Should STEM majors be required to take Ethics? Should every college major be required to take Ethics?

But I can use morality to increase my day-to-day acumen, which allows me to operate efficiently and decisively in accord to my personal values.

Ethics is just too broad of a subject. I think it is better to simply offer stem students several entrance courses that cover what classical education was about. A little bit about history, philosophy and older languages in general.

I think better understanding in history especially helps to not fall for leftist bait that easily.

HURR DURR LEFTISTS

Classics should be mandatory for reading and studying as early as in middle school. Latin and Greek should be taught so that every student can fluently read ancient and medieval texts in original.

The biggest mistake of Western educational system was the abolishment of classical education.

Why the fuck would I want to learn a dead language when I can learn one that's spoken by millions of people today? You're a Veeky Forumstard aren't you?

no, but they should definitely take logic and metaphysics courses. I talk to too many STEM majors who have no education in either. logic is a particularly embarrassing thing to have no education in when you think you apply critical thinking to things.

morality is not a spook, it is simply often a spook. read the material.

language is not a spook. read the material.

Because it's the greatest heritage of Western civilization.

>brainlet

nice opinion. blog link?

That's a pretty stupid reason, never mind being subjective. WHy the fuck would I want to learn fucking Ancient Greek so I can read Xenophon?

Cucks, all me btw.

>spook
whats that

One of the reasons the West is declining is because it has completely abandoned its thousand-year old traditions. Latin is the ultimate language of Western civilization. For more than thousand years of Western rise and expansion educated men have cherished the traditions of their culture. Today the West is deprived of any spirit or substance, it is completely separated from its roots that made it great.

At least we're not as degenerate as Romans and write this post in Latin right now or yer mum a cuck.

I can't speak for yank schools, but here in europe many 'ethics' classes are just thinly veiled lefty propaganda without any significant counter arguments or critical thought.

Heck, even in full blown historical institutes only the professors for antiquity til early 20th. century are not full blown commies.

Kinda sad, desu.

HURRRR DURRR LEFTARDS HURRR

Tradition has no value in and of itself, unless you're a grumpy old cretin who can't accept things change.

AHAHAHAHA what a cuck.

>HURRRR DURRR LEFTARDS HURRR

>Tradition has no value in and of itself, unless you're a grumpy old cretin who can't accept things change.

Our degeneracy is far worse than Roman. Even with all its bad sides the Latin culture has laid new foundations that lasted for another 1500 years. Such was its greatness.

Our "culture" is nothing, it's empty and void. A dying shadow.
Things change yes, but only because new things naturally develop on old and solid foundations. A culture that throws away its own foundations will have no future.

Yer mum a cuck now and ur smelly ass baby ewww so stinky.

its a slang term leftists use to discredit anything that is a human made concept/idea. private property, nation states, families, freedom, etc.

they cant argue their positions like normal people, they lost all those arguments, so they are forced to argu at the level of retards who want to destroy all of civilization.

they fail to realize that because something is a human concept, doesnt mean it is not a useful or desirable thing

You sure showed me. Bravo.

Best post ITT

>DURRR LEFTARDS DURRRRR

i think you've given the leftist itt brain damage lol

I don't mind the political views of my lecturer but I don't see the point of basically indoctrinating your students.

>be me 1st semester history.
>Visit course 'Introducing History' by Prof. M
>M is a middle aged woman that probably was a hippy at some point.
>She enters the room, draws a dick on the black board and proclaims: Ladies, this is the symbol of your oppression.
>She harps on for 20 minutes about how men are bad and how male students will only ever get a B at best during the finals.
>Get a C at the end of term.
>The coursework was basically fem and lefty propaganda and I learned fuck all about historical things.

I wish I made this example up but there is literally no excuse to blurr out political propaganda if your job is to teach people something more meaningful than drawing dicks.

Nobody believes you.

not him but I've had similar experiences in college here in the west coast.

>anthropology class
>instructor asks if sexual dimorphism exists in humans
>I raise my hand, as I was young and eager at the time, and answer "yes, of course, just like many other species"
>get told that I am wrong and that humans display no sexually dimorphic traits
>I'm confused, so I ask about breasts, muscle growth, hip/waist ratios, average height/weight
>people in the class are rolling their eyes and a couple of people interrupt me to say "that's not dimorphism, sometimes both men and women have these traits you are talking about", instructor smugly laughs it off
>I shut up

I don't care about political ideology, but it definitely stands in the way of science in academia. I also had a fat acceptance health professor, and geography and english professors who spent much of their classes talking about their opinions on political issues as though they were axiomatic facts.

Did you make her cry after explaining that Jesus loves her and Earth is actually 6000 years old?

No. Absolutely not.

