G-G-Guys?

Shorting means you have a short stubby pee pee, and you are trying to spread margarine on it to ease the pain....this is what is called a margin call or margarine call...you have to sort of grease up...does that make sense?

You have a bitcoin. You think it will be worth more by Wednesday and I think it will be worth less.

I borrow your bitcoin and sell it, with the understanding that I'll have to pay you a bitcoin on Wednesday. If I can buy a bitcoin on the open market for less on Wednesday than I sold it for today, I make money. If it costs me more, you make money. That's shorting.

You asked for collateral equal to 10% of your bitcoin's price to do the deal. On Tuesday, the price of bitcoin goes up by 12%, and it's no longer clear I'll be able to pay up if I buy it Wednesday. Under the terms of our agreement, I now HAVE to buy at its current price to pay you back because I only put up so much collateral. That's a margin call.

All those liquidated long positions,uma delicia...

Best explanation I've seen on here in some time.

Winners use peanut for the added benefits.

the crowd are nearly always wrong about these sorts of things

*peanut butter, of course.

What the fuck. They are going to cause BTC to go up to $5 grand with this stupid shit.

What are the chances for a short squeeze? I personally think it has more chance of happening than not happening, which means BTC will shoot up by quite a bit.

Any estimates how much a group with easy access to USD like a bank or hedge fund would need to cause the biggest crypto margin call ever? Potentially they could borrow a few hundred million USD, buy a gorillion BTC and watch it spike to 4k or 5k as all the shorts get liquidating leaving them with hundreds of million in profit and only a few thousand dollars in interest expenses.

they're shorting on exchanges that won't support BCC, then buying on exchanges that do, August 1st they close both and pocket free BCC to dump.

it's already happening

For fucks sake I just want to buy into BTC cheap but these shorter are ruining everything, memes aside how likely is btc to sky rocket but then come tumbling down

Very likely to sky rocket past 4k and then tumble down in the 3k. Will never be 2k or less again, bro.

Simpler (and more accurate) explanation:

I short 1 btc: I tell the exchange to sell 1 btc at market price (say $2,780)

I close my short: I tell the exchange to buy again 1 btc at market price (say $2,500)

At the end the exchange still has 1 btc, plus $280 ($2,780 - $2,500). The exchange gives me $280 minus a commission.

If instead the price went up (to say $3,000) and I closed my short, the exchange would still have 1 btc but $220 less. These $220 the exchange takes from my account, and still takes a commission on top of that. The exchange always wins.

If I opened my short with a leverage things can get worse. Let's say I have 2 btc on my account and I shorted 1 btc with leverage x10. That means I tell the exchange to sell 10 btc at market price ($27,800 in total).

If the market price goes up 10%, the exchange loses $2,780. If it goes up 20%, the exchange loses $5,560. But the exchange never loses, whatever it loses I have to pay back. So the exchange will make sure to never lose more than I have in my account, which means it will close my short before there is a risk it loses more than I can pay back. That's liquidation.

My short is said to be squeezed when whales are purposefully driving the price up to force my short into liquidation, which causes the exchange to buy back the btc's it sold when I opened my short, which drives the price even more up

Thank you user

I'm getting shrekt on my 150 XMR/BTC long

Should I close while I can at 0.5 BTC losses? I'm scared man. fuck this

and how could it collapse? the record high short positions mean an enforced, record high short-term demand
you better be some shorter trying to damage control
in that case i'm sorry for you, but you really should close your positions ASAP because once shit hits the fan there WILL be liquidations.

Never margin trade dude, it's not worth it.

pic related for the "we'll never see $x again" crowd

Why do you think that? They're shorting it. If BTC was going up to 5k, they should be going long.

majority = mouth-breathing plebs
When a huge majority takes the same position, aren't you supposed to take the contrary position?

that is only bitfinex btc trading. futures shorting is not same as stocks shorting where you lend the stock, only some aspects are similar somewhat

So if this happens and the price of BTC skyrockets after 1st of August, this will mean Alts will lose tremendous value for a short while, won't they?

Still contemplating weather to exchange what Ether i have now just for the BCC, but still not sure if i can buy back at the same price

what, are you gay ?
How else would I make ten grand out of petty money?

price might drop 5-10% but those shorts will need to be closed, driving the price back up

Will i still get my BTC later, in case they were stuck during the fork on exchanges, or are they all gone for good?

Because they all need to buy back their bitcoin. If no one ends up dumping on the 1st then the price is going to shoot up. You need to understand how shorting works here

So... gambling the price goes up or down?

where is the data from?

All investing involves risk, and therefore is gambling to some degree. Shorting brings a much larger risk because you can lose even more than all the money you have.

This is exactly what's happening, you guys are fucking retarded

People are borrowing a lot of bitcoin and sold them in hopes of buying back cheaper to repay the loan. Now they're gonna get fucked when they get margin called and they get forced to close the short and buy high. Remember that flash crash of ETH? It's gonna be like that but in the opposite direction. A flash moon.

bfxdata.com/positions/btcusd

shorting volume is STILL growing, approacing 3x right now lol
its porbably just the interest though, people who started shorting 2+ days ago have to open new short positions with AND also pay back the added interest, or pay back without opening new loans and swallow their losses
and i guess not many of them are ready for that right now

once the first people give in / get liquidated... there'll be B L O O D.

