"Christianity was proto-communist"

Why do people say this? Is there any evidence for this?

Other urls found in this thread:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_anarchism
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4577547/
thehindu.com/news/national/Muslim-population-growth-slows/article10336665.ece
cbs.nl/nl-nl/achtergrond/2012/28/sterke-regionale-verschillen-in-vruchtbaarheid-naar-herkomstgroepering
pewforum.org/2015/04/02/religious-projections-2010-2050/
newenglishreview.org/Ibn_Warraq/Demographics:_Why_Islamic_Societies_are_Dying/
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

I've never heard people claim that Christianity itself is proto-communist, but I have heard people say Jesus was a proto-communist. Mostly for his rhetoric on redistribution of wealth and immigration

More than any other Bible source, the Sermon on the Mount is used as the basis for Christian anarchism.[6] Alexandre Christoyannopoulos explains that the Sermon perfectly illustrates Jesus's central teaching of love and forgiveness. Christian anarchists claim that the state, founded on violence, contravenes the Sermon and Jesus' call to love our enemies.[6]

The gospels tell of Jesus's temptation in the desert. For the final temptation, Jesus is taken up to a high mountain by Satan and told that if he bows down to Satan he will give him all the kingdoms of the world.[16] Christian anarchists use this as evidence that all Earthly kingdoms and governments are ruled by Satan, otherwise they would not be Satan's to give.[17] Jesus refuses the temptation, choosing to serve God instead, implying that Jesus is aware of the corrupting nature of Earthly power.[18]
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_anarchism

> Looking at the man, Jesus felt genuine love for him. “There is still one thing you haven’t done,” he told him. “Go and sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” At this the man’s face fell, and he went away sad, for he had many possessions.
> Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the Kingdom of God!” This amazed them. But Jesus said again, “Dear children, it is very hard[b] to enter the Kingdom of God. In fact, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!”

Also Acts have something about early Christians living in a commune having everything in common. So yeah, there is a lot there communists would agree with.

New International Version
But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, "And who is my neighbor?"

Acts 4

>32 All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of their possessions was their own, but they shared everything they had. 33 With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all 34 that there were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales 35 and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need.

Acts 5
>5 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.
>3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”
>5 When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died.

>James 5:1-6

>5 Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you. 2 Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh like fire. You have hoarded wealth in the last days. 4 Look! The wages you failed to pay the workers who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord Almighty. 5 You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves in the day of slaughter.[a] 6 You have condemned and murdered the innocent one, who was not opposing you.

Religious right BTFO again itt.

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ITT: american "christians" justify the fact they don't give a shit about people worse off than them

not a shred of evidence for that.

???
dontcha read too good

>Mostly for his rhetoric on redistribution of wealth and immigration

You also forgot his rhetoric about white privilieges and nazism

I don't hate communism but I don't think Christianity is compatible with it as it seeks to eliminate the class system. Jesus said we will always have the poor, even Deuteronomy says the same thing, "For the poor will never cease out of the land." Am I misunderstanding what communism is?

That actually sounds a bit capitalistic and free market. Especially
>4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal?

why do atheist communists love to make appeals to Christianity so much?

they'd burn every church and kill every priest as soon as they could

>hahhah I don't believe in your silly religion but didn't Jesus say to love thy neighbor haha why don't we let in 10 million Somalian refugees haha checkmate btw your religion is shit bahaha the entirety of my humanism is based on Christian norms but fuck you dad I'm not going to church lol


So disingenuous.

Every new faith hates it's older, especially ancestral competitors.

People who peddle this bullshit also forget Jesus was a hardcore racist/Jewish supremacist who considered Samaritans to be dogs and who went around preaching about eternal hellfire for people who can't stop sinning.

Even if we ignored that, communism is materialist by definition and Jesus was pretty much the biggest anti-materialist in the entire ancient world.

On Sexual immorality
Luke 16:18
Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries a woman divorced from her husband commits adultery

On alcohol
Matthew 26:29
But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom.

On abortion
Matthew 18:6
whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, andthathe were drowned in the depth of the sea.

On Separation of church and state
John 18:37. "You are a king, then!" said Pilate.
Jesus answered, "You are right in saying I am a king. In fact, for this reason I was born, and for this I came into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me."

