I am searching for a new car, but because i live in a country with dumb HP tax laws, i can't get a car with a lot of HP.
So i want to know if you guys and girls know cars which might not have a lot of power, but are still fast (HP limit 170).
Please no dumb comments from Burgerkangz about Europoor stuff, it's cringe.
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Old lotus Elise.
But for a serious answer, you probably want a hot hatch of some sort. Get one with a turbo so you can crank the boost, add fuel, and make more than 170hp while paying the lower registration price.
If you are limited in hp, try to find something with lots of torque like an inline 6 engine
Thank you for that great answer.
Yes a hot hatch turbo would be great, and as you wrote i could make it faster without having to pay more tax.
I heard you can tune a 1.4 TSI Scirocco with 160 BHP up to 200 BHP, with the original Turbo.
Can you get the 1.4t in a Polo where you live. The lighter chassis will be much quicker.
Eurofag here with banter, move to none cucked europoor country.
The Netherlands only calculates tax based on fuel type and curb weight. They don't give a crap about emissions, no cat if it's old enough, engine size, turbo or power here. Insurance is beneficial for an Veeky Forumstist: a 110hp miata is cheaper to insure than a 75hp golf or civic. Civic coupe is cheaper than hatch. For a 20 year old with no accident free years insurance is 65€/month for a 110hp miata, 85€/month for a 115hp civic coupe, 95€/month for 75hp civic hatch and 105€/month for a 75hp golf.
Also 25 year old petrol cars get 75% tax reduction and cheaper insurance if you don't drive during winter.
In taxes, a Miata without reduction is 90€ per 3 months, golf 3 and pre '99 civic is 110€ per 3 months and '99 and later civic is 130€ per 3 months.
Most 20 year old cars in decent condition are €1000 to €2000, miata na and nb are €3000 to €5000.
Now more seriously
If you want to cheaply and secretly upgrade a turbo car, look at volvo 940s (with lpg if you can) with the b230fk engine. 135hp stock, were also sold with 170hp with same turbo, can be tuned up to 400hp with just a wastegate
Well the only options i have in my country (inline 6 wise), are old Bimmers (E36, E46, E34, E39) and (i am not kidding) a Chevrolet Epica 2.5l.
Do you know some other ones?
Thanks for the info, i don't really want to leave my country because of that though.
I think the best country in Europe for car fags is Germany.
For example for 170KW i would have to pay 1200€ hp tax only (insurance 580€).
I Germany you pay for the same HP 200€ a year.
And thank for the Volvo info, i am going to check that out.
They are dirt cheap here!
Toyota MR-S
it's less than 1000kg
>They don't give a crap about emissions, no cat if it's old enough, engine size, turbo or power here.
"Old enough" being 40 years.
Also no twisties anywhere and some of the highest fuel prices in the world.
Besides that yeah, it's not too bad.
Thanks sounds good!
lol are you portuguese
EK Civic VTi/Type R (if you're going to splash a little more cash)?
Nope, Austrian!
VW's 1.8T can easily hit 200hp with just a tune, even in basic bitch 150hp trim.
>inline 6
>torque
Safest bet would be some shitty Audi, VW, or Ford with a 2 liter turbo diesel and then run higher boost.
Na dann irgendein VAG TDI und chippen. Wenn dir Treibstoff und Antriebsart egal sind.
Is the tax law counted only in HPs? If so, get a turbo diesel.
Newer 2 liter diesels should hit around the 173 mark and older 3 liter are there also.
If you insist on gasoline engined car, then something like Fiat Grande Punto Abarth(155hp in a 1015-1040kg car) or some similar hot hatch.
If money isn´t an issue, a Caterham Super 7.
Ja das is schon einfacher, aber ich mag den Diesel sound nicht (Klingt wie ein For Transit van oder ein Traktor).
Ich glaub VAG benziner turbos würden gehen.
Unironischer Punto Abarth
>günstig
>zuverlässiger motor
>sieht fesch aus
>großer aftermarkted
Die Haltbarkeit aber...
Wobei, die modernen VW Turbobenziner sind auch ziemlich fragwürdig...
