Tell me about the Huns.
Random questions: What lead the Huns all the way from northern China to Gaul? Were they Turkic, did they speak something like Chuvash? How did they manage to gain so much power? Why did Attila pull back his army, what did the Pope Leo I say to him? As for his death, did he choke on his nosebleed, poison, stabbed?
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Huns.
A broad term for a larger group of related tribes who, fleeing China's massive push West against any barbarians they found, ended up starting a tidal wave towards India, Middle East, and Europe. The Huns who ended up in Europe pushed most of the Germanic tribes who ended up defeating and taking over the Western Roman Empire. The Germanics who did not flee ended up joining the Hunnic forces in Europe. Many Gepids, Goths, and pre-Slavs were the bulk of Attila's infantry core.
The Huns supported skull shaping in all their children. They elongated the skull until early childhood. This gave them an ugly, odd shape. Ritual scarring of both cheeks gave them a grotesque appearance that really shaped the fears so many people harbored towards them. The power they held came from Attila's ability to monger his own legend. Slaying his brother, Bleda only added to his prestige. As more tribes joined his war path into Europe, fewer resisted. Fewer losses and higher recruitment ended up culminating into a very large army.
They were paid in loot and stayed out of fear. Attila's inability to lose gave him a very large persona. Eventually his streak had to end. The Battle of the Catalaunian Fields was a massive (someone dramatic would call it an "end-game") battle in which tens of thousands of Germanic warriors took sides with the fading Roman Empire or the rising Hun Horde. Attila's forces slew a Visigothic king in the height of the battle. Rather than flee, his vanguard rushed to his corpse. Other soldiers saw this and thought they had the advantage. Pressing hard into Attila's forces eventually paid off. The unbeatable Hun retired from the battlefield. His image was tarnished, but not broken.
He returned to his base of operations in Eastern Europe. A famine ravaged the area - a mix of climate change and his own raiding ensured it would occur. Launching another raid into Northern and Central Italy ensured his horde remained intact. Pope Leo approached Attila then
This is why I come to Veeky Forums. Were the "white huns" the ones that made it to Europe?
The huns being turkic/linked to chinese barbarians is an old myth with little evidence.
Germans were pushed into the empire less by the huns, more by the tribes the huns displaced, /and/ changes in climate that led them to search for more fertile lands within the Empire. (At that, they were useful. They helped replace the deplated rural populations).
The battle of Châlons was not as large as it was historically assumed to be. It did not stop Attila from continuing his later raids into Italy.
The Gallic campaign had really been decided by the strategic success of the allies in cutting off Attila from Orleans. The battle was fought when he was in full retreat. It wasn't some 'clash of nations'.
The invasion into Italy was more a 'raid all the shit' thing, which was stopped due to plague out breaks, not due to the Papacy.
Overall, the Huns were but one of many minor warlord tribes on the outskirts of the Empire that occasionally raided in it. They were paid off a lot, which was standard imperial policy.
The empire fell apart after Atilla's death.
You come for the orthodox narrative from the late 19th century?
Attila received Pope Leo in an oddly calm fashion. The two exchanged many words, but the story goes that Pope Leo effectively surrendered Rome's legacy as the king of all kings. He prayed that Attila might see his constant attacks proved his superiority to the old Roman Empire and that continued violence would only ensure nothing to remain for plunder. Whether the surrender actually worked, or the famine in Attila's base of operations got so bad that no food was arriving to feed the army... Attila actually left. Maybe it was the Byzantines seizing the opportunity to raid across the Danube and steal what Attila already stole. Maybe it was the famine and low supplies. Maybe Attila was just a really cool dude who could take an honest surrender with respect.
Attila's eventual death - totally poison by the way - would spell the end of Hun domination in Europe. His relatives who led different confederations of tribes into India and the Middle East had equal success in destroying old empires, carrying off much plunder, and spawning all kinds of apocalypse myths. The Huns who attacked these areas are called White Huns, the Hephthalites, the Hunas, the Hua, and Hudun. The name mattered little because what we do know is they caused a lot of mayhem and destruction. They led a large band of Turkic and Iranian tribes on a warpath. They made the once mighty Sassanid Empire a tributary state. Something the Byzantines had tried to do without success many times.
Oddly enough, they used Greek script and Bactrian terminology often in what little records we have left from them. Maybe they forced scholars to work for them, or maybe the offer of great wealth and survival was enough to entice willing, educated people to join their empire. The modern nation of Tajikistan contains much of what these people left behind. The Gupta Empire ended up driving them out of India and effectively ended their massive attacks on neighboring states.
They too altered their skull shapes
Shit would be unnerving to see
What connection do they have with Hungary
Eh, it was more the plague.
Seriously, once you enter the plains of northern Italy your army (till say, 1920s) is gonna catch disease. It's what keeps happening to the HRE later on.
