Why is universal income a bad idea? are first world countries not developed...

likme
likme

why is universal income a bad idea? are first world countries not developed enough to start setting the ground work for this to happen?

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Burnblaze
Burnblaze

shut up faggot

Evilember
Evilember

Because the weak, lazy and stupid should die off. We do too much to take care of our parasites already.

WebTool
WebTool

fuck you bitch
this has nothing to do with the purpose of universal income, please stop posting your opinions in public in any format because you're dumb as fuck

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

It has everything to do with universal basic income, you leech. Explain your position or fuck off.

MPmaster
MPmaster

educate me for free
lmao fuck off you fucking cunt, i'll wait until someone with half a brain comes in and wants to have a productive conversation with me

haveahappyday
haveahappyday

I think providing basic sustenance for people once we have larger scale 3d printing and farm automation is a must. However, I hate people too much to give them free money.

No one can really argue for or against it right now since it's all theoretical. It could get implemented and be the best or worst thing to ever happen. Capitalism is going strong though. People are too shitty for any other system to work out.

w8t4u
w8t4u

I'm to stupid to articulate what I mean therefore you should figure out what I mean for me

How retarded are you? I don't see a single good reason for UBI. The productive members of society already have fucking jobs.

idontknow
idontknow

If you just throw $1000 at everyone, prices will rise proportionally. Why? Because there is the same amount of products in circulation.

Basic income CAN work in conjunction with public housing guarantee, and a basic amount of calories/day guarantee. That will unchain people who are stuck in dead end jobs due to family obligations to create, having an amplifying effect on the economy. Of course, don't hold your breath - we're moving very quickly in the opposite direction where the tiny top owns enterprises and creates huge barriers to entry, a small professional class to serve them, and a large (90%) underclass. Think Brazil.

PackManBrainlure
PackManBrainlure

Besides all the other problems with this, is we have shit boarders In 1st world western countries. So even if it worked now (unlikely) you'd have tons of poor people from the global south (Africa and South America) coming in till it crashed under the weight of 1000 to 1 productive worker ratios.
At least cancel all your refugee treaties that require you to take anyone that makes it to your land first

Emberfire
Emberfire

what is this picture

RavySnake
RavySnake

.....Get a job or suck a dick
nigger

StonedTime
StonedTime

A real man, a king of his kingdom, a teacher, a father and a warrior. Everything that man should aspire to be, but western numales forgot.

FastChef
FastChef

because taking property from one private individual to give to another private individual vis-a-vis violence or threats of violence is heft and theft is wrong

Nojokur
Nojokur

The poor cannot be trusted to spend money responsibly. That's why they are poor in the first place. If you give them money they will spend it on stupid shit like drugs and alcohol and then rely on public welfare systems just like before. I do support having government run mass homeless shelters where the poor can wallow with other subhumans of their kind and get housing and nutrition at no charge. There would have to be lots of restrictions in place to prevent abuse, and ultimately, the resources necessary to prevent violence and crime in such shelters might make it not worth it.

cum2soon
cum2soon

It's more retarded than communism idealists.
.
Ideas that are much more interesting: interest free small business loans from the Government,
Free retraining if you get laid off, shooting all the non functional druggies in the face.
AND FIX THE FUCKING SCHOOLS THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS IN AMERICA IN POOR METRO AREAS ARE A FUCKING EMBARRASSMENT.
We should be giving away free money when we hadn't even funded our schools right yet

Inmate
Inmate

ur 2 dummmb to argue wit lole

Kill yourself loser

DeathDog
DeathDog

I would say that we wait for automation to go to full swing before having universal income can be a good idea.

Most jobs will be obsolete (at least blue collar wagecuck type jobs), and automation will increase productivity without needing workers.

TechHater
TechHater

So I assume you also hate rich kids too? Or anyone else who is rich enough to have passive income?