>Die Haltbarkeit aber
die packen 200k+ km kollege, fall nicht auf die maymeys rein
Ganz im ernst, ein E46 320er. Der Motor reisst natürlich keine Bäume aus, jeder 1.6er TDI fährt dir davon. Aber er dreht so wunderschön raus und hat nach 4k rpm auch noch brauchbares Drehmoment. Außerdem wird dich der Motor nie im Stich lassen und das Chassis ist so gut balanciert, kaum ein Auto fährt sich spaßiger. Für einen Schönen musst du aber fast in Deutschland schauen.
Acknowledged.
45 years means no tax or inspections at all. Cat is not mandatory if your car didn't come with it originally. Only exception to emissions is if you have an petrol ecoshit with extremely low emissions, then you get a tax reduction. Having a murican v8 gassing more than a certain austrian dude doesn't increase your tax compared to a 10 yo 1.0 3 banger if the curb weight would be the same.
I have to agree on high fuel prices and lack of twisties though. There are somewhat twisty roads on the Veluwe and in the south but they still are flat compared to a toe gay.
Volvos are great sleeper tuners, got a one as a project car / winter beater. Bought a €25 ebay wastegate, replaced the rear shocks and springs with a set designed for use in a (volvo) hearse, put a second sway bar in the front and a strengthened one in the back.
Keep in mind to use the oem turbo exhaust (or equivalent diameter), the one for the n/a gives a noticeable power reduction. Also get one with the 16 inch rims (5 spoke) or get aftermarket ones, I use 15 inchers for my winter tires and they are much more wobbly.
It set the wastegate to approximately +1 bar, the low pressurer turbo has +0,3. The 1,3 bar in total gives me somewhere around 250hp I think. Stock transmission is great, strong enough to handle as much power as you can get out of the engine and even after 700k km the synchros work perfectly at any speed.
Don't be scared of high mileage, the engines are so underpowered they don't show signs of wear after a half million km. Plus their pretty much indestructible, sure some parts can break but they're always something cheap and easy to repair, most of the time it can limp home or to a parking lot at least. (Did the last with a blown water pump) They're noninterference so even if the timing belt breaks, nothing gets damaged and you could run on 91 if it were available. Just get one with lpg though or the gas mileage is insufferable.
If you aren't dead set on petrol, you could get a BMW or Alfa Romeo diesel car. You'll have a fuck ton of torque even with not that much power, and you can remap them for at least 30 hp more very cheap (a few hundred €).
>There are somewhat twisty roads on the Veluwe and in the south but they still are flat compared to a toe gay.
>tfw up north where there's only many acres of flat land
A-at least the TT circuit is 15 minutes away
>VW 1.8 Turbo engines (the 20V ones)
They have a reputation od´f being an indestructible powerhouse with just an ECU tune. Found in older VW and Audi models.
>BMW E90 320i
170 hp exactly, 2 liter 4 banger. This car is newer and more expensive then options one. Also not that fast, but very nice to drive. Really, really comfy with good handling and these cars are coming down in price.
>Fiesta ST
If 170 hp is not a hard limit, you could get one of these. They are a tune away from 215 hp and really fun from what I hear.
hp tax? What the fuck is this?
Fun prevention.
An idiotic way to try to stay below idiotic EU emission thresholds.
The (((EU)))
Something light and turbo. Can be easily re-mapped (retuned) to pick up an extra 20-40whp usually. Maybe one of the newer fiatas or some sort of european fwd turbo hot hatch.
also
>being limited to less than 170hp
>wanting to live in communist shitholes
err I mean europe
What do you guys think of the W210 Mercedes E Class with the
Diesel Inline 6 OM606 engine?
It's like the Diesel JZ/RB.
We Euros actually us it a lot.
And they are capable of more than 800WHP.
This.
2zz swap it though.
>engine swapping
Have fun in that legal minefield.
Good car, great engine. The W210 is suscepptible to rust and electronics failures, so look out for that before you buy.
Visited US couple of years ago and the irony is that in europe traffic with 75hp shitboxes moves much faster than in us with all those 300hp cars.
People drive barely over the limit, I kinda understand with police like that but still.