If BTC is gonna moon from this shit should I cancel my 2950 sell order? I bought at 2400

Nobody knows for sure what's gonna happen, but long term your best bet is to just hold. If you want to take the gamble and sell at 2950 and hope for a dip, that's your business, but nobody can say with any degree of certainty what will happen.

yes

i'd cancel it
ps. if you want long term success, don't look at the price you last bought, only look at the current circumstances of the market irrelevant of your personal transactions (unless you're a whale and can your transactions actually affect the market)

unless you're a whale and your transactions actually affect the market*

I need the gamble money for cam whores

I'm sure its been posted already, but at least 30k of those shorts are 1:1 hedged purely for exposure to free BCC

Nobody here seems to understand how that works because this board is retarded and thinks these people are shorting in anticipation of a drop

it doesn't matter though, those people hold their BTC in offline wallets (unless they're really dumb)

if BTC surges they still get liquidated

and nah, def. not 30K (that's almost 75%) are 1:!. a lot of the people wanting the free BCC went all in with shorts.

Its only bitfinex data right? and they have screwed up bitcoin cash distribution and now people are trying to profit from it. bitfinex.com/posts

Example: short on bitfinex long on kraken is neutral position but kraken pays bitcoin cash on long positions so its free bitcoin cash. Long positions are on kraken. Also other tricks with short positions that create these inflated short positions.

I learned some new stuff from the smarter brahs here. All I ever did was research, try to find important dates and buy dips sell at peaks.

Not enough knowledge or balls to go shorting. SO eli5 is people are shorting btc, but if goes up and exceeds their threshold of their ability to pay it back they get "margin called" and have to buy at the higher price/ their threshold limit? And this drives the price up higher because people are being forced to buy at a higher price?

lmao Ima sell my btc at 4k (not - I repeat; I am too stupid)

>paying cam whores
Why do people do this? I can get paying prostitutes but free porn is everywhere, why pay money just to have her show her tits?

does kraken publish shorting volume data?

anyhow, the liquidations already started on bittmex, but they offer crazy high leverage so it's obvious they'd be first

a lot of people actually believed in a crash on aug1 tho, but bittrex's attitude definitely played a role in the unprecedented surge of shorts

I guess it feels more personal to command someone, idk. It's kind of weird.

bitfinex* not bittrex

E-elaborate please senpai

people opened short positions because on bitfinex this meant they get a higher share of the distributed BCC, because their system is retarded

bitfinex.com/posts/212

however, since short positions outnumber long positions by 3:1 by now, everyone is only going to get 1/3rd of the BCC for their BTC on bitfinex regardless if they're shorting or not

so anyone who actually wants to get BCC is best off just withdrawing before the deadline

IT IS GOING TO CRASH TO 2k OR MOON to 4K

IM SO CONFUSED

so if i understand what happening correctly, if shorts are outnumbering longs 3:1, and the price is still going up, when/if it keeps going up then they will get margin called if it gets high enough. there will then be a mass buy to cover their short positions, which will drive the price up higher, which will trigger more margin calls. which will trigger more mass buys.. which will drive the price up higher.. which will trigger more margin calls..

etc etc etc.

so the more short interest there is right now while the price is still driving up, the higher the possibility for a runaway price increase? and the higher it will go when/if it does happen?

just trying to get a rough idea of how much of my life savings i should be putting into the bitcoins right now.

This is called a short squeeze. Pic very related.

short squeeze, thank you. will read up on it. just started investing with spare $$ a month or so ago so im still pretty new to all this. cheers.

you got it
google.com/search?q=short squeeze

but
>just trying to get a rough idea of how much of my life savings i should be putting into the bitcoins right now.

it's still crypto. i wouldn't risk more than i can afford to lose no matter how great any kind of move looked like

Remember the etherium flash crash? This is shaping up to possibly be the opposite of that.

my rent is due tomorrow. are you saying i shouldnt put my rent money in btc tonight with the plan of selling it tomorrow?

Pros don't guess what's going happen after major events like this, it's too unpredictable, they react instead.

Of course you should put rent money on BTC tonight. What could possibly go wrong?

Look how wrong people were in the past as well. Short positions were at their lowest at the peak, and highest at the start of a rally. Absolutely couldn't do worse if you tried.

You have no clue what's going on.

Not an argument

Jump in with the majority if it makes you feel safer :^) I'm sure they know best

>Not an argument

Neither was your post.

he's not wrong tho, pros don't try to predict, they try to minimize losses and react in a flexible way. It may seem counterintuitive but the name of the game isn't making money. It's making trades while loosing nothing. If you can do that, you'll always be a winner, do it often or long enough and you'll eventually get lucky and hit the jackpot.

>I've got a boner!

There's a proposition backed by two predicates, if you're too dumb to infer them that's your problem kiddo :^)

Still not an argument.

Literally the formal definition of a logical argument :^)

>It's making trades while loosing nothing.
if you do that, exchange fees will eat up your stack

The best part is that in a couple hours those positions will be forcefully closed for the fork, meaning, there's going to be a metric shitton of buy orders flooding the markets later today anyways, and these will be at market value.

obviously you need to factor in the fees

this thread is a mess

>shorting on margin at split

...

>def not 30k

24k in shorts have already closed and the market has barely moved.

i'm not sure to say if i'm proud but i saw this faggot live

anyone live streaming tomorrow that is holding with leverage?

Me too heard it was a larp though