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

Morality, especially libertarian NAP morality, is pure autism and has no relavence in the real world

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

good thread op. people on this board are just lonely and hate the world. i would support my significant other financially even if they didnt have a job. let the hate roll in

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

and other people close to me, but universal income is kinda bullshit imo

Nude_Bikergirl
Nude_Bikergirl

DESU UBI should take the form of free housing (think housing projects/commie blocks) and shit cafeteria food. None of this EBT and welfare crap. and give everyone a few sets of cheap clothes.

housing is cheap since it's subsidized by govt (biggest expense)
everyone given 3 meals a day of extremely low quality to keep cost low

Don't like it get a job. None of this giving people cash for nothing. If you don't want to work like a normal person then you can't pretend live like one. Also maybe rules strictly enforced:

no leaving after 9pm unless going to a job
day activities should be spent looking for jobs or cleaning up the building
no tvs allowed except maybe a communal theatre for education purposes

Booteefool
Booteefool

suck my dick

fuck you

fuck you too

you guys are beta-cucks, i make more than you, i'm worth more than you, my dick is bigger than yours, i'm taller than you, i'm fitter than you, i'm smarter than you

guess what I'm straight up BETTER than you lmao

let those suicidal thoughts roll in cuz you guys AIN'T SHIT

viagrandad
viagrandad

I don't particularly like the idea of inherited wealth, but it's hard to argue that in a free society that we should or could prevent fathers from providing their children with the best life possible. The government, however, is not your daddy.

Bidwell
Bidwell

Inheritances are taxed. What more do you want?

likme
likme

...you mean prison? Because that's a thing, and they are already buckling, at least in my country, due to all the petty shit that gets given a mandatory time served punishment.

I mean, both your examples are basically an open prison. You literally want to criminalize being poor.

There needs to be an award for an opinion this heartless and cold. It goes beyond the mere shitposting that has come before.

Deadlyinx
Deadlyinx

Nothing. There's no legislative solution to this, which is my point.

Methshot
Methshot

t. nigger

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

Everyone bitching about scroungers, nobody working, and basically jacking off to how not-lazy they are (pretty much everyone in the thread) seem to be missing the point that this isn't about laziness and unwilling workers.

It's about the fact that no matter how much they obfuscate it, unemployment is rising, will continue to rise as populations grow and immigrants take unskilled work for pennies, and then shoot to massive portions of the populations across the world even in skilled labor as automation gets better and more widepread.

You either end up with civil war, basically a worldwide, long-term french revolution, or you give the billions of plebs housing, food, and an ipad/VR device to make them feel wealthy while you buy your secoand yatch and moon-house. It's far easier than killing everyone.

Don't think it can happen in our lifetime? Maybe not. But the groundwork needs to start long before it becomes a humanitarian disaster. Also, look at how far tech has progressed in less than twenty years, and consider that the better the tech gets, the faster and more broad impovements come.

Critical thinking and foresight seem to be... lacking these days.

Crazy_Nice
Crazy_Nice

No joke, I'd support a welfare system if it came with a mandatory vasectomy/tubal ligation. Instead we incentivize people to have children they can't afford. UBI will only make matters worse as those individuals who do not work and merely exist will breed with each other, continuously driving down the per capita productivity. The assumption that automation will pick up the slack is founded on the extrapolation of economists not engineers. Moore's law no longer applies, any advancements in AI beyond the current state must come from better algorithms not more processing power which is far more difficult.

Skullbone
Skullbone

into the poorfag gulag with you

If I'm a company, I'm paying people well below their fair wage and just enough for these people to meet the baseline.

If I'm selling any bread/dairy, I'm selling it at the highest price I can because I know people will buy my bread/dairy rather than go eat shitty cafeteriacockroach food

Firespawn
Firespawn

merely exist will breed with each other, continuously driving down the per capita productivity.

The aristocrats used to say that about the poor useless peasants. Yet the post-revolutionary french republic (when it selected for men of ability) became one of the most powerful nations in the world.

If you're gonna put up barriers for kids of course they'll grow up as useless shits. If you're gonna encourage and develop talent, many will take the way out of poverty.