They would tell them their life purpose is to provide bigger welfare checks for the ghetto, not space exploration or any grand goals, that they should give up jobs for objectively less qualified minorities in the name of "diversity" and they should never use their critical thinking skills to critique.such memes.

Nigger evryone does STEM for a good and well paying job not to explore space or some vague sci fi trope.

This is the power of his.

Where do you think you are?

No, I did shut the fuck up and tried not to fail the class. No point in arguing with these people. I'm not a retard.

>This is your brain on /pol/

Ethics are nothing more than a discursive framework within which interpersonal problems can be resolved in a particular institutional context, so the answer is something like "only if they're going to be working with people."

This thread is, if anything, proof /pol/ either needs some ethics classes or at least more subtlety in broadcasting their particular propaganda.

Well the STEM guys do have ethics and philosophy, at least in my country.

My brother is an electrical engineer and I think he had 10 credits worth of ethics, which isn't a lot, but at least they had it.

In my country it is obligatory to either take ethics or religion in secondary school. Both are exceedingly poorly done. I consider them necessary, of course, but in their current form, they actually do more harm than good.

not him but try stepping out of your bubble for just a second

campusreform.org/?ID=9099
campusreform.org/?ID=9096
campusreform.org/?ID=9079

There's plenty of examples showing some schools and teachers being exactly like the two anons described.

My college requires a philosophy course no matter your major, and Intro to Ethics is a really common choice. I think it, like the other requirements of a liberal arts education, is valuable to all students.

Good thing your belief doesn't modify the reality of the situation.

No

Ethicists are already a burden to mankind, we don't need to slow down science even more

[spoiler]kys[/spoiler]

You linked an article about student government being autistic (which it always has been), Harvard saying it's okay to be trans, and a professor criticizing a student for being a shit writer, all from one of your favorite rightycuck website. How does this prove the other anons daydream about the evil feminist professor destroying his history class?

I proved that this it's all pretty likely considering the state of US colleges today.
Are you denying that any indoctrination with a left-wing bias is taking place at universities?
Of course mainly rightwing outlets will report on this since they stand to gain on exposing it and Lefty-outlets only stand to lose by shedding light on it.
I'm not right wing btw, i'm just against brainwashing being done by either side

Instrumentalists pls go

The only thing you linked that had anything to do with the behavior of a professor was a student complaining about writing a shit paper. Where's the indoctrination?

>losing an entire letter grade for not using gender-neutral language
>shit paper
Wew lad

Nowhere do i see any proof of him losing a letter grade for using mankind at the start of the paper. That seems to be an assumption the student made. The article you posted has a picture of the last page of the paper with plenty of underlining and corrections. The kid just wrote a shit paper and wanted to blame it on "muh sjws".

>I proved that this it's all pretty likely
I don't think you know how probability and proof works, if you think you have "proven" that something is "pretty likely" (read: highly likely) based on three anecdotes (read: unsystematic, uncontrolled, biased, low sample size data).

Here's an article talking about it:
postandcourier.com/news/liberal-professors-conservative-students-clash-on-college-of-charleston-campus/article_9de17ee8-e1ae-11e6-8f86-938417ffedfd.html

But how about som video evidence of this occurring:

A student coming out with audio evidence:
youtube.com/watch?v=qaRLGMtZvaM

Video evidence of another professor:
youtube.com/watch?v=db8oL3sRzgo

LSU professor tells students that blood will be on their hands if they don't support global warming legislation:
youtube.com/watch?v=LdZohYX8Gak&t=38s

Canadian Student Removed From Class For Speaking Up About Anti-Trump Lecture:
youtube.com/watch?v=DRuIvdbr1fU

But sure i can admit that i should've sourced and formulated my argument a bit better the first time around.

>Here's 4 more pieces of anecdotal evidence totally proving universties have become marxist indoctrination hotbeds

Professors calling donald trump and republicans stupid isn't indoctrination. If you think professors sharing their opinion on contemporary politics, especially in classes relating to those topics, is a modern innovation than you are mistaken.

He's right, though. A lot of things are part of tradition because they're valuable, and Chesterton's fence is important to consider; but tradition isn't inherently valuable.

I got my MECE undergrad in the USA. We were required to attend one ethics lecture in Junior and Senior year.

The senior one was pretty much just a patent lawyer describing certain cases (with pictures). Little girl loses an eye on a toy, man gets pulled into woodchopper, etc.

all i've claimed is that this is happening with some teachers and in some universities. Stop being disingenuous

Here's a acedemic paper on the issue as well from the National Association of Scholars:
nas.org/images/documents/A_Crisis_of_Competence.pdf

Here's basically the TL;DR of the paper:
youtube.com/watch?v=xZaVXso9_Vo

*not academic paper, but a report

>Here's a report written by a hard-right thinktank about why dirty liberals in schools are bad

I'm not the user who posted the link. The mankind crap is probably in those corrections somewhere. I've had professors knock my grade down for similar shit in the past. These kinds of practices are commonplace in the academy.