And you're calling the ERE Byzantines when talking about the 4/5th century? Really?
i was entertained by his storytelling, at least give him some credit senpai
>Pope Leo effectively surrendered Rome's legacy as the king of all kings
Wew
hungary appropriated the hunnic legacy for their own ends basically, and created a national foundation myth out of it. as far as i know there's no connection between the magyars and huns
Eh, storytelling is 'nice', but it bullshits a lot.
If I wanted to read Gibbon and John Julius Norwich tier 'muh historical epics and dramas!' I'd get 'em off my shelf.
For actually answering a question? It's best to not try and make some grand narrative
This is an infant skull. The proportions make the cranium look more elongated than it actually is.
> Tell me about the Huns.
Their true might started and ended with Attila.
The moment Attila died, the Germanics genocided the fuck out of the Huns and wiped them out utterly.
They even sent the head of Attilas sons to Constantinople.
>>They even sent the head of Attilas sons to Constantinople.
Source? As far as i know the sons of Attila begged the Eastern Romans for some land. Two died but the third named Ernak managed to recieve some.
fucking hell
makes my blood boil to see the descendants of Scipio, Caesar, and Trajan kowtow to these horse marrying scumbags
sometimes i wonder what's the point of it all when you know your future people will destroy everything you worked and bled for.
Looks like a Maya man
"The head of Dinzic, son of Attila, king of the Huns, was brought to Constantinople" - Marcellinus Comes
One source states that it was the Romans that destroyed them, but others state the Goths doing it and then sending the heads of the nobles as a declaration of their might.
I think it's beautiful and quite poetic. It's karma.
not beautiful. it is tragic. poetic, but tragic.
so were they some kind of chinese?
They definitely didn't ride into battle shirtless, armed with fucking whips.
We had the last laugh.
Speta Huna or the White Huns were either Xionites, Kidarites, Hephtalites, or a related people. Either way, they were probably mostly Iranic steppe nomads that conquered central Asia, northern Iran and bits of northern India in 4th and 5th centuries CE. They mingled with local cultures, became sedentary and were eventually defeated by the Gok-Turks.
The name "White" doesn't refer to their skin colour, but to tribal divisions - we have mentions of "Red Huns" as well as various other colours in later Turk and other steppe confederations - Kara (Black) Khanids, Karakalpaks, Karakitay, etc.
Given that most of the steppe area the Magyars traveled through from northern Russia/Urals, they almost definitely absorbed plenty of hunnic derivatives that had fled to the steppe after the hunnic empires dissolution
Why are you sad? Both Roman Empires survived Attila and his Huns. The western one by 23 years and the Eastern one by exactly 1000.
And remember whose legacy survived till today. It ain't the Huns.
Guess what is happening nowadays? If you aint so sure, go check /pol/
en.wikipedia.org
>"They made their foes flee in horror because their swarthy aspect was fearful, and they had, if I may call it so, a sort of shapeless lump, not a head, with pin-holes rather than eyes. Their hardihood is evident in their wild appearance, and they are beings who are cruel to their children on the very day they are born. For they cut the cheeks of the males with a sword, so that before they receive the nourishment of milk they must learn to endure wounds. Hence they grow old beardless and their young men are without comeliness, because a face furrowed by the sword spoils by its scars the natural beauty of a beard. They are short in stature, quick in bodily movement, alert horsemen, broad shouldered, ready in the use of bow and arrow, and have firm-set necks which are ever erect in pride. Though they live in the form of men, they have the cruelty of wild beasts."
I would honestly shit my pants if I saw one charging at me.
>the Huns
Lmao more like the Homos
t. Aetius
Aetius was a huge Hunaboo though. He spent most of his young adult phase at the court of the Hunnic king Uldin.
Wasn't he a sort of hostage?
So the Huns were an army of Elliot Rodgers?
This dude
I bet you're real fun at parties
No you didn't.
>Battle of Chalons V.2
Literally this
youtu.be
Best scenario.
They sound like Kurgan kek
Huh, I thought the hunnic invasions were done by tribes from the caucasus region. Didn't think the Huns would look central/east asian.
That's because you're retarded.
Barbarians.
Reminder that the Avars, Bulgars and maybe even the Khazars were Hun leftovers. They didn't simply disappear from Europe after Attila died.
Be glad it happened not that its gone :(
Also the huns were memes in my opinion. Just shitty hordes that got rekt like Goths. The huns when in major battle were no match for Roman might and deserve what they got. A shitty hole in Hungary if it wasnt for that jealous cunt princess theyd have stayed where they belonged.