>Jesus was a hardcore racist/Jewish supremacist who considered Samaritans dog
Sometimes I wonder if people just say the exact opposite of well-known facts to get a reaction out of people.

According to the Bible, Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines. The wives were described as foreign princesses, including Pharaoh's daughter and women of Moab, Ammon, Sidon and of the Hittites. The only wife mentioned by name is Naamah the Ammonite, mother of Solomon's successor, Rehoboam.

Solomon's infedility is well documented. His practice of marrying pagan women is what caused god to have absalom killed.

Plato and the Inca has protocommunist traits, too. Don't take it too seriously, it's just a word.

>never read Matthew 15

>If I take this completely out of context and deliberately misrepresent it, it sounds a lot like the complete opposite of what it meant.

Polygamy is not adultery, that's not an infidelity.

>thinks Caananites are Samaritans
>misinterprets that passage to mean the opposite of what it actually means.
why do i even bother?

>bahaha the entirety of my humanism is based on Christian norms
you think Communists care about humanism? I mean genuine Communists, not the fucking vegan upper-class roleplayers.

The poor might exist in "the land" but whether that applies to the kingdom of heaven is another matter.
Christianity isn't even consistent within itself, let alone communism. However, every label has a certain amount of wiggle room, and people may call themselves a christian communist if it synthesizes their religion and political views accurately without adopting traditional Marxist secularism, Cornel West being an example. The Bible at least sentimentally shares some concerns with communism.

>why don't we let in 10 million Somalian refugees

I know this is figurative but holy shit you stormfags exaggerate the number of refugees and immigrants relative to white people. Mexico has ~1/3 the number of people as the USA, 10-15% of them are white Mexicans and their birth rates decline as they immigrate and urbanize/get wealthier. Not to mention extrapolating immigration trends up to a century in the future and claiming they're accurate predictions. Of course saying this shit hurts their feelings and their super-rational response basically consist of calling people liberal pussies and cucks to show how STRONK they are.

Some christians tried to go communal and failed. They pooled all their resources and waited around for Jesus to come back. When he didn't, they went broke. Paul took collections from gentile nations and cities to give money to these idiots in Jerusalem.

Similarly, the pilgrims tried to work out socialism and almost starved. They instituted private ownership of land and good and flourished.

Being charitable is a personal choice, and not one that can be enforced by men with guns without becoming tyrannical.

>Christianity isn't even consistent within itself

Claims without evidence can be dismissed.

Dismissed.

>People who peddle this bullshit also forget Jesus was a hardcore racist/Jewish supremacist who considered Samaritans to be dogs
Yeah, except the Gospels state that whenever Jesus met a Samaritan, he looked past it and told people that they need to get over such petty squabbles. Literally the exact polar opposite of what you said is true.

Don't pay attention to Ælian the Æutist, he's just a dumb /pol/ack "christian" obsessed with how people view him. I've always found it sad how someone pretends to be christian, yet is still obsessed with status and whether people view him as wise and witty.

From the way Ælian obsessively follows Veeky Forums for every mention of him to the way he tries to "win" ever "debate" on here and "dominate" his "opponents", every action on here just shows a sad, lonely man, desperate for attetion and approval. I don't even hate you, Ælian, I deeply pity you and hope that someday, you resolve the obvious personal problems you have

>all who draw the sword will die by the sword
Why do I never see criticism of this quote? its arguably ignorant as fuck.

There is no evidence so far that Muslim fertility rates in Europe decline, nor is there any evidence they become less religious through the generations (opposite is true). Furthermore, even if their fertility rates decline to the European norm, it doesn't matter. The game is already over at this point.

Argue then

>Atheist communists
The faggots with che guevara shirts in college are all into new age bs and cubans are religious as fuck, atheism and communism dont get along for a long time now

Do you realise the reason the USA has Somalians is because of Christian cuckholds? you played yourself

>implying I worship a dead kike on a stick

Yes I am aware Catholic and Lutheran charities are the number one importers of Muslim migrants.