SniperWish
SniperWish

In that case, for sake of argument, let's throw out automation. Instead, let's look at the rapidly rising global population, and the percentage of the elderly and retired (likely with state pensions in the west) is going to double and triple (at a modest estimate) in the next decades to come and how our systems are already buckling.

When we start steralising people, it's not long until mandatory euthenasia.

So, we are approaching a dystopia where if you want to be looked after you don't get a family and will be killed after you are no longer useful, and there are beggar shanty towns full of the disabled and elderly in all major cities across the first world, while the wealthy sip a fine vintage on a boat. Sounds like a place I would like to live! Can you imagine the civil unrest? What you are describing would end up a 'setting' worse than most dark scifi tales.

Personally I would prefer to shoot for a Utopia. Even if it fails and becomes something grim, at least you tried.

It's simple fact that there are troubles comng that need to have the groundwork to deal with laid, and all most people can do is say 'lol, kill the scroungers'.

LuckyDusty
LuckyDusty

Except peasants were far from useless. They sowed the wheat that everyone ate, they fought the wars which maintained the sovereignty of the kingdom. Inner city project dwellers are not the modern equivalent of peasants.

I'm also not claiming that the children of welfare recipients cannot be productive members of society, but they have both nature and nurture stacked against them proportionally the chance of that is significantly lower than those children already born to productive members of society.

If I understand you, your claim is that preventing some individuals from having children will cause a demographic collapse and lead to euthanasia of unwanted members of society. That would only be a valid argument if we assume that a large number of individuals would be on welfare indefinitely. However, that number is going to decrease over time as that population does not reproduce. There may be phases of such an existence which place strain on society but if society doesn't collapse, the end state is stable and not dystopian.

5mileys
5mileys

You can claim slipperly slope fallacy as much as you want, but the minute you start doing shit like that to people, other roads look less dire also. Plus, people would resist that, and that itself, beyond who would get the right to make the call and what the criteria is and when, has a whole assload of issues to deal with.

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

How's it prison if they are getting things provided in a structured environment for their own good?

Should they be rewarded free money for being poor? What business does a person that doesn't work have being outside after say 9pm?

Like I said there would be programs and education materials available for people to pull themselves out. Those who don't (assuming they are able bodied and not sick with a physics illness) don't deserve easily abused handouts.

My plan does fall apart when people live in families with children. But there are slum highrises in china that raise children just fine.

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

How's it prison if they are getting things provided in a structured environment for their own good?

...da fuk?

Should they be rewarded free money for being poor?

Why not? I know plenty of rich people who did fuck all for enough free money to buy me tens of millions of times over, and they would be spared for this little set up because they already have the free money.

You're acting like it would be some great crime if everyone had the ability to live a life of dignity if they choose to. Sure, some people would piss it away and take advantage, but studies and tests have already proved plenty of people use the security as a platform to improve themselves. Only 4channers, and people like them, would use it as a lisence to be lazy, because the base income would be pretty bare and joyless if you tried to live your entire life on it or raise a family on it.

What business does a person that doesn't work have being outside after say 9pm?

How about whatever the fuck they want? I mean shit, that's some police state level bullshit right there. Suppose someone just wants to take a walk, to think under the stars.

Hell, your entire attitude and what I can grasp of your worldview makes it clear you think the majority of people are beneath you and need looking after in the same manner as a potato with anger issues. I really pray, for your own sake, that you are LARPing or very young with room to grow. Because otherwise it must be really shitty being you.

TreeEater
TreeEater

how old is pic related?

RumChicken
RumChicken

How about whatever the fuck they want? I mean shit, that's some police state level bullshit right there. Suppose someone just wants to take a walk, to think under the stars

Well if they spent less time walking and thinking and more time on working they should have the freedom to do it.

Should someone that gets handouts use the money to get drinks at a bar or entry to a dance club or concert? As a tax payer the safety net is to provide basic needs.

