Why did lucifer betray god?

Why did lucifer try to betray god?
What was his goal?

Why would omniscient Jehovah create a being that would betray him?

He was the first American, he wanted freedom

Because the War in Heaven is a very common motif in Indo-European religions, and a very popular theme for poetry, art, and metaphor. When the Galileans were trying to sell their religion to the gentiles, they soon realised that they were never going to efface paganism. The best they could hope for is to substitute Christian characters where Indo-European divinities originally were. So they spun a tale of Lucifer rebelling against Yahweh as a parallel to Loki betraying Asgard, or Typhon storming Mt Olympus.

It is worth remembering that the War in Heaven is never mentioned in the Bible, and does not exist in Judaism. It is not a core Abrahmic doctrine, just a syncretism to please the northern barbarians.

He rebeled out of pure pride and spite. Think of a small barbarian village being invaded by a massive Roman warhost. They know that they'll all die if they resist and they have no chance of victory, but they fight anyway simply out of pride. Satan was possibly annoyed by knowing in advance about the upcoming deification of man. He is superior to man so he was angry that God will choose to honor man by being born as a man.

However, Satan is chatting relatively casually with God in the Book of Job and it seems that he has some sort of a fuction as a prosecutor of humans. There's not much information about the actual relationship between God and Satan, we are only told that Satan is not here to help us.

You both are partially right. God Almighty agreed to create a being independent from Himself (and therefore - free), including the ability to abandon Him. God however is the source of existence and everything that comes with it - light, order, universe, time and space. Also goodness and health. Abandoning all that only drowns you in your own nihilist cesspit. No light, no happiness, only sorrow and madness.

>Galileans
Weren't all from Galilee.
>trying to sell their religion to the gentiles
>they realised that they were never going to efface paganism
>So they spun a tale
This is an idiotic narrative in line with the Muslim claims that Jews and Christians intentionally conspired to ruin the Bible. Shows a complete lack of knowledge about early Christian history.
>War in Heaven is never mentioned in the Bible
Revelations.

>does not exist in Judaism

Possibly in the Songs of the Sabbath Sacrifice, and The War of the Sons of Light Against the Sons of Darkness, in the Dead Sea Scrolls.

How could he betray God? God is all knowing, all powerful.

Lucifer wished to carry out his own will, his intentions were pure but he had to leave the Kingdom of Heaven to do it and he tempted us to come along with him.

God came down to Satan's world to experience it as a mortal and saw that it was a failed experiment full of suffering and offered us a way out.

We may return to heaven if we pledge to serve God as we once did, or we may stay here and try to do something about the mess.

He wanted to be worshiped as God; he wanted to put his throne above God's throne.

His five "I Will" statements were the first lies in existence.

He took credit for how he was made, rather than be grateful to God for how God made him.

Sound familiar to any of you?

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

God made the world. The devil never made jack shit. He's a liar, and the father of lies. He's a thief and a murderer.

Just like you.

Jewfags loved persian memes and adopted the concept of dual cosmogony, ahura mazda and angra mainyu. Before that point there was no "devil". Even "sin" was simply perceived as only an obstacle put in your way by god to test your faith or resolve. The devil really was just working for God all the way until Cyrus happened and then the hebrews became massive persiaboos.

You have to work very hard to be this ignorant. Well done, fool. Well done.

Donde esta la argumente? No lo se, no esta una argumente senor.

This.
Dualism is an eastern meme that occurred when Zoroaster took the distinction between the two classes of Indo-European gods to the absolute extreme, making one absolutely good and the other absolutely evil. It didn't exist in any other IE or Middle Eastern religion until that point.

so how did satan betray god then, why didn't god say "put those crayons down, you're not allowed to write on the wall"

satan wanted to leave god and so did adam and eve, they wanted free will

>So they spun a tale of Lucifer rebelling against Yahweh as a parallel to Loki betraying Asgard, or Typhon storming Mt Olympus.
>I don't know what Isaiah 14 is

>However, Satan is chatting relatively casually with God in the Book of Job and it seems that he has some sort of a fuction as a prosecutor of humans

That's because Satan was not the Devil in the narrative. Satan means adversary and here it's implying that he is a divine being of YHWH not an adversary opposed to him.

