In what ways was he justified for the war in Vietnam?

Non-historian fallacy answer: Dominoes were falling and the U.S. needed to move to protect their interests before the whole she-bang fell to communism.

Historian fallacy answer: Assisting an ally and that's about the extent of it. Most people would say none here.

No. North Vietnam was going for a more nationalistic approach. The VC were diehard communists, though. Think of them as an SS equivalent to Ho Chi Minh communism.

How true to life is the Bryan Cranstan documentary?

Wasnt Ho Chi Minh more nationalistic anyway, he approached the US and only went to the Soviets as he was turned away

It's was far left wing nationalism they had posters of Stalin in the capital

That's a tired meme

What were they full on socialist communist?were the hippies protesting rightfully retarded

>hippies protesting a shitty war must mean they support communist terrorist group

Your brain on /pol/

They were protesting getting drafted more than anything but they did have stupid ideals like spitting on the marines who came home and openly thinking communism is a "great plan"

t.greasy brain damaged hippie.

>dominoes are a fallacy

wrong

Breakbeat Reminder we rightfully went into Vietnam to win against the gockers even if LBJ was an awful president we had every right to be there

>Spitting on marines
While there was some prejudice held towards servicemen that served in country based on what they may or may not have done, this is a particularly tired and old meme that is more steeped in its own legacy than the reality of post-Vietnam America.

Basically, his logic went

>there are literally billions of people who live free because of US security guarantees
>if the US's commitment to its allies comes into question, the USSR and PRC can begin to exert political coercion on US allies
>if Western Europe, Japan, or South Korea can be bullied into giving the communists economic concessions, closing US bases, or otherwise dropping out of the Cold War, the communists can win the Cold War
>South Vietnam is a US ally being invaded by communists

It's worth pointing out that this wasn't just Johnson, the entire cabinet supported this view.

>prejudice against servicemen
And there's your problem the fact they had to nerve to do that while dodging the draft makes me nauseous

>'if we pull out well bust every treaty we got, 44 nations will say the US cant be counted on for anything'
-LBJ (rough quote)
He knew he'd be crucified by the Republicans if he attempted to leave

What's assets did they have in Vietnam
Oil?

I think it's absolutely wrong for people to have done that, as many soldiers were drafted, many of whom were disproportionately poor and rural or poor and urban - but vindicating that opinion with people having dodged the draft doesn't make that much sense to me. The War was wrong, and people did whatever they felt they needed to do in order to avoid it sits fine with me.

>he approached the US and only went to the Soviets as he was turned away
Ho Chi Minh was communist since the 1920's, lured in by French communists, not the Soviets.
He was more nationalistic, drawing upon Jefferson and the like, but he also drew quite a bit from Marx, Lenin and Stalin. The VC, unlike your previous statement, were ultra-nationalist and extreme communists. They wanted a lot of communist reforms that the North Vietnamese weren't willing to concede (and never did for that matter). As an example, land reform was a big promise in the VC but since the NV leaders were primarily land-owners that never actually came to be. In short, the North Vietnamese government (as a whole) weren't as communist
as the U.S. government claimed, but the V.C. absolutely were and honestly, even more so. There's a book called Last Night I Dreamed of Peace by Dang Thuy Tram that really highlights the disconnect between the Vietnamese Communist Party and the Vietcong.

>you in charge of reading comprehension

>this is a particularly tired and old meme that is more steeped in its own legacy than the reality of post-Vietnam America
It wasn't as common as Vietnam vets claim, but it did happen.

Rubber. A lot of missions in Vietnam centered around Michelin rubber plantations. Specifically in II Corps.

Vietnam was a righteous war.
North Vietnam invaded South Vietnam.
It was a policing action and defensive war.
The good guys lost desu.

>It wasn't as common as Vietnam vets claim, but it did happen.

No it didn't though anecdotes are not evidence of it at all let alone the fact that the whole "your recitative/friend of a friend of mine" factor comes into play which is flimsy as hell.

Brothers in War, Vietnam War documentary, it's available on Netflix. Unless you're going to deny video evidence?

>Born too late to experience Vietnam
Literally what is the point?

Why was rubber so important ?

