How can an entire nation particularly suck at war ? What are they doing wrong ?

The space before the question mark makes me think op is an ignorant self hating frog. The ones like you should be replaced with Algerians.

Because aside from Spain thanks to its american gold and silver, no other nation on this planet had the manpower and resources or capabilities of war like the french. Thanks to their land, France.

14 years ago? Fuck.

Except potential manpower =/= fielded army
In most of those wars, France was outnumbered by the coalitions

lol what's up with France and coalitions? every fucking time

fpbp

Everyone hate them

>no other nation on this planet had the manpower and resources or capabilities of war like the french
how eurocentric of you

Historically France was extremely strong and successful in military matters. This was due to thousands and thousands of Swiss soldiers the French hired as mercenaries.
This was literally a dream team of medieval and early modern Europe, the French did the talking and the Swiss did the walking.
However, after Napoleon cucked the Swiss, they refused to go war again for France.
That was a catastrophe for la Grande Nation, desperately they tried to build a French Foreign Legion, which kinda worked but was no real replacement for battle hardened Swiss regiments. And ever since France kept losing wars.

They were what the german want to be, the big bad bully of Europe and get away with it.

Why did Spain and France never fight a bona fide land war?

Fucking hell!
Time flies quick on the net...

delusional mountain faggot 2/10

I've seen a lot of misplaced self-importance on this board, but this one takes the cake
Swiss mercenaries stopped being relevant when they got BTFO at Marignano in 1515

After that they became a neutral cuckold country
France kept a tiny unit of hundreds of Swiss guards, but they were never used in battle and got massacred by peasants with sticks during the early days of the Revolution

negrito, please, you know it is true, when France started hiring the swiss in the late 15th century France began to win, when the Swiss left in the mid 19th century France began to lose

jesus christ

I've seen a lot of stupid uninformed posts on this board, but this one takes the cake! Are you even trying you stupid cunt?

They Swiss ended their politic of expansion after Marignano, but they kept on soldiering for centuries.
France had several hundred thousands of Swiss troops hired, at times the Swiss would represent the majority of French troops under arms, and they always where the senior regiments.
de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweizer_Truppen_in_französischen_Diensten_für_das_Königshaus_der_Valois_1480–1589
de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweizer_Truppen_in_französischen_Diensten_für_das_Königshaus_der_Bourbonen_1589–1792
de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweizer_Truppen_in_französischen_Diensten_für_das_Königshaus_der_Bourbonen_1814–1830

Same goes for most European Nations at the time
de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweizer_Truppen_in_fremden_Diensten

>three manlets with halberds were the decisive force in France's military prestige

simply ebin

>France kept a tiny unit of hundreds of Swiss guards
>By 1740 more than 12,000 Swiss soldiers were in French service. During the remainder of the eighteenth century Swiss numbers varied according to need, reaching a peak of 20,000 during the Austrian War of Succession

You are not very smart, are you?

If the post claiming that France's success in war was entirely due to a few hundreds swiss mercenaries seems less retarded to you than these two, there's something wrong with you

It's like claiming Nazi Germany conquered Europe thank to Czech volunteers

Hmmm, that fits exactly the era during which France was bad at war (mid 18th century)
I'll blame the Swiss since before (17th century) and after that (Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars), France was the best in Europe

Apparently, hiring Swiss merceneries is what weakened France and made them lose the Seven Years War
Well, at least they learned the lesson and massacred them in 1792, which enabled them to conquer Europe in the following decade

France had several ten thousand Swiss at most times during the 16th and 17th century. Get your facts straight so other people don't have to facepalm when reading you.
books.google.ch/books?id=qUp-AwAAQBAJ&pg=PP12&lpg=PP12&dq#v=onepage&q&f=false

Could story
But Nazi Germany did have thousands of Czech volunteers during WW2
Guess German conquests were due to them only

Cool story bro, but the Swiss at times compromised the majority of the French Army, and at all times the better part. They where payed higher and where senior, even Swiss officers where senior to French ones. And that for 350 years+.

This was during the time mercenaries composed the better part of dinastic armies.

After national armies became a thing everything changed of course.

