Is there an example of where another human being has suffered more than Jesus?

His execution was standard. Nothing special about it.
On the other hand, if you did this to a few people there was no need for prisons because all were so scared of punishment.

That dude who assassinated the head of the Netherlands got it pretty much as bad as I think it's possible to get it.

>assassinated the head of the Netherlands

Volkert van der Graaf?

The Chinese consort girl who was pulled apart limb by limb, blinded and tortured for days was pretty bad.

Consort Qi
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consort_Qi

Tupac Amaru II

Jesus was nothing special in that regard, he got the standard execution of the time.

Did some digging to prop up my poor memory and it was actually the very first head of the Netherlands, William the Silent (of Orange) who got murdered. The guy who did the murdering was Balthasar Gérard.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balthasar_Gérard

The Dutch seemed mildly unimpressed with him murdering the main leader of their war of independence.

and died in a few hours when some agonized for days on the cross

Munster rebellion leaders got a pretty bad deal.

For the time, they didn't had it that bad.
>t. a guy who just read about the HRE penal justice.

Top kek, shitloads.
Off the top of my head, Marcantonio Bragadin:
>Then, at the surrender ceremony on August 5[3] where Bragadin offered the vacated city to Mustafa, the Ottoman general, after initially receiving him with every courtesy, began behaving erratically, accusing him of murdering Turkish prisoners and hiding munitions. Suddenly, Mustafa pulled a knife and cut off Bragadin's right ear, then ordered his guards to cut off the other ear and his nose. There followed a massacre of all Christians still in the city, with Bragadin himself most brutally abused. After being left in prison for two weeks, his earlier wounds festering, he was "dragged round the walls with sacks of earth and stone on his back; next, tied to a chair, he was hoisted to the yardarm of the Turkish flagship and exposed to the taunts of the sailors. Finally he was taken to the place of execution in the main square, tied naked to a column, and flayed alive."[4] Bragadin's quartered body was then distributed as a war trophy among the army, and his skin was stuffed with straw and sewn, reinvested with his military insignia, and exhibited riding an ox in a mocking procession along the streets of Famagusta.

Probably bernard knipperdolling, jonh van leiden and bernard knechting.

>Each of the three was attached to a pole by an iron spiked collar and his body ripped with red-hot tongs for the space of an hour. After Knipperdolling saw the process of torturing John of Leiden, he attempted to kill himself with the collar, using it to choke himself. After that the executioner tied him to the stake to make it impossible for him to kill himself. After the burning, their tongues were pulled out with tongs before each was killed with a burning dagger thrust through the heart. The bodies were placed in three iron baskets and hung from the steeple of St. Lambert's Church and the remains left to rot. About fifty years later the bones were removed, but the baskets remain.

ripeace.wordpress.com/2012/09/14/the-murder-of-junko-furuta-44-days-of-hell/

Who has the latest Veeky Forums suffering chart

No idea, but however put Jebus on top spot was pretty clueless.

>His execution was standard. Nothing special about it.

This, I don't get why people act like it was unordinary. Not to mention they crucified Christians for hundreds of years after this, then suddenly as they converted to Christianity they said ROMANS DINDU NUFFIN IT WAS DA JOOZ and started Crucifying hundreds and hundreds of Jews and Samaritans in the name of revenge for Jesus. It's literally the reason there are only 777 Samaritans left.

>It's literally the reason there are only 777 Samaritans left.

There used to be over a million Samaritans.

Yeah, who got 100, 100?

Why is Jesus so fucking special. Memes aside, he may well have not existed. If he did exist, who's to say that the details of his death weren't exaggerated for dramatic effect? On the other hand, we have DOCUMENTED sources of real people in real life who suffered tortures worse than Jesus, but somehow Jesus is the ultimate kind of death despite the miserable deaths that have befallen thousands if not millions in history.