Truth be told someone with no job/money is more likely to try breaking into a business/car after dark. Just watch the morning news and see what happens in every major city at night.

I'm all for self determination, but it should be worked for and not handed out. If you don't yet have the means for self determination there will be a structured environment to help with that. It's basically a live in shelter with a career center.

Can you give me a reason why an able bodied person should not have to work and rely on handouts? If living in section 8 and having an EBT with welfare is so time consuming/mentally exhausting for someone not to search for a real job to improve their situation then they need the structured help.

You want to help people better themselves right user?

Carnalpleasure
Carnalpleasure

Basically you want to reinstutue serfdom with the uglier aspects of a police state and/or martial law. Fair enough. I have to, for my sanity, believe you're trolling.

Soft_member
Soft_member

because it doesn't work

ENDING central banks will alleviate poverty and will actually work

redpill yourself

farquit
farquit

please gas yourself, you poverty loving cuck

Nojokur
Nojokur

his kingdom is a yurt
wew

StonedTime
StonedTime

The only problem we haven't solved yet is how to stop politicians who scapegoat the welfare class from cancelling it before it gets off the ground.

This guy thinks people would rather starve than raid his fridge. Have fun paying more for ransom insurance than you would on a UBI brov'ner.

I would say the intent of UBI is to make capitalism work even when return on capital exceeds the growth rate of the economy. A lot of people not born into money are already moving their activities to the grey economy. If the economy is growing at 3%/year and capital earns 7%/year, there's just not much incentive for taking part in the legal economy for a lower or middle class citizen. UBI means everyone has money to spend, so the owners of capital are incentivized to fund innovations that everyone wants to spend money on.

citation needed

Muh schools
Just pay kids to finish Khan academy courses.
more retarded than communism
I'm guessing you heard that word a lot growing up. Let's look at track records:
Communism:
Millions dead in Russia
Millions dead in China
Etc...

UBI:
fewer hospitalizations and high school dropouts in Canada
Three times as many entrepreneurs in India
Etc...

When you talk about UBI, you really get to see what things about themselves people project onto the welfare class.

whereismyname
whereismyname

Got a couple of serious questions for you, please answer if you can:
1. what percentage of jobs do you think are actually productive?
2. what percentage of those productive jobs do you think are the most productive thing that worker could be doing?

UBI will only make matters worse
That... isn't borne out by the data. In almost every case, it's the marginal class that has the most children, not the lower middle class.

a reason why an able bodied person should not have to work and rely on handouts
Because he's building the next microsoft.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

mongolians would be the epitome of we wuz kangz n shiet

RumChicken
RumChicken

Because he's building the next microsoft.
If that were the case then that's working.

If he has his own disposable income to soul search then more power to him.

I can spend 50$ to eat food for the month, at a steakhouse or at a bar and that's fine since I earned it. Giving people money to potentially squander is a bad idea. Do you give the homeless money?

I've seen homeless begging for money with signs saying they are hungry by my grocery store. I've given them apples/oranges/crackers and they just take it and put it on the ground next to them and go back to begging. Why don't they take a bite right there in front of me if they were truly hungry?

I've skipped a few meals because I've had to do shit for my job and as soon as I get in front of food I basically shove the stuff in my mouth.

Serfdom has no escape. My system has an escape if you put your mind to something. Think of it as a halfway house for those who just got out of prison. It's a structured environment to help people transition to society as working people. Sure there are flaws in my idea but truth be told I wrote it a bit hastily.

Gigastrength
Gigastrength

THIS. I work in the healthcare sector and while some people do seem to get their shit together, a majority spend their fking money on drugs, etc and then end up in the emergency department and waste more of the government's/police's time and money.

i would fully support food, clothing and shelter for every fellow man. but anything additional should only come out of your own hard work.

Why should I have to work hard, get taxed more and not reap the rewards while someone else gets it for free??