I had Astra G 1.4 swapped with 2.0 turbo (Z20LET) and no one seemed to notice during annual inspections.
As long as you don't change the number of cylinders I don't think you'll have any problems.
Probably has something to do with stricter driving tests and as a result, better education. If the majority of people actually knows how to drive, stupid shit is far less likely to happen.
Entirely depends on the country in question's laws. Some places don't care at all, others require you to re-register the car if going above a certain percentage of power or displacement increase, number of cylinders, or aspiration type but beyond that you're good to go, and in the worst case you're not allowed to change anything from how it rolled off the assembly line.
Of course this also depends on if you actually want to do it legally or if you're keeping it in the dark, and again both options have their pros and cons.
A good car if you find a rust free one. The older W124 is also a solid choice. It has the OM603, which is basically a "sohc 606", a solid engine itself. Mercedes´ with OM605 or OM602(both 5-cyl) are good choices also.
youtube.com
they make 100 hp ish and are extremely light.
Speaking of 5-cylinders, the 20V NA versions of these made 170hp. Turbo versions of the engine can do stupid shit like 1000hp reliably.
Yeah, I know. Here, Finland, those Audi fives are in god status thanks to Group-B.
Thanks for the nice suggestions guys!
The problem with Swifts is they are rusty and all broken here in Austria.
Also they used to be driven by poor Hungarians for a long time (The are now stereotype cars here), even Hungarians don't want them anymore.
The Audi Coupe is one of the most if not most loved car in Austria, and that's also the problem.
They are very expensive here, for a rusty half broken one you have to pay at least 3500€, and for a good one up to
15 000€.
But maybe i will find one, but probably not with Quattro (Because no one ones to sell em).
You could also try the CLK 200 K from the W208 gen. It's basically a W202 with two doors and better rustproofing (Rust is the only problem of the W202 so the 208 should theoretically be close to perfect).
It has 163 hp and the MB M111 is bullet proof.
BMW is a good choice, as long as it was well cared for by the previous owner. Datsun 280z is nice older choice
>be cucked
>"plz don't tell me I'm cucked"
>Burger
Every time
E30 325is.
Best bang for your buck? Almost any Honda from the 90's. Super lightweight, put some suspension work & lower that bitch. I have a 1997 Accord 2.2l & I have fun in that fucker daily.
I'm an Australian
A4 B5 2.4 quattro
>audisteers into a tree
Seriously, though. If what you want is a lot of power down the road (these can make several hundred HP fairly easily if you don't mind doing that), this platform is a decent choice.
I can corner
>hp limit 170
>australia
na
imagine living in a such a poor pathetic totalitarian communist shithole that the government thinks they have the right to tell you how much hp your car can have
i dont know about your money but these cars are very cheap so what you save on buying can go toward having the rust repaired just like i did on mine.
they don't
it's just more expensive to own a more powerfull car
motorcycle
Porsche 924 S
>160 hp
>48/52 weight distribution
>was driving 260+ in one multiple times
It also can take boost, get a DOHC head and even 4 additional cylinders...
>you must pay 5000 europoorean money per year for car above 200hp
>somehow this isnt the government controlling what you can and cant do
taxes prohibition
A lot of it may be completely capitalist insurance.
Austria is one of the richest countries in the world.
They tax HP because in the 90's the (((Green Party))) came up with this shit.
You can legally drive a 1500 HP or 3000 HP car on the streets, but you have to pay 8000€ and more for that!
Are you the Australian, if yes have fun getting these laws in the following years.
And if you are American, than you already have enough problems outside of cars.
I hope the new Rightwing/ Far Right goverment changes this law.
They already changed the stupid Green Party smoking law.
And thank god that the Green Party is not in Parlament anymore!
Not wanted to get political, but the whole problem came from the leftwing green party policies!
1200€ not 5000€.
Can you read?
>Not wanted to get political, but the whole problem came from the leftwing green party policies!
Niemand hier mag die Grünen oder Sozen generell...
When i saw the title i knew you were from Austria (((Motorbezogene Versicherungssteuer))) is a massive scam. You should probably look into light cars that are "slow car fast" like the Suzuki Swift Sport or a Lotus Elise depending on your budget.