The vast majority of people who were involved in war die in bed, combat casualties have always in history been a tiny % of total military manpower with only borderline genocides exceptions like some mongol campaigns or when brazil and argentina double teamed paraguay

Any time somebody politicises the Gospels it's always

>dude lmao we'll just ignore everything that contradicts what we're trying to say (e.g. that christianity and materialism are fundamentally incompatible) and accept what we like

This is how Christ can simultaneously be a conservative, a communist, an anarchist, a liberal, etc.

>wealth redistribution
>acumulation of wealth and oppressing the poor is inmoral
>everyone is equal independant of where they are born

jesus attacking the merchants at the temple is pure proto-communism

Politics are fleeting, the empires of man will fall but the Kingdom of God is forever.

>Christian cuckholds
Well that's a weird way to spell "Bill Clinton" but I agree.

And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Women's fertility declines from economic opportunity regardless of background or religion.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4577547/
Muslim fertility slows in India
thehindu.com/news/national/Muslim-population-growth-slows/article10336665.ece
Dutch Turks have slightly lower birthrate than native Dutch women
cbs.nl/nl-nl/achtergrond/2012/28/sterke-regionale-verschillen-in-vruchtbaarheid-naar-herkomstgroepering
Fertility rate in Europe projected to decline over next two decades
pewforum.org/2015/04/02/religious-projections-2010-2050/
Muslin's themselves worried about aging populations and plummeting birth rates in native countries
newenglishreview.org/Ibn_Warraq/Demographics:_Why_Islamic_Societies_are_Dying/

>therefore we should kill the rich people and seize the means of productions to gain access to the fruit of our labor, amen
t. shit Jesus never said

"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,' spoken of through the prophet Daniel--let the reader understand--then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Wow good thing people are so easy to understand if you box them into caricatures

You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.

I never espoused that interpretation.
To say Jesus advocates materialism is false.

Yeah I bet that's why the scholastics had an entire school of philosophy based around resolving apparent biblical contradictions and insisting they existed in the mind of the reader.

o shit what happens if evil people get eternal life?

>yfw you realise that christianism is proto-comunism while the protestant split is basically proto-capitalism
>yfw the cold war was just european religion wars 2.0

Absolutely. He's anti-materialist.

>yfw you realize you're a fucking retard
Christianity is pretty strict anti-materialist monarchism and Catholicism draws from that as well as Roman tradition. And the proto-capitalists were the Italian merchants from Venice and Genoe, not the protestants. Protestants are more like the NO FUN ALLOWED league.

Marxism is materialist, but socialism and communism predate Marx, and weren't all materialist.

>taking a shitpost this serious
no u

although protetastism is very related to capitalism and industrial revolution
but yes, the first were the filthy venetian merchants

>protetastism is very related to capitalism and industrial revolution
It isn't really, that's Max Weber nonsense. Historically the most Lutheran areas were Germany and Scandinavia and they show pretty strong collectivist values. When they aren't fully socialist they're at the very least in full support of the welfare state.

You're probably thinking about specifically Anglo protestantism which is top tier bullshit religion that just somehow morphed into delusional Anglo nationalism and justification of whatever crap Anglos were doing at the time (imperialism, slavery, capitalism, zionism etc). Anglos shouldn't be taken seriously.

He's talking about a dangerous lifestyle. Something which does get a lot of people killed.

Yes, people have to be taught. It's basic. Wandering about blind in complete and utter ignorance towards a sheer cliff is not a good place to be.

So?

>Why do people say this

Because they're stupid and can only think in linear, dumbed down ways. In the minds o these people, there is only one spectrum: Communism and Capitalism. Funnily enough this spectrum is only tied to the vague simplified propaganda their politicians spew out and not on any rational enquiry or understand of politics, history or economics.

Or rather because they're trying to frame the views of a man who lived 2000 years ago in Israel within the context of 2017 post-industrial post-colonial USA politics.

They don't even know what communism is.

Seriously are you illiterate?

The argument is that christian values morphed into liberal hipp-dippy philosophy during the Enlightenment, which you honestly can't argue against.

please just kill yourself

Samefag

>Jesus was a hardcore racist/Jewish supremacist

So were Marx and Lenin

Because leftists disingenuously conflate communism with generosity.

No, there isn't. Commies take the 'Don't be greedy' part of the Bible and say that it ACTUALLY meant 'Kill the rich, take their shit'.