How is God not a sky fairy again...

How is God not a sky fairy again? The way the bible describes him he sounds more like Zeus than anything Christian philosophers said about him 1000+ years later.

Exodus 34:5
>The Lord descended in the cloud and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name, “The Lord.”

Deuteronomy 33:26
>There is none like God, O Jeshurun, who rides through the heavens to your help, majestic through the skies.

Psalm 68:4
>Sing to God, sing praises to his name; lift up a song to him who rides upon the clouds — his name is the Lord— be exultant before him.

Psalm 68:33
>to him who rides in the heavens, the ancient heavens; behold, he sends out his voice, his mighty voice.

Psalm 104:3
>He lays the beams of his chambers on the waters; he makes the clouds his chariot; he rides on the wings of the wind;

There's more, in hebrew it's often written that there are multiple Elohim (Gods), also it's clear he's been ripped from Ugaritic mythology.

Because

People believed it for a long time

Everyone knows that if a religion is old than it's true

all the talk about him "riding the clouds" and defeating the monsters and Leviathan is taken DIREXTLY from the God El of the Canaanite pabtheon.

the hebrew YHWH IS the Canaanite God El. Abrahamicfags dont even know theyve been worshipping a "false god" this whole time.

Fuck off edgy Reditor.

>what is allegory and metaphor
>what is genre

Nu-male Redditors are the worst.

The truth is reddit now?

God is just Zeus without any of the interesting Olympian intrigue and character flaws

Also he is a Mary Sue

...

Fuck off moron

>My religion is true, allow me to ignore the straight falsehoods (you can do miracles too, just say the name), the many contradictions, the math errors...

Nobody takes the Bible seriously. Christianity is now quite removed from the Bible, and is now characterized by partial adherence to a moral code and a nondescript belief in God.

>Chooses more poetic bits from the Bible.
>Asks us to accept them as prose.

>trying to reason with people who literally believe in magic

No wonder, it's a religion so filled with errors and contradictions one has to wonder if it isn't actually the work of a demon that's been punished with idiocy and thus can't write straight.

I've had a spiritual experience, apotheosis, and when it happened, my eyes turned reptilian for a while, I also dreamt I would go to heaven, meanwhile the bible is angry at serpents and dragons, take that for you will.

Exodus and Deuteronomy are literal history.

How are gaytheists like the OP allowed to post on here when you need to be 18+ ?

He's a meta-archetype for order and paternal structure. Though if you're an edgelord, you can call that whatever you want.

pagans are quite unreasonable, I agree tbqh

While the Hebrew plural is used, it is used in the singular sense.

"Let us make mankind in Our image".....and God made mankind in His image.

Plural, yet singular. Gee. Why does that sound familiar when speaking of God....

No, just very young edgy faggots who add nothing to the board.

Anything that doesn't make logical sense is allegory

Except the jew who walked on water and turned into a zombie, that literally happened

Lack of enforcement.

No need to be atheist to disregard the bible, literally Lovecraft is more believable.
See

Edgy is being below the age of 50 and clinging to primitive superstitions to be contrarian

This too.
See: paganism.

>old testament conception
Irrelevant, one culture's conception of God need not be ours. God is beyond definition, His features are given by the mind contemplating Him.

Just think of it like this:
>Oral Torah exists a good while before anything is recorded
>As Jews face persecution by other peoples, but also try to communicate their beliefs to other peoples, they modify their oral tales to make it easier for others to understand and accept by association (Romans did this by adopting foreign gods)
>YHWH is portrayed with features of a thunder-god as a result
>Foreign gods are mentioned as a result

But go ahead and reject everything we know about the oral tradition and culture at that time because you want to impose your Greco-Roman ideology onto civilizations that flourished before even Crete. Yes, being edgy is much better than that STUPID BULLSHIT.
Stop shitposting.

Nobody is shitposting here but you, people have laid before everyone valid arguments to pass up this religion, including personal experiences, and all you can do in its defense is tell lies and call everyone a shitposter.

>below

I guess when you're wrong, you're wrong about everything, huh.

Fuck back to plebbit, pleb.

No, I stay here where I have been since 2005 or before.

>calls someone elses maturity into question
>uses the word "gaytheists"

>valid arguments
No they haven't, they've tip-a-tipped all through the thread.
durka durka this is bad because it HURTS MY FEELINGS ITS BAD BECAUSE IT VAGUELY RESEMBLES ANOTHER RELIGION THAT THE JEWS HAD TO INTERACT WITH HOW DARE THEIR ORAL TALES BE ALTERED BY INTERACTIONS THAT ISNT VERY SCIENTIFIC OF THEM THEREFORE THERE IS NO GOD
No you haven't.

