Will Paganism ever make a major revival, or will it always be relegated to autists like Varg?

Will Paganism ever make a major revival, or will it always be relegated to autists like Varg?

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Our proud ancestors have so much to teach us...

It will mostly be relegated to cultural beliefs, like "cultural" Christianity.

Paganism in the general sense of that word is the most popular religion on earth and its pantheon includes capitalism, Marxism and countless other isms.

However paganism in the sense of making food offerings to the thunder god will never be anything more than a pastime for burgers.

One picture is architecture from a thousand years ago, the other is architecture from yesterday :^)

Maybe. It's been slowly and steadily growing for basically as long as it has been around. The main thing I'd say it's due for is some actual theology and philosophy.

I agree
Augustus, Cæsar, Cicero, Leonidas, Socrates, Aristotle, Nero, Marcus Aurelius etc etc
great Pagan men of Europe

don't be so sure about that

I'm pretty sure the Muslims will wipe them out within our lifetimes once all the formerly white countries become Muslim-majority.

Panagism has survived hundreds of years in the middle east. It's pathetic in its current shape but there they are.

Pagan pride might give Europeans the will to fight back
Paganism = blood & soil
Christianity = internationalism

I know Christians online like to act tough and reactionary, but literally every Christian I know IRL is pro helping refugees

The neo-bagans have a high rate of growth because they're new religions that don't have many people to start with so when you go from 20 people to 200 people that's a huge rate of growth but nothing more.

It will be interesting to see if they keep growing how they adjust to the mainstream because right now only the most terminal neckbeards would self-identify as neo-pagan in public.

Paganism can't revive in a society where our fundamental institutions are based around Christianity to a large extent.

No.

All of their beliefs were either adopted by their conquerors or destroyed, and any attempts to """reconstruct""" the religions are LARPing at best, and absolute retard tier like wiccan at worst.

Any of their values that were deemed useful were preserved by the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, and everything contrary was destroyed. You can be a teenage me and lament what was lost to le ebil christfags, or you can grow up and realize that they sacrificed animals across their ships for good weather and thought that killing a guy means you were right in any dispute at all.

We would still be living in mud guys flinging poo poo at each other if everyone stayed pagan. Rome's conversion was inevitable.

>We would still be living in mud guys flinging poo poo at each other if everyone stayed pagan
you mean like Rome, Greece, Egypt, Sumer, Chine, the Indus Valley, Persian Empire etc that managed fine without Christianity
art, architecture, society, science, everything degraded with Christianity
it wasn't until we revived our Pagan spirit that we got better art, scientific revolutions, industrial revolution etc

Everyone likes to point to Rome before it's fall as this example of stronk paganism, but then why did Rome convert? Why did the vast majority of their legions at the peak of Rome's power follow the cult of Sol Invictus which became Christianity upon its fusion with the Christian cultists?

You point to a time where the economy was based on the impressment of entire populations of other people into slavery, and act like it was some haven of civilization, and maybe it was if you lived in that part of the world, but all the other pagan shitters were just fodder.

Christians used the bible as an excuse to enslave blacks. Also the Empire was converted from the top down. Elites became Christians and used their powers to attack the pagans and shut their temples, banned rites etc.

I'd rather be a pagan then a cuckold Judaism lite. Literally a Jewish faith and you cucks see no problem with it.

>Hindu is fastest growing religion in Saudi Arabia
Wat

Not really surprising. The Saudis invite a lot of foreign workers to their country and essentially enslave them until they are done with the job and then kick them out of the country.

The New Testament was composed within the Roman Empire and written in Greek. The Jews hated the church back then just as much as they hate it now but I wouldn't expect those who get spiritual insight from heavy metal music to understand these things.

Most European pagan religions are vary simple and lack the intellectual meat that Abrahamic religions provide. They were mostly just rituals with poorly defined dogma. They could have survived like Shinto did in Japan, but that's about it

>paganism

I don't know for other people but we were never Pagans but Zoroastrians

First, let me start off by say your an autist

Both of these civilizations are before the major abrahamic religions (and their culture, ideologies, and architecture) came into the lands.