>Österreich wieder mal rechts
hupsi, wir wissen wie das letzes mal ausging
i am another australian, this communist shit will never happen here, the average bogan will run riots
youtu.be
They used to tax people based on displacement until technology caught up and everyone was driving 2L turbo 4-bangers with 300+ hp, so they switched over to hp-based tax because someone has to pay for fatmas 7th child.
Anfangs lief es doch super, nebenbei ist die FPÖ leider nicht ganz so rechts wie die NSDAP...
zzw30 or sw20 na
Its always Vienna that votes these retarded cunts into parliament because nobody owns a car there.
>18000 Eurobucks minimum
>completely unrelated topic
>still its the immigrants fault
Äußerlich vielleicht.
>taxes
>welfarestate
>immigration
>unrelated
Jetzt werden keine fehler gemacht!
^^
Stimmt
Wäre schön, ist aber leider nicht so...
bimmers are mediocre and so is their cornering.
good choice and no its slightly above 1ton
good choice if you dont mind FF
if you want handle stock e90 is not the way to go.
No need unless you're a retard whose first mod involves adding 200kg of speakers and bling. If you focus on being light and handling the stock engine is fine.
2zz looks exactly the same as 1zz and nobody thinks to check engine codes and numbers. Engine swapping is illegal here but people pass inspection with even shit like v10 swapped sierra.
bmw is a good choice but you can do better. BMW is a very safe choice. but mr2 sw20 and up will run circles around it in every way imaginable
Well its not just the immigrants that are pulling this shit although they're the main offenders. The main problem is that as you have more kids you get more and more money from the state for them and it increases more with every child you have. Which leads to families with 5+ neglected kids that only live off state child support. And guess where that money is coming from and you have your answer as to how thats related.
Yeah fight for your right Mick!
Don't let (((them))) fuck your country too!
Also don't you also have some stupid laws in New South Wales?
Die erste regierung die voll ist mit Burschenschaftern.
Also ist es nah dran.
Lustige info über "Cuckservative" Shorty (Kurz), der war auch ein Burschenschafter aber er leugnet das immer.
Do you think that the E39 2.5l TD can be tuned like a Mercedes OM606?
>Swapping 2ZZ in
Will they really not notice it?
And, are you Austrian, would be great to talk about our problems and car culture.
I should make a Austrian car thread!
Klingt schonmal gut, hoffentlich wird es bei uns auch mal etwas...
Was würdest du von einer Blau/Blau Koalition halten?
Bist du Deutscher?
Wäre gut wenn ihr enflich mal diese erfundene schuld ablegen könnt, und endlich mal Deutsch seien könnt.
Ich hoffe unirinisch das Höcke euer Kanzler wird!
Ihr werdet es schon packen, denn in Ost Europa hat es angefangen mit den Rechten, aber es musste jemand das Eis für den Westen brechen und das waren wir Österreicher.
Ab jetzt geht die party los, den jetzt werden andere West Länder keine angst mehr haben rechts zu wählen, und rechts zu seien, denn Österreich hat es ja schon getan.
Heil Höcke
*unironisch
>Bist du Deutscher?
Ja.
>Ich hoffe unironisch das Höcke euer Kanzler wird!
Das hoffe ich auch, wobei ich gegen einen großdeutschen Kanzler Hofer auch nichts einzuwenden hätte.
>Ihr werdet es schon packen, denn in Ost Europa hat es angefangen mit den Rechten, aber es musste jemand das Eis für den Westen brechen und das waren wir Österreicher.
In Deutschland, insbesondere NRW, haben wir ein demographisches Problem, in manchen Städten sind schon 70% der Kinder von Migranten.
Das könnte knapp werden oder in einem Bürgerkrieg enden.
Heil Hofer!
NRW REPRESENT BRUDI AMK
Höre bitte auf mit diesem Scheiß, es ist schlimm genug, dass viele hier unironisch so reden/schreiben.
moruq isch ficke disch
>Ich töten, sie fukken
if they only look at the amount of HP from the factory, i'd look at chip tuning, and if diesel is okay i'd get a turbodiesel
Narrow-body 944 is pretty good if you can fix it yourself
...