Came out from Judaism

>The Kingdom Age prophecies were not fulfilled because Israel rejected and murdered the messiah. Had they received Jesus as their messiah; had they know the very day the Messiah was going to show up

Isn't the whole point of jesus in Christianity was that he died to solve the original sin? He was destined to, he doesn't fit their requirements

>Came out from Judaism
Enough said. Everything else it has to say goes to the trash.

Because Isaiah's wife was not a virgin.

Unto us a child is born - Isaiah and his wife
Unto us a son is given - Jesus to the Hebrews

It's a double prophecy. Both the wife and Mary were young women, but only Mary was a virgin. So the double prophecy has young woman.

However, the Greek translation rendered it "virgin" as a boy being married to a young woman would not be a sign to the world.

It would be an ordinary occurrence that happens multiple times an hour.

More than that, it also says that "Ha-almah" conceived some time in the past and will give birth in the future, i.e. she is pregnant right at this moment, when Isaiah is uttering the prophecy, not some time in the future. It also uses a masculine "Hara" as opposed to the feminine "Horah", i.e. she was inseminated, by a man.

He would have died the other way too.

World B: The Jews recognize and accept their Messiah.

Jesus still gets arrested by Rome, still tried for treason, claims to be a king, gets crucified, rises from the dead, and establishes the kingdom.

Note even his apostles were asking him if he was going to establish the kingdom soon.

Jesus had to die on a cross to fulfill prophecy and to provide humanity a perfect sacrifice to satisfy God's holiness, justice and righteousness.

Yes, by Isaiah.

>It's a double prophecy. Both the wife and Mary were young women, but only Mary was a virgin. So the double prophecy has young woman.
So how is the other half of the double prophecy supposed to work. Before Jesus was old enough to tell the difference between good and evil, how did the kings that Ahaz was afraid of cease to bother him? You know, the actual prediction of the prophecy.

>The Jews after Jesus were blinded by God; a veil was put over their hearts so that they cannot understand Moses and the prophets. If this man never repented and came to know the messiah, Jesus, as his Lord and Savior, he is in Hades right now awaiting trial to be cast into hell.

I'm not even Jewish, but damn Christians are assholes. You guys basically ruined their religion, threw in a bunch of bullshit not even present in Judaism, then claim that they will all burn in fire for eternity for not accepting them.

Satan happened

Modern jews are from caucasus that follow the satanic doctrine of Kabbalah and Talmud

That was the fulfillment of the first prophecy, not the second. Isaiah's son. It was a time frame.

Open your eyes, Jew. YHWH is coming.

'',..Behold A Great Red Dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads,.''' Rev 12:3

skyview.gsfc.nasa.gov/current/cgi/query.pl

Coordinates: 13 48 1.0, -8 28 20.5"
IRAS micron 100

Shit happens.

While the heavens are for signs, the symbolic nature of that statement is that the devil is in control of the 10 kingdoms of the world, his man the antichrist having supplanted 3 of those 10 rulers (hence 7 crowns, but still 10 kingdoms), and controlling the beast that is the final kingdom, the 10 toed kingdom of iron and broken pottery.

What you're looking at is not a picture of what is in the heavens, but a distortion and an amalgamation of pictures of what was in the heavens.

>Jews kill our Savior
>We're the assholes

Fuck off Shlomo. Jews deserve every second in Hell they will burn. For eternity. Generations and generations of Hell. How does it feel knowing the Nazis are in heaven while the Jews are suffering in fire forever?

The balls on their rabbi to say that the Messiah is the Son of Perdition is just breathtaking. Truly the Synagogue of Satan was well named.

So, in other words, the part of the "double prophecy' that actually predicts something isn't part of the second half, only the first half?

Is it just you, or is all Christian apologetics this bad?

Actually the Romans killed Jesus

and Jesus also said he was sent only for the lost sheep of Israel and non-Jews are dogs

>The balls on their rabbi to say that the Messiah is the Son of Perdition

The Jews will really suffer for that statement. Until they accept the Messiah, they are doomed to suffer.

its still a sign of the armageddon
repent now

>Actually the Romans killed Jesus

Because the Jews begged him too. They knew he was the Messiah and decided to kill him for it.

Why would the Jews even want Jesus dead? Claiming to be the messiah is something that would piss of the Romans, not the Jews

It's both. Isaiah's son's birth was apparently also something of a miracle. But it was the timetable that was important to the hearer of the prophecy.

The secondary part of the prophecy would not be fulfilled until everyone hearing it was dead. Kind of hard to tell if a man is a prophet of God or full of shit if all of his prophecies are to come true after everyone is dead.

Don't need to, thanks. I already agree with God on everything.

>Why would the Jews even want Jesus dead?

