So the answer the Germans give in response to the holocaust was that Allied interception of supply shipments led to food shortages and an outbreak of Typhoid, while internment camp casualties were exaggerated tenfold. The 'mass killings' were actually mercy killings, meant to stretch supplies further and avoid prolonging needless suffering.
I know that, (especially since we won) the burden of proof is on them, but just out of curiousity, what is the 'official' refutation of these claims?
Also, in general, I am curious as to how casualty reports were conducted, if someone actually went out and counted all the bodies or if the survivors tattoos could be used as a numeric tracking system gave any clue as to the number of dead or missing.
It seems ludicrous to me that anyone could put such a spin on the war as to exaggerate casualties from a systematic genocide of such a scale by a factor of two, much less ten.
For example, were allied soldiers counted amongst the holocaust victims?
Matthew Taylor
In WW1, whenever the Germans ran into situations where they didn't have enough food to feed prisoners, guess what they did?
They let them leave.
Owen Scott
Yes, but they hadn't interned 6 million people either. If even a fraction of those people left and joined the allies, say 10%, you are still looking at 600,000 conscripts.
Dominic Ortiz
Seriously, this thing is like a silver bullet. If you don't have anything prepped in response to it, you're going to keep hemorrhaging more and more people to Stormfront.
A simple statement of fact regarding how casualty numbers were arrived at would do wonders for the left right about now.
Did they count the bodies?
Noah Smith
Assuming they did, who signed off as witness? Coroners? Officers? Field Medics? Army personnel?
Were the bodies then exhumed and entered into evidence? (Obviously not the bodies themselves) Did someone take photographs? Were the numbers entered into record?
Easton Young
There is no "official" refutation because of what you noticed; the onus of providing proof is on the stormfronter to prove the deaths were caused by typhus, that the supplies really were interdicted, that they were mercy killings, etc.
In any case, the fact that deaths broke down so well along ethnic lines in the PoWs, as well as even in the most heavily bombed areas, the Germans were still capable of conducting military operations with millions of troops, who don't just need food, but things like lots of ammunition and POLs, makes this one rather a strained claim.
>Also, in general, I am curious as to how casualty reports were conducted, if someone actually went out and counted all the bodies or if the survivors tattoos could be used as a numeric tracking system gave any clue as to the number of dead or missing. It was done based on demographic decline. They weren't amassing death tolls by looking up individual massacres and camp death tolls and adding them up, they looked at the number of Jews who went missing in the various places the Nazis occupied, subrtracted a bit for ordinary deaths, and worked from that.
No, PoWs in general were not counted among holocaust deaths, only civilians. You do get some who try to include mostly Soviet PoWs in the "official" tally though.
John Foster
>I know that, (especially since we won) the burden of proof is on them, but just out of curiousity, what is the 'official' refutation of these claims? Just google "final solution to the jewish question"
Xavier Gomez
Does somebody have that link that provides details regarding each camp and the number of casualties? It would be interesting to compare that to Stormfront estimates.
Frankly, it would only serve to dig themselves deeper and radicalize the remaining deniers. After all, you have to protect your flock from moving too far from the center.
Connor Myers
Here's your answer, OP. You dense motherfucker
James Thomas
>what is the 'official' refutation of these claims?
It's well documented the Nazis had implemented a program of extermination through labor and starvation for their Jewish prisoners which they didn't immediately kill. Running out of food may have accelerated that program a bit but really didn't change it.
I should rephrase that, it should be well known here but it isn't. I've played devils advocate on this issue a few times and nobody has brought that point up here.
> how casualty reports were conducted
At first by estimates (some grossly wrong), historians have been trying to accurately count the number of victims since the war. The numbers are widely available.
Gavin Russell
>You do get some who try to include mostly Soviet PoWs in the "official" tally though. That makes more sense given the horrendous treatment of Soviet POWs, especially early in the war.
Logan Roberts
A man is a better citizen of the United States for being also a loyal citizen of his state, and of his city; for being loyal to his family, and to his profession or trade; for being loyal to his college or his lodge. . . . For only through the ennobling effect of its strivings can we develop the best that is in us and give to this country the full benefit of our great inheritance. The Jewish Problem And How to Solve It (1915). Louis Dembitz Brandeis (November 13, 1856 – October 5, 1941) was an important American litigator, Supreme Court Justice, advocate of privacy, and developer of the Brandeis Brief.