There is an extreme left bias in American schools. This promotes group think and it crushes dissenting opinions on discussion.
heterodoxacademy.org/problems/

>heh, if i dismiss everything user posts as fabricated, propaganda by evil right wingers i'll never have to admit that i'm wrong!!

The article says the mankind correction was on the first page. Judging from the page pictured and the professors feedback, however, it looks like the students mechanics were just shit. Saying he got a B- for using mankind is disingenuous.

Don't link shit that's ideologically loaded if you want to have a discussion. this seems reasonable. I agree that most universities are left leaning, and i agree that dissenting opinions shouldn't be silenced, but that doesn't make it "indoctrination" like those clickbait bullshit videos linked earlier claim it to be.

That was the argument for getting rid of Latin and Greek and now students can barely speak one language.

Ha ha ha no fucking waaaaay

CS fag here, Ethics is a required course at my Uni.

>socialism, which he associated with placing equality before freedom (to the possible disadvantage of equality)
muh socialism means equality meme

Ethics aren't a spook though.

>STEM
>ETHICS aka SLAVE MORALITY
pick one

Can't teach ethics

>willingly spooking yourself

If your PhD program receives NIH grants (and most bio labs do) then you have to take an ethics course.

Pretty basic knowledge.

Surprised you don't know this, OP.

>Don't link shit that's ideologically loaded if you want to have a discussion.
I'm not familiar with the organisation, and i saw nothing that could point to that. So i would appreciate it if you could provide some sauce.

>I agree that most universities are left leaning, and i agree that dissenting opinions shouldn't be silenced, but that doesn't make it "indoctrination" like those clickbait bullshit videos linked earlier claim it to be.
You calling those videos "bullshit clickbait" does not mean they're not real user.
"indoctrination, the act of indoctrinating, or teaching or inculcating a doctrine, principle, or ideology, especially one with a specific point of view" If you bothered to actually watch the videos, you would find that these videos are an example of exactly that.
The information i've provided in this thread, is enough to substantiate my claim that: "[indoctrination] is happening with SOME teachers and in SOME universities" thereby making & accounts believable.

Plz fuck off with your political conditioning.

*i didn't think to wiki NAS, but i found it, sorry bout dat.

On its own the claim is plausible, but based on my own knowledge of the system it seems very likely.

Go vivisect some babies then

The study of ethics in these programs has little to no bearing on the true pursuit of ethics in a philosophical sense. It essentially boils down to the arbitrary application of one particular moral theory to a discipline without really investigating why you ought to act in a certain way. It's more or less training individuals how to comply within whatever legal parameters will be most likely a tenet of whichever company they work for. They're not being trained to act ethically; they're being trained to follow codes.

Got a B.S. in comp sci, I was required to take two ethics classes.

>ethics in the digital age
>discussed pirating, torrenting, etc
>who is responsible if someone is injured due to buggy code
Surprisingly, most of my teachers actually sent out links or emailed pdfs of required textbooks, because they hated how much textbooks cost. But I went to school in the deep south where we still hung nooses on statues of famous black people, so...

>Ethics and leadership for Navy ROTC
Without a doubt my favorite class in college. Was taught by my CO (navy O6), we basically debated a bunch of moral dilemmas

They should all be required to take writing. Some of the papers I've seen are just people throwing down what comes up, with only a vague semblance to any sort of structure.

they can be. more often than not they are, and are just a synonym for morality.

Sure you can, you just have to start young.

Ethics hold back science

Lack of ethics hold back science.

>no, but they should definitely take logic and metaphysics courses. I talk to too many STEM majors who have no education in either. logic is a particularly embarrassing thing to have no education in when you think you apply critical thinking to things.

Logic belongs in the math department, not philosophy.

Engineer here, took a philosophy course once for shit and giggles as it was entirely optional
>the scienttific method is WRONG
>you don't know nothing
>you don't know nothing
>you don't know nothing

Really made me think. At least the exam was very easy, I just wrote x didn't know nothing and was therefore also WRONG

>There is no truth, only models
:/

This.

What's wrong with philosophers?

Did you like your "ethics in digital age" class? I'm curious as to how they approached the subject.

Ethics could teach willingness to acknowledge the truth.
Which is useful, because you occasionally get kids who want to play God, but forget to check if they are growing their own kids.

t. never read Stirner and thinks every abstract concept is a spook
You can be unspooked and have morals btw