Because they hate God, they are satanists. They KNEW Jesus was God, that is the reason they killed Him. They wanted to feel powerful.

Keep following that road. Jesus continues to gather bigger and bigger crowds trying to crown him king, Rome gets pissed off, Rome obliterates Israel.

Their head rabbi said "better one man die than the country".

Most times, he'd be right. This time he was dead bang wrong.

Besides the existential threat, the people loved and were following Jesus, and Jesus was exposing the pharisees and elders as corrupt evil hypocrites. Jesus threatened their positions in society, and eventually their lives.

So they decided it was better for Jesus to die for His beliefs than that they die for theirs.

yeah, like they begged the Romans to kill all those other messianic claimants like Bar Kokhba.

>It's both. Isaiah's son's birth was apparently also something of a miracle.
What on earth makes you think that? It's completely unnecessary to the narrative.

>But it was the timetable that was important to the hearer of the prophecy
Precisely, a timetable that's fulfilled in the immediate future, hundreds of years before Jesus is walking around.

> Kind of hard to tell if a man is a prophet of God or full of shit if all of his prophecies are to come true after everyone is dead.
It's also kind hard to tell if there "secondary part of the prophecy" is really meant to be in there when you have to deliberately mistranslate it on at least three separate points, and ignore half of it outright to get it to apply to Jesus. By the way, whoever called him Immanuel?

christianity is just passive aggressive islam

In verse 13, Isaiah turns from addressing Ahaz as an individual and addresses the entire house of David. The English language does not distinguish between “you” addressed to one person and “you” addressed too many people. In Hebrew there is a difference, and there is a clear change between the singular :you” of verses 9,11,16,17 and the plural “you” of verses 13-14. The sign therefore is not just for Ahaz, but for the whole house of David. This becomes clear if we state the passage again with the singular [s] and the plural [pl] words indicated:

“Then the Lord spoke again to Ahaz, saying, “Ask a sign for yourself [s] from the Lord your God; make it deep as Sheol or high as heaven.” But Ahaz said “I will not ask, nor will I test the Lord!” Then he said “Listen now, O house of David! Is it too slight a thing for you [pl] to try the patience of men, that you [pl] will try the patience of my God as well? “Therefore the Lord Himself will give you [pl] a sign: Behold, a virgin shall be with child and bear a son, and she will call His name Immanuel. “He will eat curds and honey at the time He knows enough to refuse evil and choose good. 16 “For before the boy will know enough to refuse evil and choose good, the land whose two kings you [s] dread will be forsaken. The Lord will bring on you [s], on your people, and on your father’s house such days as have never come since the day that Ephraim separated from Judah, the King of Assyria.”

In verse 14, the Hebrew word for ‘behold’ is a word which draws attention to an event which could be past, present, or future. However, grammatically, whenever “behold” is used with the Hebrew present particle, it always refers to a future event. That is the case here. Not only is the birth future, but the very conception is future.

Why would God take a human form? isn't that idolatry?

The key point of this should not be missed. God is promising that the House of David cannot be deposed or lose its identity until the birth of a virgin-born son. Again, this requires that Messiah be born prior to the destruction of the temple and its genealogical records in 70AD.

Who called Jesus "God with us"? How about His most beloved disciple?

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
...
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Islam is just a offshoot Arabic christian cult that came into being 600 years after Christianity.

How could anything God does be idolatry?

Do you any zero understanding of what a Kinsman Redeemer is?

Why would they think he was God? Wasn't Jesus saying and doing things that were against the Torah which is the word of God?

>In verse 13, Isaiah turns from addressing Ahaz as an individual and addresses the entire house of David
And you're drawing this from what exactly? There's more than one person in the House of David, and they're all in the government, what with the whole "hereditary monarchy" thing that was in vogue at the time..

>However, grammatically, whenever “behold” is used with the Hebrew present particle, it always refers to a future event.
But it ISN'T being used with a present particle. The immediately following verb is הָרָה, which is most definitely preterite. If you wanted it with a present/future (Biblical Hebrew uses a very fuzzy distinction between the two) it would be הֲרוֹת

Happeningfags are the JW's of Veeky Forums

reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee fuck of shill

>christianity is just Judaism for the goyim
Ftfy

>God is promising that the House of David cannot be deposed or lose its identity until the birth of a virgin-born son.
No, God is promising כִּי בְּטֶרֶם יֵדַע הַנַּעַר, מָאֹס בָּרָע--וּבָחֹר בַּטּוֹב: תֵּעָזֵב הָאֲדָמָה אֲשֶׁר אַתָּה קָץ, מִפְּנֵי שְׁנֵי מְלָכֶיהָ
בִיא יְהוָה עָלֶיךָ, וְעַל-עַמְּךָ וְעַל-בֵּית אָבִיךָ, יָמִים אֲשֶׁר לֹא-בָאוּ, לְמִיּוֹם סוּר-אֶפְרַיִם מֵעַל יְהוּדָה: אֵת, מֶלֶךְ אַשּׁוּר.