You would not like me to mention the way the Germanic Tribes, and I will put this in terms you can understand, "Niggered Up" Rome would you?

>Pope acts Christ-like
>This is bad because the man is black.

I didn't know that the NT said that black people didn't count.

>Buddhism is growing in Scandinavia
>Countries traditionally considered "uncucked" have Islam as fastest-growing religion.

I'm laffin'.

when the Germanic tribes "niggered up" Rome they were faithful Arians.

Paganism is the dominant religion on the planet. Catholics with their idols, Muslims with their idol in a cube, Hindus with their idols, Buddhists with their idols, etc., etc., etc.

>t. Firejew

So imagine how much worse it would have been if they didn't have Jesus to at least somewhat curb their impulses toward niggotry!

The modern secular worldview is not that different from the pagan one. It is fatalistic and deterministic universe born from chaos with romantic emphasis on man defying this nature of the universe (absurdism and existentialism).

The Wolves of Vinland go about it in the right way.

>So imagine how much worse it would have been if they didn't have Jesus to at least somewhat curb their impulses toward niggotry!
Jesus didn't stop their niggotry quite the contrary

It was not uncommon for Early Goths to slay an entire(mongol-like) if it resisted

>to slay an entire(mongol-like) if it resisted
to slay an entire city*

>Christians used the bible as an excuse to enslave blacks.

There is literally nothing wrong, morally or biblically, with the institution of slavery.


>Literally a Jewish faith and you cucks see no problem with it.

Christianity was anti-Jewish up until the 1800s when liberalism began infecting Lutheran churches. Rome followed soon after.

Kissing up to muslims when muslims are invading europe is a betrayal of christendom that cannot be forgiven

No because neo pagans do it only for political or social reasons instead of spiritual.
As long as that's the case it will never be taken serious.

Paganism doesn't offer much spiritually. It's mostly just rituals

>I know more about the church than the pontifex maximus.
t. burger who found jesus after falling down while fixing roof shingles

Gemanics aren't Aryan though.

>papal infallibility
good meme

Isn't Christianity fastest growing religion in china?

slate.com/bigideas/what-is-the-future-of-religion/essays-and-opinions/fenggang-yang-opinion

>specifically shills Odinism and Viking imagery
>"hey user, paganism kinda suc---"
>"HUH WHAT ABOUT ANCIENT ROME CHECKMATE CHRISTFAG

>its pantheon includes capitalism, Marxism and countless other isms.

I think it will eventually become something like what shinto is in japan. A religion used as an excuse to party and have fun + services for important community events. But as far as people seriously believing in it? No.

Christianity has tried bending over backwards to make the message of the bible believable to an increasingly secular and skeptical population in the first world, and they're failing. I see little reason to assume that polytheists of any sort will do better.

How can you be educated in the 21st century and NOT have to be autistic to accept paganism? I understand the appeal but really, the fucking jig is up.

>fastest growing religion in Romania;
>Islam
My sides.

>Also the Empire was converted from the top down. Elites became Christians and used their powers to attack the pagans and shut their temples, banned rites etc.
Nah.
It was the bottom, then equal distribution, then it bounced around with persecutions, then some nobles found it trendy, THEN it became LEGAL, then way later, during the time of Theodosius did any sort of infrigment upon pagans(which were muribund until christianity became popular, if Trajan's letter is any indication) did any pagan faggots start getting restricted in their rights.

You can say the same things about abrahamic faiths though. People believe in things for emotional reasons, not intellectual ones.

>Rome they were faithful Arians.
Some of them.
But germanics that did become cathortodox were the biggest romeboos this planet has ever seen.

>>This is bad because the man is black.
No it's because that man and his ilk are using white countries as welfare havens while raping and committing crimes in greater proportion.

If blacks were not mentally retarded they would be treated with the same respect as Asians. Instead christcucks such the BBC and want mexicans to destroy the white race.

