Why are there people who claim the US is imperialistic when it actually carries freedom and democracy?

>democratically elected
Being democratically elected doesn't make you democratic, his ideology was contrary to democracy.

>CIA coup
It was a Chilean military coup.

>for a dictator
Chileans loved and still love the guy. And he ran a referendum on whether he should have remained in power for a certain time.

The U.S represents the perfect empire. One that isn't recognised as one despite dominating the entire planet.

The U.S government is the only one on the planet that taxes its citizens even when they move overseas. I think that says it all.

>america decides for the world what is and isn't democratic, and will install a literal dictator if it disagrees

I'm fine with you believing this is okay, but it requires that you accept that the US is imperialistic and is not actually carrying "freedom" since the only choice is What America Likes™

If the US can choose what democracy is, and say that someone elected democratically is "contrary to democracy", they are acting imperialistically.

>Chilean military coup.
CIA supported it. Coups are not democratic.

>Chileans loved and still love the guy.

1. Doesn't mean it was democratic.
2. Many leftist chileans fled the country during his rule, ironically many went to the USA.
3. He ruled for many years prior to the referendum, and had thousands imprisoned or killed for opposing him.

Regardless of what you think of Pinochet, if you think he was good an Allende was bad, you CANNOT argue that Pinochet was put into power democratically and Allende wasn't.

This.

A few things, off the top of my head:

-CIA-staged assassinations and coups, which other anons have mentioned
-Protracted and unnecessary involvement in the middle east
-Selling boatloads of weapons to Saudi Arabia, who is notable for the very human rights
abuses we claim to invade other countries in the name of
-Military bases and troops stationed all over the globe to project power
-Aircraft carriers in the South China Sea
-Revamping our nuclear weapons under the Obama administration
-A clinically insane military budget of $600 billion+, on top of having 1,500+ nukes

And media outlets that support state imperialism by selectively reporting. To give a small, recent example: Russia and China agreed to seriously impede North Korea's nuclear program on the condition that the U.S. quit doing military drills with and weapons shipments to South Korea (foreignpolicy.com/2017/07/17/why-isnt-russia-worried-about-kim-jong-uns-nukes/). Mainstream media won't report this because we require the narrative of psychopathic, warmongering N. Korea and valiant, defensive U.S.

But other than that you guys are okay

being this much of a shill

Da Brice of Freedum :DDDDDD

Uh yeah, I think the beacon of democracy knows better than you what democracy is.

>If the US can choose what democracy is, and say that someone elected democratically is "contrary to democracy", they are acting imperialistically.
Uh by your logic literally Hitler would be democratic. Being elected isn't the be all end all of democracy. Communism is literally tyranny, doesn't matter if the guy is voted in. Same with nazism.

>CIA supported it. Coups are not democratic.
Nope, coups aren't inherently anti or pro democratic, brainlet.

>1. Doesn't mean it was democratic.
>2. Many leftist chileans fled the country during his rule, ironically many went to the USA.
>3. He ruled for many years prior to the referendum, and had thousands imprisoned or killed for opposing him.
1. He paved the way for democracy though.
2. Yup, commies are hypocritical.
3. Many years during which he gave his people prosperity and overall happiness.

>Regardless of what you think of Pinochet, if you think he was good an Allende was bad, you CANNOT argue that Pinochet was put into power democratically and Allende wasn't.
Both of them were dictatorial but only the former paved the way for democracy.

I'm not an American, sweetie.

poe

Pretty much this.

Lol what like half these things aren't even bad
>War of 1812
>Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
>Scientology
Really?

Trying to impose freedom and democracy, and interfering with other countries is very imperialistic to me.

Its fun to mess with other countries internal affairs

>it actually carries freedom and democracy
Gr8 b8 m8 I r8 8/8

>t. burger

Neo-imperialism is still imperialism. People dislikes you for bringing """freedom""". Just don't do it, don't bring anything at all. People will get those if they want it and, if they don't, your meddling will not help. Is this so hard?

But I bet you can't fucking do that because you're just another imperial big bully, but in more denial than Russia or China.

>Banana Wars
>Banana Massacre
Top lol

>Chileans loved and still love the guy
No we don't. Only the richest, ABC1 sector liked him. If we actually loved him would we have voted No in the referndum?