Safety from the Assyrians and the breakaway northern Israelites is what is being promised, not Messianic salvation.

>Who called Jesus "God with us"? How about His most beloved disciple?

I don't see Emmanuel in there. I see a Greek writing anonymous author decades after the fact scribbling it in. Considering John can't even tell the difference between Hebrew and Aramaic (Like in 19:13), it makes things very dubious.

Furthermore, you're not using it as a name. If John's beginning can be used to claim that Jesus was the "Immunel" of Isaiah's prophecy, than anyone else the OT describes as being "with God" equally applies, from Enoch down to the tribe of Levi mentioned in Malachai.

He did things only God could do; healed lepers, blind men from birth, cripples, palsied, cast out demons from a deaf dumb and blind man, calmed storms, fed 10,000 people with one kid's lunch; Jesus proved He was God to those willing to accept what they were seeing Him do; the works of the Father.

Jesus taught the torah in the Temple, by his own authority, and amazed the Jews with his wisdom. He never did anything or said anything contrary to the torah/tanakh.

He did, however, obliterate the Pharisaical Judaism that the Jews created in Babylon in order to never again be taken captive; rules to live by that had very little if anything to do with the torah.

The singular, Ahaz, to the plural, the House of David. The part directed to Ahaz, and then the part directed to the House of David.

Are you the coward who erased all his prior posts?

Both.

Double prophecy.

Jesus is called "God with us" by all who love Him.

You Jews can keep calling the devil your father for all I care.

Any proof that he did any of those things? Herakles and Dionysos did all kinds of magic tricks too, no evidence for any of them either, so why do yu dismiss those but accept the claims about Jess?

>Herakles and Dionysos

No proof you would be capable of understanding.

He didn't fulfill the role of a Messiah at all. For a good idea of what a Messiah is supposed to be, look at Cyrus the Great. He brought the Jews back to Israel and helped them rebuild the temple.

A Messiah isn't some spiritual savior bullshit, it's somebody who restored Israel to the Jews and their sovereignty.

>rules to live by that had very little if anything to do with the torah

Not true at all. Parts of the Torah make absolutely no sense without the Oral Torah. If you don't know this it's because you haven't bothered to even look into it.

this. A Messiah was never supposed to be God.

Fuck off Satan.
>"If a Jew be called upon to explain any part of the rabbinic books, he ought to give only a false explanation. Who ever will violate this order shall be put to death." - Libbre David 37

You are religiously mandated to lie to us when it comes to the Talmud.

Could Hitler have been a Messiah if he rebuilt the temple?

>christianity is supposed to be the religion of love
>half of the christians i meet are hypocrites or proselytize to me (not all), don't like debating, and have the bloodiest history of any religion next to Islam

>judaism is supposed to be a bunch of people damned to hell
>every jew i've met has been nice or neutral towards me, likes talking about their religion without sounding like they're from /x/, and one jew has even helped me emotionally in my life and gave me enough motivation to stop being a neet

What's so hard to understand? You either have or you don't.

Yep.

You completely misunderstand what the Messiah is. If the Jews had accepted Jesus, it would have meant open revolt against the Romans, an all-out war to drive all gentiles from Israel. There's a reason the Romans wrote "king of the Jews" so mockingly over his cross, because that's exactly what he aspired to be by claiming to be a Messiah.

Why was he so stupid? He would have accomplished the same goal, and make friends with everyone.

Where can I actually find this book, from what I can tell somebody just pulled this quote out of their ass.

Please, go onto wikipedia and their compendium of Talmudic books and show me where "Libbre David" is.

You got (((me))). I guess I have to expose your New Testament now.
>Jimmy 1:12 - "Kill the non-Christians wherever you find them"
>Frank 4:35 - "Fight against those who do not obey Jesus and do not believe in Jesus or the Last Day."

Christians believe this shit LMAO

>the ravings of a literal lunatic
>no different than the thousands of apocryphal revelations that were rightly excluded from the Bible
>left in solely because it was erroneously believed to be authored by John the Baptist
>people have died over this shit

smdh

>The singular, Ahaz, to the plural, the House of David. The part directed to Ahaz, and then the part directed to the House of David.
Except Jesus would not be directed ot the house of David, but rather to everyone.

>Are you the coward who erased all his prior posts?
nope.

No, seriously, where in Isaiah 7 are we hearing "God promising the house of David cannot be deposed or lose its identity"? You made that up, just the way your ilk makes up other nonsense to justify shoehorning Jesus into prophecies that don't mention him at all.