>It ain't the Huns.
they did
They are remembered as those who started the dissolution of an empire who believed to be undefeatable, the arrival of the Huns changed history forever
>made the ERE their bitches
>plundered and destroyed everything in North Italy and only stopped at Rome because of plague and lack of supplies
>shitty
They were certainly more impressive than any other barbarian tribe the Romans faced.
t. Flavius Catullinus
Poor man's mongols, got btfo by Romans and cucked to existance by Germanics despite being horse archers
I really can't stand the Huns. Partly because of how they jump-started the barbarian migrations.
The Avars, Bulgars, Magyars, Khazars, Pechenegs, Cumans, and other steppe-based groups after the Huns don't seem to be as bad in comparison.
Oh and Genghis >>> Attila.
>got btfo by Romans
When? I should remind you that Attila's successful invasion of Italy happened just one year after the Battle of Chalons, so it was pretty much inconsequential to their bigger plans.
Keep in mind that the Romans were fighting everywhere at this point. The Huns success was not due to them being the tits. It was due to lack of Roman fighting forces left. The legions were stretched extremely thin. The Huns when faced in real open battle were meh at best saw as much success as other Germanic tribes.
so what did the Pope say to Attila ?
No one knows but it is summed up as essentially gtfo Jesus don't play this shit.
>he Huns when faced in real open battle were meh at best saw as much success as other Germanic tribes
Look up their earlier invasions of the ERE. They got dangerously close to ravaging Constantinople until they agreed with paying tribute to the Huns to be left alone. Alaric and the Vandals didn't achieve 1/10 of what they did. They just sacked an irrelevant depopulated city which was no longer the capital of the WRE.
What connection do they have with Hungary?
The national fairrytail says: there were two brother: Hunor and Magor...
Not realy there is the double homecapture theorry, medival kodex'es say when Árpád captured our homeland they found people what had the same culture and language what we had.
Probably
>Both Roman Empires survived Attila and his Huns.
You think, that Roman Empire can be roman if it aint leed by a Roman?
Well being homo was part of the greek and roman culture.
They were, their burring ritual shows it, well in Europe and asia you can find kurgans, these are little hills were the nooble was burried.
true, probably
Who wants major battle, when you can starve out an entire army, burn the villages, get in some cities? You know the roman army was foot-based, if i have a horse howmutch times iam more mobile?
Not realy, they just crushed some cultures and assimilated.
Who cares about what you care?
>Well being homo was part of the greek and roman culture
Not in the 5th century
They were probably some East Asian mongoloids.
A recent new study came out now we know that Eastern Schytians were basically steppe Indo-europeans (Yamnaya) + Eastern Asians.
nature.com
Huns were probably more Asian tho. Old studies have shown that supposed area from where Xiongnu migrated if they were actually Huns had Q, N, R1a, C markers. But still that doesn't tell much about their admixture, judging by their descriptions that have survived they were definitely chinks.
Byzantiboos make me fucking sick
Likely the colours refers to cardinal directions.
Just like it was with Rus (Belarus/White Rus, Black Rus, Red Rus) or White Croatia.
en.wikipedia.org
>Attila's eventual death - totally poison by the way
Dude, his death was accidental and underwhelming: his nosebleeding killed him while he was asleep...
Sometimes people just die.
It's like Bruce Lee's death: accidental.
Wow, this thread turned into historical masturbation of alt-right really quick.
wat?
Some fun facts about Huns:
>Attila, aka "God's Judgement", aka "God's whip with which to punish the nations", aka "the scourge of God" aka Big Guy
>Huns -> hung aryans -> Hungarians
>Huns were, in fact, the last remnants of the Finnish army from the so-called Hyper War
>genetically engineered Asian superwarriors with the geen-seed of the perfect aryan "Finn Marines"
>feared by the pathetic Hwan Empire
>7 ft tall, muscular warriors with an extremely high IQ
>Attila's life-force was extremely powerful. They needed 3 metal coffins (adamantium laced) to contain the uncontrolled power emanitng from his corpse
>modern Hungarians are the genetic descendants of these mighty Hung-aryans
>full moon turns 1 of 10 modern Hungarians into werehuns
>many Hungarians believe that Attila will rise again - in fact, the Hungarian government kills every citizen who dares to say otherwise.
>Attila's psyche is just as active as his life-force in those coffins: he's well aware of the state of the world and plans his return to save mankiind
>only modern Polacks know these facts - they will fight at Attlia's side in the next Hyper War
Pic related: see the bird symbols on the armor of Attila - it's the so-called Turul bird, the totem of the Huns
>Not realy there is the double homecapture theorry, medival kodex'es say when Árpád captured our homeland they found people what had the same culture and language what we had.
Sounds more like Avars than Huns, really.
>Sounds more like Avars than Huns
They are the same thing. Avars are just an offshoot of the Huns.
Giving internet to the Finns was a mistake.
>The Huns supported skull shaping in all their children
Indeed.
Shaping the skull in the right way activates important acupressure points in the brain, unlocking supernatural abilities in the process.