All the literary motifs in the Bible are part of a larger near Eastern cultural milieu. The ideas are not original, and the stories are just retellings of retellings. Utnapishtim and the flood, Sargon of Akkad and Moshes origin stories, even the opening line of Genesis when properly translated from the Hebrew is the same as the opening line of Enuma Elish.

t. redditor that hasn't read the whole bible

See
A personal experience
Actual things wrong with the bible, like its lies or the contradictions
Possible ripoffs

You've become stupid because you've read the bible, and the spirit of evil that it imbues makes people retarded as fuck, so you cannot tell a good argument from a silly complaint, I suggest a lobotomy, since you're probably a lost cause by now, given how you invariably will not see one of the many contradictions, nor will you see anything wrong with the bible straight out lying by telling anyone can do miracles.

>personal experience
'i turned into le lizard xdd theres no god' isn't a personal experience.
>Actual things wrong with the bible, like its lies or the contradictions
None exist, stop shitposting.
>Possible ripoffs
No, I've already explained this. Stop shitposting.

Have you even ever studied where all the stuff in the Bible comes from, or do you just take it at face value and close your ears to anything that goes against your worldview? I don't see how anybody can call themselves a Christian without having thoroughly dissected the body of the New and Old Testament through study and investigation. If what's written in the Bible is true, this investigation will embolden your faith a thousandfold. But if it's false this investigation will open your eyes to the error of your beliefs.Either way you have nothing to lose but delusion.

i can has argue god is devil look at stone lel plebbit

I'm the person who had that experience, I literally said God gave me a spiritual experience.

www.bibviz.com has tons of contradictions

The bible very clearly says anyone can do miracles.

Stop shitposting and lying.

Not seeing anything alluding to "sky-fairies" there, tea be age.

>i turned into le lizard xdd theres no god' isn't a personal experience.

but " i was posessed by a magical ghost after being dipped in water" is?

>how can we defend our religion?
>I know, lets lie on the internet and call everybody names!

Learn to fucking read you stupid Redditor. I know both texts better than you. I know its 'sources' better than you. Get your own dick out of your ass, you aren't a good fuck.
>www.bibviz.com has tons of contradictions
No it doesn't, just redditors misreading.
HAHA EPIN

Who are you trying to convince here? I mean, we all have seen your lies since long ago and nobody agrees.

Why would I want to convince you?

>nobody agrees
How is this a metric of truth?

A metric of truth would be if what you said, actually were true or relating to reality, you say your book is true.

>You can do miracles in my name

Doesn't happen, so it's false.

>reality
Ideological construct.

The only people who believe that now are ultra-orthodox Jews and bible-thumping southern baptist nutjobs.

Doesn't matter, before it became clear it didn't happen everyone did.

>didn't happen
Delusional.

Baal*

>.....straight out lying by telling anyone can do miracles.

Doesn't say that.

cont. Actually yes and no. I'm pretty sure the ones who are promised miracles are those who live righteously, anyways from a biblical perspective technically all (most) people do have an option to partake in that but most don't. Also I learned that quite a few people are praying in vain since sin separates people from God so it's not just miracles that are limited to many people but it's also getting prayers answered as well. Just saying what the Bible says, used to read it a lot and learned from others.

Actually anyone who uses the name is entitled.

man I just a large article on the perspective of YHWH and his early origins a couple of days ago, if anyone has any questions AMA

*written up

You mean Baal.

What's the etymology of 'YHWH'?

YHWH in history has had a number of different etymologies. YHWH is a third-person verb of the phrase "ehyah, asher, ehyah" (Exodus 3:4), which literally means I Am Who I Am, or I will be what I will be.

The meaning of his name today is still divided because of how one's presupposition and use of extra-biblical or biblical evidence is used on the name.

YHWH by the many of scholars (thanks to Frank Moore Cross) means, To Be or I exist. This etymologies origins though has had division over where it came from. Frank Moore Cross and Patrick Miller have hypothesized that it's an El epithet, that came out from one of the cultic regions of Israel or Edom. I personally don't agree with this as it lacks data. Others will use Judges 5:4 and Deuteronomy 33:2 to show that YHWH was not associated with El but with the south of Edom and the gulf of Aqaba as the residential home of the midianites likely was there where Moses resided.

Other hypotheses of YHWH's etymology have been swings and misses. YHWH by De Moor hypothesizes that the name is of El, meaning may El be present. Others like Ahituv and Huffmon believe that YHWH is adduced from Jacob's name meaning may El follow me closely. Some speculate it was an deified ancestor!

The most convincing alternative to Cross' etymology of YHWH is Van Toorn's. He rejects the west-Semitic languages and hypothesizes that alternatives from other cultures is more reasonable, he uses the Arabic language to explain the etymology (due to the three root system Hebrew shares with Arabic). He concludes that YHWH likely means 'he blows' points it the a storm deity from the south of Edom and north of Aqaba or Arabia. This is the most prominent among those who see Cross's hypothesis as lacking (though I personally disagree).

>YHWH is a third-person verb of the phrase

the third person verb of the first-person phrase, I forgot to put that in there.

You know much about YHWH's relationship to Baal?

Lord means baal.
Christians will say no, but they have been worshipping baal for a while.

that's the literal meaning. Baal is used in the OT to refer to a specific god.