Nothing wrong with helping refugees, but it seems Europeans have no plan on how to assimilate them or what to do with them, they also seem to be accepting more young single guys vs families and children who are more vulnurable. At least in the US we have no problem integrating somalis and muslims.

The idea of a "fastest growing religion" map is inherently ambiguous in terms of its significance.

When Esorteric Kekism was founded a year and a half ago, there was presumably a time when there was only one Kekist. Now it appears that there are many thousands of them. Now, this means that Kekism has had something like a 500,000% annual growth rate.

But it's still only got a few thousand followers and it seems unlikely that its growth rate will continue.

No because "paganism" wasn't an organized religion. It was tradition that was passed down orally and resurrecting it after a thousand year gap (and ironically based on things written down by christians) is nothing but larping.

This is one thing I don't understand about pagans, where do they even get their beliefs? All of our knowledge about Norse paganism comes from the evil christians

>he thinks people don't idolize their ideology

>tfw pagan

>Estonia

Pic related

>Christians used the bible as an excuse to enslave blacks.
Pin point the part in the bible where they said slavery is good.

There's tons of evidence on paganism from pagan philosophers. Many committed themselves to writing down these oral secrets so they would not be lost.


But ya. It's hard to resurrect something like that and kinda pointless anyway since most of the theurgical functions were adapted into liturgical functions.

Idk. I'm just an agnostic who wishes we didn't have to choose between christcuckery and vacuous atheism. You could also call me a secular buddhist and yogi or an annoying new ager.

>Most European pagan religions are vary simple and lack the intellectual meat that Abrahamic religions provide.
Abrahamic religions are literally copypasta from several older religions and their snowflake imagery, and all said religions in turn stem from the same European one.

>le LARP meme
Not everything that is Pagan is a "reconstruction". Sure, it could be based on whatever remnants one can extract, but from that point on one can build a religion up anew. Religion has always evolved, and usually while core elements stay. What do you expect from a modern non-abrahmic? To dig up the oldest records available and stick to it while never ever evolving despite the world changing? Quite tired of the whole "u r jusd a larber x-DD" meme, especially since LARPers know jack shit and LITERALLY don't care about the religions of the people they LARP as, neither of the past nor the present.

Also, like I said in my reply to the second quoted post, all Euro religions and religions of civilizations that rose when Europeans expanded (ie those today considered non-european ones) were all just local interpretations of the same European core religion practiced by various tribes and later nations and those were evolving with them. Nordic paganism, Slavic paganism, Indian paganism, fucking Chinese Paganism, they're all the same European religion from the beginning, so regarding "content" and "reconstruction", there are many more pieces to the puzzle than you think. Pre-Abrahamic religion goes far beyond any current salvagable recorded history (since all libraries and archives were destroyed, Alexandria being the big known one) and shitty Wikipedia articles.

Do you believe pagan Europe didn't read or write before the Judeo-French apostle and his Crucifix Dicks™ arrived as well? Fucking hell, m8.

>political or social reasons instead of spiritual
k

You're gravely wrong.
t. heathen

>to the second quoted post
first*
I had to cut the first quote to the OP due to maximum character limit.

>other
>no indication of what other
Kys

The Goths' sacking of Rome was an act of revenge, and it says something about Rome and as well as the resolve of the Goths when the whole city fell to a small force of nomad Germanics. :^)

What went through your head as you typed that?

There's plenty of attestations from Greco-Roman authors, and Hinduism and Zoroastrianism both still exist. Germanic sources, combined with archaeology, can be used to reconstruct a lot. Hell, a few turbo-autists (Who are in it more for fun than religion) like to go back to the PIE religion.

I don't get this whole "If you don't have a handbook precisely detailing what to do going back x years you're a roleplayer" thing. The only religions that can satisfy that criteria are Judaism and Buddhism then, and Judaism is literally "Roleplay as your ancestors" and Buddhism is "Pretend you have no desire until you don't". Not only are the vast majority of Christians on Veeky Forums LARPers (Yes, converting to Eastern Orthodoxy because le ebin desu vaulting monks are FUCKED BASED and 40k is cool is LARPing) but Christianity innovated shit all the time.