Zachary Phillips
yeah, that's funny, cause I didn't ask you for a number. I asked how the casualty reports were conducted.
saying something is 'well documented' isn't the same as documentation. You might point to all the love letters Hitler wrote to the jewish people, but that's not really the same thing, is it?
After all, we aren't arguing about the consequence, we are arguing about the cause, the means, and the numbers.
Tyler Hernandez
>It's well documented the Nazis had implemented a program of extermination through labor and starvation for their Jewish prisoners which they didn't immediately kill.
See, that's basically just another spin on it. Unless you arguing against the motive, (ie, mercy killings) or the facts, (supply shortages, outbreak of disease) you are just presenting your opinion on the matter.
Oliver Long
Being a Stormfag doesn't automatically disqualify you're right to vote. Eventually, you are going to have to confront them with evidence, not hyperbole. You can be as right as you want to be, you can work a jury, but nothing quite silences the opposition like the facts.
Brody Diaz
>saying something is 'well documented' isn't the same as documentation
You're right. It means it's not hard to find if you look. Spoon feeding people is not my cup of tea.
If you ignore all evidence of unfit to work jews being killed immediately in many camps sure. If you ignore evidence that the sun is yellow it could be just my opinion that it's yellow.
Nathan Adams
You know, thats interesting. Did the Germans allow the children to leave? Were they remanded into the custody of the Red Cross?
Ryan Turner
>If you ignore all evidence of unfit to work jews being killed immediately in many camps sure. >If you ignore all evidence
Such as?
Adam Cook
In my experience, those numbers and methods are not well documented at all. I had to dig through considerable amounts of documentation to find them and the results are often vague and inconclusive.
If I had more than a couple hours to devote towards researching something that should already be well indexed and cross referenced, I would not have call to ask the question, would I?
I'm not up for playing the documentation game tonight beyond this. Go read if you are interested.
Charles Collins
>I'm not up for playing the documentation game tonight beyond this.
This. This is why you are getting you're shit pushed in. The tides are turning, do you not understand that? Stormfront could happen tomorrow, and you are sitting hear jacking it with a thumb up your ass. You need to take this threat seriously. If this is the best spin your people can come up with, you are going to get crucified, do you understand? The people are out there, they are pissed, they are angry, they are looking for a scapegoat, and you are offering them platitudes and opinion pieces, holding a 100 year old war up as sacred testimony that "It can happen again" when the wolves are right outside your doorstep.
Cooper Richardson
Why does no one ever discuss the early Holocaust in the East - Poland, Baltics, Belarus, Ukraine?
Because that was rather straightforward - ditches and firing squads, not much to dispute.
Colton Long
You think the system is just this machine that keeps perpetuating itself, that we exist to make you rich. Those gears are oiled in blood. You've thrown enough people into the works to know that.
I'm telling you that this is how it starts. It starts when things get quiet. When people stop throwing rocks and moltaive cocktails and start wearing polo shirts and tiki torches. It starts when some right wing college kid gets his head caved in on national television.
Easton Peterson
>the left
What the duck is with this "only the left believes in the Holocaust" shit that's being pushed here recently? People on the right believe that the Holocaust happened. It's only fringe lunatics on both sides who claim it didn't
William Allen
great. great. another ad homonym. just keep piling the ridicule on. that will in no way incentivize them.
David Kelly
>the onus of providing proof is on the stormfronter and explain to me how that matters in the court of public opinion. explain who is going to defend you when all the police and all the soldiers are busy jerking off to Mein Kaumf.
Hudson Wilson
>Stormfront could happen tomorrow
user, what do you think Stormfront is? You might be saddened to learn that's it a shitty forum that hasn't changed since the 90s.
Caleb Barnes
Says who? Says you? Says Dr. Greenburg? Are you writing an oral history report? Are you studying for an exam? Or are you fighting for your god damn life? Cause you sure don't fucking act like it.
Nicholas Torres
What ridicule are you referring to?
Aaron Brown
>all the police and all the soldiers are busy jerking off to Mein Kaumf.
In what universe is this ever going to happen?
Easton Miller
Stormfront is a movement, not a forum. Their poison is creeping into the center. The far right is primed to drop out of the game entirely.
Your not doing your job. You think this is a game?
Sebastian Lee
It's another "stormcunt pretends to be just innocently asking questions but is too retarded to stay in character" episode.
Ethan Jackson
>creeping into the center
Citation needed
Kayden Carter
>So the answer the Germans give in response to the holocaust
Stormniggers not germans!
btw most of the holocaust deniers and neonazis on this board are slavs and americans.