TreeEater
TreeEater

the main right wing hot take on UBI is that no one would ever work because everyone would sit around all day masturbating bla, bla, bla but that's pure bullshit and there's no reason to believe that, since IRL nations with more liberal welfare programs tend to have even have lower unemployment levels since people always want more money than the minimum

the criticism I would take more seriously is that UBI would be inflationary... since workers would not be afraid of being laid off and starving in the streets they would demand higher wages for their work driving up the costs of production and causing a profit squeeze on corporations. this might happen so in a corporate economy based on low wages a UBI might cause problems but ideally it might move the economy towards more self-employment and partnerships instead of big corporations

also since our economy today is globalized, how much of this income will generate domestic employment instead of just being used to import foreign goods?
also UBI is pretty much a neoliberal idea, it's premised on the idea markets pretty much work perfectly besides maldistribution of income, any keyensian should be a little sceptical of that

something to read here is Michael Kalecki's essay "Political Aspects of Full Employment" from 1943: delong.typepad.com/kalecki43.pdf

Supergrass
Supergrass

Why should I have to work hard, get taxed more and not reap the rewards while someone else gets it for free??
with a UBI you wouldn't have to work hard if you don't want to, if you work hard it would be because you want to [and there would also still be a monetary incentive]
there's studies proving when you put people in poverty they start acting less rationally, so presumably UBI would create less social fuck ups but there will always be fuck ups no matter what without a UBI they just have a more strong punitive punishment
I don't see anything wrong with someone being employed producing that "free stuff" which otherwise wouldn't

Booteefool
Booteefool

Edgy

lostmypassword
lostmypassword

It's not a universal income it's just a bigger, shittier welfare state. All UBI will do is basically make the state have total control of our lives and can control our self determination. You want that? Look how it turned out for the niggers.

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

That... isn't borne out by the data. In almost every case, it's the marginal class that has the most children, not the lower middle class.

UBI will increase the size of the marginal class.

By what logic or evidence do you conclude that it will increase the size of the lower middle class?

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

or

TalkBomber
TalkBomber

You really should kill yourself.

Take a look at your posts and try and find one thing that you've contributed. You have put in zero effort and you expect people to put thought into their replies. Typical of someone who wants UBI. Gib gib gib, I owe you nothing!

Fuck off. KYS for the good of humanity.

SomethingNew
SomethingNew

I'm not the biggest fan of universal income. I think a negative income tax for those making under a certain amount every year would work better.

CouchChiller
CouchChiller

We need an impenetrable border wall first.

Bidwell
Bidwell

The church of communism, lead by lord savior Bernie, have brainwashed these retards into believing BI is such a perfect solution that they think you're just trolling if you disagree or point out any of the countless flaws in it.

They simply don't comprehend That BI is a stepping stone towards an authoritarian government. All they see is the gib dats.

Look at all the fallacies BI arguments

It magically wontcause inflation
The poor will use it to better their situation instead of just wasting it on more consumerism and
It can be implemented in The US without becoming a debt black hole or that all regular welfare can be repealed and replaced With BI
muh automation
BI improves capitalism (top mother fucking kek)
It won't be abused by immigrants

iluvmen
iluvmen

We already have that, its called the earned income tax credit. It would be nice if the extended this to be a little better for people without kids, but it's a start.

whereismyname
whereismyname

why is universal income a bad idea?
new zero, hyperinflation

it might work if the employable part of the population gets to under 10% and their productivity will be so great is actually makes sense to provide free money for the non producers and since this free money won't even approach the wages off workers there is no inflationary effect.

Lunatick
Lunatick

I dont make a lot of money. I dont have kids or wife. I never applied for neetbux even though I could have. Why should people who make less than me, or next to nothing, get free money through welfare to support their retarded kids they shouldnt have had?

Abolish welfare and begin universal income for everyone, not just the dumbest and lowest pieces of trash.

There...., a hate-fueled perspective we can all agree on.

Inmate
Inmate

welfare is not unconditional thus distorts the labour supply curve less than ubi.

it's way way better idea to simply provide a lot of free service for everyone instead of giving them money. healthcare and education for example, also basic housing and nutrition.

