Why do people view Nationalism as something natural, when in reality it's a 19th century meme?

I have been here since the board was made and am a nationalist. No one views nationalism as natural. It is not the claim of the ideology. Stop pretending you're an oldfag.

Also nationalists have never been prevelant on Veeky Forums. It was always /pol/tards and /leftypol/.

>I am a nationalist
Oh, that explains why you're pointlessly angry.

> No one views nationalism as natural. It is not the claim of the ideology.
Okay, so you're playing the "no one who shares my ideology believes something I think is stupid" game. You've never seen someone claim nationalism is natural? Well guess what dude, I have some information that might blow your mind: I HAVE. More than once, even. What now?

>But youre probably a libshit and implying that before nationalism people were cosmopolitans
No, people identified with groups they could actually actively participate in, such as their city state. While one Athenian could see himself as kin to the other 39,999 Athenian citizens because of their common experience, desires and bounds forged by working together both in the ekklesia and on the battlefield, it's only ever been the wealthy elites that have held massive nations like Rome and even Medieval France together until the invention of nationalism dragged the common man into it.

So this is the power of US Unis

nationalism is as old as countries are you mong.

Patriotism > Nationalism

Anyone who thinks otherwise has the mental capacity of a child.

>Oh, that explains why you're pointlessly angry.
I'm not mad. Just exposed your intentions with this shit thread. You however, as being passive aggressive is usually a sign of being angry, are probably mad because I derailed your thread that you wanted to be a circlejerk about how dumb dem natsunalisthjs are.
>Okay, so you're playing the "no one who shares my ideology believes something I think is stupid" game
Nope. "Being natural" has never been a part of nationalism. Are you one of those people that claim labels are the only things that matter? That if a follower of an ideology goes against the ideology they're still a representative of that ideology because they call themselves that? Are you gonna pull the no true scotsmen too? When in this case I'm saying to a beetle that they are a no true scotsman?
>You've never seen someone claim nationalism is natural?
I was being hyberpolic, but pretty much yeah. Every institution of higher learning that I've attended to, every person that has anything substantial to say on the matter knows that the ideology came about in the 18th century and flowered in the 19th century.
>I HAVE. More than once, even. What now?
You've met people who are sorely misinformed. Did you tell them about their wrong ideas? Or did you just seethe behind your teeth and make this thread when you got home?

>I'm not mad. Just exposed your intentions with this shit thread. You however, as being passive aggressive is usually a sign of being angry, are probably mad because I derailed your thread that you wanted to be a circlejerk about how dumb dem natsunalisthjs are.
Stopped reading there, I'm not OP.

>and am a nationalist
how can a history savy person be nationalist, after seeing what nationalism has done to Europe (two world wars)

What do you mean by countries though? Don't you think nationalism appeared in the 19th century? Why not?

The term comes from the 19th century, but do you think the French in 100 Year War weren't fighting for the Kingdom of France to stay French or something?
Inb4 some stupid shit about the Plantagenets being just as French

Why do communists say they are communists, after seeing what communism did to the world? They see something wrong in the previous interperations of communism. Same goes with nationalism. Though nationalism was more succesful than communism. Oh and by the way: Imperialism caused World War 1, unless you go by the belief that the sole reason why WW1 happened is the assasination of Franz Ferdinand. Even by this logic you should be blaming Franz Joseph for overreacting, and not nationalism. But WW1 was about Imperialism. WW1 however allowed many nation states to become free, after the Empires exhausted themselves.

And about WW2. I denounce Hitler as a nationalist, but I accept that is not the norm. For WW2 refer to my original point.

I am really curious, what nationalists like you think.
Should we abadon multinational organisations and globalization, and turn back to nationalistic politics and switching alliances, like before WW1? Do you think this will create a more peaceful world?

I don't no,because as far as I understand it the idea of nationalism comes from the idea of the nation, which didnt appear until much later in history, around 400 years, would you also say that every other war of conquest was therefore linked to nationalism? the English against the Normans/ Norwegian kingdom etc etc.. Nationalism is not just a sense of identity.

>Nationalism is not just a sense of identity
That's exactly what it is

It's as simple as that really? that's really over-simplifying it... Look in a dictionary for the definition of the word. It may be a part of it sure- but it's more than that.

Are you the one who claimed the Old testament was ''Literally Jewish nationalism'' ?

Peoples all the way throughout history have had some sense of cultural boundaries though

1700's+ Nationalism is just a continuation of this

WW2 was typical imperialism driven by the economic need for annexation of assets instead of actively building up your own economy.
It had nationalistic sentiments to get the people to be for the war but it was mostly imperialism aswell.

I am not a nationalist, just reall interested with the großdeutschem Reich

It was also a way to unify your country and get rid of self esteem issues about your heritage due to years of "racial science"
Read about mussolinis fascism and the mediterranian heritage for example.
Most people believed in this shit, especially nordic people being the most influential thinkers and person in the world.

> loyalty and devotion to a nation; especially : a sense of national consciousness (see consciousness 1c) exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups
I think you're over-complicating it, all of these can apply to the 100 Year War and dozens of others prior to the 19th centuries mass movements about being freed from foreign rule or uniting culturally similar countries together
No because that's fucking retarded

It's a interesting one, makes me really think a lot about it. the meaning of it. Thanks for the discussion.

Because it IS a natural consequence of increased long range communication and faster travel, connecting people of further distances and making the differences in cultures more apparent to the common man.

>give up nationalism
>get conquered by foreign nationalists

Pottery

Custom

Same reason why people see porn as something normal when it isn't

They grew on it