Operation Typhoon

Imperial Germany beat the Tsar by letting Russia collapse in on itself. They never tried to penetrate the interior of the country, they were not insane like Hitler was.

France beat Germany in WW1. Should we draw firm conclusions from that in 1940? Situations change... the nature of Nicholas II's regime was not the nature of Stalin's regime. While Hitler may very well have thought he could have "kicked the door down and have the whole rotten structure come crashing down" it didn't work out in practice.

He finally listed to intelligence (that Japan wouldn't attack in the east) and sent Siberian divisions to Moscow

>Finally, the Stavka saved Moscow by raising and fielding 10 reserve armies that
took part in the final defense of the city, the December 1941 counterstrokes, and the
January 1942 counteroffensive.

The Germans should have halted after their initial encirclement at Bryansk and Vyazma. They paused during the raputitsa but then decided to gamble by going on the offensive again since the roads had frosted over.

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>ww2 thread
Saged & hidden

Cold and exhausted german soldiers overwhelmed by russian waves. Also no preparations were made for the harsh winter.

>no preparations were made for the harsh winter.

How is this even possible? How is that an excuse? Even a fucking five year old knows not to go outside without a winter jacket.

>"More meat for the grinder!"

What did he mean by this?

each hero of the soviet union medal is for many million russian soldiers he killed

Possible reasons and thought processes:

>the war will be over by Christmas!
>we'll just rape and pillage for s1ck l00t
>let's have our manufacturing make complicated, over engineered machines that break down instead of coats
>let's have our manufacturing make complicated, over engineered machines instead of trucks
>our logistics suck

meant for

Seeing pictures of Germans in Stalingrad is always weird to me. Looks so out of place.

The Axis armies were worn down and whittled down from six months of hard fighting.
The Axis logistic tail was long and ran over rough terrain, and the Axis armies that had never been properly built up (and, given the limitations of the Axis resource base, probably could not have been built up) for such intensive demands.
The Soviets still had lots of men and materiel. They still had fresh troops, while the Axis were scraping the bottom of their barrel.
And the weather was rough.

Give me some books about Eastern Front lads

barbarossa went wrong, too many losses

>taking 2/3 of european Russia with 180k KIA isn't a cakewalk.
Considering that krauts lost a similar amounts at Verdun alone in WWI, I'd say it was.

you are retarded, wounds and missing ppl are losses aswell

Because the Germans had massive problems with logistics in the Soviet Union. Most supplies came with trains and Russians are smart enough to have train tracks with a different width compared to the European standad. Plus, the Russians carried out large scale scorched earth tactics on their retreat

they had no issues with tracks, pretty fast and easy to adjust the width
i dont know where you get that info about massive logistics problems, scorched earth hurt the locals more than the army since they just confiscated everything with deadly efficiency

i dont know where you get that info about massive logistics problems
Not him, but Germans relied a lot on horses and at some point those died. Then again, Germans had irreparable and unrecoverable loses from day 1 of Barbarossa, so they were losing from the very start. Or you can call it "Pyrrhic victories".

Plus enormous losses in materiel and expenditure of resources. Which all had to be supported by an economy that was more or less improvising big parts of the logistics necessary to back the war effort. Synthetic fuels... dozens of different varieties of every weapon... trying to use captured French and Czech gear... and meanwhile most of the Wehrmacht is basically a train & horse-based army, and you have millions of soldiers a thousand miles away from Berlin who you have to supply via those trains and horses. It was a mess.

as far as i know, they had storages where the trains unloaded then the supplies were distributed, the lack of supplies often came from the fact it was just simply not enough, not because they couldnt transport it

even the partisans couldnt really make a difference with their so called "track war" which was about blowing up the traintracks or supplytrains

the recurring issue was supplying units which thrusted deep into enemy territory which meant supply transports could be easily ambushed

Hitler hadn't put the national economy into full Total War mode yet. Probably the biggest mistake in the entirety of WWII.

bump

>be sympathetic to the nazis because you hate Stalin
>try to sabotage Red Army by sending millions of men to their deaths
>germans run out of bullets and you're hailed as the greatest Soviet general of war

But the post I was responding to said >no preparation

I'm not denying that there weren't logistical problems, I'm just wondering how it is possible not to prepare at all for an invasion that was years in planning.

stalingrad by antony beevor

>we'll just beat them before winter lmao

also add to the fact that USSR used different railway gauges to Germany and the Germans somehow expected to capture enough intact soviet trains to make up for this during Barbarossa

Imagine I went back in time and took park as an ordinary soldier in operation Barbarossa for Germany what would be my chance of getting back to Germany after the was and living a normal civilian life?

Of course, his pre-war economic setup was pretty much 3/4 of the way there to total war mode, so this tends to get overstated.

Pretty slim, unless you get transfered to the Western Front. From then on, you could try surrendering to the Allies.

Germans are notorious for inflating casualities.
Retreating, they burned their own military hospitals.

>Germans had irreparable and unrecoverable loses from day 1 of Barbarossa
What do you mean?

Anything by Beevor is decent entry stuff really.

That image is photoshopped

War of Attrition.

this 100%

They didn't have any reserves.

what is deep level entry?

>Germans are notorious for inflating casualities.

>this idiot doesn't know about the russian waves.

I'd say the biggest mistake of ww2 was starting it