The French army in the 17th and 18th centuries always numbered in the hundreds thousands, so ten thousands of Swiss mercs never made the "major part" or even a significant one

Really depends on the the time frame, the Swiss where the majority for several wars, namely the French wars of religion, the Italian campaigns and so on, mostly because they monarchy trusted them more than French soldiers as they where not prone to mutiny or switching sides.
Also, the Swiss where exclusively combat troops, not auxiliary forces, they where the senior line regiments of France. Better equipment and pay came along with that, but also more combat duty.

In fact the Swiss developed an industry out being mercenaries, they had professional systems to enlist and train entire regiments and hire them away complete with officers and everything else. Many monarch unsure of their own subjects where more than happy to hire them. So for a long time the Swiss where the most prominent mercenary force in Europe, perfect for cabinet wars and the like.

no I said that because the swiss guy was obviously joking, and if he wasn't well it would be funnier
not saying that swiss soldiers were bad or anything but come on
>That was a catastrophe for la Grande Nation, desperately they tried to build a French Foreign Legion, which kinda worked but was no real replacement for battle hardened Swiss regiments

Fun Fact, the FFL started after the Swiss made foreign military services illegal.
>Swiss stop serving France 1830
>FFL is founded 1831

>"La Grande Nation"
>Found the kraut

>The French Foreign Legion was created by Louis Philippe, the King of the French, on 10 March 1831 from the foreign regiments of the Kingdom of France. Recruits included soldiers from the recently disbanded Swiss and German foreign regiments of the Bourbon monarchy.

I'm too lazy to do that for you but feel free to google the borders of France in, let's say the 11th century, and compare them to 16th century France, and tell me how they got all this land by "losing all wars".

I know they only teach you about WW1 and WW2 in American schools, but that doesn't mean there is no History that happened before George Washington.

Probably a German speaking Swiss
It's pretty hilarous how German speakers are the only ones to use this term

>14 years ago

Everything went by so fast, Veeky Forums how do I slow it down.

If you kill your enemies they win, and France has killed a lot of their enemies

Uhm, you mean the Swiss have killed a lot of enemies for France?

smoking pot helps a great deal I heard.

Why do people pretend like France's WW2 performance was some footnote of history that doesn't reflect on their exemplary record of military excellence?

>the Iraq War was nearly over a decade ago
>there are people born after 9/11 who are having children right now

youtube.com/watch?v=sggJWiqdICA

Because taken together, ww2 was an anomaly. I mean hey, it's a country that's been around in some form for a few centuries. That's not to say its performance in 1940 isn't relevant, and their performance since hasn't been stellar.
But hey, that's one century among a few. the 21st isn't shaping up to be too terrible for France.

Don't forget that even though France was ill-prepared for the war, it went up against one of the world's best military forces of all time. The English certainly would not have held out without their navy and their luck of living on a fucking island, and the Soviets had an ally in General Winter and the endless steppe.

They literally got curbstomped into the dust and got occupied for half a decade, it was the most important military campaign France ever fought in since it decided the very existence of their country, and they blew it completely, if anything all of their stupid meme wars from centuries ago deserve to be disregarded

> it was the most important military campaign France ever fought in since it decided the very existence of their country
It was not and did not. Funny thing, despite losing in spectacular fashion, France apparently still exists.
>wars of the coalition
>meme wars
what are you doing on a history board

What reason would there have been to have one?

>It was not and did not. Funny thing, despite losing in spectacular fashion, France apparently still exists.

Gee I wonder why that might be the case, may have had something to do with the allies winning the war for them and kicking the germans out

Doesn't take anything away from their own pitiful attempt

Ah, so for the period between June 1940 and August 1944, France as a country did not exist. Is this correct?

Or do you mean to say that, at the conclusion of formal peace, one of the terms would be the annexation of all French territory?

While it sounds ridiculously stupid, it is not far from the truth. During the 16th & 17th century, they Swiss where the core of the Royal French army, they provided the line infantry regiments. During the times before the national states, mercenaries of some sort where the mainstay of every army, and the Swiss happened to be the most reputed and the ones most readily available. And the French kings where their best customers.