>Gérard's torture was also very brutal. On the first night of his imprisonment Gérard was hung on a pole and lashed with a whip. After that his wounds were smeared with honey and a goat was brought to lick the honey off his skin with his rough tongue. The goat however refused to touch the body of the sentenced. After this and other tortures he was left to pass the night with his hands and feet bound together, like a ball, so sleep would be difficult. During the following three days, he was repeatedly mocked and hung on a pole with his hands tied behind his back. Then a weight of 300 metric pounds (150 kg) was attached to each of his big toes for half an hour. After this half hour Gérard was fitted with shoes made of well-oiled, uncured dog skin; the shoes were two fingers shorter than his feet. In this state he was put before a fire. When the shoes warmed up, they contracted, crushing the feet inside them to stumps. When the shoes were removed, his half-broiled skin was torn off. After his feet were damaged, his armpits were branded. After that he was dressed in a shirt soaked in alcohol. Then burning bacon fat was poured over him and sharp nails were stuck between the flesh and the nails of his hands and feet. Gérard is said to have remained calm during his torture. On 14 July 1584, Gérard was executed.[2][3]

>Is there an example of where another human being has suffered more than Jesus?
You know, from a torture point of view, Christ's passion was pretty damn tame.

>Why is Jesus so fucking special.
Jesus was special not for the torture itself, but for the context of the torture (son of god choosing to withstand suffering for the sake of mankind). People hung up on how much he suffered are totally missing the point.

Came here to post this

>Gérard is said to have remained calm during his torture.
what a fucking tank

I don't see how that logically connects. Nobody asked the guy to become the self-proclaimed savior of mankind, after which god goes "lmao ok now humankind can go to heaven because i sacrificed a representative of myself XD"

Plenty of people have played the martyr in history but somehow.

You need quite a bit of belief to buy into that narrative. Likely he was just one of thousands of zealots and religious weirdos that got killed for the same shit. If Paul didn't style him the messiah nobody would care.

somehow... we have to have faith that this guy is the one. i guess thats faith for you

hmm

Wtf is wrong with Dutch people

You mean the guy whose chromosomes were completely fucked by radiation to the point where his cells stopped reproducing and his skin fell off?

>You need quite a bit of belief to buy into that narrative.
Yeah hello, we're talking about religion? It's kind of the point.

>Plenty of people have played the martyr in history
The point is who Jesus was. It's one thing for a random fucker with nothing to live for to sacrifice himself, a whole another for someone as exalted as Christ.
I grant you, it kinda takes away from the "all life is sacred" narrative, but Christianity is not very coherent in general.
>a representative of myself
Jesus was both god's son and God himself. I get it that it sounds very silly to non-believers like you or me, but try to see it from a christian's point of view.

Pretty sure that was the OP.
Last I saw it was Carthage.

American "Christian" bullshit

The suffering of Jesus isn't something extradordinary and it is that who make Jesus so great

Jesus was not a great warrior nor a great scholar, he was God incarnated in a normal guy who lived a normal life, and was killed amidst general indifference

anything involving fire or skinning people alive keeps me up at night thinking about. People are the most monstrously cruel creatures in the universe, no animal could ever devise torture like that. Even a grotesque natural death is a relatively quick affair over a few minutes because a predator actually wants you dead as fast and as efficiently possible.

>Jesus got a standard execution for the time, he was nothing special about it, thousands and thousands had the same fate.

Jesus had Crucifixion lite. He was beaten to death and would die of the cross within a few hours.

Compare this to people who were straight up crucified and would be there for days.

Ni

God sacrificed "himself" because people want more than love. They want a love so powerful it would torture itself for them. That's why it worked in this case and got such a foothold in religious consideration. I can never remember what my Christian friends tell me the reason was but practically speaking it was very effective.

>People hung up on how much he suffered are totally missing the point.

So if it's not the point then why suffer at all? Why couldn't he die quietly in his sleep?

The two guys who were crucified with Jesus and didn't get stabbed so they would die sooner.

Nah, they were all killed on the same day since Jews want no corpses hanging around in passover.

>not knowing he was stabbed to prove he was dead

The men who were dragged to death by ISIS.
The prisoners impaled through the anus by Vlad or the Ottomans.
The blood eagle and wicker man victims.

You know Jesus was a Jew, right? And that all his followers were Jews, right?

Jesus (pbuh) was a Muslim

Probably most people. At least his suffering was over in a couple hours. Better than stomach cancer or something.

>Is there an example of where another human being has suffered more than Jesus?

Literally every couple of days

...

The last part is pretty awesome
>Philip II: Holy shit, I thought nobody would pull it off. Fuck this cash reward, here, you fuckers are noble now, have these three estates.

There are much worse ways to die than by crucifixion. Jesus' death was pretty mild.

Every human who has ever died had it worse, since Jesus was God and knew that his "torture" would be brief and that he would return to paradise afterwards, two things no human has ever known with the certainty of a God.