Yes I do, YHWH and Baal have had much of a history though both are not the same deity. YHWH conflict with Baal comes from the fact that Baal was a highly syncretic deity in the ancient world, a majority of ancient kingdom's had Baal or a variant of Baal that they venerated in their religious practices. Israel on the other hand were very critical of the deity being able to be syncretic into their religion. YHWH's conflict with Baal by scholars was that early on Baal and YHWH were storm deities competing for the same role (I disagree, due to additionally evidence of YHWH's kingship in early Israel) lead to religious tension in the cult of YHWH. YHWH combated Baal and YHWH won! This can be seen through the battling of the gods in Kings (priests of Baal vs Elijah prophet of YHWH, I won't into too much of this). Later on the psalm authors and prophets would use the attributes of Baal and associate it with YHWH. This was polemic of the highest order, saying that YHWH was the cloud rider and not Baal and that Baal was nothing compared to YHWH. This expression showed YHWH's supremacy over other deities, the writers constantly associated the things of other deities and applied it to YHWH, showing that he is the only God with the power and not the weak polytheistic deities of the ancient near east.

Baal does mean lord, though it doesn't mean that they worshipped the deity named Baal, since the words were highly flexible and were used in multiple ways, it would commiting exegetical fallacies which no scholar would take you seriously if proposed. If that were the case, then El and his variant names would also mean that the Israelites were worshipping mult-El, though the morphology and textual data says otherwise that they were worshipping YHWH (the text obvious shows they are worshipping YHWH but using different epithets and names for him). Now scholars do have a better case for the worship of El found in the Old Testament but that's straying too far away from the point.

Actually we could have a corrupted text with multitude of gods that are not the intended one.

>a corrupted text with multitude of gods that are not the intended one.

what evidence of corruption is there? are you talking about the variants of YHWH's name?

>what evidence of corruption is there?
Well, if you haven't noticed a multitude of different names a fucking glowing street sign is gonna pass by unnoticed too.

those are called epithets and don't necessarily point to multiple gods. the YHWH isn't the only god to have different names.

again what do you mean by corruption? there's no corruption in the text where deity names are present to begin with since there're no redactor marking to be seen.The documentary hypothesis doesn't even go that far as to say corrupted texts due to different deities. I said this before and I'll say it again, the different names of YHWH are epithets to express the attributes that YHWH hold, there is not a multitude of El's in the biblical text that refers to an outside deity like El-Roi or El-Olam (the only two variants would be El and Elyon, former more convincing than the latter) The same with other cultures near Israel. The multiple epithets that deities had in the ancient near east whether from Israel, Ugarit, Babylon, Assyria or Egypt were all trying to express the attributes of their deity.

Plus please present evidence of which parts of the bible associate with more than one deity due to the multitude of names.

Neither do the many contradictions, I'm sure.

>there're no redactor marking to be seen

Jeremiah 8:8 is a pretty nice [redacted]

It pretty much states scribes would change the text.

But here you are making science user.

Yhwh's battle with Leviathan mirrors Baal defeating Lotan.

so how does Jeremiah's distrust in scribes prove that there were specifically redactions to make a text with multiple gods have one god with all of those names?

>the very bible warns its contents are changed
>fuck you, it isn't changed
Ok, kys yourself.

I didn't say it didn't change, I'm disputing the specific claim of your's on how it changed

I've made some changes as I have made some mistakes in my previous post and deleted it so here my new post:

The words are not to be limited in their reference to the efforts of the false prophets, who spread their delusive prophecies by means of writings: they refer equally to the work of the priests, whose duty it was to train the people in the law, and who, by false teaching as to its demands, led the people astray, seduced them from the way of truth, and deceived them as to the future. The labours both of the false prophets and of the wicked priests consisted not merely in authorship, in composing and circulating writings, but to a very great extent in the oral teaching of the people, partly by prophetic announcements, partly by instruction in the law; only in so far as it was necessary was it their duty to set down in writing and circulate their prophecies and interpretations of the law. But this work by word and writing was founded on the existing written law, the Torah of Moses; just as the true prophets sought to influence the people chiefly by preaching the law to them, by examining their deeds and habits by the rule of the divine will as revealed in the Torah, and by applying to their times the law’s promises and threatenings. For this work with the law, and application of it to life, Jer. uses the expression “style of the Shoferim,” because the interpretation of the law, if it was to have valid authority as the rule of life, must be fixed by writing. Yet he did not in this speak only of authors, composers, but meant such as busied themselves about the book of the law, made it the object of their study. But inasmuch as such persons, by false interpretation and application, perverted the truth of the law into a lie, he calls their work the work of the lying style (pen)

Keil, C. F., & Delitzsch, F. (1996). Commentary on the Old Testament. Peabody, MA: Hendrickson.

Somebody give me a quick rundown- has this thread sorted itself out?

Proves nothing, and I see the text contradicting.

Proofs?

What do you mean?

This post is criptic

fedoras BTFO