Take the Trinity: It's purely a political copout used to settle the autism of hundreds of competing sects who had differing views on who the Big Cheese was. Papal supremacy, church architecture, the entire ecclesiastical hierarchy, EVERY aspect of "Christian Culture", Church as a concept, not to mention the entirety of Protestantism is all shit that someone said "Hey, that's neat" or evolved out of innovations. Jesus didn't come up with the fucking Gregorian Chant or the Papal regalia after all. Why can't Neopagans innovate, especially as every neopagan worth a damn stresses the organic nature (Or, rather, what would be the organic nature if any of them got off of their asses) of the religion.

>What went through your head as you typed that?
Truth. Aryans come from Iran. They also practice zoroastrianism or it's proto-form. Not the simplistic animism of the Germanic.

>Zoroastrianism
>pagan
Pick one.

>his ilk
What is his ilk exactly? Do the non mentally retarded blacks get the same treatment?

>Truth. Aryans come from Iran.
M8, you're pretty dumb, arent ya?

Aryans are the proto-European people, ie who is believed in and was noted in most cultures to be direct descendants of the gods, and they built civilizations all over the world. Aryan means "pure" and "noble" etc and the entire word sprung from the Aryans' existance in itself. Recieving attributional names is a long stretching tradition that even surpassed Christianity and lived on into medieval times. You can't connect the origin of Aryans to something simple as the name of a country. Iran was called Iran when Aryans lived and built there, but since then the people there were eventually washed out (similar to how the Indians were once Aryans but are not anymore) and created Persians. Remember that the name change back to Iran is quite recent, and no longer representative.

Now, all peoples and subraces of the world have been interbred at some point and created various biological profiles, ranging from small changes as phenotypes to big changes like creating entirely new subnations. Pretty much no race is pure nowadays, BUT, genetically, Germanics are the closest you can get to Aryans today, and the group of people with the largest amounts of somewhat preserved Aryan individuals.

This is literally geo history 101 m8, step up your game

>Germanics are the closest you can get to Aryans today, and the group of people with the largest amounts of somewhat preserved Aryan individuals.
I doubt it

Most Germans are just French, and Poles in denial.

No, you'd have to be an idiot to believe it would. It lacks any theological ground to stand on.

>Religion has always evolved, and usually while core elements stay. What do you expect from a modern non-abrahmic? To dig up the oldest records available and stick to it while never ever evolving despite the world changing?
Well said. LARP-"argument" BTFO forever.

It will always be a niche thing, relegated to people like Varg and specialized websites/corners of the internet. But the people involved in it seem to have a lot of fun doing it, and maybe it will grow more as time goes on.

Chinese paganism comes from european paganism
Wait, how?

Arian Christians- don't believe in the Trinity

>Faithful
>Arians
Pick one

>christianity fastest growing religion in Turkey
>Hindu in Greece

What the fuck is going on here

>I doubt it
Not an argument

>Germans
We're talking about Germanics, not Germans, m8. Also, the Franks are racial bastards which is why their >>generalthe absolute state of you

If we are talking about paganism as practiced in Europe pre-christianity then probably not due to a lack of the source material on beliefs. If we are talking about a wiccan-esque or otherwise pagan-inspired movement then maybe, but that will probably remain niche. The religions of old generally don't suit the tastes nor lend themselves easily to modern life, as they were generally ad-hoc kind of affairs. You could say that paganism survives on in Christmas and other cultural aspects but that seems more like a legacy than a living thing.

>Ireland
>Hindu
At least it's not Islam

This all happened after Napoleon freed the jews.

Where is Voltaire buried? Look it up user, you're not going to believe me if I tell you.

Only ones to write anything significant down were the greeks and romans.

>the son of the creator of the universe is a Jew
really makes you think

Globalists literally ruin everything, that's what.