>1. He paved the way for democracy though.
By being kicked out of office.
>2. Yup, commies are hypocritical.
I guess not wanting to be brutally tortured and murdered alongside are your family is just a symptom of hypochondria.
3. Many years during which he gave his people prosperity and overall happiness.
Economical growth caused by making poor people poorer and making rich people richer is not a sound economical practice, and in fact, does not make people happier.
>Both of them were dictatorial but only the former paved the way for democracy.
Wrong, one was democratically elected, the other wasn't.

I'll be honest, I wish the "Anti-Irish Sentiment" had stuck around because Irish Americans are a mistake of nature and shouldn't be allowed to exist
t. Burger who lives in an area where there are a lot of Irish-Americans

>shilling for burgerland this hard going "hey but they're the ultimate good guys I swear"
wew
what a cuck

Except the support of Saudi Arabia which is bad the rest of the things you mentioned are either specific actions in opposition to imperialist regimes or notions that aren't inherently imperialistic.
China and Russia are imperialistic for example.

>Helping countries get freedom and democracy, which are opposed to imperialism, is imperialistic
Really makes me think

Wow, you guys don't know much about history, do you?

I already said I'm not an American.

>Not curtailing the freedom of fruit entrepreneurs who gave jobs to Central Americans and provided healthy food to them is like imperialistic and evil man

...

>By being kicked out of office.
Again, he ran a referendum and he respected the people's choice. He was a dictator who paved the way for democracy.

>I guess not wanting to be brutally tortured and murdered alongside are your family is just a symptom of hypochondria.
What? That guy brought up the leftists who went into exile to the USA which I pointed out is a sign of commie hypocrisy since they went to the most capitalist country instead of China or North Korea. Your comment makes no sense.

>Economical growth caused by making poor people poorer and making rich people richer is not a sound economical practice, and in fact, does not make people happier.
Um, someone hasn't heard about the Chilean Miracle? Or about communism, a tyrannical ideology that brings murder and famine.

>Wrong, one was democratically elected, the other wasn't.
That democratically elected guy was a commie, and communism is inherently anti-democratic and communist regimes don't hand out power, they collapse. All in all, although Pinochet was a dictator, he was closer to being democratic than Allende. Thanks to the Chilean military, Chile didn't end up like Cuba or Russia under Stalin.

I'm not shilling, brainlet. And while the US has engaged in anti-democratic shady actions, it has pushed for freedom and democracy in several instances as in Germany or Cuba and isn't imperialistic.

Ugh some people are so historically illiterate

>Um, someone hasn't heard about the Chilean Miracle? Or about communism, a tyrannical ideology that brings murder and famine.
The "Chilean Miracle" was a consequence of the Chicago Boys neoliberalism, which I described. also >Far Right dictatorships dont bring murder and famine.
>That democratically elected guy was a commie, and communism is inherently anti-democratic and communist regimes don't hand out power, they collapse. All in all, although Pinochet was a dictator, he was closer to being democratic than Allende. Thanks to the Chilean military, Chile didn't end up like Cuba or Russia under Stalin.
Again, with that retardy.

Our hegemony is backroom imperialism. We do the same acts, but not in the open as to be criticized.

Because they don't know the difference between an empire and a hegemony.

>it actually carries freedom and democracy?

Chicago Boys were allowed into making reforms by Pinochet, who is what is referred to as a "benevolent dictator" who had the wellbeing of his people in mind. He gave prosperity to them. Far-right dictatorships kill people but many of them are leftist sociopaths who hate freedom and would starve people, sociopaths who breach the NAP. Regarding famine, those dictatorships generate the opposite, they provide prosperity, with abundant food and consumer goods.

This. I'm arguing with uneducated people, ugh.

Bump

Because when you are the top dog people call you imperialist and try to call you on shit and paint you as the bad guy.

Honestly the US isn't that bad and people in this thread are just being contrarians for the sake of it.

Aside from Chechnya modern day Russia havent really committed any imperialism

>far-right dictators are actually leftists

>Far-right dictatorships kill people but many of them are leftist sociopaths who hate freedom and would starve people, sociopaths who breach the NAP. Regarding famine, those dictatorships generate the opposite, they provide prosperity, with abundant food and consumer goods.
Wew lad, are you 12?