Firespawn
Firespawn

oh and the other side of it, if you don't want to partake in the free stuff because you want better, you get tax deductions for declined state financed services. like you don't want the free housing or the staple food? okay that's fine.

AwesomeTucker
AwesomeTucker

make 200k a year
pay 60k in taxes to help support basic income shit
get 12k back

Universal basic income also doesn't take into account cost of living.

GoogleCat
GoogleCat

Universal basic income also doesn't take into account cost of living.
nah that's the only thing it would actually take into account for sure. that is why it would cause an inflationary spiral.

Boy_vs_Girl
Boy_vs_Girl

there is one very serious argument for ubi tho, it in theory requires a hell of a lot less bureaucracy than any other way of redistribution. it could be mostly automated. but that also means more unemployment in the government sector and so on. so it's a win-lose anyhow.

girlDog
girlDog

i know you won't take this post seriously because it's very /pol/ but it's 100% the truth.

kikes will introduce UBI after the big homogenisation of the races has ocurred. in particular after whites are effectively a tiny minority. the introduction of UBI will put an end to basically all welfare infrastructure, thereby reintroducing true meritocracy. this would betray the marxist ideals of a classless society because whites would again outperform everyone and create a white ethnic upper class. so we are probably 30-60 years away from seeing UBI on a broad scale in the western world. automation taking jobs might catalyse this though.

eGremlin
eGremlin

Inheritances aren't taxed, federally, to the recipient. Source: tax attorney.

Supergrass
Supergrass

why should government subsidize poverty and low IQ genes?

Ignoramus
Ignoramus

Because being 'marginal' means a lack of security. UBI is dependable, and even if rents and food prices rise on average, a person with a UBI still has more freedom to turn down a bad deal, be temporarily unemployed or complete education. that IS borne out by the data.

It's actually a much smaller welfare state because it's easier to administer and harder to game.

If that were the case then that's working.
Now we're getting somewhere. So in your world, who decides what's working? Because it clearly isn't the market. Suppose I have an idea for the next microsoft and quit my job to work in one of your halfway there houses. Suppose what I'm doing requires mostly sitting, thinking, reading the occasional book or article and running things by people on social media. I expect no tangible outputs for the first year. Who decides whether I'm working? Does someone come by and check whether I'm actually on track, and what is that person paid? What if I find dancing helps me think and the person who's supposed to check on my progress thinks I just enjoy dancing and don't plan to ever do anything that contributes?
Your idea runs into the same issue as marxism does - in practice, someone has to decide things that humans aren't good at deciding

won't cause inflation
Yes it will. That's an explicit goal to a lot of people, because inflation is a tax on unproductive capital.
The poor will use it to better their situation
That's what's happened when it was tried. Don't like it? don't bring it up.
debt
That's a challenge, but the US already spends tons on welfare, much of which is administrative overhead. UBI is at least a more efficient way of getting money into the hands of poor people. Some schemes have the UBI being actually printed the way QE money is now, which wouldn't cause any debt at all.
automation
Automation may make work obsolete or it may not, but it's very poor risk management not to hedge against it.

w8t4u
w8t4u

(cont)
improves capitalism
Improves capitalism for the poorest, yes. more purchasing power for basic nescessities will increase quality and competition in that space.

immigrants
This... honestly makes no sense to me as a non-american. Like do immigrants actually go on welfare in your country? How does that work? you let people with no way to support themselves in? Or are they illegal? are you imagining an illegal immigrant will come to the tax office and ask for their UBI with a dead person's SIN?

Just want to make sure I understand - you're saying once there's 90% unemployment, UBI becomes a good idea?

But welfare means there's essentially a 100% tax rate between unemployment and minimum wage. That's a yuge distortion.

Who provides these services? Who decides what's good enough and who pays the people providing them? Because in a UBI system, the answer to my questions is, 'the market' - your answer seems to involve a much larger state and more bureaucracy.