Or raise the dead, like Elisha did while being dead himself! Elisha must be God!

>He never did anything or said anything contrary to the torah/tanakh.
Well, you know, other than ignoring Kashrut laws, or eating a paschal lamb he wasn't around for the sacrifice for.

Show me one single instance of a Roman governor asking a crowd of locals for their opinion on justice? Absolute nonsense, the Romans had an excellent reason to execute him as a rebel, yet they ask a mob if they want to free a murderer or a rebel? Pure fairytale, the Romans would have just crucified both.

OY

Don't forget that the "other guy" is named "Jesus Barrabas", i.e. Jesus, son of the father.

It's because Pontus Pilate knew something was different with Jesus. He and his wife didn't want to Crucify him. They knew he was God. The Jews, however, we're fine with him dying. They screamed for it to happen, and even said the blood was on their children. They don't get to play the victim now like they didn't do what they did.

>he can only cite the Bible as source

Nigga the Trinity isn't even in the NT. It's pure fanfic.

>Pontus Pilate knew something was different with Jesus
>They knew he was God

There are 10 different sources (Simon, Andrew, James, John, Philip, Thaddeus, Bartholomew, Thomas, James, Matthew, Judas Iscariot) along with Josephus, Tacitus, The Talmud, Suetonius and Mara bar Sarapion.

So ancient Wikipedia?

So, the Bible.

I'd like to see these alleged statements in Josephus, Tacitus, the Talmud, Suetonius, and Mara bar Sarapion; offhand, I can't think of any of them mentioning both Jesus and Pilate together at all.

Jews never believed that Jesus was the Messiah for a number of reasons. In Judaism there are requirements the Messiah has to fullfil to be acceptet as the Messiah and Jesus fullfiled none of them. You caan read about these requirements in the Mishne Torah.

>t. Baal worshipper

Not true at all. There's a reason Messianic Judaism is one of the most popular religions among Jews. It's because Jesus was the Messiah, he is still fulfilling more of the promises each day.

This is not true.
Messianic Judaism is a very tinny sect and not a large movement.

You speak as a fool who does not know that Jesus, the Messiah, is alive.

And still doing the things of the Messiah.

He will not miss one single jot nor tittle.

The oral torah, as you say, is garbage.

Who but God can die for his brothers, and at the same time set up an everlasting throne?

Prove it.

The proof is in the inerrant and authoritative Word of God.

Something you are incapable of understanding.

The oral torah is as man-made as the old and the new testament and every "holy" book

It wasn't done mockingly at all. The Jews asked Pilate to change it to "He said he was the King of the Jews", and Pilate refused. He wrote truly; Jesus truly is the King of the Jews.

You completely misunderstand what the Messiah is. If the Jews had accepted Jesus, it would have meant open revolt against the Romans, an all-out war to drive all gentiles from Israel.

That Jesus would have won.

You sound like my Evangelical father. I tried to check him on this and he just told me Jesus is the brains behind Israel. He told me that Jesus is allowing Israel to defeat her enemies and soon all the Jews will be in Israel and the second coming will commence. Pretty fucking dumb if you ask me.

Jesus is the Root of David, and sits on David's throne forever.

Jesus is the King David referred to, as in "The Lord said to my Lord..."

The Bhagavad Gita or the Koran? Which authoritative word of god?

The genealogical records were destroyed with the Temple in 70 AD. Prior to that, everyone knew whether or not they were of the House of David.

After that, not so much. You, for instance, have no idea who you are.

The dead raised prior to Christ were also raised by Jesus, and they died again.

Jesus did not die again, but rose bodily in a new form, eternal, and much better than the one He died in. Then He ascended living into heaven.

While Elijah ascended living into heaven, he did not die first but was translated, like Enoch.

Sure glad you know Pilate's business better than Pilate.

Just Barabbas, which means Son of the Father. A likely pseudonym as the man was caught in a rebellion murdering someone. He was the option because Pilate really did want to let Jesus go free, but really did not want the Jews to tell Caesar he let Jesus go free.

Tacitus absolutely does.

>The genealogical records were destroyed with the Temple in 70 AD.

No they weren't. Idk where this came from but people always repeat it for no reason. You realize the vast majority of Jews were outside of the Holy land, right?

Jesus fulfilled every single messianic prophecy that was ripe.

Because He was rejected and murdered by His people, the Kingdom Age prophecies are now in our future, not in the past.

Both the old and new testaments were inspired by the Holy Spirit of God Who indwelled each of the 40 or so men who wrote its 66 books over about 1500 years.

The oral tradition of the Jews is a joke. Ask two Jews on anything, get three answers.

God will do what He said He will do, and one of those things is to put all real Jews into Israel, which of course He caused to be reborn after 1850 years. Just as prophesied.