England

>T.Lloyd

>"We"
Always amuses me when I see someone online obviously deriving his self esteem from military shenanigans that happened centuries before his birth.

Good old Lindybeige.

> it was the most important military campaign France ever fought in since it decided the very existence of their country,
Never heard of Revolutionnary war? You know the stuff that change Europe for ever?Or the HYW, where france begin it march to centralist state? Or WW1, THE war that decide the fate of france for the century?

Mostly as a response to the mainstream view in Post-2003 English speaking media that because France lost WW2, they have never won a war
Fighting an extreme by using the other one

>They literally got curbstomped into the dust and got occupied for half a decade

Your point?
In 1806, Prussia got BTFO in 19 days (twice fasted than France in WW2) and occupied for 7 years (twice longer than France in WW2) until Russia liberated them
Doesnt prevent people from worshipping Prussia's military history and calling them "Gods of War"
Performance in one war, regardless of how bad, isnt enough to judge a country that fought countless of them

Thats true, but Franco-Prussia was disaster, WW1 was a close call and needed lots of help, WW2 was a disaster, Indochina war was a disaster, Algeria war was a disaster and so a reputation forms.

prussiaboos are subhumans so you can disregard anything they do

>it was the most important military campaign France ever fought in since it decided the very existence of their country, and they blew it completely, if anything all of their stupid meme wars from centuries ago deserve to be disregarded

You're a literal retard who doesnt understand history
How did you even end up on this board, normie scum?
Did you get lost on your way to /b/?

France fought countless wars in its history, many of which were decisive in whether they would continue to exist or not
WW2 wasn't as exceptional as you can believe, and the nazis didnt want to annex all Europe to Germany like in your hollywood movies
Even without the allies, what would've happened is that France would have falled under German domination for some times until another country rose to prominence
This shit happened to plenty of countries in history, and it didnt erase them from the map

If anything, the HYW and the Revolutionary Wars were the most decisive, fate changing wars France ever had to fight

I would really like strangling him to death with my bare hands.

>but Franco-Prussia was disaster
Counter balanced by the Crimean War and the Franco-Austrian War in the same era

>WW1 was a close call and needed lots of help
France was still the most important nation on the winning side
Don't get me started on the "needed allies to win" bullshit because if we go that way, Britain is the country that must be mocked for its military history

>WW2 was a disaster
Indeed

>Indochina war was a disaster
Yeah, a France that still hadnt recovered from WW2 lost against a nation that would BTFO the world superpower

>Algeria war was a disaster
It wasnt a military defeat

Btw, this list is really cherrypicked
Between these wars you mentioned, dozens of other wars were fought and won by France (I mentioned Crimea and Austrian War, but many more occured)
One can claim that they werent as relevant as WW1 and WW2 (which is true), but they definitly were comparable to the other three cited

As France is the true Hero of History, the scriptwriter likes to pit them against insurmountable odds for greater suspense and entertainement value.

>this list is really cherrypicked
Name one more important French war than the ones I picked between 1860 and today.

France was by far the most populous country in Europe until the mid 1800's, when other countries started catching up in terms of population, frogs couldn't sustain their zerg-rush tactics anymore

>I'm too lazy to do that for you but feel free to google the borders of France in, let's say the 11th century, and compare them to 16th century France

Thats why they always fought alone against large scale coalitions of the next-following major countries of their time to make it more fair.

Not "more important", but "as important":

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cochinchina_Campaign (if Indochina is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Italian_War_of_Independence

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonkin_Campaign

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Siamese_War (if Indochina is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Syrian_War (if Algeria is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rif_War (if Algeria is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Syrian_Revolt (if Algeria is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ifni_War (if Algeria is important by your standard, this one too)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suez_Crisis (military victory)

See

>11th century, and compare them to 16th century France

Most of the land France gained during that period wasn't won by war either though

Austria was pretty good most of the time.

But they did, from the French intervention into the Thirty Years War until 1659 or so.

Eh, relied more on Spanish allies, and then spent much of the 18th century losing to the Prussians. Did well in the Thirty Years War I guess, holding Bohemia for almost 300 years afterwards, and it took the combined efforts of France, Denmark and Sweden to win.