If you're unemployed and your UBI doesn't cover both rent and food, you're living in the wrong place. Mobility of people - and their minimal but nonzero spending power - is a big part of why I like the idea.

more unemployment in the government sector
See, this is the thing that a lot of people aren't acknowledging - a lot of work today is useless. I did an internship in the public service a while back - I'd guess about half the jobs on my floor shouldn't exist. They're not adding value to the economy except by adding a few consumers. We all talk about automation, but a lot of jobs exist already that aren't contributing to society by any reasonable metric.

Why should we have a few people being paid a lot to be useless instead of paying everyone a little?

Methshot
Methshot

are they not taxable income for the recipient?

BunnyJinx
BunnyJinx

you're saying once there's 90% unemployment, UBI becomes a good idea?
i'm saying it could maybe work then. not sure if we will have any other choice at that point.

viagrandad
viagrandad

Thank you for your posts, if only more people posted as informatively, witty and without ad hominem as you do. Every year we seem to garner more and more uneducated and stubborn idiots who come here for the counter-cultural aspects who devolve every thread into racist KEK shit.
I've never understood why less government is good when it is the only thing stopped anarchy and reverting back to feudalism; how you explain that a smaller govt can be achieved via UBI due to smaller over head on who decides which programs and to which people resources are allocated is something I've never considered.
I've always been against free market as people in power can and will abuse it as we have seen through lobbying. But a reduced government would mean less opportunity to use money to corrupt. I saw the problem as rich people when in fact its the government who accepts the bribes that is the problem because there will always be those who are rich and they will always play the system any way they can.
TL;DR thanks you blew my mind

Lord_Tryzalot
Lord_Tryzalot

more purchasing power
Aren't you the same pieces of shit that think higher purchasing power is a BAD thing?

If we had a deflationary economy, the poor would have their living standards raised every year.

But you turds want central banks and inflation.
UBI isn't going to solve the problems YOU created.

You people all need to be killed, I swear.

Poker_Star
Poker_Star

Thank you for your kind words

That seems a bit high to me, but I'll take it. So do you think that a society can stay stable past the 90% unemployment range? or should a program be phased in so that it's up and running at 90%?
And do you include paying but useless jobs in that 90% figure or is that 90% people on welfare and the grey economy

Let me get this straight. You're saying that in a deflationary environment, which is essentially high and growing demand for money... people with no money will gain more economic power? The last period of deflation in the US was in the 1930s - did the poor have their living standards raised every year then? And if you agree they didn't, what would you do differently that would make deflation work this time?
inb4 gas people like me

TreeEater
TreeEater

Our workforce is declining
We don't have enough money for pensions
Let's give those who don't work money

Stupidasole
Stupidasole

people with no money will gain more economic power?
Yes, there would be more jobs available for them and prices would be much cheaper.
Also if someone is retarded enough to have zero money and no job it becomes easier and easier to help them out because the cost to support people like this is much cheaper.

The last period of deflation in the US was in the 1930s
The 1930s deflation was the result of a previous inflation from the fed. The economy got massively distorted. Then when the inevitable crash happened the government put in an insane amount of economic controls, taxes and massive levels of spending which only made the problem far worse.
That's basically what the great depression was.

Imagine how terrible this time would be if we had INFLATION. People would die of starvation.

did the poor have their living standards raised every year then?
No, but they did during the gilded age for 30 straight years. This must make you really upset.

And if you agree they didn't, what would you do differently that would make deflation work this time?
Not have the government implement socialism, which is basically what happened in the 1930s.

happy_sad
happy_sad

or should a program be phased in so that it's up and running at 90%?
that is the most likely scenario. the smallest amount of ubi will increase both wages and unemployment. the more pronounced it gets the more so.

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

Universal income is disguised communism. Do not fall for it.

Emberfire
Emberfire

FIX THE FUCKING SCHOOLS THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS IN AMERICA IN POOR METRO AREAS ARE A FUCKING EMBARRASSMENT.