Pic related: Ancient Hunnic warriors in full regalia. Note the elongated helmets.
the Huns were based
>Giving internet to the Finns was a mistake.
I hope you're not one of those "alt-histoy" folks...
It's funny that we still have Hyper-War deniers in 2017.
the hyper war meme is probably the most unfunny shit to become 'popular' in the last five years on Veeky Forums. Fucking horrendous
Second.
Typical Hwan propaganda.
Europe is being overrun by hunnish immigrants?
>makes my blood boil to see the descendants of Scipio, Caesar, and Trajan kowtow to these horse marrying scumbags
May I remind you that barbarians like these buttraped Rome?
Actually that's wrong. The biggest ignominity of all this is that the Huns barely figured in the destruction of the Western Roman Empire at all, and arguably helped prop up the East leading to it lasting another millenium. The West was pretty much doomed from the 420s because of the massive civil wars that had basically lasted from 408 all the way up to 430 with most of the Roman army of hundreds of thousands wiped out, going unpaid or cut off from the chain of command. By the time the Huns arrived to threaten the West Aetius had managed to wipe out or sideline his opposition but the fundamentals were gone, the barbarians had already pretty much gained virtual independence and it was only mutual self-interest that led to them fighting alongside the Romans at the Catalaunian Fields.
The Huns ended up dominating the entire Danubian frontier, reining in the tribes that had previously threatened to overrun the Eastern Empire's frontier a la Alaric. In the breathing space the Huns gave the East, busy as they were with fucking over the Western Empire, they managed to reinforce the Theodosian Walls of Constantinople making them impregnable and forever stopping western foes from threatening the rich agriculture lands of Anatolia. It would only be from the east that Byzantium's doom would come, and Attila was inadvertently a key figure in that state of affairs.
>popular
I hope you understand that Veeky Forums is basically made up of 40-50 people and maybe 3 or 4 of them have been responsible for propagating (see. forcing) this "meme" since the founding of the board. Don't make the mistake of assuming that this is a thing, because it isn't.
can you give me a quick rundown on the hyperwar?
Nah the Romans made that up, they want the most terrifying man in history to go out in the most bitch ass way
Bloody Romans.
I wish they'd be d-... oh, wait! XD
>his board
>party
These things are different
This
Epic facebook meme, d00d.
Bump
>Posting anime
Western civilization has truly lost
yes.
no they didnt.
I just want to know how could a people that went from one tiny village to a multi-continent empire could stand to pay tribute to a bunch of horse dick sucking pin heads.
Did they back down from Phyrus and his elephants?
From Carthage's navy?
From Hannibal's seeming invincibility?
Never.
It's a meme satirizing the aggressive nationalism and historical revisionism of far-right groups in Finland and the North Korean government revising history to feel relevant. Add in some Veeky Forums memes, and you've got the Hyper-War. Some user was going to write a chronicle of it, but that never materialized. If you want more, you should start a new thread, because this one is actually interesting and relatively informative.
>no they didnt.
Let's see, then:
>The year 476 is generally accepted as the formal end of the Western Roman Empire. That year, Orestes refused the request of Germanic mercenaries in his service for lands in Italy. The dissatisfied mercenaries, including the Heruli, revolted. The revolt was led by the Germanic chieftain Odoacer. Odoacer and his men captured and executed Orestes. Within weeks, Ravenna was captured and Romulus Augustus was deposed. This event has been traditionally considered the fall of the Roman Empire in the West. Odoacer quickly conquered the remaining provinces of Italy.
smoked a lot of pot and ran along a information highway of the day thus civ tech line advantage
most of what i know i learned in age of empires 2
Why did they elongated infant skulls? To look more terrifying? Was it just the men?
They knew about aliens.
The women did the skull elongation too, but the cutting of their cheeks was done by men
Yeah. And they actually exchanged Aetius with Attila. I don't know why is it notre widely known but Attila lived in Rome during his childhood and apparently he knew Aetius
To stay woke
Anime is literally the only thing that makes "Western" civilisation worth saving.
Patently false Finnish propaganda. The real Attila the Hun was
>a cute girl
>sent to Earth by an evil alien computer to destroy bad civilisations
>could transform into a giant and crush Romans with her delicious feet
>was very affectionate despite being autistic
>had a magical sword that could be used to phone Mars and ask him to fire laser beams from space to blow up Romans
>destroyed Rome (this was covered up by medieval writers)
>will return to marry me
Stay woke gentlemen.
too far type moon
minor defeat, king was an empty title and a weak man who's realm soon destroyed utterly, by a few thousand genetically superior eastern Roman imperial soldiers.
Get a bloody grip, man.
It's history, not football - you don't have to take sides.
>Judeo-cuckoldian propaganda designed to turn impressionable Western millennials into degenerates and derelicts
>makes Western civilization worth saving
What did he mean by this?