clearly your autism is too powerful to pick up and even the simplest social cues

Social cues don't transfer in text, in the midst of serious discussions. But you were just pretending to be retarded so it's all good, right?

Which they deserved

>firebombings 1942
Firebombing didn't begin until 1943.

The nuking of Japan was for the Russians. They got off easy because of the experiments. We also needed an eastern base to monitor the russians.

>The nuking of Japan was for the Russians
Can we end this myth please?

you say this, most likely, from a western perspective. our media did not care at all, simply enough.

however it is true for sure that the Japanese got off better than the Germans did. your notion of Germans being "instilled with a sense of guilt and self-hate" is completely wrong though.

here is what happened:

after Germany was divided by the winners of the war, politicians mostly did not change. you also head the same elites as you did during the nazi time, with the only difference being that those killed off during the nuremberg trials were not there anymore.

most of the former NSDAP members just joined CDU and CSU. even 'til the 60s and 70s there were actual nazi politicians still active in high positions in German politics.

this later led to the horrible acts of the RAF, red army faction.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanns_Martin_Schleyer

truth is, most Germans did not feel guilt. additionally many of them still had NSDAP propaganda deeply ingrained in them.

you can ask every German that still has grandparents, especially the grandfathers. if they talk about the Hitlerjugend it is always in a positive light, as was the case for my grandpa.

the sense of guilt came from a younger generation who loathed their parents for what they did - for good reason. their problem was not so much the war crimes, but the silent acceptance of said crimes.

the fact that much of the nazi-thought (and many of the personnel) existed even in universities still is what led to the '68 student movement.

the Weimar republic was certainly a democratic system alright, but Hitler's rise to power was not democratic.

even the Wikipedia article explains that so I urge you to read up on it.

you are an ignoramus and a fool. American presence in Germany is a bunch of hot air. same goes for Japan.

if you wanted to make a point you could have said that South Korea is a American colony and maybe I would have agreed, but now you just look ridiculous.

I have lived in all three of those countries, how about you?

simply embarrassing

you are completely right in what you are saying and the other user is clearly an idiot for not wanting to educate himself, but please consider this

this is wrong in every way imagineable

the only reason why the nukes were dropped in the first place is because utilitarianists think tanks in the US were expecting the Japanese not to forfeit at all, which turned out to be wrong.

read some Rilke you pleb

>Why did, after WWII, Japan get off so easy compared to Germany
They got nuked, 先輩.

Reminder he said after.

Also the firebombings did more damage anyway.

>Also the firebombings did more damage anyway.
Only because US didn't nuke the largest cities. A nuke in Tokyo would have devasted the fuck out of it and made Meetinghouse look like a campfire.

Tokyo was already devastated.

Germans performed firebombings in 1942 in Murmansk and Stalingrad

Hitler rise to power was not democratic, yet he was elected...

We aren't discussing the Eastern Front. Firebombings didn't start in the Pacific until Spring of '43.

Japan had a more democratic system than Germany. They were an executive monarchy and unlike in Germany, the elected officials could and did overrule the dictator/Emperor.

Hitler wasn't elected. He was appointed because people were threatening civil war.

>they are naturally shielded from outside influences in that way.
Are you serious? Do you have any idea how anglicized their language has become, how much more western they are than they were in WWII? I'm not sure of the real number but an unbelievably large portion of the language are English loan words. They almost have a worship of the English language there.

Versailles was harsh considering the fact that Germany did nothing wrong and it was the Russians who started WW1.

Thanks for the post.

This.

USA scared of Soviet, because it could win a WW3.
Japan didn't get off easy, and there was rationing, mass starvation, war crimes, and social unrest because of this, far into the 70s