The schools aren't broken, the 75 IQ single-mother welfare crotch-fruit is broken. Baltimore has one of the most well funded school districts in the entire fucking world, thus proving that no amount of money can fix broken people.

No, fuck your UBI. If you are poor and unemployed, stop fucking having children.

RavySnake
RavySnake

a classic upload from Veeky Forums's early early early days.. (fun fact: Veeky Forums was actually founded as an image board for asian farmers to discuss commodity prices/trade livestock and get into long pointless arguments on their lifting techniques (some things never change! ;) )

Need_TLC
Need_TLC

educate me for free
no

This is the same guy arguing for a basic income. I know this thread is b8, but I just wanted to point out how ironic that is.

StonedTime
StonedTime

IRL this girl is a freak shoutout to my boys who know the source

Spamalot
Spamalot

its the exact opposite tho
in communism you work for no pay
with ubi you are paid not to work

Burnblaze
Burnblaze

You're completely right, the school system is fine, it's the students.

Too fucking bad we're not allowed to actually publicly say that though.

We don't have a drug, education, gun, or poverty problem, we have a nigger, mexican, indian, red neck, and single mother problem.

Some people, either through genetics or by the consequences of their own actions, are simply always going to be at the bottom of the pyramid.

This is probably the biggest flaw and problem with western civilization and why no economic or social system will ever work, is because it keeps trying to perpetuate this "no child left behind" utopia.

The left thinks giving poor people means they will use it better themselves, or that they will use it to help buy necessities, the reality is that the overwhelming majority will just blow it on mindless consumerism.

UBI is essentially just government subsidies for Jordans, TVs, and spinning rims.

UBI will essentially be a monthly tax return for poor people, and instead of being retarded once a year with a large sum of money, they'll do it twelve times a year.

All while the middle class gets another tax hike

askme
askme

who is she ??? and how is she a "freak"?

massdebater
massdebater

The 1930s deflation was teh result of a previous inlation from the fed
living standards raised during the gilded age

So living standards raised during the time of previous inflation from the fed?

Emberburn
Emberburn

don't need UBI, got plenty of money, more than you'll ever have cuz i wasn't born into a family of losers lmao

face it dude, you're fucked for life, you'll struggle for your first million by the time you're 50, and you'll die in your 60s from a fucked up heart because of the stress

stay pressed, faggot

Raving_Cute
Raving_Cute

reverse image search, shes daddy daughter/diaper fetish stuff

Sir_Gallonhead
Sir_Gallonhead

Nice LARP. But if it's not, remember, rains falls upon all men. You could trip falling down the stairs tommorow or develop an inoperable brain tumor. So that hyper strssed 60 year old might even outlive you.

Death. The great equalizer. I'll see you there, no matter which of us goes first.

VisualMaster
VisualMaster

Not really, they only raised for a few.
The majority of the population didn't gain much.
Increases in technology helped them during that time though.

Also kill yourself isolationist. You're the reason everyone is suffering right now.

You ENJOY being poor and enslaved.
Get gassed.

TechHater
TechHater

social democrats should be killed and social democratic parties should be constitutionally banned

seriously, fuck you and your poverty

StrangeWizard
StrangeWizard

Not that guy, but you are aware sticking your fingers in yours ears and singing to yourself loudly doesn't make shit go away, right?

Spazyfool
Spazyfool

sticking your fingers in yours ears
What shit?
What are you talking about?

shit go away, right?
What shit go away?

King_Martha
King_Martha

seriously, fuck you and your poverty

Poverty is a major problem that is only getting worse, and by itself could cripple our societies. Unemployment isn't getting better, politicians simply obfuscate the data with shit like zero-hour contracts and mandatory apprenticeships (here in the UK at least).

What I mean, is, that saying 'fuck you and your poverty' because he has a meme political image is as shitty a reponse to what is being discusses as his image is.

Playboyize
Playboyize

social democrats should be killed
so like 70% of the population?

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