They defeated the Turks many times, and under Eugene of Savoy they defeated the French a couple of times under Louis XIV. For Prussia, they were pretty good in the 7 years war, it wasn't as one sided as before. They also were the first to score a clear victory against Napoleon. After that, I agree, it was pretty bad. So Austria never had the best army in Europe, but it was a pretty good one most of the time.

>The English certainly would not have held out without their navy and their luck of living on a fucking island

Yeah how dare we build the largest navy in the world. Fuck us, right?

True, and commendable, but the English Channel saved your ass.

Even if the RN had disappeared, the RAF wouldve been enough to sink every german river barge trying to cross the channel

How did the Germans get cucked of so much land?
Where they this bad at war before the 19th century?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Spanish_War_(1635–59)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nine_Years'_War
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_the_Pyrenees
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peninsular_War

You can't claim a win based on an arbitrary distinction between revolutionary/napoleonic wars.

They did, despite Spain losing all of them. Not fun. Even with Charles Quint (and the whole fucking Europe but France under them) they kept losing

>literally saved from Napi by Portuguese and Anglos
kek evritim

I'll lend you my gloves.

Maps like that of the HRE are pretty much disinformation. You cannot compare the collection of very independent states under an "Emperor" as anything like France or England. It pretty much only looks good as a picture.

You are retarded. You do know Spain won almost all the times un the italian wars, right ?

quite triggering the frogs

>arbitrary distinction

Nothing arbitrary, the Peace of Amiens ended all hostilities and is widely accepted as the end of the Revolutionary Wars

1871 was far more embarrassing than 1940 tbqhwyf

Yeah and you also won some skirmishes in America where it didn't matter more.

>pic related
How do you feel about it ?

Salty cowards, one and all

And now they're losing the greatest war they will ever face against the muslim hordes

Not really
Losing in 9 months against an enemy that outnumbered is less embarassing than losing in a month against an enemy with equal numbers

>And now they're losing the greatest war they will ever face against the muslim hordes

All of Western Europe is losing that war

I'm convinced Veeky Forums is just a board full of French people, all of which are pretending to be from other nations. The amount of French dick sucking is unreal.

t.burger

Then you've never browsed /int/
Shittons of people from various countries are francophile (for whatever reason I don't understand) and will defend France regardless of the topic.
Pic related

Of course, as an American it must surprize you as hating and despising France is a norm in your country (which is another thing I don't understand as they're the reason your country exists)

Shits weird
Countries that should hate France (Germany, Britain, Spain, Mexico, Vietnam...etc) love them but the one country that should love France (America) hates their guts

But I agree that Veeky Forums should get flags
It would prevent retards like you (and many others) to make dumb assumptions about nationality each time someone says something good/bad about a country

>still posting this bait
>2017

>Shittons of people from various countries are francophile (for whatever reason I don't understand) and will defend France regardless of the topic.

Maybe people just react to the globalized French bashing in opposite excess? I mean. As a French, I don't see at all what you're talking about, i.e. Francophiles. I see a lot of French hating however. Thus when I speak about my country I tend to be very passionate about it. Also it's a very lovable country and folks. Easy to mess with for sure, but good folks.

ps:
>Countries that should hate France: Germany

Mate have you ever met a German ?
English don't like us, well that goes around. Spaniards don't love us, well they really can't: we saved their arses from Muslims and brought them Human Rights and a few good things. Our only misbehaves to Spain are being better than them (I'll get Spaniards mad for this but don't, I love you folks. Think you're great) and maybe, just a little tiny bit, Napi invading them while they were our allies.
But mate, Germans ? They hate us so fucking much kek. I've never met a German that did not hate the French. Well, their country is kinda built around French hate desu. But 200 years later you'd think they would have grown up. Nope. They still hate the shit out of us, with no reciprocity whatsoever.

Americans just can't tolerate losers. It's not in their culture. We lost a Battle they had eyes on, it will take time for them to forget. I'm confident we will show our greatness again though. Fucking hell I love my country.