>Jewfags loved persian memes and adopted the concept of dual cosmogony, ahura mazda and angra mainyu.

Good thing we have very little evidence of this other than a text that comes from the 10th century AD.

>Isaiah 14

That's about the king of Babylon.

>Satan, or anything for that matter, betraying God
>Some still putting satan on the same pedestal as God

Satan didn't betray God. God has certain creations that have free will and Satan was/is a creation that has free will. Similar to how MILLIONS of humans disobey the commands of God - Satan also disobeyed a command.

The glorification of this imbecile Satan has to cease.

The first protestant/revolutionary.

Read the second part, and you'll see it becomes a divine being, it uses Ugaritic material to show that this divine being wants to become greater than what he is.

v.12-15. Yet it is now considers Morning Star, trying to go above the stars of God (El) and to be in the divine assembly at Mount Zephon, a mountain associated with the gods of Canaan.

This is also parallel with Ezekiel 28 the prophesy against the King of Tyre. What we can see is a narrative of a divine being rebelling against YHWH and being put in his place by him.

> Yet it is now considers Morning Star, trying to go above the stars of God (El) and to be in the divine assembly at Mount Zephon, a mountain associated with the gods of Canaan.

Because Eastern monarchs always wreathed themselves in divine imagery. Why do you always pretend the Bible is more complicated than it is?

Isaiah 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

btw in some translations "O Lucifer son of the morning" is "morning star, son of the dawn" instead. That seems pretty vague, and Isaiah is a prophecy/poetry book so it is written weird.

Lucifer means bringer of light in Latin. How do we know that Lucifer = Satan?

Lucifer could just be another name for God for all we know.
There have been catholic bishops named Lucifer too: St. Lucifer of Cagliari and St. Lucifer of Siena.

>Why do you always pretend the Bible is more complicated than it is?

Cause it is, it really is and I'm not even scratching the surface of the OT, it's not a simplistic picture. The bible (OT) is multi-layered and is more complicated than just a basic reading of the text. It's situated at the time and place and the writers wanted to make a message so that the people could understand it. In fact, secular scholars have realised this about the bible, this isn't something new that I'm bringing up, it has been known for a very long time.

teh lulz

>Why did lucifer try to betray god?
Pride
>What was his goal?
To be God.

Lucifer didn't rebel against the True God but against the Demiurge

>Sometime in the last 400 years Paradise Lost actually became the narrative of the actual Bible in popular consciousness

Quite funny actually. Really says something about that book.

I was trying to find a pre-Milton source for the war in heaven some time ago, and just couldn't. Did he really make all that shit up?

Yeah? It's literally just his imagination, and it's a fictional account of what went on with Satan, it obviously was never meant to be taken literally.

His words was that he was going to write a story that "Justified the ways of God to men", which implies to me perhaps some kind of analogy to the Book of Job.

Milton's details are his own, but the concept of Satan cast out from heaven for rebellion had existed in Christianity for more than a millennium.

>Son, come 'er for a second
>'sup papa.
>Do you see all these little thingies down there?
>Yeah?
>You have to listen and obey them from now.
>...

>but the concept of Satan cast out from heaven for rebellion had existed in Christianity for more than a millennium.

Source.

Pride, jealousy and spite was definately there.

At the end of the day I would say he was denying God's work, the whole act of Genesis. All he ver did was trying to show God that his work was pointless and wrong, that is why he kept on trying to corrupt mankind too to prove his nihilistic worldview to God, acting like and angsty, narcistic, edgy teen out of jealousy.

Because other angels hate her

>not wanting to worship a God responsible of suffering is edgy

>ITT: headcanon

If you take the headcannon out of Christianity there's not much left desu.

Satan IS God. God wanted him to rebel for his own sake. What Satan did was inexcusable, which is why God created him, to be a scapegoat for his own master plan. What Satan represents is evil, the evilness inherent in all of life. And why does he act this way? It's glorified through him. Satan is a glorified star. He craves nuance, power and GLORY. Yes, even if it means destruction, death, paganism, and all that. He's the other side of God, the side that nobody could live with if they knew about.