What was Ukraine?

A country is imperialist when, instead of simply doing his own business and leave other countries alone, his dedicated to extend his military, culturally and economic influence in in a specific zone of the world, or in the entire planet.

>Strongest military in the world, outposts everywhere
>His economy influence half of the world
>Current "international" culture is American-Born

You can be a opressive goverment and yet non-imperialistic (north korea, ancient Sparta) and you can be an agressive imperialistic democracy (America, but also ancient Athens)

>majority off Crimeans are ethnic Russians that also want to be part off Russia instead of Russophobic Ukraine
>it's still imperialism somehow

>being this much of a 12 year old ancap
retard

>heh heh USA SUCKS
>imperialist war burgers!!!!

can you imagine what the world would be like under Chinese or Russian hegemony?

Sure the USA does fucked up shit to stay to preserve its power but at least it acts like it has morals to answer for. Intelligent people just love being contrarian. Despite it's flaws, the USA is easily the most benevolent "empire" in all human history.

How would china and Russia be worse?

I'd rather have the US in control than any other nation.

...

Not an argument

Most people in the 19th century (aside nationalists Frenchs and Germans maybe) would have told the same for the pax Britannica. Sadly no pax last forever, if the American one would last a century or so, like the British one, would be a great success

>when it actually carries freedom* and democracy*
*when that freedom does not affect a local ally and purveyor of resources negatively; see every middle east ally

*when that democracy votes in the interests of the United States; see Chile and Venezuela

I'd prefer the Swiss or one of the nordics desu.

The United States has a constitution and respects the freedoms and rights of its peoples and it's worse criticism is that exports right wing dictatorships. Russia is an oligarchy and China is a leftist dictatorship, they don't even respect the freedoms of their own peoples. How do you think they would treat the rest of the world if it were at its mercy?

Russia was an oligarchy in the 90s but the oligarchs are hardly in charge since Putin.
How is USA not an oligarchy btw?
>constitution, respect the rights of it's people
Thats why you have shit like NSA and the patriot act

also CIA spying you from your computer/phone

>YOU'RE LE 12 YEARS OLD LOL
Communism brings hunger and mass-murder, so much for being a working class ideology. Capitalism brings prosperity for the working class, for both working classes (wage one and business owning one). If capitalism didn't work, people wouldn't cross over to Chile to buy TVs, gaming consoles, etc. In capitalism, people enjoy plentiful food, cheap consumer goods and overall happiness.

I said that many of the people killed by those dictators were leftists, not the dictators. Improve your reading comprehension, sweetie ;)

This.

>Meme definition of imperialism

>Le meme definition
What is not an meme definition then?

What is your definition of imperialism dude?

One thing is to say the US isn't as bad as 2 despotic regimes. It's quite another to claim or otherwise promote the view that the US only does good or stop short so as to only see good as in the OP.

One is true the other is propaganda.

>Communism brings hunger and mass-murder
If the present state of the world is any indication so does capitalism. Unless you want to claim communism is the planets dominant economic model.

trying to excuse atrocities committed by a nation by bringing up other, worse off nations doesn't change the fact that they all need to improve.

I don't believe the US only does good, there is fucked up stuff (like supporting Saudis). I just think that they have promoted freedom and democracy several times throughout history and that they are not imperialistic which is what the British Empire did or the Roman Empire did.

When they only does it when it bennefits them while doing the opposit when it don't it's imperialistic. Also if some peoples don't want liberal "democracy" it shouldn't be forced on their nation.
Liberal universalism is cancer

Btw, I am OP and this post is mine but not the one you responded to there. I don't believe that " it's worse criticism is that exports right wing dictatorships. " like that guy said.

>I don't believe the US only does good
Then you need to work on your phrasing because the OP implies this by on the one hand asking why people view the US with imperialistic negativity and on the other promoting its good actions to the exclusion of its bad ones.

Doing fucked up stuff doesn't equal imperialism.

Ask South America.

Glad that I made a thread that might educate a few people. It'd be bad if it gets pruned.

How is destabilising and invanding countries to increase your death and influence not imperialist

>death
Wealth

>muh democracy

When did Veeky Forums get so Anti-United States?
To call the modern United States imperialist is retarded. The late 19th century and very early 20th century US, yes that was Imperialist.