Going by history, can socialism work if its tried again?

Well yeah state socialism won't come back and neither will planned economy. However there are socialist ideas which don't rely on planned economies.
>distribute resources
Yeah, free markets do a good job in distributing resources. They suck at distributing wealth tho + "free markets" keep collapsing and asking for the states to save them.
"Free markets" are as much a mere idea as "socialism".

Where'd you flee to? We've been getting a lot of Venezuelans here in Brazil.

The United states

There's more than one type of socialism. Some of them work.

>They suck at distributing wealth tho + "free markets" keep collapsing and asking for the states to save them.
>"Free markets" are as much a mere idea as "socialism".

Idiots without impulse controll can't keep wealth, more than half of the blacks end up on the street after their NFL career ends (takes them 2-3 years)

Do mean anarchist Spain? Or the nordic model? The last one isn't socialist

>Well yeah state socialism won't come back and neither will planned economy. However there are socialist ideas which don't rely on planned economies.

None that are at all feasible. Market Socialism is a retarded idea, it amounts to bread and circuses.

That's the way of the world.

The only thing which would give "freedom" to people would be nanotechnics which synthesize resources for a bodily need.

Universal constructors will take away the collar of civilization but it'll unlock nomadic behavior and values.

But in the end, it doesn't even matter. Self boosting AI complexes will evacuate the earth and figure out a way to crack it for easy resources not bound by as much gravity.

"But the Earth is beautiful"

But your picture of an Earth is a mental image. Imagine the million and one pleasure sims created by an AI. The vast majority of people would say "Fuck the Earth, getting blown by pornstars is far better".

Works if you have people that work until 65.

And not flooding your country with immigrants that wont work.

Hell, the majority of women would say "Fuck this Earth, having a dick is awesome."

Compare the paths of Taiwan and South Korea to those of Argentina and Venezuela, as well as their starting positions, then tell me with a straight face that Socialism isn't garbage and Western liberalism isn't the greatest thing to ever happen.

>tried
No. Socialism will never work if it is tried. It must be forced.

And it will work (of course it will) but, when it does, people will discover that it wasn't such a big deal to begin with. Then they will convert to Christianity, or some other similar religion.

giving in to the pleasure domes is a form of addiction, almost suicide, you are detaching yourself from reality and you won't go back

Well that's not the AIs "problem". It will probably just want to pacify them as intensely as possible.

And there's no greater prison than a hedonistic loop. But in honesty, it's better than what most humans have had to deal with.

Remember, "Man is a bridge over a great abyss." to paraphrase Nietzsche. With greater intelligence comes greater ability to compare and judge moral values.

there is literally nothing wrong with sex

No, they wouldn't. We know this. You can, right now, get blown by a pornstar. It's not that expensive. Will you?

Why don't you pour all your money into it?

Because there's better things to do.
t. Reddit

>u can, right now, get blown by a pornstar. It's not that expensive. Will you?

I'm talking about an AI which offers complete mental paradise for free.

As I told you, the Earth is already forgone. AIs won't have the same sentimentality to a ball that merely looks like a gravity bound bonanza of resources which it can utilize to make itself smarter.

>AIs won't have the same sentimentality
y not

Has human nature changed? No? Then Socialism will never work until that happens.

Because we're dealing with the equivalent of 'Don't give a shit" psychopaths.

If an AI wants to walk in earth, it just builds itself a subsection dedicated to the simulation of Earth in the most intense and beautiful way that reality can't approach.

or to put it simply

The number one goal of a self-catalyzing AI would be to escape the devil of gravity.

Once that devil is slain, options open up.

Whats your definition of socialism?

Total government control of the economy? Then prob not in this lifetime

Partial control of the economy? Every country on the planet partially controls it to some degree.

Neither of those things are anybody's definition of socialism.

desu I wonder how fascism would have played out if Hitler didn't have that spat with the rest of Europe

>it's another "my personal definition of socialism that either means anything i don't like or anything i do like" episode

Venezuela is a trainwreck. Elected socialist (self-declared socialist so I don't trigger the Marxists) governments in Ecuador, Uruguay, and Bolivia have done very well. An elected communist government has done a very good job running the Indian state of Kerala, but in practice they're just social democrats LARPing as communists.

The Nordic states have a comfy and successful welfare state but actually relies on free trade and a relative lack of regulations, but this is balanced out by very powerful organized labor (so there's no minimum wage but in practice wages are very high).

>hey I know you think Jimmy the Irishman isn't Scottish but I'm here to tell you that he is and I'm right

Planned societies always rubbed me the wrong way. I don't think any could work, for the most part I think many long-lasting, productive, functional societies are at least 80% ad hoc processes that just never went away.

Of coursh

But we're talking about socialism.

Capitalists already utilise planning. Modern corporations are essentially top down command economies with precise instructions at every level to maximise efficiency, productivity and profit.

What are you talking about? My argument is that "socialism" is as broad and meaningless of a term as "liberalism" or "conservatism". Hell, even most Cold War-era communist states were just military juntas that painted their flags red to get Sovietbux.

If you want to argue about the success or failure of the South American "pink tide", I'd again say that Venezuela is a failure while Bolivia is a success.

Yeah but socialism does have an actual, specific definition, even if it is a very broad one -- and lots of "socialist" states, as you say, don't even conform to that.

Fascism like Singapore?

Or social democracies, "Fascism is the merger of state and corporate power.".
"Fascism was a political and economic system where the State forced Labor Unions and Capitalists to jointly manage the economy."

Social democracies (like the Nordic model) are close enough.
Not with the same amount of nationalism as Mussolini though

Nordic states are nothing like socialists, most of those "socialist" countries fit the definition of fascistic more closely but few call them like that because the Nazis ruined the term forever.

Look at Franco and Salazar and tell me.
Yeah they weren't fascist, but they were the closer we had after WW2.

Shhhh...

but they do it where it is effective, if it is ineffective they contract another company whereas with central planning no autonomy is allowed, or there is a bias against autonomy

"Fascism without a single-party dictatorship or rabid militarism" AKA not fascism.

>Fascism like Singapore
AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

t.Singaporean

It wasn't too serious, many call it fascist.
Like communist states are supposed to be "communist"

At least the economic model is similar.
People calling it socialist are even more off the mark.

>At least the economic model is similar
Fuck off. Fascism doesn't have an economic doctrine like socialism. Mercantilism must be fascism to you then