That's probably the most grotesque thing I've watched, and I've seen a lot of shit.
Still, there are ancient methods of torture that makes this look like a walk in the park.

Jesus didn't even get the worst treatment by Roman standards much less the shit going on elsewhere or even now.

>Jesus was God and knew that his "torture" would be brief and that he would return to paradise afterwards

It's funny how you think God's experience is limited to linear time.

That just makes his suffering even less impressive, since a few hours is literally nothing against infinite time.

Babies when they get circumcisions

You're right, he probably made it happen in a fraction of a second for himself

this. it like those set-ups in stories where someone hires others to attack/rob them while they're with a person they're trying to woo and impress, but with omniscience and omnipotence

>a few hours is literally nothing against infinite time

those few hours are eternal and concurrent with themselves and all other particular moments given infinite time

So those few hours outweighed the literally infinite time God has existed? yeah, no. Now YOU'RE the one claiming God's view of time is limited.

>literally infinite
>outweighed

you really just don't get it, do you?

suffered >

...

Everyone agrees he actually existed you fucking retard

So he is forever feeling the pain of when he stubbed his toe on a rock when he was younger?

There is always something worse
ALWAYS

>hasn't read The Idiot

also i think aquinas addresses the question of whether or not jesus suffered the most out of anybody and what relevance that has to soteriology.

Jesus doesn't even come close to making the top million.

Actually the historic existence outside of Christian sources is very very dim.

>actually the historic existence outside of this one source I chose to ignore is very dim.

There are no non christian sources of the time mentioning Jesus Christ at all, Falbius Josephos has been debunked as a forgery by christian copists in the 3rd century.
Feel free to post other sources dear christcuck.
>protip you can't

My faith is my source heretic, fuck off

Yes, thats gonna prove really useful in a historic discussion then.

You understand that there is no way to prove objectivity without God
How do you know what's real or not? Who writes the rules?

scaphism.

Well, there is historic sources and there is theology. All I am stating is that there is no historic source for a historic Jesus, it is all just theology.

Presuppositionalism is an admission that you have no evidence. Thanks for playing, dumb-dumb.

link?

so fucking cruel of them not to put him out of his agony

t. Science hating christcuck

No, he didn't he regurgitated some convoluted bullshit out of his ass to try and justify his primitive believes like any other theologian ever

>American "Christian" bullshit
Bull fucking shit. I know for a fact that there are plenty of Irish and Germans out there who have that old catholic attitude towards life which could be summarized as "Jesus died on the cross for your sins you fun-loving brats! Think about how much he suffered for you!"

Although Evangelicals are, in fact, complete cancer.

You don't know much about insects

But this doesn't follow through at all. We have no contemporary references to any of the other Jewish preachers, prophets and Messianic claimants either, despite several of them having followers in the thousands that required the mobilization of Roman troops to disperse. And the Hannibal example shows that we can have no contemporary references to extremely prominent people. This is simply the nature of ancient source material - we don't have much of it on anyone, so making an argument about the existence of anyone on the basis of a lack of contemporary references is stupid.

GOT A MOVE TO A TOWN THATS RIGHT FOR ME

insects don't torment each other for kicks. The worst that one will do is eat another alive, and considering that they don't even have proper brains, just a rudimentary bundle of nerves, it's not like they're exactly self-aware of their own suffering.

Jesus christ I've never seen the video but just reading that made me temporarily ill.

When Likens became incontinent, Baniszewski locked her in the basement and began a bathing regime to "cleanse" Likens, involving dousing her with scalding water and rubbing salt into the burns. She was often kept naked and rarely fed. At times, Baniszewski and her twelve-year-old son John Jr. would make Likens eat her own feces, as well as urine and feces from the diaper of Gertrude Baniszewski's one-year-old son.
On October 22, Baniszewski began to carve the words "I'm a prostitute and proud of it" upon Likens' abdomen[11] with a heated needle.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Sylvia_Likens

People can be nasty.

György Dózsa

Carthage literally deserves everything they got.
>bbbbut muh salt fields
Get fucked Punic scum, the Phoenicians/Canaanites and by extension the Carthaginians were the fucking edgiest people on the earth and it's a Jupiter-damned shame that the relatively not fucked up and noble romans didn't put an end to their shit sooner.
CARTHAGO DELENDA EST

Yo guys check this one out.