>In conquered countries, he abolished laws restricting Jews to living in ghettos. In 1807, he designated Judaism as one of the official religions of France, along with Roman Catholicism (long the established state religion), and Lutheran and Calvinist Protestantism. (Followers of the latter had been severely persecuted by the monarchy in the late 17th and early 18th centuries.)

How the hell did based Napoleon get cucked this hard?

holy shit kys

>Do you believe pagan Europe didn't read or write
Not really.
Well, they did(we know muh ancestors had poems in their language, with a greek script, and shit) but there wasnt that much literature outside of the greco-roman world(or those that did, either got lost when the romans invaded, or suffered degradation in the following centuries).
And even for those, when they did try to reform it, all Julian did was able to make was some artificial cathortodoxy-lite pagan Church that crashed as soon as he was dead.

There are more well-documented religions and some actually serious attempts at reconstructing germanic paganism(forgot the name atm), but they also needed to remake the entire social framework, which is a pain in the ass.

>Papal supremacy, church architecture, the entire ecclesiastical hierarchy, EVERY aspect of "Christian Culture", Church as a concept
Yup. Difference is, we can track that development across history(patriarchal and papal systems are an outgrowth of the original 3-tiered authority ranks of early christianity dealing with schismatics, heretics and gnostics going "no, my group is secretly the OG communion that is the awesome church. Let me split the community in twain for that") .
It didnt get transplanted 1800 years later based off some off-quotes from patristics and Bible quotes collected from the critiques of fedoras upon the text.

But if paganfags actually tried, they could try living faiths(we still have pagans in Russia) for inspiration.
They will find them much less glamorous and more intensely ethnic than they expect.

found it:
pagan.wikia.com/wiki/Theodism

This is how you do it, not baptist "Trail of Tears" tier LARPing.

>baptist "Trail of Tears" tier LARPing.

You do know that no serious, conservative, orthodox Baptist believes that crap right? Landmarkism is completely absent from SBC churches, dying in Missionary Baptist churches, and dead in British reformed Baptist churches?

I get it was a reference, but that slur against baptists has survived too long.

>Only two cultures mentioned.

No, after the victory of scriptural religions that aren't bound to a single ethnic group, it's impossible to recapture a truly "pagan" mindset. Attempts at recreating an oral-based religion based on a single ethnic group would inevitably begin setting up rules for which gods can/can't be worshipped; and would end up being far closer to a parody, than to what the pagans actually believed.

I imagine a Christian here will still bitch about my answer though, not being able to tell a compliment when he sees one because he has the reading comprehension of a dog.

>inb4 Judaism
Modern Judaism is an "ethnic group" in the sense that an ethnicity is based around shared religious traditions.

This post is wrong actually, christians were at most 10% of the roman population by the time of Constantine and were not even a majority by the time of Theodosius and his state-sanctioned oppression of polytheist faiths.

I see no reason why you can't have a multi-ethnic polytheist faith other then tiresome and idiotic comments about "LARPing".

>Nero
>Leonidas
>Great
This is bait.

Neither the Persians, nor the Chinese or Indus were Pagans.

>Faithful
>Arians
Do you even know what an Arian is?

A defined religion will inevitably have to set a number of "legitimate gods" which can be recognized, which always is whittled down to some form of one. If you let everyone worship any gods they want without limit, it's no longer a defined faith. If you try to have a base set of gods/beliefs that a multicultural faith must recognize, while allowing everyone to worship other national gods as well, the lesser national gods will be pushed aside for the international ones; which in turn will be fused into one international god.

>Also, the Franks are racial bastards
Nope

They're a pure race unlike Germanics who are mostly bastards of various races.

Yes you can it's called pantheism.

serious question:
do modern pagans genuinely believe in spirits/deities?
Or do they practice rituals and the such merely for an extension of their forebears culture?

I'm talking about the minority (if any) of actual practitioners, not the memers

No I'm a Christian and that is how it is.

>Crusader intensifies