Did ringmail armor exist? It's a favorite in tv and video games, I have yet to find any academic source talking about it.
For those of you who don't know, "ringmail" is supposedly mail links sewn on top of either leather or linen, basically a combined piece of armor.
Pic only sort of related.
Isn't Ringmail like D&Dspeak for plain old chianmail?
Possibly, but games like Age of Empires, Morrowind, etc. treat them slightly differently.
1200s was objectively the most aesthetic.
"Its a favourite in tv and video games" I've actually never heard of this. Do you have any depictions of ring mail armour? (From fantasy settings)
that pic
>1600s to today with nothing in between
I agree. Best looking armours/garments were introduced to Europe and the Far East during that time period. IMO
"Ring armour (ring mail) is an assumed type of personal armour constructed as series of metallic rings sewn to a fabric or leather foundation. No actual examples of this type of armour are known from collections or archaeological excavations in Europe."
anyway DnD treats ring and maille differently, or at least it once did. Doesn't seem clear at all that it was a real thing
Did hobbits exist? It's a favorite in tv and video games, I have yet to find any academic source talking about it.
For those of you who don't know, "hobbit" is supposedly a small creature with hairy feet, basically a combined human and gnome
I think this is what OP means, and no.
Rings within leather
>1600s armor.
>It's always the infantry half-armor that's feature,
Why are normies incapable of understanding that extensive plate armor was still a thing in the 1600s?
Glad to see help helper made its way to Veeky Forums. You forgot you picture btw.
YOu ForgOt youR pICtuRE By tHE WaY
Probably, but considering that official uniforms didn't become a popular for a while we can expect evidence of them to be scattered at best.
Plus if you're going through all the trouble to buy ring mail why not just get chain mail?
its ARMOUR worn in europe, not military clothing articles
Of if you want something cheaper, why not studded fabric, or coats lined with small metal plates?
sure if you had money
your average dude was going to be using munitions armor, which might just be a cuirass and a helmet
Well, I thought you're talking about chainmail, but after reading te thread, i'd say it would be hard to prove without documents. since the mail would be only thing to survive hundred of years for us to find.
Or just stiffened leather and a felt hat and call it a day.
The armor listed in OP's picture were almost all by elites.
Was studded leather a thing?
I don't quite see how it could actually help you in combat.
Well back to topic. I found this abomination.
Studded fabric is a bit different from studded leather. The Ming armies equipped their massive amount of levies with the former
There were garments like brigandines and bracers that had a leather exterior and steel on the inside that give the appearance of "studded leather", but yeah, random pieces of iron in the leather wouldn't help.
Interesting, is that Japanese?
Yep, it's called Kiko
Thanks!
>armor wasn't used after the 17th century
*stabs you anywhere*
Cuirasiers were a heavy cavalry unit which at the time would make them the only guys wearing armour. There were some officers and troops who wore a brestplate under their coat, but that wasn't standard issue. By the 17 hundreds firearms had come so far that armour was essentially rendered useless up untill the 20th century.
>Studded fabric is a bit different from studded leather.
The Ming inherited Mongol coat of plates/brigandine.
greatmingmilitary.blogspot.com
>The Ming armies equipped their massive amount of levies with the former
The Ming no longer relied on universal conscription(Warring States-Western Han),the military consisted of hereditary garrisons,native auxiliaries and mercenaries/militias derived from the civilian populace.
en.m.wikipedia.org
Its possible. Theres some debate as to whether they constitute a different species, but that seems to be the consensus now.
They probably went extinct about 50,000 years ago though. Some have suggested that their skeletal remains were only 12,000 years old.
In answer to OP's question, ringmail armor might also have existed. Just because no examples exist doesnt mean that its impossible. Keeping that in mind, no evidence means that we can only speculate.
Poor people fought in wars all the time, and poor people couldnt usually afford good armor. If a guy had a bunch of rings laying around but didnt know how to make actually mail, sewing them to a leather or fabric tunic would have been better than nothing. I'm sure people in the past experimented with all sorts of crazy shit.
>Cuirasiers were a heavy cavalry unit
Hmm...
> There were some officers and troops who wore a brestplate under their coat, but that wasn't standard issue.
HMM...
> firearms had come so far that armour was essentially rendered useless
It's beyond me, how one can see some pattern (cavalry and officers(rich people)) still worn armours, but his conclusion about the rest, who didn't, is that they choose to, because it was useless!
No, there is no connection with fact, that they couldn't equip hunderds of thousand poor fucking infantrymen with armours.
And didn't muskets on average got weaker in early 18thC compared to 17thC versions?
idk much about all that
Thought you might find it interesting that men of substance wore silk at the time because it didn't fragment when shot and so was easier to remove from wounds
No.
>If a guy had a bunch of rings laying around but didnt know how to make actually mail
This is essentially impossible.
It's a weird victorianism that was spread by the popularity of D&D.
Same thing with studded leather, splint mail and banded mail.
Thats just 100% retarded and part of the reason that show triggers me so much.
Open a kids viking history book to see how they fucking dressed
Making mail correctly isnt easy. Also people were dumb as shit back then. Most couldnt read. You think they knew how to make chainmail by default? It takes skill.
iirc "ringmail" was people misinterpreting old simplified depictions of maille, and never existed
>It takes skill.
No it doesn't. Making mail is incredibly fucking simple.
Making mail correctly isnt easy.
Close rings together in a 4 in one pattern. make a sack. Leave holes for your body parts. You may or may not be alternating solid/riveted rings.
A fucking retard can make mail if they have the components, and anyone who has ever seen it will be able to do it very easily.
There's a fucking reason it spread across multiple continents with such absolute ease. Chains are almost completely universal among cultures that worked iron, and chain armor is much the same.
On top of that, the sort of links used to make armor are fucking worthless for anything else. You literally wouldn't have them unless you planned on using them as armor.
inb4
>HUUUR WHY WAS IT EXPENSIVE/WHY DIDN'T EVERYONE DO IT
Because iron was fucking expensive, not everyone had the tools to produce wire or rivets, and making a shirt of chain is labor intensive work that takes fucking forever.