Was ancient Europe that different from the Middle East?

>b-but they don't let us objectify women as sex objects and fuck our best friend in the ass no homo fuck Islam man wtf I hate them

I don't know what you're trying to get at, I never said Europeans were perfect in any way. But objectively, our cultures/civilization are faring better on pretty much every level. For now, at least.

I kinda see them as the cousin we grew up with, started out with the same environment opportunities and there wasn't much difference to start with.
While you managed to later have a pretty good life, he ended up smoking meth and with a broken household. And you shudder a little bit like "it could have been me".

You think Europe and the Middle East had the same environment and opportunities throughout history? What book did you hear that from? And what about the Middle East is centuries late than the West? Are you talking about morality and culture? That's subjective.

Of course a X is going to say they're better than Y and vice versa.

The problem is that muslims fucked their cousins and are thus inbred subhumans while the catholic church in europe forbid incest. Apart from the genetical harm, Muslim societies are generally clanish and corrupt whereas European ones tend to enable cooperation and trust on a nation-wide level.

Scientifically the odds of birth defects with cousins is like 4%. And doesn't forbidding incest contradict the theory of Adam? Muslim societies are corrupt because of culture not religion. Europeans have invaded and caused corruption with virtually the entire world.

>You think Europe and the Middle East had the same environment and opportunities throughout history?
Ever heard of a metaphor ?

>And what about the Middle East is centuries late than the West? Are you talking about morality and culture? That's subjective.
See all the trouble and debates shaking the Middle East today. We had these already in the past decades/centuries : place of religion in public life, place of woman in society, place of tribalism in a nation state, etc... Some of these are still going on strongly in our societies as well, but we have a headstart desu.

Also, for every single shit and bad behaviours the MEasterners are accused of today : Europeans did it already in the past.

It's not a 100% fit of course, we have differences, but I can't help but notice we have much more similarities with the Middle East than with, say, East Asia. The Middle East kinda embodies today many of the defaults we see in our past selves and would try to forget. Hopefully, they will fix many of these soon.

I'm not stomping middle easterns as "muh sandniggers", don't get me wrong. But we have to recognize that today, Europeans are handling their shit better than MEasterners. It wasn't always the case, I reckon that without a problem.

> That's subjective.
I ain't a huge fan of cultural relativism, thanks.

>Muslim societies are generally clanish and corrupt whereas European ones tend to enable cooperation and trust on a nation-wide level.
And so were ours. Germany before it was united was clanish as fuck. So was France before the central government steam rolled every single province and erased most of the local cultures (local languages were forbidden to be taught among other things).
Clanism disappeared quite recently desu.

>Europeans have invaded and caused corruption with virtually the entire world.

Oh boy, here we go.

>Middle Easterners are a reflection of what we could have been if it wasn't for some crazy ass philosophers who expanded our worldview

You must be over 13 to post on this board

>Scientifically the odds of birth defects with cousins is like 4%.

Rinse and repeat for several generations, and you have cousins who are actually much more related to each other than cousins in places where exogamy is the norm.

>And so were ours. Germany before it was united was clanish as fuck. So was France before the central government steam rolled every single province and erased most of the local cultures (local languages were forbidden to be taught among other things).

That has literally nothing to do with clans

Usama ibn Munqidh? He recorded a lot of banter on the cuckoldry of the Franks

The Middle East was more advanced than the west and most of our Greko-Roman philia began when we read translated Arab texts that they preserved

In no way is Europe a continuation of ancient greco-roman civilization. Its more like a revival wannabee. Like israel

>That has literally nothing to do with clans
Would you care to develop your point ?

>Rinse and repeat for several generations, and you have cousins who are actually much more related to each other than cousins in places where exogamy is the norm.
It doesn't work like that. After 2 generations of close inbreeding, the large majority of the offspring start to die off because of too many genetic defaults.
Birth defects don't necessarily means hurr durr, they mostly mean severely sick or dead, which isn't exactly a great situation to start a lineage.

You should acknowledge that another reason for the middle east being behind is political instability that was largely caused by direct and indirect interference from the west.

When a country is politically unstable then it stagnates and takes longer to develop and evolve.

>Scientifically the odds of birth defects with cousins is like 4%
the odds is higher than general population, but the odds in general population are really low, so they are high only in comparison

unfit individuals will simply die, so it doesn't hurt the gene pool anyway

besides, inbreeding tends to reveal recessive genes more, and you know "MUH RECESSIVE GENES"

finally britain - inbred
faroe islands - inbred (they have higher rates of recessive diseases)

There is account somewhere from the 12th century that tells the same story: Muslim traveler horrified that Europeans let women walk free instead of locking them at home and even worse, European men showed respect towards women.

It wasn't common for women to wear headgear in the Ancient Mediterranean world just for modesty purposes (aside from ceremonies I'm assuming) and during the Renaissance the Queen of England and a bunch of other aristocratic women wore dresses which freed their tits.

I'm amazed there's people who still entertain the idea of debating about the validity of islamic culture. It's a curse upon the world.

Notice that the difference in this case is that muslim men have no morals or self-restraint. If there's no explicit punishment hanging above his head all the damn time he turns into an animal. He has no internalized morality or any form of higher thought/emotion. Generations upon generations of inbreeding reduced them to a very primitive level. They're essentially devolving back into apedom.

>Would you care to develop your point ?

The bigger and smaller states of the HRE weren't clans, just like the largely independent duchies of early-high medieval France weren't clans.

>After 2 generations of close inbreeding

It's not close inbreeding, it's repeated cousin fucking in an extended family network.

telegraph.co.uk/news/health/children/11723308/First-cousin-marriages-in-Pakistani-communities-leading-to-appalling-disabilities-among-children.html

both my great grandmothers wore headwear, i remember that clearly, they were orthodox christians

>In Iceland, a country with a population of 320,000 where most everyone is distantly related, inadvertently kissing cousins is a real risk.

>A new smartphone app is on hand to help Icelanders avoid accidental incest. The app lets users "bump" phones, and emits a warning alarm if they are closely related. "Bump the app before you bump in bed," says the catchy slogan.

>Some are hailing it as a welcome solution to a very Icelandic form of social embarrassment.

>"Everyone has heard the story of going to a family event and running into a girl you hooked up with some time ago," said Einar Magnusson, a graphic designer in Iceland's capital, Reykjavik.

>"It's not a good feeling when you realize that girl is a second cousin. People may think it's funny, but (the app) is a necessity."

I sure am glad I wasn't born on an island.

...

Read Milgrim Et Al.

So basicly every culture before the """""""""""""""Enlightment""""""""""""""""""" was the same according to you?
Because Cultural differences are only about Traditionalism and Liberalism or Individualism and Collectivism?

>wow we both wear hair covering, have classes in our society, and don't like gays. so much alike

You forgot the T*rks

>banging a second cousin something to be embarrassed about.
The only reason I can think of this being a thing is due to American cultural hegemony. In most places even getting married to a first cousin wasn't that taboo until recently. You would think in a small island nation like iceland that they would be used to it.