Tires you dumbass

>USS Maddox bombed in the Gulf of Tonkin
>it ain't me starts playing

There's litrrally books on the topic the best one being bob greenes homecoming

That's what I thought at first I thought it went deeper than that you deadbeat shiteater

It was a mene friend no hard feelings :^)

Don't know why I laughed monstrously hard at that image

>America is the world's policeman
>good guy v bad guy narrative

You guys can be insufferable at times.

It really was like that in nams case a lot of Vietnamese love Americans

The higher echelons of the party may have been proper believer, but ho chi minh prioritized nationalism above communism, and the rank and file of course had simpler motivations than communism or nationalism, and would go with whatever seemed to offer them more.
But one can't blame LBJ here, by the time he took office the US had already destroyed the possibility of warm relations with ho chi minh. There wasn't room for amiable reconciliation.

>It really was like that in nams case a lot of Vietnamese love Americans

this is your brain on burgers

It's true though put more effort

t.jeolousy

Vietnam was just a gook-hunting romp that got way out of hand

It was just a prank

yeah, it's one of these things where it happened maybe a handful of times - over a nation of 200m people mind you - and the press burned it into our national memory and now everybody's uncle's brother remembers it happening to their neighbor. just like bra burnings

Or medieval anti-semitism

They took out poppy fields

the Cranston HBO flick is actually a very faithful reproduction of a theatrical play, which i recommend if you ever get a chance. there's some limitations inherent to the theater medium that the movie actually gets the feel of the events better. but the energy of a good crowd is worth it.

the movie is very accurate in terms of portraying the mood of the times and the sequence of historical events. they used a lot of direct quotes from the actual figures (LBJ, MLK, etc).

the movie and play are, i wouldn't necessarily call them hagiographic - they show plenty of his weaknesses, some of his cruelty, and cast him as the paranoid he was. but you should be warned that for many there is no accurate portrayal of Johnson other than to draw the devil horns and tail on him.

i'll bite. link?

Just saying the over-exaggeration of public displays of hatred and humiliation like spitting on a soldier likely have many correlates to other such claims.

What's cranstons flick called

nigga you're on the internet, GOOGLE

Darude - Sandstorm

Epic

Hey what's Cranstons flick called

Morrisay

Rubber is stupid important for industry. Tires, hoses, o-rings, gaskets, etc. The war wasn't about rubber but it was a significant factor to consider.

Didn't they have large surplus of opiates in Cambodia

The war didn't enter Cambodia (outside of supplying the Cambodian monarchy) until much later, but yeah Opium was a big thing in Cambodia. There's a whole historiography of Vietnam that makes it about resources and class struggle (Marxist historiography), but it's an uncommon point of view as the primary source texts we have regarding the war don't really bring up resources as much as domino theory.

Yeah usually the reasons for wars are actually the reasons school tells you like civil war was about slavery.Vietnam was communism etc there is still a myriad of reasons but those are usually the basis points for mobility

Also while it originated in Cambodia, it was really common in Vietnam as well. VC bodies often had opium on them which makes quite a bit of sense (pain reducer, appetite suppressant, etc.). Opiates are the drug of choice among working classes and soldiers for a reason.

I don't know if I'd go that far.

Thread theme
m.youtube.com/watch?v=tznKkts0nG0

>I knew from the start that I was bound to be crucified either way I moved. If I left the woman I really loved—the Great Society—in order to get involved in that bitch of a war on the other side of the world, then I would lose everything at home. All my programs.... But if I left that war and let the Communists take over South Vietnam, then I would be seen as a coward and my nation would be seen as an appeaser and we would both find it impossible to accomplish anything for anybody anywhere on the entire globe.

He also had a list of all the men that had died read to him every morning during breakfast, and would often send personal notes to families.

He followed the policy of containment, understood that domino theory was fully plausible, continued the support of Diem's government just like Eisenhower and Kennedy and simply retaliated against North Vietnam following the Gulf of Tonkin incident (probably a fabrication however).

He'd also fall asleep in the situation room in his PJs after staying up all night keeping updated on the mission to rescue a downed pilot.

Poor bastard.

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THE WAR OF NORTHERN AGGRESSION!